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flushtheherd Offline
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Post: #21
RE: NFL combine
(02-07-2018 08:12 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  Come to think of it... none of these 8 guys mentioned (Ernsberger, Chukes, Jarvion, Phillips, Pfeifer, Mitchell, Asantay, Spillane) missed much (if any?) time due to injury last season... yet that red herring still somehow exists... <sigh>

Last I checked it takes more than 8 guys to play a game of football.... and Pfeifer only snaps the ball to a kicker... but you can go ahead and continue to drive your narrative.
02-07-2018 08:46 PM
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Hoekjeness Offline
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Post: #22
RE: NFL combine
(02-07-2018 08:46 PM)flushtheherd Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 08:12 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  Come to think of it... none of these 8 guys mentioned (Ernsberger, Chukes, Jarvion, Phillips, Pfeifer, Mitchell, Asantay, Spillane) missed much (if any?) time due to injury last season... yet that red herring still somehow exists... <sigh>

Last I checked it takes more than 8 guys to play a game of football.... and Pfeifer only snaps the ball to a kicker... but you can go ahead and continue to drive your narrative.

That’s precisely the point.

We had talent across the field on both sides of the ball, including special teams.

No MAC team is going to have all 22 NFL-caliber players. But having 7-8 of them on one roster shows pretty remarkable depth.
(This post was last modified: 02-08-2018 06:06 AM by Hoekjeness.)
02-08-2018 06:06 AM
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brovol Offline
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Post: #23
RE: NFL combine
(02-07-2018 04:39 PM)RunningGame Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 03:57 PM)brovol Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 02:54 PM)RunningGame Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 02:15 PM)brovol Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 10:51 AM)Wmufan715 Wrote:  Hiller I don’t see 8 NFL players on next year’s team. Aside from Keenoy and Beal, not any big talent. Bogan is too small.

And only Alabama sends 8. Sending 4 is really really good for a team that went 6-6. I thought Spillane would be on the fence. Seems his decision last spring hurt him in that he never rebounded to what he was as a junior.

They are inviting these players because they know, mostly by what they saw prior to this past season, that they have NFL talent. As others have said, we have great players who are leaving and arent getting a combine shot. The 2017 team that Lester inherited was perhaps the most talented in school history. 2016 team might be slightly better, but perhaps not. Unfortunately, the 2017 team is also the most underachieving team ever.

It's a team sport, Brovol, not an average of talent. The 2011 Colts were as talented at the 2010 Colts or the 2012 Colts, except for one key position...
My point exactly. Even great players will lose in football against less talented players if not playing well as a team; players and coaches included. But with good coaching, great players become a great team, and win lots of games.

We had great players; but not a good team. Coaching is critical in college football. Planning, teaching, preparing, game decisions, recruiting, dealing with issues on and off the field (including injuries which will always happen throughout the course of a season), and motivation, are all huge in determining which team wins on a Saturday afternoon.

So, I couldnt agree with you more RunningGame.

You know that wasn't my point.

My point was that every position needs to be playing at a high level to have a great team. The team is as strong as the weakest link, and last year an entire phase of the game was our weak link before the injuries piled up. The 2013 Bronco squad was a year of extreme underachievement from your perspective given the coaching and talent present on the team. How many current NFL players? Four? However, it had a lot of youth and a ton of injuries as well, and sometimes you need to row through muddy water to become the ELITE nekton you were meant to be.

If we're going to beat this dead bronco some more, let's keep it straight.

No, my friend; a "chain" is only as strong as its weakest link. A "team" makes up for weaknesses by working together and compensating for "weaknesses". It is what makes team sports so great. Many great college football teams have several weaknesses, and inexperienced players. All football teams have lots of injuries throughout a season. Only the teams with poor records reference "injuries" or "inexperience" as reasons for failure. And the teams who just beat them just smile and say, "whatever".

The 2017 WMU football team was loaded with talent; proven talent. We grossly underachieved, not because of injuries or talent, but because the coaches didnt put us in a good position to win enough, and did not take advantage of our superior manpower and abilities. Look at the prediction thread at the beginning of the season to provide a perspective. Throughout the season our offensive game plan was predictable, unimaginative, and thus put our QB's and receivers consistently in a bad 3rd and long situation. The staff never seemed to adjust during the season, and kept hoping that our running game would become dominant enough to gain yards even while defenses were stacking the line. That never has worked, and never will work, no matter how good your backs and line are in an offense like ours.

The 2017 season was a lost golden opportunity to repeat as MAC Champs and continue the tremendous momentum our program had. It is history now, and I can live with that as long as we learn from the experience and don't repeat the mistakes. I would love for Lester to be successful here, but if he sticks with the same philosophies he and his staff had this past season, he never will be successful here.
02-08-2018 09:41 AM
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RunningGame Offline
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Post: #24
RE: NFL combine
(02-08-2018 06:06 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 08:46 PM)flushtheherd Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 08:12 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  Come to think of it... none of these 8 guys mentioned (Ernsberger, Chukes, Jarvion, Phillips, Pfeifer, Mitchell, Asantay, Spillane) missed much (if any?) time due to injury last season... yet that red herring still somehow exists... <sigh>

Last I checked it takes more than 8 guys to play a game of football.... and Pfeifer only snaps the ball to a kicker... but you can go ahead and continue to drive your narrative.

That’s precisely the point.

We had talent across the field on both sides of the ball, including special teams.

No MAC team is going to have all 22 NFL-caliber players. But having 7-8 of them on one roster shows pretty remarkable depth.

Then why did our 2012 squad with 7 future NFL players fail (including several high round picks)? Was it poor coaching? You're fixating on one or two things the same way other fans were that season. Have a little faith baby, have a little faith!
02-08-2018 11:52 AM
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brovol Offline
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Post: #25
RE: NFL combine
(02-08-2018 11:52 AM)RunningGame Wrote:  
(02-08-2018 06:06 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 08:46 PM)flushtheherd Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 08:12 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  Come to think of it... none of these 8 guys mentioned (Ernsberger, Chukes, Jarvion, Phillips, Pfeifer, Mitchell, Asantay, Spillane) missed much (if any?) time due to injury last season... yet that red herring still somehow exists... <sigh>

Last I checked it takes more than 8 guys to play a game of football.... and Pfeifer only snaps the ball to a kicker... but you can go ahead and continue to drive your narrative.

That’s precisely the point.

We had talent across the field on both sides of the ball, including special teams.

No MAC team is going to have all 22 NFL-caliber players. But having 7-8 of them on one roster shows pretty remarkable depth.

Then why did our 2012 squad with 7 future NFL players fail (including several high round picks)? Was it poor coaching? You're fixating on one or two things the same way other fans were that season. Have a little faith baby, have a little faith!

Yes, poor coaching. Nice thing about that year is that our coaches learned, changed and improved what they were doing. Lets hope this current staff does the same.
02-08-2018 01:35 PM
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Hoekjeness Offline
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Post: #26
RE: NFL combine
(02-08-2018 11:52 AM)RunningGame Wrote:  
(02-08-2018 06:06 AM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 08:46 PM)flushtheherd Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 08:12 PM)Hoekjeness Wrote:  Come to think of it... none of these 8 guys mentioned (Ernsberger, Chukes, Jarvion, Phillips, Pfeifer, Mitchell, Asantay, Spillane) missed much (if any?) time due to injury last season... yet that red herring still somehow exists... <sigh>

Last I checked it takes more than 8 guys to play a game of football.... and Pfeifer only snaps the ball to a kicker... but you can go ahead and continue to drive your narrative.

That’s precisely the point.

We had talent across the field on both sides of the ball, including special teams.

No MAC team is going to have all 22 NFL-caliber players. But having 7-8 of them on one roster shows pretty remarkable depth.

Then why did our 2012 squad with 7 future NFL players fail (including several high round picks)? Was it poor coaching? You're fixating on one or two things the same way other fans were that season. Have a little faith baby, have a little faith!

Fixating on one or two things... you mean, like blaming everything on injuries?
02-08-2018 07:00 PM
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wmubroncopilot Offline
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Post: #27
RE: NFL combine
Part of the problem in 2013 was coaching, part injuries, part talent. Most of the "future NFL players" referenced were freshmen, not seniors like last year. Those same issues in various forms cost us games in 2017. The talent difference was the difference between 1-11 and 6-6.

This staff's ability to recruit is encouraging but I'm not sure things will get better right away given how much talent we lose.
02-08-2018 07:04 PM
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Dirty Ernie Offline
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Post: #28
RE: NFL combine
(02-08-2018 07:04 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  Part of the problem in 2013 was coaching, part injuries, part talent. Most of the "future NFL players" referenced were freshmen, not seniors like last year. Those same issues in various forms cost us games in 2017. The talent difference was the difference between 1-11 and 6-6.

This staff's ability to recruit is encouraging but I'm not sure things will get better right away given how much talent we lose.

At least an equal chance that we will get better with the talent gone. I’m not saying they were bad players, obviously not, but I have a hunch they were not in to it that much. Senior-itis is what we used to call it.
02-08-2018 08:18 PM
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