I didnt realize it but a fifth of Lou's losses have come at U.S.C. It might have taken a little longer to turn things around here but with the last two recruiting classes I expect hi winning % at Carolina to improve dramatically. Pardon me for saying it but, The Future looks bright(if I do say so myself)

Head coach: Lou Holtz
5th year at USC: 22-25
32nd year overall: 238-120-7



<!--EDIT|TheFuture|May 14 2003, 12:07 PM-->

Look for it to really start in '04. We'll hover around .500 this year, which will still raise Lou's %.

Drakeman Wrote:Look for it to really start in '04. We'll hover around .500 this year, which will still raise Lou's %.

...And after the mediocre '03 season, people will be saying, "Just watch us in '05." No, the time for Lou to turn it around is in '03. Face it, if we don't see significant improvement in '03 (winning record, bowl trip), then Lou is not going to get it done.

I don't think so King, & here's why. IMO we've improved our talent level tremendously with the last 2 recruiting classes, but this has us in a position where we're very young & green. I think this years team will show signs of potential greatness, but will also be very inconsistant.

When I look at '04 I see guys like Summers, Whiteside, Newton, Lee, & many others having a year under their belts. I see Troy Williamson with 2 years under his belt, & a host of talented, & now experienced skill players to free him up from double coverage. I see 2 Sr QB's (1 a 5th year Sr), backed by young, talented underclassmen who've been in the system.

I could go on, but I hope you see why I think '04's the year. Not just because I can't think of anything else to say. If we go 5-7 this fall I'll still feel that '04 will be the year we get back on the winning track. However, I probably feel the same way about '04 as you do '03. If we don't win 7-8 games & go bowling then I'll share your concerns.

If he goes three losing seasons out of five and adds yet another home loss to UPC, then it's over. Or, it ought to be.

I'm kinda with King on this......and my reasoning goes something like this: I'm not sure just two great recruiting classes are enough. We're competing in the SEC with schools that have been recruiting like that for many, many years. Therefore, any casualties they suffer along the way barely phase them, but we are still vulnerable to such mishaps. A losing season this year could hurt recruiting.......and could start a tailspin. I dunno......it's just what I've seen so often before. And the rest of the SEC isn't slowing down for us.......

However, IF we manage to grab 6 wins this year (including beating Clemson) and even get to the tiniest of bowl games, I think we'll be fine next recruiting season. That will demonstrate we're back on track (somewhat, anyway).

As for so many of Lou's losses coming at USC, you have to keep in mind that, really, this represents the greatest challenge of his career. In fact, USC would be the greatest challenge in ANY coach's career.

Hey Gal, like I said on another thread, I do see recruiting dropping off next winter due to a sub par campaign this fall. That's why I put so much importance on the '04 season. I feel that the 2 classes will be good enough, & more importantly, experienced enough to win 7 games on an 11 game schedule, & go to a winnable bowl by then. That will jump start recruiting again IMO. If we don't have that kind of season then I'll share King's concerns.

I agree 100% that losing to Clemson's unacceptable this year, & if it happens Lou needs to have his feet put closer to the flame.

That's what I'm wondering. Can we lose as many as 7 games.....but still have one of our 5 wins come over Clemson? I don't see it........but it IS a rivalry game and you never know. It's just that, historically (last 30 years, anyway), when there's been an "upset" in that game, it's usually UPC who pulls the upset........never the other way around.

If two classes IS enough, you're right in that '04 will tell the tale. I just don't know......the schedule never gets any easier. AUBURN comes on the slate next season.........Bama joins them in '05, replacing Ole Miss. YEE-OUCH.

Galactus Wrote:That's what I'm wondering. Can we lose as many as 7 games.....but still have one of our 5 wins come over Clemson?

Absolutely! Look at these 5 home games, & tell me what you think:

ULL
UAB
UK
Vandy
Clemson

Yeah, when you look at it that way, it does seem possible. But my concern would be our momentum (or lack thereof) going into Clemson. The problem we have is that, by the time Ole Miss, Arkansas and Florida have beaten us to a pulp, will there be any thing left for the Tiggers? My guess is that if we've only won 4 games up to that point and those three opponents have put huge whippings on us, we would probably lose to UPC, too.

But at least we have 'em at home (for whatever that's worth).

Another thought: let's say we finish 6-6 with a win over Clemson. That would mean that we would be going INTO the Clemson game with a 5-6 record. Given that bowl bids go out way too early, IMO......what would our chances at a small bowl be under those circumstances?



<!--EDIT|Galactus|May 16 2003, 10:03 AM-->

I agree with you on the momentum thing, but it can still be done. I don't think the Tigers will have a whole lot of mo coming into our game either. In fact, it wouldn't surprise me if this years games is played under similar situations as last years game.

Beating Clemson, & going 6-6 would probably get us in some lame bowl that probably shouldn't even exist. Bids don't seem to go out as early as they used to. So much can't be decided until the SEC & Big 12 title games. Everything seems to fall into place very quickly after that.

Hey guys . . . my first time venturing outside of AST!

Put me in the corner with King and Gal on this one . . . no doubt we should be much improved in '04 over '03, but I like the way the schedule sets up for us in '03. I don't think there is anyone on our schedule that we can't beat. I count at least 6 wins at home and think we catch a break in at least 1 or 2 road games for a 7 or 8 win season. If we don't do that this year, then unfortunately I don't think we do it in '04 either.

jesse james Wrote:Hey guys . . . my first time venturing outside of AST!

Put me in the corner with King and Gal on this one . . . no doubt we should be much improved in '04 over '03, but I like the way the schedule sets up for us in '03. I don't think there is anyone on our schedule that we can't beat. I count at least 6 wins at home and think we catch a break in at least 1 or 2 road games for a 7 or 8 win season. If we don't do that this year, then unfortunately I don't think we do it in '04 either.

Thanks for posting Jesse - you are welcome here. Sometimes after you see the same posts you wander off. It happens. I myself post on 3 or 4 boards a day :eek: I know I need a life :wave:

I think the Cocks will have a season like last year, btw

Drakeman Wrote:I don't think so King, & here's why. IMO we've improved our talent level tremendously with the last 2 recruiting classes, but this has us in a position where we're very young & green. I think this years team will show signs of potential greatness, but will also be very inconsistant.

When I look at '04 I see guys like Summers, Whiteside, Newton, Lee, & many others having a year under their belts. I see Troy Williamson with 2 years under his belt, & a host of talented, & now experienced skill players to free him up from double coverage. I see 2 Sr QB's (1 a 5th year Sr), backed by young, talented underclassmen who've been in the system.

I could go on, but I hope you see why I think '04's the year. Not just because I can't think of anything else to say. If we go 5-7 this fall I'll still feel that '04 will be the year we get back on the winning track. However, I probably feel the same way about '04 as you do '03. If we don't win 7-8 games & go bowling then I'll share your concerns.

:bang: but what if lou's wife dies ,this is something i've not hear anyone talk about,or gets real sick again..face it carolina is putting a lot of hope in a old man ...who has nothing to prove .....and would leave at a drop of a hat.........................lee

leechrdavdar Wrote::bang: but what if lou's wife dies ,this is something i've not hear anyone talk about,or gets real sick again..face it carolina is putting a lot of hope in a old man ...who has nothing to prove .....and would leave at a drop of a hat.........................lee

thats a good point lee .beths an x factor,if she gets real sick again then lou will retire........he should .i guess we dont talk about it because its morbid..........and a little mean.........no one for usc wants to see beth get sick or worse.....

why do you gave a gator next to your name.......

Drakeman Wrote:

leechrdavdar Wrote::bang: but what if lou's wife dies ,this is something i've not hear anyone talk about,or gets real sick again..face it carolina is putting a lot of hope in a old man ...who has nothing to prove .....and would leave at a drop of a hat.........................lee

thats a good point lee .beths an x factor,if she gets real sick again then lou will retire........he should .i guess we dont talk about it because its morbid..........and a little mean.........no one for usc wants to see beth get sick or worse.....

why do you gave a gator next to your name.......

:angel: ok .it wasn't morbid and mean when it was an issue before he was hired.and it delayed his signing......................remember???????????????why is it now. hummmmmmmmmmm. i just think carolina is putting to much hope in an old man ..and skip the lou isn't going to do it.

leechrdavdar Wrote:

leechrdavdar Wrote:.

:bang:

Quote: carolina is putting a lot of hope in a old man ...who has nothing to prove .....and would leave at a drop of a hat.........................lee

:stupid:

<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'><span style='color:yellow'>Bobby Bowden who is many years the Senior to Lou Holtz has had nothing to prove for many years, yet he has enjoyed kicking Clemson up and down the field for the past decade.

Exactly what is your point nimrod?</span> </span>

leechrdavdar Wrote::angel: ok .it wasn't morbid and mean when it was an issue before he was hired.and it delayed his signing......................remember???????????????why is it now. hummmmmmmmmmm. i just think carolina is putting to much hope in an old man ..and skip the lou &nbsp;isn't going to do it.

guess you missed the part where i agreed with you..........guess you also missed the part where i said i guess.

the rest of your post makes no sense........

why do you have a gator next to your name....... :rolltide:



<!--EDIT|Drakeman|May 20 2003, 12:24 AM-->

[quote="Drakeman"][quote="leechrdavdar"]:angel: ok .it wasn't morbid and mean when it was an issue before he was hired.and it delayed his signing......................remember???????????????why is it now. hummmmmmmmmmm. i just think carolina is putting to much hope in an old man ..and skip the lou

Cocky Road Wrote:

leechrdavdar Wrote:

leechrdavdar Wrote:.

:bang:

Quote: carolina is putting a lot of hope in a old man ...who has nothing to prove .....and would leave at a drop of a hat.........................lee

:stupid:

<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'><span style='color:yellow'>Bobby Bowden who is many years the Senior to Lou Holtz has had nothing to prove for many years, yet he has enjoyed kicking Clemson up and down the field for the past decade.

Exactly what is your point nimrod?</span> </span>

TIME WILL TELL.