The unofficial online home for fans of the Western Michigan University Broncos. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

(01-20-2018 11:17 AM)BuickBronco Wrote:  Buffalo has chance at sweet 16 spot. That said our centers got killed last night. Can't keep up with speed and handle the ball when needed. Our best rebounders are Davis, Johnson, Wilder and Jones. I would move Johnson to center, start Jones. Lamont just can't get going this year after last years injury bug, Duggan isn't in playing shape yet.

Lamont is just a giant pylon out there at times... No idea whats going on with him... If he could get that baby hook to work more often he would be dangerous... He just backs himself to the bucket and has no options... works has a$$ off down low and nearly always comes away empty...

(01-19-2018 10:42 PM)flushtheherd Wrote:  Are we seeing the demise of the Hawkins dynasty here at WMU? This team is talented enough to not look this inept.... I’ve always argued that hawk led teams suck at shooting... just curious where everyone else stands. Hawk has done so much for this program it’s hard to not give him the “Izzo wait till the end of the year” pass... I just hope we turn it around...

You gotta give him the wait til the end of the year pass, but this is bad. Hawk's always struggled when he hasn't had really good bigs. The Kool years (post-Joe) and the Wilder years (post-Whit) are evidence to me that he's not capable of adapting his offense to fit his personnel. I see the way Kampe is able to spread things out for guys like Nunn and Martez-Walker (name?) and I get super jealous. Buffalo's offense, too, is a guard-centric thing of beauty that looks a lot more like what NBA teams are all running. I think Hurley's influence is still being seen there in terms of the system they run. We just don't seem to have any clue how to run the kinds of sets that are bread and butter for NBA teams (4 guys on the perimeter and a pick and roll for a ballhandler), this despite the fact that our personnel is soo much better suited to that kind of offense than to Hawk's 1980's motion **** that seems designed to get Drake Lamont post-ups and a lot of opportunities for offensive boards. That works pretty well when you have a Reitz, Paul, Whittington, Tava, Stainbrook, Mike Williams, but makes no sense when your best offensive players are Wilder, Moore, Jones, and Davis.

I'll definitely wait and see, but I'm pretty bummed. I thought this team was going to be doing what Buffalo is doing and instead it looks like a typical top-third-of-the-MAC team. I think Hawk's system has a pretty high floor, but I'm starting to worry that it has a low ceiling too. I'll admit I've had some Saddi Washington fantasies lately, especially after reading about his recruitment of Isaiah Livers, at Oakland and then at Michigan.

They may have been the quickest MAC team I've ever seen...How many layups did they get by blowing past our defense, and how many times did they're, in your face man-to-man totally stuff our "O" ???? A LOT..
I hate to say this, but our big men ought to be in division 2 basketball...The middle is really, really weak.....It isn't the fault of those two kids, they play their asses off.....It's rather the evaluation of the Bronco recruiting staff who brought them here in the first place that I blame...

(01-20-2018 11:59 AM)HaymondAtThe4 Wrote:  

(01-19-2018 10:42 PM)flushtheherd Wrote:  Are we seeing the demise of the Hawkins dynasty here at WMU? This team is talented enough to not look this inept.... I’ve always argued that hawk led teams suck at shooting... just curious where everyone else stands. Hawk has done so much for this program it’s hard to not give him the “Izzo wait till the end of the year” pass... I just hope we turn it around...

You gotta give him the wait til the end of the year pass, but this is bad. Hawk's always struggled when he hasn't had really good bigs. The Kool years (post-Joe) and the Wilder years (post-Whit) are evidence to me that he's not capable of adapting his offense to fit his personnel. I see the way Kampe is able to spread things out for guys like Nunn and Martez-Walker (name?) and I get super jealous. Buffalo's offense, too, is a guard-centric thing of beauty that looks a lot more like what NBA teams are all running. I think Hurley's influence is still being seen there in terms of the system they run. We just don't seem to have any clue how to run the kinds of sets that are bread and butter for NBA teams (4 guys on the perimeter and a pick and roll for a ballhandler), this despite the fact that our personnel is soo much better suited to that kind of offense than to Hawk's 1980's motion **** that seems designed to get Drake Lamont post-ups and a lot of opportunities for offensive boards. That works pretty well when you have a Reitz, Paul, Whittington, Tava, Stainbrook, Mike Williams, but makes no sense when your best offensive players are Wilder, Moore, Jones, and Davis.

I'll definitely wait and see, but I'm pretty bummed. I thought this team was going to be doing what Buffalo is doing and instead it looks like a typical top-third-of-the-MAC team. I think Hawk's system has a pretty high floor, but I'm starting to worry that it has a low ceiling too. I'll admit I've had some Saddi Washington fantasies lately, especially after reading about his recruitment of Isaiah Livers, at Oakland and then at Michigan.

I would be super pumped if we somehow landed Saddi as our next HC once Hawk leaves WMU... likely by the time Hawk leaves, Saddi will already be an HC somewhere... at or above WMU.

IMO UB is the best MAC team since the Szerbiack Miami team. I don’t think Coach K himself could have coached us to a win. UB has that much more talent, and they really move the ball.

That said, I prefer our smaller line up with Johnson in the post. They move better without the ball, seem to have a better flow, and they get more offensive boards. Lamont is a serviceable back up. Dugan should have redshirted. Centers take longer to develop, and Dugan’s clock is running out. He plays soft, sulks when things aren’t going his way.

The style of basketball is changing. The era of the big post guy is done, at least for awhile. A classic example yesterday had Lamont just inside the free throw line, facing the basket. The defender backed off, and Lamont wouldn’t take the shot. Offenses today require frontliners to take and make open shots.

I marveled at how quickly UB moved the ball, and how they pressured the perimeter. There were no easy passes, even 30 feet from the basket. Great coaching. No drop off from when Hurley left and Beard transferred.

When we visit UB I expect to lose by 20. This team mirrors the South Carolina team that we played twice.

(01-20-2018 11:59 AM)HaymondAtThe4 Wrote:  The Kool years (post-Joe) and the Wilder years (post-Whit) are evidence to me that he's not capable of adapting his offense to fit his personnel. We just don't seem to have any clue how to run the kinds of sets that are bread and butter for NBA teams (4 guys on the perimeter and a pick and roll for a ballhandler), this despite the fact that our personnel is soo much better suited to that kind of offense than to Hawk's 1980's motion **** that seems designed to get Drake Lamont post-ups and a lot of opportunities for offensive boards.

Drake Lamont took 2 shots last night.

The offense is struggling, but I'm not sure you've defined the problem.

IMHO

We have players that are limited offensively. And our basketball IQ is HORRIBLE on the offensive end.

Look at the season stats.

RJ has taken the 2nd most shots on the team. He is shooting 37% from the field. He has taken 6 less 3 point attempts than Thomas Wilder. And he is shooting 26% from being the arc. Many of his shots are "quick"....not in the flow of the offense. Which leads to fast breaks going the other way. Why is this tolerated?

Brandon was 0-2 from behind the arc last night. He is shooting 21% from that range. Why is he allowed to shoot these?

Bryce Moore is a warrior. But he is limited on offense. Shooting 42% from the field (44% from beyond the arc). Teams simply crowd him now and make him put the ball on the floor, where he struggles.

Josh has had a GREAT year. I have been impressed and am happy for him because he has put in the time. He is not a threat off the dribble either.

Seth and Drake? Neither is a threat in the post. They are often near the 3 point line looking to pass the ball. While the defense guards us playing 5 on 4.

Randall is shooting 21% from the field. Printy is shooting 40% from the field, and is one dimensional.

Akongshul is very limited offensively.

Buffalo was VERY good defensively last night. Many times it was an effort just to get a shot off. As mentioned by another poster, we were lucky enough to hit a couple of prayers as the shot clock ran out, or the score would have been much worse.

Going forward, we need to stop helping teams defend us. We need to play better, and smarter on the offensive end. Because there isn't a lot of room for error.

Oh yeah....FWIW....Buffalo has 1 senior on their team.

(01-20-2018 12:06 PM)broncojohnny Wrote:  They may have been the quickest MAC team I've ever seen...How many layups did they get by blowing past our defense, and how many times did they're, in your face man-to-man totally stuff our "O" ???? A LOT..
I hate to say this, but our big men ought to be in division 2 basketball...The middle is really, really weak.....It isn't the fault of those two kids, they play their asses off.....It's rather the evaluation of the Bronco recruiting staff who brought them here in the first place that I blame...

Lamont had an OU offer and Dugan had 15 offers, including Purdue. I don’t think we did a bad job evaluating them. Both have seen significant PT since their freshmen year. Neither has shown huge development. In the case of Dugan, I just don’t think being competitive is in his DNA. Not sure you can coach what he needs. Lamont has taken his skill set as far as it can go.

(01-20-2018 02:30 PM)Chipdip2 Wrote:  

(01-20-2018 12:06 PM)broncojohnny Wrote:  They may have been the quickest MAC team I've ever seen...How many layups did they get by blowing past our defense, and how many times did they're, in your face man-to-man totally stuff our "O" ???? A LOT..
I hate to say this, but our big men ought to be in division 2 basketball...The middle is really, really weak.....It isn't the fault of those two kids, they play their asses off.....It's rather the evaluation of the Bronco recruiting staff who brought them here in the first place that I blame...

Neither has shown huge development. In the case of Dugan, I just don’t think being competitive is in his DNA. Not sure you can coach what he needs.

Totally disagree regarding Dugan. He is much better and showed it before injury. Talked to him a few times off the court I think his DNA is different than has showed but he still is bothered by the injury. Playing HS BB vs 6'3 guys requires a huge transition to D1, it isn't like Seth playing A class teams in HS. If you have listened to Hawk talk about centers it takes two season minimum. Whittington was lights on his SR season.

Whittington made huge improvement as a 5th year senior.
Seth should have been redshirted.

Saw Dugan at Saturday nights hockey game wearing a boot. Probably just precautionary but shows his foot isn't close to 100%.