(11-13-2019 09:19 PM)southpaw1 Wrote:  This could be landmark shift in the way the NCAA deals with eligibility decisions. Wiseman and Memphis (Penny) stood up to the NCAA and the NCAA blinked.

I think it will just cause the NCAA to change and clarify some of the rules about boosters. That, in itself, is a good thing.

(11-13-2019 06:45 PM)rolexjames Wrote:  Sit Wiseman for 4-6 and Penny for 4 - 6. That would be a hammer from the NCAA.

Penny didn't break any rules while he was the coach of Memphis...

I don't think Penny will be punished.

4 games would be nice...That is more than 10% but I would bet it would be more. Unfortunately even if the suspension was that short it would be affect two of our competitive games.

Also does a suspension only mean the player cant play...Or is he suspended from all team activities including practice.

(11-13-2019 08:46 PM)BandwagonJumper Wrote:  i have a bad feeling we're fixing to get the back door special, if you know what i mean

Hershey highway

(11-13-2019 09:34 PM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:19 PM)southpaw1 Wrote:  This could be landmark shift in the way the NCAA deals with eligibility decisions. Wiseman and Memphis (Penny) stood up to the NCAA and the NCAA blinked.

I hope you right, but so far we have only seen rumors of them blinking.

The NCAA handles the majority of cases this way. They are settled - They did not blink. Memphis would have blinked if they don't go to trial.

(11-13-2019 09:35 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 06:45 PM)rolexjames Wrote:  Sit Wiseman for 4-6 and Penny for 4 - 6. That would be a hammer from the NCAA.

Penny didn't break any rules while he was the coach of Memphis...

I don't think Penny will be punished.

4 games would be nice...That is more than 10% but I would bet it would be more. Unfortunately even if the suspension was that short it would be affect two of our competitive games.

Also does a suspension only mean the player cant play...Or is he suspended from all team activities including practice.

I believe it includes practice. Seems like I remember them saying Young had returned to practice this week as the announcement that he was cleared to play.

(11-13-2019 09:38 PM)griffin Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:34 PM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:19 PM)southpaw1 Wrote:  This could be landmark shift in the way the NCAA deals with eligibility decisions. Wiseman and Memphis (Penny) stood up to the NCAA and the NCAA blinked.

I hope you right, but so far we have only seen rumors of them blinking.

The NCAA handles the majority of cases this way. They are settled - They did not blink. Memphis would have blinked if they don't go to trial.

Well, I am pretty sure the negotation was what they were aiming for. Like I have said in other posts, not knowing the penalty makes it hard to lay down. Fishman was comparing it to other things like Murder 1 you know what the penalty is. You can talk to the prosecutor and get a deal and decide if you want the deal before declaring yourself guilty. With the NCAA, you declare yourself guilty, then they tell you what the penalty is.

In this case we are forcing them to negotiate, tell us what the penalty is, then we can decide if it is worth the fight, or to accept the deal.

(11-13-2019 09:39 PM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:35 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 06:45 PM)rolexjames Wrote:  Sit Wiseman for 4-6 and Penny for 4 - 6. That would be a hammer from the NCAA.

Penny didn't break any rules while he was the coach of Memphis...

I don't think Penny will be punished.

4 games would be nice...That is more than 10% but I would bet it would be more. Unfortunately even if the suspension was that short it would be affect two of our competitive games.

Also does a suspension only mean the player cant play...Or is he suspended from all team activities including practice.

I believe it includes practice. Seems like I remember them saying Young had returned to practice this week as the announcement that he was cleared to play.

That would suck.

(11-13-2019 09:41 PM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:38 PM)griffin Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:34 PM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:19 PM)southpaw1 Wrote:  This could be landmark shift in the way the NCAA deals with eligibility decisions. Wiseman and Memphis (Penny) stood up to the NCAA and the NCAA blinked.

I hope you right, but so far we have only seen rumors of them blinking.

The NCAA handles the majority of cases this way. They are settled - They did not blink. Memphis would have blinked if they don't go to trial.

Well, I am pretty sure the negotation was what they were aiming for. Like I have said in other posts, not knowing the penalty makes it hard to lay down. Fishman was comparing it to other things like Murder 1 you know what the penalty is. You can talk to the prosecutor and get a deal and decide if you want the deal before declaring yourself guilty. With the NCAA, you declare yourself guilty, then they tell you what the penalty is.

In this case we are forcing them to negotiate, tell us what the penalty is, then we can decide if it is worth the fight, or to accept the deal.

Don't listen to attorneys or taking heads for the NCAA side
Don't listen to attorneys or taking heads for the player advocate side
Their messages are literally what they should be for their clients

Just know
The NCAAs goal is to settle every suit - just to move on they were never going to court.
Memphis' goal was to settle, they were never going to court.
Neither want anyone to answer any question.

The majority of every single case is settled:

The formula:
1) Pay back the money
2) 1/3 of the sports season (different for every sport)
3) Then the next step is for the NCAA to declare the amount of games
4) Appeal or work out plan for less than
5) It's settled

This happens and is the template regardless of any suit.

Makes you wonder why so much happened to get what was going to happen anyway

(11-13-2019 09:47 PM)griffin Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:41 PM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:38 PM)griffin Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:34 PM)Claw Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:19 PM)southpaw1 Wrote:  This could be landmark shift in the way the NCAA deals with eligibility decisions. Wiseman and Memphis (Penny) stood up to the NCAA and the NCAA blinked.

I hope you right, but so far we have only seen rumors of them blinking.

The NCAA handles the majority of cases this way. They are settled - They did not blink. Memphis would have blinked if they don't go to trial.

Well, I am pretty sure the negotation was what they were aiming for. Like I have said in other posts, not knowing the penalty makes it hard to lay down. Fishman was comparing it to other things like Murder 1 you know what the penalty is. You can talk to the prosecutor and get a deal and decide if you want the deal before declaring yourself guilty. With the NCAA, you declare yourself guilty, then they tell you what the penalty is.

In this case we are forcing them to negotiate, tell us what the penalty is, then we can decide if it is worth the fight, or to accept the deal.

Don't listen to attorneys or taking heads for the NCAA side
Don't listen to attorneys or taking heads for the player advocate side
Their messages are literally what they should be for their clients

Just know
The NCAAs goal is to settle every suit - just to move on they were never going to court.
Memphis' goal was to settle, they were never going to court.
Neither want anyone to answer any question.

The majority of every single case is settled:

The formula:
1) Pay back the money
2) 1/3 of the sports season (different for every sport)
3) Then the next step is for the NCAA to declare the amount of games
4) Appeal or work out plan for less than
5) It's settled

This happens and is the template regardless of any suit.

Makes you wonder why so much happened to get what was going to happen anyway

There is no way to prove it, but I would guarantee Wiseman ends up with a lesser punishment this way than he would have if he had just laid down and said give it to me.

We did that with the Rose case. We laid down, admitted wrong doing, called Rose ineligible, begged for mercy and they hit us with max penalties.

Some people never learn and continue to lay down for a bully, that only excites them. It is when you jump up and pop them in the nose that they decide it is easier to find a different target... you know, the one who lays down and takes it.

We are all in different territory. How the NCAA handled situations before, well.... truthfully, why should they count.

Less a question than a statement.

I wonder what would Penny do if he found an extra $11,500 in his checking account.

(11-13-2019 09:35 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 06:45 PM)rolexjames Wrote:  Sit Wiseman for 4-6 and Penny for 4 - 6. That would be a hammer from the NCAA.

Penny didn't break any rules while he was the coach of Memphis...

I don't think Penny will be punished.

4 games would be nice...That is more than 10% but I would bet it would be more. Unfortunately even if the suspension was that short it would be affect two of our competitive games.

Also does a suspension only mean the player cant play...Or is he suspended from all team activities including practice.

My issue with settling is this:
Penny was not acting as a booster of the UofM when he paid Wiseman’s mom’s moving bill. That one of the other wrinkles with this issue. If Penny was giving the money to induce JW to sign with Memphis, then why did he let Alex Lomax sign with Wichita State? If there was any inkling that Penny was ultimately going to become the UofM head basketball coach job, then Lomax signs with Tubby.

(11-13-2019 09:56 PM)Seabee TIger Fan Wrote:  I wonder what would Penny do if he found an extra $11,500 in his checking account.

Chances are likely he would never know it. His accountant might see it and pass it off as some kind of endorsement or appearance deal and not even note it as unusual.

(11-13-2019 09:50 PM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:47 PM)griffin Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:41 PM)memtigbb Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:38 PM)griffin Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:34 PM)Claw Wrote:  I hope you right, but so far we have only seen rumors of them blinking.

The NCAA handles the majority of cases this way. They are settled - They did not blink. Memphis would have blinked if they don't go to trial.

Well, I am pretty sure the negotation was what they were aiming for. Like I have said in other posts, not knowing the penalty makes it hard to lay down. Fishman was comparing it to other things like Murder 1 you know what the penalty is. You can talk to the prosecutor and get a deal and decide if you want the deal before declaring yourself guilty. With the NCAA, you declare yourself guilty, then they tell you what the penalty is.

In this case we are forcing them to negotiate, tell us what the penalty is, then we can decide if it is worth the fight, or to accept the deal.

Don't listen to attorneys or taking heads for the NCAA side
Don't listen to attorneys or taking heads for the player advocate side
Their messages are literally what they should be for their clients

Just know
The NCAAs goal is to settle every suit - just to move on they were never going to court.
Memphis' goal was to settle, they were never going to court.
Neither want anyone to answer any question.

The majority of every single case is settled:

The formula:
1) Pay back the money
2) 1/3 of the sports season (different for every sport)
3) Then the next step is for the NCAA to declare the amount of games
4) Appeal or work out plan for less than
5) It's settled

This happens and is the template regardless of any suit.

Makes you wonder why so much happened to get what was going to happen anyway

There is no way to prove it, but I would guarantee Wiseman ends up with a lesser punishment this way than he would have if he had just laid down and said give it to me.

We did that with the Rose case. We laid down, admitted wrong doing, called Rose ineligible, begged for mercy and they hit us with max penalties.

Some people never learn and continue to lay down for a bully, that only excites them. It is when you jump up and pop them in the nose that they decide it is easier to find a different target... you know, the one who lays down and takes it.

Good points and a different lens.

Memphis' release outlined they were cooperating with the NCAA on a joint investigation. There may be a lot of "smoke" in this lol. May explain the Bahamas, two exhibition games etc

Point made of expectations of NCAA.

You can google cases and most everyone does follow that template unless they did not cooperate. It s better to get an equitable decision made. While public opinion was in our favor it was not going to get us what we wanted. It was a good show, we will see.

(11-13-2019 09:57 PM)CKMcDan Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:35 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 06:45 PM)rolexjames Wrote:  Sit Wiseman for 4-6 and Penny for 4 - 6. That would be a hammer from the NCAA.

Penny didn't break any rules while he was the coach of Memphis...

I don't think Penny will be punished.

4 games would be nice...That is more than 10% but I would bet it would be more. Unfortunately even if the suspension was that short it would be affect two of our competitive games.

Also does a suspension only mean the player cant play...Or is he suspended from all team activities including practice.

My issue with settling is this:
Penny was not acting as a booster of the UofM when he paid Wiseman’s mom’s moving bill. That one of the other wrinkles with this issue. If Penny was giving the money to induce JW to sign with Memphis, then why did he let Alex Lomax sign with Wichita State? If there was any inkling that Penny was ultimately going to become the UofM head basketball coach job, then Lomax signs with Tubby.

Just to be clear and maybe it just not knowing but:

1) Penny was at the time (until he became a coach and will be after he is a coach) a Booster for Memphis. That will never go away, never.
2) He is an Ambassador, he is #34. There are about 60. That is a forever booster for Memphis, not a one time thing
3) Lomax is different they had a very long standing history and relationship and was covered by the NCAA

Him being a coach has zero to do with this. Remove that thought. A Booster can't pay any recruit anything for any reason unless it's a meal and approved by the university.

Hope this helps

I guess I’m a glass half empty-type of guy, because I can see this falling out like this...

A settlement of 4 games gets negotiated, and we go from there. The team gets comfortable with each other and grow from freshmen to really good teammates. We make a deep run in March, maybe all the way to the elite eight or better. After the season, as is their usual method of operating, the NCAA sends a notification and announces they have retroactively deemed Wiseman ineligible and we forfeit all wins and get sanctions.

Deja vu all over again...

(11-13-2019 10:03 PM)griffin Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:57 PM)CKMcDan Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:35 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 06:45 PM)rolexjames Wrote:  Sit Wiseman for 4-6 and Penny for 4 - 6. That would be a hammer from the NCAA.

Penny didn't break any rules while he was the coach of Memphis...

I don't think Penny will be punished.

4 games would be nice...That is more than 10% but I would bet it would be more. Unfortunately even if the suspension was that short it would be affect two of our competitive games.

Also does a suspension only mean the player cant play...Or is he suspended from all team activities including practice.

My issue with settling is this:
Penny was not acting as a booster of the UofM when he paid Wiseman’s mom’s moving bill. That one of the other wrinkles with this issue. If Penny was giving the money to induce JW to sign with Memphis, then why did he let Alex Lomax sign with Wichita State? If there was any inkling that Penny was ultimately going to become the UofM head basketball coach job, then Lomax signs with Tubby.

Just to be clear and maybe it just not knowing but:

1) Penny was at the time (until he became a coach and will be after he is a coach) a Booster for Memphis. That will never go away, never.
2) He is an Ambassador, he is #34. There are about 60. That is a forever booster for Memphis, not a one time thing
3) Lomax is different they had a very long standing history and relationship and was covered by the NCAA

Him being a coach has zero to do with this. Remove that thought. A Booster can't pay any recruit anything for any reason unless it's a meal and approved by the university.

Hope this helps

Hardaway was a booster and was a great ambassador for the university, now he's our esteemed coach. The only contention is that the money he gave to Wiseman's family (at the time) had nothing to do with talking Wiseman into playing for Memphis.

I still think Hardaway should have known to give $17,500 to me for services rendered at his barber shop (that was one damn good style), I would then give $15,500 to Jason D Williams, who would in turn give $13,500 to Prince Mongo who would head to Nashville in a Chevy Nova with $11,500 in cash in shoe boxes and leave it at Wiseman's door. Then it would have been deemed "not cheating" by the amazingly idiotic NCAA.

I hope this is figured out before Monday for everybody's sake, but mostly mine.

(11-13-2019 10:35 PM)cmt Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 10:03 PM)griffin Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:57 PM)CKMcDan Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:35 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 06:45 PM)rolexjames Wrote:  Sit Wiseman for 4-6 and Penny for 4 - 6. That would be a hammer from the NCAA.

Penny didn't break any rules while he was the coach of Memphis...

I don't think Penny will be punished.

4 games would be nice...That is more than 10% but I would bet it would be more. Unfortunately even if the suspension was that short it would be affect two of our competitive games.

Also does a suspension only mean the player cant play...Or is he suspended from all team activities including practice.

My issue with settling is this:
Penny was not acting as a booster of the UofM when he paid Wiseman’s mom’s moving bill. That one of the other wrinkles with this issue. If Penny was giving the money to induce JW to sign with Memphis, then why did he let Alex Lomax sign with Wichita State? If there was any inkling that Penny was ultimately going to become the UofM head basketball coach job, then Lomax signs with Tubby.

Just to be clear and maybe it just not knowing but:

1) Penny was at the time (until he became a coach and will be after he is a coach) a Booster for Memphis. That will never go away, never.
2) He is an Ambassador, he is #34. There are about 60. That is a forever booster for Memphis, not a one time thing
3) Lomax is different they had a very long standing history and relationship and was covered by the NCAA

Him being a coach has zero to do with this. Remove that thought. A Booster can't pay any recruit anything for any reason unless it's a meal and approved by the university.

Hope this helps

Hardaway was a booster and was a great ambassador for the university, now he's our esteemed coach. The only contention is that the money he gave to Wiseman's family (at the time) had nothing to do with talking Wiseman into playing for Memphis.

I still think Hardaway should have known to give $17,500 to me for services rendered at his barber shop (that was one damn good style), I would then give $15,500 to Jason D Williams, who would in turn give $13,500 to Prince Mongo who would head to Nashville in a Chevy Nova with $11,500 in cash in shoe boxes and leave it at Wiseman's door. Then it would have been deemed "not cheating" by the amazingly idiotic NCAA.

I hope this is figured out before Monday for everybody's sake, but mostly mine.

Understand good read.

It's not the intent as you outlined. Has nothing to do with it.

As a "Booster" a Booster can't give $ 11,500 "unless" that booster does not want the player to be eligible at his or her school where he or she is a booster. It's that simple

Lots of ways to get $ 11,500 without all of this.

(11-13-2019 10:03 PM)griffin Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:57 PM)CKMcDan Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:35 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 06:45 PM)rolexjames Wrote:  Sit Wiseman for 4-6 and Penny for 4 - 6. That would be a hammer from the NCAA.

Penny didn't break any rules while he was the coach of Memphis...

I don't think Penny will be punished.

4 games would be nice...That is more than 10% but I would bet it would be more. Unfortunately even if the suspension was that short it would be affect two of our competitive games.

Also does a suspension only mean the player cant play...Or is he suspended from all team activities including practice.

My issue with settling is this:
Penny was not acting as a booster of the UofM when he paid Wiseman’s mom’s moving bill. That one of the other wrinkles with this issue. If Penny was giving the money to induce JW to sign with Memphis, then why did he let Alex Lomax sign with Wichita State? If there was any inkling that Penny was ultimately going to become the UofM head basketball coach job, then Lomax signs with Tubby.

Just to be clear and maybe it just not knowing but:

1) Penny was at the time (until he became a coach and will be after he is a coach) a Booster for Memphis. That will never go away, never.

And therein lies the rub. The NCAA don’t define it as forever. They defined as “indefinite” which means “indeterminate.” It can ALSO mean “forever” but ambiguity in terminology is legally, and lawfully, defined to be understood to favor “indeterminate.”

It DOES NOT MATTER (legally) what their recent “clarification” happens to say on their unofficial and non-legally-binding website. Not one iota.

(11-13-2019 10:39 PM)griffin Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 10:35 PM)cmt Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 10:03 PM)griffin Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:57 PM)CKMcDan Wrote:  

(11-13-2019 09:35 PM)macgar32 Wrote:  Penny didn't break any rules while he was the coach of Memphis...

I don't think Penny will be punished.

4 games would be nice...That is more than 10% but I would bet it would be more. Unfortunately even if the suspension was that short it would be affect two of our competitive games.

Also does a suspension only mean the player cant play...Or is he suspended from all team activities including practice.

My issue with settling is this:
Penny was not acting as a booster of the UofM when he paid Wiseman’s mom’s moving bill. That one of the other wrinkles with this issue. If Penny was giving the money to induce JW to sign with Memphis, then why did he let Alex Lomax sign with Wichita State? If there was any inkling that Penny was ultimately going to become the UofM head basketball coach job, then Lomax signs with Tubby.

Just to be clear and maybe it just not knowing but:

1) Penny was at the time (until he became a coach and will be after he is a coach) a Booster for Memphis. That will never go away, never.
2) He is an Ambassador, he is #34. There are about 60. That is a forever booster for Memphis, not a one time thing
3) Lomax is different they had a very long standing history and relationship and was covered by the NCAA

Him being a coach has zero to do with this. Remove that thought. A Booster can't pay any recruit anything for any reason unless it's a meal and approved by the university.

Hope this helps

Hardaway was a booster and was a great ambassador for the university, now he's our esteemed coach. The only contention is that the money he gave to Wiseman's family (at the time) had nothing to do with talking Wiseman into playing for Memphis.

I still think Hardaway should have known to give $17,500 to me for services rendered at his barber shop (that was one damn good style), I would then give $15,500 to Jason D Williams, who would in turn give $13,500 to Prince Mongo who would head to Nashville in a Chevy Nova with $11,500 in cash in shoe boxes and leave it at Wiseman's door. Then it would have been deemed "not cheating" by the amazingly idiotic NCAA.

I hope this is figured out before Monday for everybody's sake, but mostly mine.

Understand good read.

It's not the intent as you outlined. Has nothing to do with it.

As a "Booster" a Booster can't give $ 11,500 "unless" that booster does not want the player to be eligible at his or her school where he or she is a booster. It's that simple

Lots of ways to get $ 11,500 without all of this.

Honestly I wonder if James is eligible anywhere with that payment unless he paid it back.