I think Murphy's programs are successful and still will find 20 wins someday. A blind replacement is risky because it's obvious we don't have the juice to keep up with Akron or Buffalo. This guy has put down seven years of .500 basketball, after 12 years of .300 basketball. People also forget that Ben Braun himself had losing seasons here mixed in with his successes. And before Ben Braun came along, EMU had TWO winning seasons over the prior fourteen years (1972 - 1986).

If you're gonna spin the wheel of fortune without any scratch for a pay raise and without any clear plan besides "YOU! OUT!", know that the odds are against this going well.

(02-14-2018 12:18 PM)Block_E Wrote:  I think Murphy's programs are successful and still will find 20 wins someday. A blind replacement is risky because it's obvious we don't have the juice to keep up with Akron or Buffalo. This guy has put down seven years of .500 basketball, after 12 years of .300 basketball. People also forget that Ben Braun himself had losing seasons here mixed in with his successes. And before Ben Braun came along, EMU had TWO winning seasons over the prior fourteen years (1972 - 1986).

If you're gonna spin the wheel of fortune without any scratch for a pay raise and without any clear plan besides "YOU! OUT!", know that the odds are against this going well.

I have been closely following EMU MBB and FB since '91 (not much before). I did follow EMU sports while i was at EMU and then 'fell away' before becoming a fan again.

As far as MBB we went through the golden years of EMU MBB. No doubt about it. As good as it gets.

I can understand how anyone who followed EMU MBB from say 1988 to 1998 can be frustrated with a .500 season (yes, EMU is .500 after throwing out the non-D-I games).

Many folks would be happy with a .500 record with good talent, near .500 in conference.

I say, until I'm blue in the face, that the MAC of the '90s, e.g., BSU, EMU, Miami, Ohio U, etc. does not exist any more. We don't have the future NBA players like Grant Long ('88), Gary Trent, Boykins, Dial, Bonzi Wells, Wally Szczerbiak, etc. etc.

Comparing the MAC today with the MAC 20 years ago I like comparing Detroit, Flint, Saginaw, etc. to those cities 30 or 40 years ago. Times have changed. Some times change works out for programs, communities, etc. and some times it does not.

P.S. I don't know why we haven't had a top 25 MAC team this millennium.

Exactly, which is why it is even more important that we find a good coach. The MAC is not good like it used to be, EMU should always be in contention for a MAC championship. If this team played in the 'golden age' it would be a last place team.

So what if they miss again in hiring a coach? then what? how much time does that coach get 5 years?

(02-14-2018 01:13 PM)emu steve Wrote:  

(02-14-2018 12:18 PM)Block_E Wrote:  I think Murphy's programs are successful and still will find 20 wins someday. A blind replacement is risky because it's obvious we don't have the juice to keep up with Akron or Buffalo. This guy has put down seven years of .500 basketball, after 12 years of .300 basketball. People also forget that Ben Braun himself had losing seasons here mixed in with his successes. And before Ben Braun came along, EMU had TWO winning seasons over the prior fourteen years (1972 - 1986).

If you're gonna spin the wheel of fortune without any scratch for a pay raise and without any clear plan besides "YOU! OUT!", know that the odds are against this going well.

I have been closely following EMU MBB and FB since '91 (not much before). I did follow EMU sports while i was at EMU and then 'fell away' before becoming a fan again.

As far as MBB we went through the golden years of EMU MBB. No doubt about it. As good as it gets.

I can understand how anyone who followed EMU MBB from say 1988 to 1998 can be frustrated with a .500 season (yes, EMU is .500 after throwing out the non-D-I games).

Many folks would be happy with a .500 record with good talent, near .500 in conference.

I say, until I'm blue in the face, that the MAC of the '90s, e.g., BSU, EMU, Miami, Ohio U, etc. does not exist any more. We don't have the future NBA players like Grant Long ('88), Gary Trent, Boykins, Dial, Bonzi Wells, Wally Szczerbiak, etc. etc.

Comparing the MAC today with the MAC 20 years ago I like comparing Detroit, Flint, Saginaw, etc. to those cities 30 or 40 years ago. Times have changed. Some times change works out for programs, communities, etc. and some times it does not.

P.S. I don't know why we haven't had a top 25 MAC team this millennium.

The MAC hasn't had a true NBA player since 1999.

(02-14-2018 02:28 PM)emussuperfan Wrote:  

(02-14-2018 01:13 PM)emu steve Wrote:  

(02-14-2018 12:18 PM)Block_E Wrote:  I think Murphy's programs are successful and still will find 20 wins someday. A blind replacement is risky because it's obvious we don't have the juice to keep up with Akron or Buffalo. This guy has put down seven years of .500 basketball, after 12 years of .300 basketball. People also forget that Ben Braun himself had losing seasons here mixed in with his successes. And before Ben Braun came along, EMU had TWO winning seasons over the prior fourteen years (1972 - 1986).

If you're gonna spin the wheel of fortune without any scratch for a pay raise and without any clear plan besides "YOU! OUT!", know that the odds are against this going well.

I have been closely following EMU MBB and FB since '91 (not much before). I did follow EMU sports while i was at EMU and then 'fell away' before becoming a fan again.

As far as MBB we went through the golden years of EMU MBB. No doubt about it. As good as it gets.

I can understand how anyone who followed EMU MBB from say 1988 to 1998 can be frustrated with a .500 season (yes, EMU is .500 after throwing out the non-D-I games).

Many folks would be happy with a .500 record with good talent, near .500 in conference.

I say, until I'm blue in the face, that the MAC of the '90s, e.g., BSU, EMU, Miami, Ohio U, etc. does not exist any more. We don't have the future NBA players like Grant Long ('88), Gary Trent, Boykins, Dial, Bonzi Wells, Wally Szczerbiak, etc. etc.

Comparing the MAC today with the MAC 20 years ago I like comparing Detroit, Flint, Saginaw, etc. to those cities 30 or 40 years ago. Times have changed. Some times change works out for programs, communities, etc. and some times it does not.

P.S. I don't know why we haven't had a top 25 MAC team this millennium.

The MAC hasn't had a true NBA player since 1999.

Yes, it is a CONFERENCE problem. This is the logical negation of the saying: "A rising tide lifts all boats."

MAC needs a top 25 team to get the nation's attention and raise its image.

The mac has gone steadily downhill in the late 1990s it was rated as high a an 11th -grade conference today it's no better than 14th. Also we fought hard to get 2 NCAA bids now most don't even get a tournament winner a bid.

Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result

(02-14-2018 03:23 PM)emu79 Wrote:  Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result

Okay, what are we (MAC?) doing and what should it do?

Should MAC schools start offering 750k - 1M HC contracts?

Other than pouring money into MBB I don't know what MAC schools can do. We need to realize that MAC schools are in states denoted 'rust belt' which means they are not flush with money for higher education.

One could argue that as the rust belt states struggled economically and financially that money for athletics have suffered...

And as I have mentioned before, after Marshall came and had big time success (nationally ranked) the MAC schools put big bucks in FB Think Marshall, Miami, Toledo, BG, etc.

(02-14-2018 01:13 PM)emu steve Wrote:  

(02-14-2018 12:18 PM)Block_E Wrote:  I think Murphy's programs are successful and still will find 20 wins someday. A blind replacement is risky because it's obvious we don't have the juice to keep up with Akron or Buffalo. This guy has put down seven years of .500 basketball, after 12 years of .300 basketball. People also forget that Ben Braun himself had losing seasons here mixed in with his successes. And before Ben Braun came along, EMU had TWO winning seasons over the prior fourteen years (1972 - 1986).

If you're gonna spin the wheel of fortune without any scratch for a pay raise and without any clear plan besides "YOU! OUT!", know that the odds are against this going well.

I have been closely following EMU MBB and FB since '91 (not much before). I did follow EMU sports while i was at EMU and then 'fell away' before becoming a fan again.

As far as MBB we went through the golden years of EMU MBB. No doubt about it. As good as it gets.

I can understand how anyone who followed EMU MBB from say 1988 to 1998 can be frustrated with a .500 season (yes, EMU is .500 after throwing out the non-D-I games).

Many folks would be happy with a .500 record with good talent, near .500 in conference.

I say, until I'm blue in the face, that the MAC of the '90s, e.g., BSU, EMU, Miami, Ohio U, etc. does not exist any more. We don't have the future NBA players like Grant Long ('88), Gary Trent, Boykins, Dial, Bonzi Wells, Wally Szczerbiak, etc. etc.

Comparing the MAC today with the MAC 20 years ago I like comparing Detroit, Flint, Saginaw, etc. to those cities 30 or 40 years ago. Times have changed. Some times change works out for programs, communities, etc. and some times it does not.

P.S. I don't know why we haven't had a top 25 MAC team this millennium.

Agree the MAC is much weaker in basketball which is all the more reason to bring in a new coach. The MAC has very average to poor coaching and Murphy still can not get above 0.500

EMU will have no choice to fire him, because the fanbase and students are losing interest.

Heather Lyke made a great hire for football. I would trust her to make the basketball hire. I do not know much about Wetherbe s capability but we're going to find out.

(02-14-2018 03:42 PM)emu steve Wrote:  

(02-14-2018 03:23 PM)emu79 Wrote:  Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result

Okay, what are we (MAC?) doing and what should it do?

Should MAC schools start offering 750k - 1M HC contracts?

Other than pouring money into MBB I don't know what MAC schools can do. We need to realize that MAC schools are in states denoted 'rust belt' which means they are not flush with money for higher education.

One could argue that as the rust belt states struggled economically and financially that money for athletics have suffered...

And as I have mentioned before, after Marshall came and had big time success (nationally ranked) the MAC schools put big bucks in FB Think Marshall, Miami, Toledo, BG, etc.

Here's my conspiracy theory. The reason the Mid-American Conference is not as highly thought of as it used to be is that the big boys are doing a better job of controlling the schedule. They play very few games on the road in a MAC arena and avoid the team entirely that are capable of pulling an upset. They do this to keep their records clean to improve their chances of playing in the big dance. And I don't think it's just a MAC thing, it's all mid-major conferences. They are increasing the perceived separation between the big boys and the mid-majors. The general population likes a Cinderella, but they don't. It's all about money.

Steve, since you want to compare this era of Eastern basketball with the golden days, back then Eastern won the conference three times. They might have been around .500 some of those years but they were capable of winning the conference occasionally. We can't say the same now. Sustained mediocrity is not good.

(02-14-2018 04:31 PM)TheWoodenNickle Wrote:  

(02-14-2018 03:42 PM)emu steve Wrote:  

(02-14-2018 03:23 PM)emu79 Wrote:  Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result

Okay, what are we (MAC?) doing and what should it do?

Should MAC schools start offering 750k - 1M HC contracts?

Other than pouring money into MBB I don't know what MAC schools can do. We need to realize that MAC schools are in states denoted 'rust belt' which means they are not flush with money for higher education.

One could argue that as the rust belt states struggled economically and financially that money for athletics have suffered...

And as I have mentioned before, after Marshall came and had big time success (nationally ranked) the MAC schools put big bucks in FB Think Marshall, Miami, Toledo, BG, etc.

Here's my conspiracy theory. The reason the Mid-American Conference is not as highly thought of as it used to be is that the big boys are doing a better job of controlling the schedule. They play very few games on the road in a MAC arena and avoid the team entirely that are capable of pulling an upset. They do this to keep their records clean to improve their chances of playing in the big dance. And I don't think it's just a MAC thing, it's all mid-major conferences. They are increasing the perceived separation between the big boys and the mid-majors. The general population likes a Cinderella, but they don't. It's all about money.

Steve, since you want to compare this era of Eastern basketball with the golden days, back then Eastern won the conference three times. They might have been around .500 some of those years but they were capable of winning the conference occasionally. We can't say the same now. Sustained mediocrity is not good.

I agree with your first paragraph. Big money and coaches who will not take a chance of a road upset.

Okay, 'Nickle, you are now on my turf with your 2nd paragraph (because I followed recruiting closely back then).

After the 1990/91 season Braun had to rebuild and had a bad season or two. Then along came the studs like Brian Tolbert and Theron Wilson and then along came Boykins, Dial, Head, Nink, Zajac, etc. and the rebuild was completed. That lasted until 1998 which was the end of that class.

Braun and Waters did a great job of doing a complete rebuild after the '91 team graduated (Kennedy, Thomas & Thomas, etc.). It did take, I think, two years.

P.S. I 'blame' AAU ball, summer camps, Internet, etc. for 'exposing' all the sleepers. Now if a kid can play high major ball, the bigs will find him and he won't go to the mid-majors.

I might add parenthetically, 'Nickle, the exact OPPOSITE is happening in FB.

Posters have noted that we have future games with Kentucky, SDSU, etc.

Some of the more affluent MAC teams will host big name schools including Miami (FL), Syracuse, Cincinnati, BYU, Maryland, Kentucky, SDSU, Kansas, Missouri, Iowa State, etc.

(02-14-2018 05:00 PM)emu steve Wrote:  I might add parenthetically, 'Nickle, the exact OPPOSITE is happening in FB.

Posters have noted that we have future games with Kentucky, SDSU, etc.

Some of the more affluent MAC teams will host big name schools including Miami (FL), Syracuse, Cincinnati, BYU, Maryland, Kentucky, SDSU, Kansas, etc.

When is the last time Michigan played at Road game at a non P5 School? I don't think they ever had. The super rich will never play one of those games. Seven or eight home games a year is far too profitable.

I mean in Football we COULD have hosted MSU . . . but Mizzou was our biggest payout ever, and State wanted a home game.

Look, the same thing is happening in all revenue sports. All the money and most of the recruits are going to P5, everyone else is stuck in a bad investment, and we're really just waiting until the P5 finally says they don't need to share anymore. At that point we'll know whether D2 is a wise move or whether the G5 / MAC is still feasible, because it won't just be US trying to make a decision, it will be the entire Michigan MAC.

I don't think it's a Power 5 domination problem. Gonzaga, Butler, Villanova and Wichita St are not P5 teams but have been extremely relevant with regard to NCAA basketball.

It's a resource allocation issue. There are a bunch of schools like the aforementioned who don't have football programs and if they do, play a Division 2 schedule. A blue chip high school prospect in the Midwest can go to a MAC school where he plays in the NCAA tournament only if his team wins the MAC tourney or to a Xavier, Dayton and Butler that might get an at large bid. Coaches at these non-football schools make the same or better money than the MAC guys while enjoying the adulation of being the coach of the most prestigious sport on campus.

The MAC has chased the football revenue understandably as it dwarfs that of basketball and that is why Syracuse and Boston College left the Big East for the ACC. Michigan State football earned 59.2 million in revenue two years ago while its legendary basketball team pulled in about 1/8 of that at 7.2 million. As much as I despise the MACtion football games in November, ESPN pays an average of $700,000 per school to televise them, far more than basketball could fetch for the entire season.

That is why you will see a whole lot more Kareem Hunts before you see any more Ron Harpers or Wally Szczerbiaks ever again.

(02-14-2018 02:28 PM)emussuperfan Wrote:  

(02-14-2018 01:13 PM)emu steve Wrote:  

(02-14-2018 12:18 PM)Block_E Wrote:  I think Murphy's programs are successful and still will find 20 wins someday. A blind replacement is risky because it's obvious we don't have the juice to keep up with Akron or Buffalo. This guy has put down seven years of .500 basketball, after 12 years of .300 basketball. People also forget that Ben Braun himself had losing seasons here mixed in with his successes. And before Ben Braun came along, EMU had TWO winning seasons over the prior fourteen years (1972 - 1986).

If you're gonna spin the wheel of fortune without any scratch for a pay raise and without any clear plan besides "YOU! OUT!", know that the odds are against this going well.

I have been closely following EMU MBB and FB since '91 (not much before). I did follow EMU sports while i was at EMU and then 'fell away' before becoming a fan again.

As far as MBB we went through the golden years of EMU MBB. No doubt about it. As good as it gets.

I can understand how anyone who followed EMU MBB from say 1988 to 1998 can be frustrated with a .500 season (yes, EMU is .500 after throwing out the non-D-I games).

Many folks would be happy with a .500 record with good talent, near .500 in conference.

I say, until I'm blue in the face, that the MAC of the '90s, e.g., BSU, EMU, Miami, Ohio U, etc. does not exist any more. We don't have the future NBA players like Grant Long ('88), Gary Trent, Boykins, Dial, Bonzi Wells, Wally Szczerbiak, etc. etc.

Comparing the MAC today with the MAC 20 years ago I like comparing Detroit, Flint, Saginaw, etc. to those cities 30 or 40 years ago. Times have changed. Some times change works out for programs, communities, etc. and some times it does not.

P.S. I don't know why we haven't had a top 25 MAC team this millennium.

The MAC hasn't had a true NBA player since 1999.

Richaun Holmes might disagree with that statement. I know his $1.074 million per season salary is 'true.'

Steve, I'm hoping for reasons to have Murphy keep his job for the past THREE seasons including this one. I'm seen nothing but perhaps the best athletic teams in EMU men's hoop history accomplish nothing above .500 and not playing up to their level but playing to lose like the football team once did. Lack of consistent focus on defense and for two halves and lack of things like making free throws and milling around on offense is why we lose games. Thompson is wasted on this team. We put up with the Raven aka Ray Lee pout fest way too long in my opinion as an example . That's my thoughts.

Michigan played @ UCONN in 2013.

One thing I hope we all keep in mind:

We are tied for 6th in the MAC standings.

Last year the #6 seed, Kent State, beat the #1 seed, Akron.

That is why we have tourneys, I have no idea who is going to win the tourney: UB? TOL? Someone else?