So, USM is only as strong as winless UTEP and Charlotte that plays in a 15,000 seat stadium.

(12-30-2017 01:58 PM)MasMack Wrote:  

(12-29-2017 11:57 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-29-2017 11:09 PM)MasMack Wrote:  

(12-29-2017 10:55 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-29-2017 10:31 PM)MasMack Wrote:  Navy played in their own stadium and sold out their allotment. 2 of the 3 points don’t add up (nor does anything else you said).

Besides, how do you explain the 2-10 versus other G5 teams. Oh wait, Nevermind, I’ll just go to the “top three excuses” thread.

NMCMS was 50/50 Navy-UVa. I was there.
And how does Navy selling tickets affect whether or not "it’s just real hard for [UVa] to get up for a bowl game" vs AAC team? They were up for it. As much or more than FSU and Duke.
My point remains: top CUSA and MAC get whupped by mediocre, not especially motivated ACC team. Definitely motivated UVa team on level with the other two in a pick'em matchup with middle-of-the-pack AAC team and AAC Navy dominates.

P6. We're just a step ahead of the G4s.

You still didn’t address the 2-10 vs your brothers. As much as you hate it, you will be judged for this way more then you’re judged for 6-5 vs P5, unfortunately.

Only by G4 fans.
2-10 in bowls is eclipsed by 32-16 in regular season. If you care about stats, then the larger sample is enough. In national/media perception, the national narrative over the last few years is that bowls outside NY6 are losing their importance with over-emphasis on the CFP, draftees skipping them etc -- G4 wishful thinking that this smaller sample is somehow more important just don't stand up. Don't try the "that's what happens when American teams play good G4s" I've proven in detail in other threads that the 10 wins in the AAC 10-4 vs G4 this regular season came mostly against the better G4 teams; the four losses were AAC cellar dwellers.
Does the 6-5 v Playoff-5 conferences carry more weight? Actually yes it does. First, the national perception, ESPN, etc are all overly focussed on the Playoff-5 conferences, we all agree about that, right? So, yes, AAC success against the big name conferences DOES get weighted in national media/perception. Nobody caares whether the mwc Aggies or the SunBelt Aggies won in Tuscon tonight, nor will anyone long remember that LaTech beat SMU. Navy-Virginia win, though, was all over the Washington Post, and prompted that McMurphy tweet.
Second, go back to first principles: P6 is not an assertion that AAC=SEC today; P6 means closer to those five than to the little four. We make our 2025 strategic goal by separating from the G4s but just need to keep pace with the Playoff-5. In that regard, 6-5 works; 32-16 works; 2-10 is merely a blip on the radar.
You may want that 2-10 to be of outsize importance, but other than four conference message boards it isn't

{1} You’re only as strong as your weakest leak. A navy guy should know that. {2} Btw, great win against Virginia. Pure domination. And I love how you guys do it with toughness and discipline. You look to be set up for many successful years. Good luck to you! {3}SMTTT!

{1} Most here will always talk about the AAC's strength from top to bottom, but I don't think this aphorism is true for conferences. Is the SEC only as strong as Vanderbilt? (Or this year Tennessee). If you're saying that 2-10 is a chunk in armor, a weakness that can't be overcome, well SEC is 0-3 in bowls right now, and that doesn't change their conference strength. 2-10 <<< 32-16< 6-5.
{2} Thanks! Navy football for a change. Feeling good about next year.
{3} What is SMTTT or TTT? I would guess Southern Miss to the Top! but thought I might as well ask.

(12-30-2017 03:32 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 01:58 PM)MasMack Wrote:  

(12-29-2017 11:57 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-29-2017 11:09 PM)MasMack Wrote:  

(12-29-2017 10:55 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  NMCMS was 50/50 Navy-UVa. I was there.
And how does Navy selling tickets affect whether or not "it’s just real hard for [UVa] to get up for a bowl game" vs AAC team? They were up for it. As much or more than FSU and Duke.
My point remains: top CUSA and MAC get whupped by mediocre, not especially motivated ACC team. Definitely motivated UVa team on level with the other two in a pick'em matchup with middle-of-the-pack AAC team and AAC Navy dominates.

P6. We're just a step ahead of the G4s.

You still didn’t address the 2-10 vs your brothers. As much as you hate it, you will be judged for this way more then you’re judged for 6-5 vs P5, unfortunately.

Only by G4 fans.
2-10 in bowls is eclipsed by 32-16 in regular season. If you care about stats, then the larger sample is enough. In national/media perception, the national narrative over the last few years is that bowls outside NY6 are losing their importance with over-emphasis on the CFP, draftees skipping them etc -- G4 wishful thinking that this smaller sample is somehow more important just don't stand up. Don't try the "that's what happens when American teams play good G4s" I've proven in detail in other threads that the 10 wins in the AAC 10-4 vs G4 this regular season came mostly against the better G4 teams; the four losses were AAC cellar dwellers.
Does the 6-5 v Playoff-5 conferences carry more weight? Actually yes it does. First, the national perception, ESPN, etc are all overly focussed on the Playoff-5 conferences, we all agree about that, right? So, yes, AAC success against the big name conferences DOES get weighted in national media/perception. Nobody caares whether the mwc Aggies or the SunBelt Aggies won in Tuscon tonight, nor will anyone long remember that LaTech beat SMU. Navy-Virginia win, though, was all over the Washington Post, and prompted that McMurphy tweet.
Second, go back to first principles: P6 is not an assertion that AAC=SEC today; P6 means closer to those five than to the little four. We make our 2025 strategic goal by separating from the G4s but just need to keep pace with the Playoff-5. In that regard, 6-5 works; 32-16 works; 2-10 is merely a blip on the radar.
You may want that 2-10 to be of outsize importance, but other than four conference message boards it isn't

{1} You’re only as strong as your weakest leak. A navy guy should know that. {2} Btw, great win against Virginia. Pure domination. And I love how you guys do it with toughness and discipline. You look to be set up for many successful years. Good luck to you! {3}SMTTT!

{1} Most here will always talk about the AAC's strength from top to bottom, but I don't think this aphorism is true for conferences. Is the SEC only as strong as Vanderbilt? (Or this year Tennessee). If you're saying that 2-10 is a chunk in armor, a weakness that can't be overcome, well SEC is 0-3 in bowls right now, and that doesn't change their conference strength. 2-10 <<< 32-16< 6-5.
{2} Thanks! Navy football for a change. Feeling good about next year.
{3} What is SMTTT or TTT? I would guess Southern Miss to the Top! but thought I might as well ask.

Well mostly I’m just giving you a hard time. Banter back and forth is fun.

You’re right on SMTTT.

Freaking Memphis. Losing at home in front of a packed house on ABC to 7-5 Iowa St.

(12-30-2017 12:33 PM)Bull Wrote:  The winning record versus the P5 is most important... it proves, beyond doubt, there is no 'separation' on the field between us and the P5.

The losing record, by our bottom bowl eligible teams, does hurt... it indicates (exactly as the converse does above...) that we have not completely 'separated' from the G4 (on the field).

Although BM and the G4 will trumpet our G4 bowl results... it really does not matter. Only how your top performs is the measuring stick.... and as the old parity in the Big East proved, you NEED a few teams to make the big splash, at the expense of the others... We are chasing the P5. The G4 hardly seem to be chasing us... or the P5. They just want us to stay with them and constitute a 'G5'. Why? Who knows... in a sane world, they would be arguing the 10 conference scenario even with their obvious distance from the P5... You either are, or are not, a 10 team FBS.

So when the "G4" beats the AAC like a drum, it doesn't matter and just means the AAC is the super bowl for the G4. But when Houston beats FSU or AAC teams with double-digit wins squeaks by a 6-6 Big 12 team teams that mean you're Power 6, amiright?

You guys may be the class of the G5, but no power 5 conference is going to go 2-10 against the "G4" over three seasons (as it's been pointed out, their record is considerably better than that).

(12-30-2017 04:07 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  So when the "G4" beats the AAC like a drum, it doesn't matter and just means the AAC is the super bowl for the G4. But when Houston beats FSU or AAC teams with double-digit wins squeaks by a 6-6 Big 12 team teams that mean you're Power 6, amiright?

You guys may be the class of the G5, but no power 5 conference is going to go 2-10 against the "G4" over three seasons (as it's been pointed out, their record is considerably better than that).

Duh - our best teams are busy holding our own against the other P6.

G4 is simply beating up on our lesser teams. Example: Fresno was #2 in the MWC this year. Houston was, at best, #4 in the American. Most of the G4 bowl losses are like that.

When you look at the regular season, we dominate G4 teams as badly as the other P6 conferences do.

I put more stock into regular season results than bowl games. Long layoffs, coaching changes, and half empty stadiums make the games feel more like pre-season games than post-season games.

(12-30-2017 04:13 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 04:07 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  So when the "G4" beats the AAC like a drum, it doesn't matter and just means the AAC is the super bowl for the G4. But when Houston beats FSU or AAC teams with double-digit wins squeaks by a 6-6 Big 12 team teams that mean you're Power 6, amiright?

You guys may be the class of the G5, but no power 5 conference is going to go 2-10 against the "G4" over three seasons (as it's been pointed out, their record is considerably better than that).

Duh - our best teams are busy holding our own against the other P6.

G4 is simply beating up on our lesser teams. Example: Fresno was #2 in the MWC this year. Houston was, at best, #4 in the American. Most of the G4 bowl losses are like that.

When you look at the regular season, we dominate G4 teams as badly as the other P6 conferences do.

I understand that when the Xth place AAC team plays the Xth place "G4" team the AAC team will usually win. But it's also true that you don't get to feed on teams like San Jose State, ULL, ULM, and other "G4" teams that don't make bowl games in the post-season.

Again, no real Power conference is going to go 2-10 against the "G4" even with their 6-6 teams representing them. The "it's bowl games" is just a lame excuse.

(12-30-2017 01:11 AM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 12:36 AM)gulfcoastgal Wrote:  Judged by whom? Contrary to some in this forum, bowl performance emphasis (or lack there of) did not originate with the formation of the AAC. And never, in the history of college football has bowl performance been the only consideration for determining conference strength. So, why in the world would that be the sole factor now?

Just look at the media coverage of the regular season vs. bowl season. Bowl performances are only discussed in the current cycle...until the next one comes along. Regular season wins/losses garner far more coverage, and more importantly, carryover with the selection committee. Now, I personally don't think one should be excluded in favor of the other as neither tell a complete story. But, there's no question that outside the CFP, the news cycle for bowls (win or lose) is shorter than the lifespan of regular season games. And, since the media deliver (and in some instances create) narratives, reg. season games consistently offer more opportunities to mold perception.

Of course, this assumes that the conferences in question receive coverage outside of bowl games. Typing out loud here, but that may be where some are coming from as bowls may be the best, or even only chance at affecting perception if reg. season press is poor to non-existent. Bowl games generally generate over 1 mil viewers and very well may be the highest visibility that some teams/conferences receive...perhaps even greater than the highest rated conference games (including championships). If indeed this is the case, then I would probably agree that bowl games may offer the best opportunity to reach eyeballs and build/promote brands in those instances.

gulfcoastgal may be hitting on a point that relates to the G4 fans' wanting to overemphasize AAC-G4 bowl record. I will look at numbers in the morning.
For most G4s, that bowl game is THE most-viewed game they're in. For an AAC team facing a G4 before Christmas, probably not. Navy's bowl game vs ACC UVa will probably be our third most viewed game. USF in Birmingham definitely behind 4.46 million viewers for the war on I4. Memphis in the Liberty, behind AAC championship and maybe others.
I look forward to getting into those numbers.

I went back and looked at ratings - how many million-viewer games do each of the non-contract bowl conferences have - in bowls and otherwise? I started out binning them as CCGs, in-conference games, home or conference controled OOC games, and away OOC games, so there are numbers less than a million: that conference's best in one of those categories. NON-bowl games bolded.

Bottom Line Up Front -- bowl games are more important as signature exposure events for the G4s than they are for the AAC.

AAC 2017
Army-Navy 8.419 million
USF-UCF 4.644
TxTech @ Houston 3.850 (this was a reverse mirror, but that is the number)
Cincinnati @ Michigan 3.693
Birmingham Bowl 3.397
Conf Championship 3.385
UCLA @ Memphis 3.238
ND @ Navy 3.203
Hawaii Bowl 2.086
Military Bowl 2.052
St Pete Bowl 1.597
Temple @ ND 1.580
Illinois @ USF 1.369
Frisco Bowl 1.250

2017 CUSA
Independence Bowl 2.205 million
St Pete Bowl 1.597
Boca Bowl 1.394
New Orleans Bowl 1.327
Frisco Bowl 1.250
New Mexico Bowl 1.212
Camellia Bowl 1.187
UTEP @ Oklahoma 1.111
Bahamas Bowl .882
Arizona @ UTEP .829
Marshall @ MTSU .453
CCG .255

2017 MAC
Quicklane Bowl 2.526 million
Akron @ Penn St 2.332
Dollar General Bowl 1.770
Kent @ Clemson 1.629
Boca bowl 1.394
Bahamas Bowl .882
CCG .652
Toledo - Ohio .471
Kansas @Ohio .195

2017 mwc
Las Vegas Bowl 3.801 million
Armed Forces Bowl 3.485
Hawaii Bowl 2.086
Fresno @ Bama 2.070
Utah St @ Wisconsin 1.760
Colorado St @ Bama 1.613
UVa @ Boise 1.288
Boise @ Washington St 1.265
New Mexico Bowl 1.212
Boise @ UNM 1.053
Boise @ BYU 1.043
CCG .623

2017 Sun Belt
Dollar General Bowl 1.770 million
App State @ UGA 1.718
New Orleans Bowl 1.327
Camellia Bowl 1.187
Okla St @ S.Alabama .966
Ark St vs Ga Southern .421
No CCG but Troy-Ark State that weekend .225

I have 2016 numbers, which include full bowl slate - they show the same thing.

(12-30-2017 04:40 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 04:13 PM)CougarRed Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 04:07 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  So when the "G4" beats the AAC like a drum, it doesn't matter and just means the AAC is the super bowl for the G4. But when Houston beats FSU or AAC teams with double-digit wins squeaks by a 6-6 Big 12 team teams that mean you're Power 6, amiright?

You guys may be the class of the G5, but no power 5 conference is going to go 2-10 against the "G4" over three seasons (as it's been pointed out, their record is considerably better than that).

Duh - our best teams are busy holding our own against the other P6.

G4 is simply beating up on our lesser teams. Example: Fresno was #2 in the MWC this year. Houston was, at best, #4 in the American. Most of the G4 bowl losses are like that.

When you look at the regular season, we dominate G4 teams as badly as the other P6 conferences do.

I understand that when the Xth place AAC team plays the Xth place "G4" team the AAC team will usually win. But it's also true that you don't get to feed on teams like San Jose State, ULL, ULM, and other "G4" teams that don't make bowl games in the post-season.

Again, no real Power conference is going to go 2-10 against the "G4" even with their 6-6 teams representing them. The "it's bowl games" is just a lame excuse.

We havent gone 2-10 over three seasons - we've gone 32-16.

(12-30-2017 04:44 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 01:11 AM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 12:36 AM)gulfcoastgal Wrote:  Judged by whom? Contrary to some in this forum, bowl performance emphasis (or lack there of) did not originate with the formation of the AAC. And never, in the history of college football has bowl performance been the only consideration for determining conference strength. So, why in the world would that be the sole factor now?

Just look at the media coverage of the regular season vs. bowl season. Bowl performances are only discussed in the current cycle...until the next one comes along. Regular season wins/losses garner far more coverage, and more importantly, carryover with the selection committee. Now, I personally don't think one should be excluded in favor of the other as neither tell a complete story. But, there's no question that outside the CFP, the news cycle for bowls (win or lose) is shorter than the lifespan of regular season games. And, since the media deliver (and in some instances create) narratives, reg. season games consistently offer more opportunities to mold perception.

Of course, this assumes that the conferences in question receive coverage outside of bowl games. Typing out loud here, but that may be where some are coming from as bowls may be the best, or even only chance at affecting perception if reg. season press is poor to non-existent. Bowl games generally generate over 1 mil viewers and very well may be the highest visibility that some teams/conferences receive...perhaps even greater than the highest rated conference games (including championships). If indeed this is the case, then I would probably agree that bowl games may offer the best opportunity to reach eyeballs and build/promote brands in those instances.

gulfcoastgal may be hitting on a point that relates to the G4 fans' wanting to overemphasize AAC-G4 bowl record. I will look at numbers in the morning.
For most G4s, that bowl game is THE most-viewed game they're in. For an AAC team facing a G4 before Christmas, probably not. Navy's bowl game vs ACC UVa will probably be our third most viewed game. USF in Birmingham definitely behind 4.46 million viewers for the war on I4. Memphis in the Liberty, behind AAC championship and maybe others.
I look forward to getting into those numbers.

I went back and looked at ratings - how many million-viewer games do each of the non-contract bowl conferences have - in bowls and otherwise? I started out binning them as CCGs, in-conference games, home or conference controled OOC games, and away OOC games, so there are numbers less than a million: that conference's best in one of those categories. NON-bowl games bolded.

Bottom Line Up Front -- bowl games are more important as signature exposure events for the G4s than they are for the AAC.

AAC 2017
Army-Navy 8.419 million
USF-UCF 4.644
TxTech @ Houston 3.850 (this was a reverse mirror, but that is the number)
Cincinnati @ Michigan 3.693
Birmingham Bowl 3.397
Conf Championship 3.385
UCLA @ Memphis 3.238
ND @ Navy 3.203
Hawaii Bowl 2.086
Military Bowl 2.052
St Pete Bowl 1.597
Temple @ ND 1.580
Illinois @ USF 1.369
Frisco Bowl 1.250

2017 CUSA
Independence Bowl 2.205 million
St Pete Bowl 1.597
Boca Bowl 1.394
New Orleans Bowl 1.327
Frisco Bowl 1.250
New Mexico Bowl 1.212
Camellia Bowl 1.187
UTEP @ Oklahoma 1.111
Bahamas Bowl .882
Arizona @ UTEP .829
Marshall @ MTSU .453
CCG .255

2017 MAC
Quicklane Bowl 2.526 million
Akron @ Penn St 2.332
Dollar General Bowl 1.770
Kent @ Clemson 1.629
Boca bowl 1.394
Bahamas Bowl .882
CCG .652
Toledo - Ohio .471
Kansas @Ohio .195

2017 mwc
Las Vegas Bowl 3.801 million
Armed Forces Bowl 3.485
Hawaii Bowl 2.086
Fresno @ Bama 2.070
Utah St @ Wisconsin 1.760
Colorado St @ Bama 1.613
UVa @ Boise 1.288
Boise @ Washington St 1.265
New Mexico Bowl 1.212
Boise @ UNM 1.053
Boise @ BYU 1.043
CCG .623

2017 Sun Belt
Dollar General Bowl 1.770 million
App State @ UGA 1.718
New Orleans Bowl 1.327
Camellia Bowl 1.187
Okla St @ S.Alabama .966
Ark St vs Ga Southern .421
No CCG but Troy-Ark State that weekend .225

I have 2016 numbers, which include full bowl slate - they show the same thing.

2016 numbers - with the added advantage over 2017 data of being complete - show the same thing: bowl games are only two of the top ten-viewed AAC games, but the distribution is the opposite for the G4s.

2016 AAC
Army-Navy 7.940 million viewers
Oklahoma - Houston 5.713
Tulsa at OSU 4.016
Las Vegas Bowl 3.744
Houston Memphis 3.093
UCF @ Michigan 2.863
FSU @ USF 2.557
Louisville @ Houston 2.432
ND @ Navy 2.420
Armed Forces Bowl 2.341
Birminham Bowl 2.308
Houston Cincinnati 2.159
Military Bowl 2.100
CCG 2.050
Boca Raton Bowl 1.581
Connecticut Houston 1.421
TCU @ SMU 1.357
USF Temple 1.300
Miami Beach Bowl .794

2016 CUSA
WKU @ Bama 2.467 million
Armed Forces Bowl 2.341
Heart of Dallas Bowl 1.615
Boca Raton Bowl 1.581
Baylor @ Rice 1.454
New Mexico Bowl 1.391
Bahamas Bowl 1.371
Hawaii Bowl 1.359
New Orleans Bowl 1.335
CCG .926

2016 MAC
Cotton Bowl 5.442 million
Dollar General Bowl 2.512
St Petersburg Bowl 2.045
Camellia Bowl 1.483
CCG 1.358
Bahamas Bowl 1.371
Miami Beach Bowl .794
Toledo-WMU .665
Toledo @ BYU .579

2016 mwc
Las Vegas Bowl 3.744 million
Nevada @ ND 2.451
Poinsettia Bowl 2.380
Cactus Bowl 2.282
Hawaii @ Michigan 2.135
New Mexico Bowl 1.391
HawaiiBowl 1.359
Potato Bowl 1.143
Wyoming @ Nebraska 1.126
CSU @ Colorado 1.073
BYU @ Boise .986
UNLV @ Boise .763
CCG .713

2016 Sun Belt
Dollar General Bowl 2.512 million
Camellia Bowl 1.483
New Orleans Bowl 1.335
Potato Bowl 1.143
Miami (FL) @ App St .955
Ark St @ Ga Southern .497
no CCG

(12-30-2017 08:39 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 04:44 PM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 01:11 AM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 12:36 AM)gulfcoastgal Wrote:  Judged by whom? Contrary to some in this forum, bowl performance emphasis (or lack there of) did not originate with the formation of the AAC. And never, in the history of college football has bowl performance been the only consideration for determining conference strength. So, why in the world would that be the sole factor now?

Just look at the media coverage of the regular season vs. bowl season. Bowl performances are only discussed in the current cycle...until the next one comes along. Regular season wins/losses garner far more coverage, and more importantly, carryover with the selection committee. Now, I personally don't think one should be excluded in favor of the other as neither tell a complete story. But, there's no question that outside the CFP, the news cycle for bowls (win or lose) is shorter than the lifespan of regular season games. And, since the media deliver (and in some instances create) narratives, reg. season games consistently offer more opportunities to mold perception.

Of course, this assumes that the conferences in question receive coverage outside of bowl games. Typing out loud here, but that may be where some are coming from as bowls may be the best, or even only chance at affecting perception if reg. season press is poor to non-existent. Bowl games generally generate over 1 mil viewers and very well may be the highest visibility that some teams/conferences receive...perhaps even greater than the highest rated conference games (including championships). If indeed this is the case, then I would probably agree that bowl games may offer the best opportunity to reach eyeballs and build/promote brands in those instances.

gulfcoastgal may be hitting on a point that relates to the G4 fans' wanting to overemphasize AAC-G4 bowl record. I will look at numbers in the morning.
For most G4s, that bowl game is THE most-viewed game they're in. For an AAC team facing a G4 before Christmas, probably not. Navy's bowl game vs ACC UVa will probably be our third most viewed game. USF in Birmingham definitely behind 4.46 million viewers for the war on I4. Memphis in the Liberty, behind AAC championship and maybe others.
I look forward to getting into those numbers.

I went back and looked at ratings - how many million-viewer games do each of the non-contract bowl conferences have - in bowls and otherwise? I started out binning them as CCGs, in-conference games, home or conference controled OOC games, and away OOC games, so there are numbers less than a million: that conference's best in one of those categories. NON-bowl games bolded.

Bottom Line Up Front -- bowl games are more important as signature exposure events for the G4s than they are for the AAC.

AAC 2017
Army-Navy 8.419 million
USF-UCF 4.644
TxTech @ Houston 3.850 (this was a reverse mirror, but that is the number)
Cincinnati @ Michigan 3.693
Birmingham Bowl 3.397
Conf Championship 3.385
UCLA @ Memphis 3.238
ND @ Navy 3.203
Hawaii Bowl 2.086
Military Bowl 2.052
St Pete Bowl 1.597
Temple @ ND 1.580
Illinois @ USF 1.369
Frisco Bowl 1.250

2017 CUSA
Independence Bowl 2.205 million
St Pete Bowl 1.597
Boca Bowl 1.394
New Orleans Bowl 1.327
Frisco Bowl 1.250
New Mexico Bowl 1.212
Camellia Bowl 1.187
UTEP @ Oklahoma 1.111
Bahamas Bowl .882
Arizona @ UTEP .829
Marshall @ MTSU .453
CCG .255

2017 MAC
Quicklane Bowl 2.526 million
Akron @ Penn St 2.332
Dollar General Bowl 1.770
Kent @ Clemson 1.629
Boca bowl 1.394
Bahamas Bowl .882
CCG .652
Toledo - Ohio .471
Kansas @Ohio .195

2017 mwc
Las Vegas Bowl 3.801 million
Armed Forces Bowl 3.485
Hawaii Bowl 2.086
Fresno @ Bama 2.070
Utah St @ Wisconsin 1.760
Colorado St @ Bama 1.613
UVa @ Boise 1.288
Boise @ Washington St 1.265
New Mexico Bowl 1.212
Boise @ UNM 1.053
Boise @ BYU 1.043
CCG .623

2017 Sun Belt
Dollar General Bowl 1.770 million
App State @ UGA 1.718
New Orleans Bowl 1.327
Camellia Bowl 1.187
Okla St @ S.Alabama .966
Ark St vs Ga Southern .421
No CCG but Troy-Ark State that weekend .225

I have 2016 numbers, which include full bowl slate - they show the same thing.

2016 numbers - with the added advantage over 2017 data of being complete - show the same thing: bowl games are only two of the top ten-viewed AAC games, but the distribution is the opposite for the G4s.

2016 AAC
Army-Navy 7.940 million viewers
Oklahoma - Houston 5.713
Tulsa at OSU 4.016
Las Vegas Bowl 3.744
Houston Memphis 3.093
UCF @ Michigan 2.863
FSU @ USF 2.557
Louisville @ Houston 2.432
ND @ Navy 2.420
Armed Forces Bowl 2.341
Birminham Bowl 2.308
Houston Cincinnati 2.159
Military Bowl 2.100
CCG 2.050
Boca Raton Bowl 1.581
Connecticut Houston 1.421
TCU @ SMU 1.357
USF Temple 1.300
Miami Beach Bowl .794

2016 CUSA
WKU @ Bama 2.467 million
Armed Forces Bowl 2.341
Heart of Dallas Bowl 1.615
Boca Raton Bowl 1.581
Baylor @ Rice 1.454
New Mexico Bowl 1.391
Bahamas Bowl 1.371
Hawaii Bowl 1.359
New Orleans Bowl 1.335
CCG .926

2016 MAC
Cotton Bowl 5.442 million
Dollar General Bowl 2.512
St Petersburg Bowl 2.045
Camellia Bowl 1.483
CCG 1.358
Bahamas Bowl 1.371
Miami Beach Bowl .794
Toledo-WMU .665
Toledo @ BYU .579

2016 mwc
Las Vegas Bowl 3.744 million
Nevada @ ND 2.451
Poinsettia Bowl 2.380
Cactus Bowl 2.282
Hawaii @ Michigan 2.135
New Mexico Bowl 1.391
HawaiiBowl 1.359
Potato Bowl 1.143
Wyoming @ Nebraska 1.126
CSU @ Colorado 1.073
BYU @ Boise .986
UNLV @ Boise .763
CCG .713

2016 Sun Belt
Dollar General Bowl 2.512 million
Camellia Bowl 1.483
New Orleans Bowl 1.335
Potato Bowl 1.143
Miami (FL) @ App St .955
Ark St @ Ga Southern .497
no CCG

You know what I noticed we have more games with more than 2 million viewers then the other conferences combined for both years. Also the mwc has three total games over 3 million and the Mac has one (cotton bowl) over the last two years. AAC has thirteen so far. Will be fourteen after peach. And liberty bowl should be 2 million plus.

Amazing how many people watch army vs navy. I couldn't get through half of a quarter. Just handoff after handoff. Boring stuff

(12-30-2017 11:21 PM)BullsBEAST Wrote:  Amazing how many people watch army vs navy. I couldn't get through half of a quarter. Just handoff after handoff. Boring stuff

I love Army-Navy, never miss it.

(12-30-2017 11:21 PM)BullsBEAST Wrote:  Amazing how many people watch army vs navy. I couldn't get through half of a quarter. Just handoff after handoff. Boring stuff

Not everyone has the football smarts to appreciate the intricacies of those offenses when executed at a high level of precision.

(12-30-2017 11:21 PM)BullsBEAST Wrote:  Amazing how many people watch army vs navy. I couldn't get through half of a quarter. Just handoff after handoff. Boring stuff

Well that's just un-American.

(12-31-2017 08:05 AM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 11:21 PM)BullsBEAST Wrote:  Amazing how many people watch army vs navy. I couldn't get through half of a quarter. Just handoff after handoff. Boring stuff

Not everyone has the football smarts to appreciate the intricacies of those offenses when executed at a high level of precision.

The precision and execution of the service academies really is admirable, and it's why they can compete effectively against many teams that have obviously bigger/stronger athletes.

Plus, as someone whose first years watching college football was back in the 1970s, before Miami/Florida/FSU changed the game forever by bringing pro-style passing to college football, watching Army-Navy is a nostalgia/throwback to the days when just about everyone ran the ball far more than passed it, and many of those running teams used some version of the triple option.

(12-31-2017 09:23 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(12-31-2017 08:05 AM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 11:21 PM)BullsBEAST Wrote:  Amazing how many people watch army vs navy. I couldn't get through half of a quarter. Just handoff after handoff. Boring stuff

Not everyone has the football smarts to appreciate the intricacies of those offenses when executed at a high level of precision.

The precision and execution of the service academies really is admirable, and it's why they can compete effectively against many teams that have obviously bigger/stronger athletes.

Plus, as someone whose first years watching college football was back in the 1970s, before Miami/Florida/FSU changed the game forever by bringing pro-style passing to college football, watching Army-Navy is a nostalgia/throwback to the days when just about everyone ran the ball far more than passed it, and many of those running teams used some version of the triple option.

People talk about it like it's a power I three yards and a cloud of dust, or slow and plodding.
Coach Mendenhall's comments post game mirror those of other opponents: your scout team can't replicate how FAST Navy executes.
It's different from a wishbone offense that used option principles to put numbers at the point of attack. It's actually a big play offense because it's designed to use option principles but to get a numbers advantage in space.
Paul Johnson added Run and Shoot elements (slotbacks in "flexbone" are essentially third and fourth receivers) and the linemen frequently take large splits. Johnson calls it Spread Option even though that term is now far more widely used in reference to zone blocking, shotgun formation read options.

(12-31-2017 08:16 AM)HuskyU Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 11:21 PM)BullsBEAST Wrote:  Amazing how many people watch army vs navy. I couldn't get through half of a quarter. Just handoff after handoff. Boring stuff

Well that's just un-American.

The schmaltzy, over the top patriotism in the broadcasts is the WORST part of watching Army Navy

(12-31-2017 09:46 AM)slhNavy91 Wrote:  

(12-31-2017 08:16 AM)HuskyU Wrote:  

(12-30-2017 11:21 PM)BullsBEAST Wrote:  Amazing how many people watch army vs navy. I couldn't get through half of a quarter. Just handoff after handoff. Boring stuff

Well that's just un-American.

The schmaltzy, over the top patriotism in the broadcasts is the WORST part of watching Army Navy

Yes Sir! That is why I don't watchthe game. Worse yet, thebbriadcastwrs, semmingly have no idea that they Cadets are college students, and barring one or two exceptions, not one have them has led a combat patrol, or led sailors on a cruise. It is obnoxious.