The unofficial online home for fans of the University of Cincinnati Bearcats. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

(10-10-2019 09:10 AM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  There's no QB controversy on a team that is 15-3 since Ridder started as a frosh and was named the league ROY. He hasn't done anything to warrant a change and he's also one of the respected leaders on the team. I do agree that it would be good to get Ben Bryant some playing time in appropriate spots to keep him ready because Ridder does not have a lot of meat on his bones and he has taken some shots this year. Maybe during the UGone or Tulsa games Bryant can get some extended minutes.

In terms of numbers, Ridder looks to be trending about the same or slightly better than last year. With the type of offense we run featuring the ground game and plays that move the chains I don't know that we can expect him to have big passing numbers per se. As a comparison to former UC QB's, he only needs about another 1,000 yards passing to move up to 10th all-time. His completion percentage over two years [62.3] is second only to Brendon Kay's 65.4. Not too shabby.

I agree that Ridder is not an elite talent but no one expected that out of him anyway. He's doing what the staff is asking - manage the game and limit negative plays. He still could have more upside but it is something he can continue to grow in and not try to become something he's not too quickly.

On another note, isn't it telling to our overall team talent and depth that we can even entertain the question of a QB controversy when the starter is playing solid? Credit to Fick and the staff for building our team up in solid recruiting.

UC isn't winning because of Ridder. UC isn't winning in spite of Ridder either. Ridder is a solid QB. He is not a difference maker. Look at Clemson and Bama. Clemson started Kelly Bryant for a season+ winning big time. When Lawrence was ready he became the QB. Tua situation at Bama is similar (and at Bama Hurts is actually a difference maker QB too). Ridder may earn the job next year, but I am hopeful that they aren't just going to give it to him because they keep winning. Best case scenario is we watch him become a difference maker as this season goes on and feel great about him starting next year. I feel fine with Ridder now, but that doesn't mean we should ignore possible upgrades.

(10-10-2019 10:36 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  

(10-10-2019 09:10 AM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  There's no QB controversy on a team that is 15-3 since Ridder started as a frosh and was named the league ROY. He hasn't done anything to warrant a change and he's also one of the respected leaders on the team. I do agree that it would be good to get Ben Bryant some playing time in appropriate spots to keep him ready because Ridder does not have a lot of meat on his bones and he has taken some shots this year. Maybe during the UGone or Tulsa games Bryant can get some extended minutes.

In terms of numbers, Ridder looks to be trending about the same or slightly better than last year. With the type of offense we run featuring the ground game and plays that move the chains I don't know that we can expect him to have big passing numbers per se. As a comparison to former UC QB's, he only needs about another 1,000 yards passing to move up to 10th all-time. His completion percentage over two years [62.3] is second only to Brendon Kay's 65.4. Not too shabby.

I agree that Ridder is not an elite talent but no one expected that out of him anyway. He's doing what the staff is asking - manage the game and limit negative plays. He still could have more upside but it is something he can continue to grow in and not try to become something he's not too quickly.

On another note, isn't it telling to our overall team talent and depth that we can even entertain the question of a QB controversy when the starter is playing solid? Credit to Fick and the staff for building our team up in solid recruiting.

UC isn't winning because of Ridder. UC isn't winning in spite of Ridder either. Ridder is a solid QB. He is not a difference maker. Look at Clemson and Bama. Clemson started Kelly Bryant for a season+ winning big time. When Lawrence was ready he became the QB. Tua situation at Bama is similar (and at Bama Hurts is actually a difference maker QB too). Ridder may earn the job next year, but I am hopeful that they aren't just going to give it to him because they keep winning. Best case scenario is we watch him become a difference maker as this season goes on and feel great about him starting next year. I feel fine with Ridder now, but that doesn't mean we should ignore possible upgrades.

This. 100% this.

(10-10-2019 10:36 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  

(10-10-2019 09:10 AM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  There's no QB controversy on a team that is 15-3 since Ridder started as a frosh and was named the league ROY. He hasn't done anything to warrant a change and he's also one of the respected leaders on the team. I do agree that it would be good to get Ben Bryant some playing time in appropriate spots to keep him ready because Ridder does not have a lot of meat on his bones and he has taken some shots this year. Maybe during the UGone or Tulsa games Bryant can get some extended minutes.

In terms of numbers, Ridder looks to be trending about the same or slightly better than last year. With the type of offense we run featuring the ground game and plays that move the chains I don't know that we can expect him to have big passing numbers per se. As a comparison to former UC QB's, he only needs about another 1,000 yards passing to move up to 10th all-time. His completion percentage over two years [62.3] is second only to Brendon Kay's 65.4. Not too shabby.

I agree that Ridder is not an elite talent but no one expected that out of him anyway. He's doing what the staff is asking - manage the game and limit negative plays. He still could have more upside but it is something he can continue to grow in and not try to become something he's not too quickly.

On another note, isn't it telling to our overall team talent and depth that we can even entertain the question of a QB controversy when the starter is playing solid? Credit to Fick and the staff for building our team up in solid recruiting.

UC isn't winning because of Ridder. UC isn't winning in spite of Ridder either. Ridder is a solid QB. He is not a difference maker. Look at Clemson and Bama. Clemson started Kelly Bryant for a season+ winning big time. When Lawrence was ready he became the QB. Tua situation at Bama is similar (and at Bama Hurts is actually a difference maker QB too). Ridder may earn the job next year, but I am hopeful that they aren't just going to give it to him because they keep winning. Best case scenario is we watch him become a difference maker as this season goes on and feel great about him starting next year. I feel fine with Ridder now, but that doesn't mean we should ignore possible upgrades.

I understand where you're coming from and I don't disagree in general but this staff isn't going to turn the reigns over to someone else just because they are an unproven "difference maker" either. I believe the staff has demonstrated that they welcome competition during the spring, so yes, Ridder won't just be given the keys as the "auto-starter" next season. If he finishes the year strong and healthy and the Cats keep winning I find it hard to believe that he won't retain the starting job going into the first game of his Junior year. Again, I was posting on the premise of the OP that there may be a QB controversy...

(10-10-2019 07:33 AM)dubcat14 Wrote:  It's obviously pretty rare to see a QB start as a true freshman and Prater won't be an exception.. most cases are when the player is that good or the team has no other options.

Graham Mertz was Wisconsin's highest rated QB ever, #65 overall recruit in the country, and he's going to redshirt. Spencer Rattler #11 overall recruit, is redshirting at Oklahoma... not surprisingly because the room is stacked.

Bo Nix is starting as a true freshman because he's that good.

I expect Prater to redshirt next year and I doubt he'd have a problem with it. He knows what the QB room looks like at Cincinnati. As previously mentioned, I hope Bryant can get some meaningful snaps in these next 6 games and get a tryout. From the few plays we've seen him he looks damn good, that deep ball against Marshall sticks out as a thing of beauty. I'd also be shocked if he doesn't transfer next year if he doesn't win the starting job. Just the nature of the position.

Bo Nix is playing as a true freshman because he's at Auburn and his last name is Nix. Florida showed how good he was last Saturday.

If Prater is all that he appears to be, he's playing. I'd hate it for Ridder, but that's the reality he facing.

Before we worry about QB controversies next year, let's see if future play and injuries render the argument moot.

Barring injury or catastrophe we have our QB for the next two years. He’s the leader and we’re winning. Coaches don’t mess with that.

(10-10-2019 12:53 PM)Dannyboy Wrote:  Barring injury or catastrophe we have our QB for the next two years. He’s the leader and we’re winning. Coaches don’t mess with that.

Agree. I am curious to know how many of the "Prater is the starter next year" guys have seen him play either live or on video. When I see the guy, I see a guy who looks and plays an awful lot like Ridder, except for the fact he is 35 pounds lighter, not as strong (yet) and has not yet faced FBS level opposition. I see no rush to name him the starter at this time.

Des is only a sophomore. I don't think his play has been bad at all, in fact, judging by his 15-3 record it is pretty darn good. He should only get better his last two years. As you indicate, he is a leader in the locker room and the team has a lot of confidence in him. Those two facts might be more important than what he does on the field.

(10-10-2019 01:06 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(10-10-2019 12:53 PM)Dannyboy Wrote:  Barring injury or catastrophe we have our QB for the next two years. He’s the leader and we’re winning. Coaches don’t mess with that.

Agree. I am curious to know how many of the "Prater is the starter next year" guys have seen him play either live or on video. When I see the guy, I see a guy who looks and plays an awful lot like Ridder, except for the fact he is 35 pounds lighter, not as strong (yet) and has not yet faced FBS level opposition. I see no rush to name him the starter at this time.

Des is only a sophomore. I don't think his play has been bad at all, in fact, judging by his 15-3 record it is pretty darn good. He should only get better his last two years. As you indicate, he is a leader in the locker room and the team has a lot of confidence in him. Those two facts might be more important than what he does on the field.

If I was betting on who the starter is the next 2 years I'd bet on Ridder. I just don't think its a done deal. As I stated...the Bearcats haven't won because of Ridder but they aren't winning in spite of him either. He is good and has room to grow.

The good news is we have several options available. Fick did go with Ridder as a RS Freshman over a Senior QB with plenty of experience so it seems he is willing to go with the player who gives them the best chance to win.

Whatever happens I’ll be looking forward to next year. We return a ton of talent again next year and the way this staff continues to recruit it looks like it won’t be slowing down anytime soon.

Barring injury, IMO we won't see Prater in the mix for next year. I could see him red shirting if everyone stays healthy.

If Prater's the best QB, why would we NOT play him?

(10-10-2019 02:22 PM)Cat-Man Wrote:  Barring injury, IMO we won't see Prater in the mix for next year. I could see him red shirting if everyone stays healthy.

I think that's the best course of action IMO...I just hope they brought him in with that potentially in mind, because if not, I don't want to piss off the best recruit to ever walk through our doors out of high school.

Put it this way. Let's assume Ridder finishes the season with the same stat line as last year. That would give him 40+ TD passes against 10+ interceptions, 5,000 passing yards and a 62 percent completion percentage. Throw in a record of something like 21-5 [11-2 + 10-3]. IMO, that makes it pretty hard to turn to another guy to be your starter that has no experience no matter how many stars he has by his name. I think the UCF game was the one question many of us had - can Ridder win the big game on the lighted stage? I think he answered that question. Yes, he will need to consistently show that he can do it and he'll have more opportunities to prove it.

(10-10-2019 02:56 PM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  I think the UCF game was the one question many of us had - can Ridder win the big game on the lighted stage? I think he answered that question. Yes, he will need to consistently show that he can do it and he'll have more opportunities to prove it.

Hate to keep banging the drum against Ridder but UC won the game. He was 17/31 for 150 yards, a paltry 5 yards a throw. I had no doubt he could manage any game with that statline. That's not going to work next year with a healthy Milton for UCF.

Ridder needs to improve as a passer, period.

Sent from my LG-H872 using Tapatalk

(10-10-2019 03:47 PM)RealDeal Wrote:  

(10-10-2019 02:56 PM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  I think the UCF game was the one question many of us had - can Ridder win the big game on the lighted stage? I think he answered that question. Yes, he will need to consistently show that he can do it and he'll have more opportunities to prove it.

Hate to keep banging the drum against Ridder but UC won the game. He was 17/31 for 150 yards, a paltry 5 yards a throw. I had no doubt he could manage any game with that statline. That's not going to work next year with a healthy Milton for UCF.

Ridder needs to improve as a passer, period.

Sent from my LG-H872 using TapatalkI

Of course, there's room for improvement, but I'm very happy with Ridder's performance overall so far. In fact, Ridder got a pretty good review from the PFF guy in the Enquirer today. It's subscriber-only, but here are a few sentences on Ridder:

Quote:Ridder throwing the ball downfield
On passing attempts targeted at least 10 yards downfield, UC quarterback Desmond Ridder has found his rhythm in 2019. He’s currently a top-20-graded quarterback in the country on those throws and has completed 23 of 49 attempts for 545 yards and 10 big-time throws (PFF’s highest-graded pass attempts). Those 10 big-time throws on 10-plus-yard passes are tied for 14th-most among all quarterbacks in the country as he’s truly caught fire the past few weeks...

FOR SUBSCRIBERS
PFF: Perry Young is a game-changer as Cincinnati Bearcats football aims for AAC title

I seem to remember that Praeter intends to play basketball for Wyoming this winter. That would preclude him from graduating early and having spring practice with UC.

Given that fact, it is difficult to see him doing anything other than redshirting next year.

If he came in early, it might be a more interesting speculation.

(10-10-2019 03:47 PM)RealDeal Wrote:  

(10-10-2019 02:56 PM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  I think the UCF game was the one question many of us had - can Ridder win the big game on the lighted stage? I think he answered that question. Yes, he will need to consistently show that he can do it and he'll have more opportunities to prove it.

Hate to keep banging the drum against Ridder but UC won the game. He was 17/31 for 150 yards, a paltry 5 yards a throw. I had no doubt he could manage any game with that statline. That's not going to work next year with a healthy Milton for UCF.

Ridder needs to improve as a passer, period.

Sent from my LG-H872 using Tapatalk

I don't believe anyone has said there isn't room for improvement. UCF is a pretty good team so that would explain some of the stat line. AGAIN, the issue is who behind him on the depth chart should take over next year if he finishes the year healthy and maintains a consistent performance? He's 5 games into his second year for chrikes sakes and is leading his team to a #25 ranking. We've come a long way since Munchie Legaux.

My biggest complaint with Ridder is consistency. Consistency from game to game and even within the same game. In one game he will throw for 300+ yards and 4 TD’s and then the next he struggles to get to 150. I know part of the game to game inconsistencies is the level of competition, but even within the same game he will drop a dime on an excellent throw and then a couple plays later miss an open receiver. May still be a product of his youth and as long as he continues to develop we will be just fine.

I think it’s more likely he finishes his career as a starter and then Prater takes over as a RS Freshman leaving Ben Bryant and some of the others as the odd man out. That said, Football can change on a single snap so it’s nearly impossible to say with any certainty.

Evan Prater will likely redshirt next year seeing limited action. Ben Bryant will continue to push Desmond Ridder for the starting job until he gets his shot as a starter through performance or injury until he's a senior where he'll compete with Prater for the starting job. Not sure if any of the other QB's have a real shot on this roster.

(10-10-2019 11:19 AM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  

(10-10-2019 10:36 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  

(10-10-2019 09:10 AM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  There's no QB controversy on a team that is 15-3 since Ridder started as a frosh and was named the league ROY. He hasn't done anything to warrant a change and he's also one of the respected leaders on the team. I do agree that it would be good to get Ben Bryant some playing time in appropriate spots to keep him ready because Ridder does not have a lot of meat on his bones and he has taken some shots this year. Maybe during the UGone or Tulsa games Bryant can get some extended minutes.

In terms of numbers, Ridder looks to be trending about the same or slightly better than last year. With the type of offense we run featuring the ground game and plays that move the chains I don't know that we can expect him to have big passing numbers per se. As a comparison to former UC QB's, he only needs about another 1,000 yards passing to move up to 10th all-time. His completion percentage over two years [62.3] is second only to Brendon Kay's 65.4. Not too shabby.

I agree that Ridder is not an elite talent but no one expected that out of him anyway. He's doing what the staff is asking - manage the game and limit negative plays. He still could have more upside but it is something he can continue to grow in and not try to become something he's not too quickly.

On another note, isn't it telling to our overall team talent and depth that we can even entertain the question of a QB controversy when the starter is playing solid? Credit to Fick and the staff for building our team up in solid recruiting.

UC isn't winning because of Ridder. UC isn't winning in spite of Ridder either. Ridder is a solid QB. He is not a difference maker. Look at Clemson and Bama. Clemson started Kelly Bryant for a season+ winning big time. When Lawrence was ready he became the QB. Tua situation at Bama is similar (and at Bama Hurts is actually a difference maker QB too). Ridder may earn the job next year, but I am hopeful that they aren't just going to give it to him because they keep winning. Best case scenario is we watch him become a difference maker as this season goes on and feel great about him starting next year. I feel fine with Ridder now, but that doesn't mean we should ignore possible upgrades.

I understand where you're coming from and I don't disagree in general but this staff isn't going to turn the reigns over to someone else just because they are an unproven "difference maker" either. I believe the staff has demonstrated that they welcome competition during the spring, so yes, Ridder won't just be given the keys as the "auto-starter" next season. If he finishes the year strong and healthy and the Cats keep winning I find it hard to believe that he won't retain the starting job going into the first game of his Junior year. Again, I was posting on the premise of the OP that there may be a QB controversy...

i think this is right. i consider Fickell to be more of a Tressel acolyte vs. Urban or Cooper, and probably maintains a more conservative approach to managing roster personnel. As noted elsewhere in this thread, he's not afraid to make a change but as long as they keep winning, regardless of the prowess of Ridder's performance, i don't foresee a change going forward. i think Fickell values the chemistry that the team has with Ridder at QB1 and will be loathe to upset that. i think for Ridder to get pulled, he would have to be materially responsible for a number of losses (probably 3+ losses).