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Boca Rocket Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 05:24 PM)emanoh Wrote:  You all realize that if we don't lose candle this year, we are just on borrowed time. Next year it will be the same merry go round of fires and hires. If he stays this year, 7 or 8+ wins next year and he'll be a candidate again. Hopefully its after another 10 win, MAC championship season.

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3 years and go is kind of the rule of thumb.
12-04-2017 06:20 PM
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San Giuseppe Jato Rocket Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 06:20 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 05:24 PM)emanoh Wrote:  You all realize that if we don't lose candle this year, we are just on borrowed time. Next year it will be the same merry go round of fires and hires. If he stays this year, 7 or 8+ wins next year and he'll be a candidate again. Hopefully its after another 10 win, MAC championship season.

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3 years and go is kind of the rule of thumb.

The other thumb rule is; graduate a record setting QB and then get out of Dodge on the next private jet ASAP.
12-04-2017 06:28 PM
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Boca Rocket Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 06:28 PM)San Giuseppe Jato Rocket Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 06:20 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 05:24 PM)emanoh Wrote:  You all realize that if we don't lose candle this year, we are just on borrowed time. Next year it will be the same merry go round of fires and hires. If he stays this year, 7 or 8+ wins next year and he'll be a candidate again. Hopefully its after another 10 win, MAC championship season.

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3 years and go is kind of the rule of thumb.

The other thumb rule is; graduate a record setting QB and then get out of Dodge on the next private jet ASAP.

Rockets have a lot of talent. Defense and OL will only get better. Plenty of returning talent at the skill positions. Just change the driver and the UT Rockets blast off.
12-04-2017 06:39 PM
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inductchuck16 Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 05:24 PM)emanoh Wrote:  You all realize that if we don't lose candle this year, we are just on borrowed time. Next year it will be the same merry go round of fires and hires. If he stays this year, 7 or 8+ wins next year and he'll be a candidate again. Hopefully its after another 10 win, MAC championship season.

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Yup but if he stays, that means the recruiting class that is currently verbally committed to THE University of TOLEDO will become Rockets, as opposed to Golden Knights. I'm a huge fan of the class we have right now. 2 years for a HC is bogus. Don't hire guys who only want to stay at Toledo for 2 years.
12-04-2017 06:40 PM
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AquaRocket Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 01:25 PM)San Giuseppe Jato Rocket Wrote:  Whoa!

I think the question is; not if UCF wants Candle. It's if Candle wants UCF.

No disrespect to the Golden Knights but's it not exactly a step up.
AMEN! A voice of reason in this asylum. +1

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12-04-2017 06:43 PM
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AquaRocket Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 04:21 PM)BDV27 Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 04:16 PM)Michigan Rocket Wrote:  According to Bleacher Report, Candle is third on UCF list. Good. We love him here and don't want to lose him. Toledo has more of a football culture than UCF anyhow. It's funny, many of us were pissed off when Campbell left (mainly because we think we lost to WMU that day because Campbell mailed it in), but, we don't blame Candle if he wanted to leave for greener pastures.

I think it completely had to do with timing. The appearance was that the team wasn't ready for WMU because he was interviewing for the ISU job and, we lost out on a MACC as a result.
That is a True statement.

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12-04-2017 06:45 PM
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AquaRocket Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 06:39 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 06:28 PM)San Giuseppe Jato Rocket Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 06:20 PM)Boca Rocket Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 05:24 PM)emanoh Wrote:  You all realize that if we don't lose candle this year, we are just on borrowed time. Next year it will be the same merry go round of fires and hires. If he stays this year, 7 or 8+ wins next year and he'll be a candidate again. Hopefully its after another 10 win, MAC championship season.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

3 years and go is kind of the rule of thumb.

The other thumb rule is; graduate a record setting QB and then get out of Dodge on the next private jet ASAP.

Rockets have a lot of talent. Defense and OL will only get better. Plenty of returning talent at the skill positions. Just change the driver and the UT Rockets blast off.
+1

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12-04-2017 06:46 PM
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northcoastRocket Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
You can never tell if an assistant will make a good head coach, as the jobs are different. Being a head coach is like being the CEO of a company, rather then working in the trenches. Some people are more suited to one or the other. The biggest skill a MAC HC has to have is the ability to attract a team of top notch assistants, with very little money to work with for salaries to offer.

That being said, if you want to keep the continuity going, Brian Wright would be the obvious choice. He's been a coordinator for a while, and had a short stint as an interim head coach at FAU, where he went 4-0 as I recall.

Going outside, I'd call Jim Harding. He's assistant head coach now at Utah and has been hailed as a top notch assistant. Not sure how much he is making this season, so it may not be a big bump in salary, so unsure if he could be coaxed or not.

Manning is another name to consider. Great o-line coach in his first year as a coordinator, so can't really say if he would make a great HC or not.
12-04-2017 06:50 PM
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UTROCKET Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
Why doesn't UT set up an athletic coaching success fund similar to UCF? I'm getting sick of us not being able to lock down a coach for more than a couple of years. We should easily be able to offer 2 million to our head coach each year. Cut Coach K's salary in half (unless he wins the MAC this year, he does not deserve how much he is currently making)

We need to wake up as an athletic department. Football is the face of this university and helps our marketing department (both academic and athletics) a great amount. It's time we start paying our head football coach the amount he deserves for putting the university on a national stage.

How do we do this? Ask alumni, students and supporters to step up in order for us to bring a coach with stability to UT. WE NEED TO CREATE A FUND ASAP AND MARKET IT TO ALL OF ROCKETNATION AND NORTHWEST OHIO. We need to reach out to the large corporations locally to help sustain a major football team that represents all of Northwest Ohio (ProMedica, Mercy, Owens Illinois/Corning, Marathon, WellTower, etc.

Having a good football program at UT does so much for our university and also for the entire Toledo region. It's time we ask others to step up financially in order to bring a long term head coach to Toledo. This university deserves it and its completely possible if our AD would step up to the plate and create a coaching success fund!

Worst case scenario? We don't raise enough money or it fails. Guess what? At least we can say we TRIED to bring in a coach that looks at UT as a great gig, one that pays well and provides a great opportunity to win consistently.
12-04-2017 06:58 PM
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Toledo_Storm Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
UT is by far a top tier G5 job. I know we have all beat this drum before, but we need to get out of the MAC. Getting out of the MAC would yes cost us more, but it would also bring in more money to the University to make great hires.
12-04-2017 07:02 PM
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northcoastRocket Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 06:58 PM)UTROCKET Wrote:  Why doesn't UT set up an athletic coaching success fund similar to UCF? I'm getting sick of us not being able to lock down a coach for more than a couple of years. We should easily be able to offer 2 million to our head coach each year. Cut Coach K's salary in half (unless he wins the MAC this year, he does not deserve how much he is currently making)

We need to wake up as an athletic department. Football is the face of this university and helps our marketing department (both academic and athletics) a great amount. It's time we start paying our head football coach the amount he deserves for putting the university on a national stage.

How do we do this? Ask alumni, students and supporters to step up in order for us to bring a coach with stability to UT. WE NEED TO CREATE A FUND ASAP AND MARKET IT TO ALL OF ROCKETNATION AND NORTHWEST OHIO. We need to reach out to the large corporations locally to help sustain a major football team that represents all of Northwest Ohio (ProMedica, Mercy, Owens Illinois/Corning, Marathon, WellTower, etc.

Having a good football program at UT does so much for our university and also for the entire Toledo region. It's time we ask others to step up financially in order to bring a long term head coach to Toledo. This university deserves it and its completely possible if our AD would step up to the plate and create a coaching success fund!

Worst case scenario? We don't raise enough money or it fails. Guess what? At least we can say we TRIED to bring in a coach that looks at UT as a great gig, one that pays well and provides a great opportunity to win consistently.

So, to support a $2M recurring expense, an endowment would have to have at least $50M. UT's total endowment for all purposes right now is about $400M. If you told people that 1/8th of your total endowment was going to just pay the football coach's salary, I would guess you would lose half your donors for other purposes.

Also, it won't do any good to pay a huge salary to the HC if all the assistants are only gonna get pays $50 or $75K each. You need to spend money on assistants to have a top notch program, and that can quickly add up to a couple million more $ for all the staff.

Although there might not be a specific HC salary fund in the endowment, there are a number of different athletic dept and/or football team funds managed by the UT Foundation. One of those is an athletic coach incentives fund, which is used to pay some part of the bonuses that the coaches get payed. Anyone can contribute to any of those funds, or can start up they're own with specific purposes designated.

If you want to compete with the big money schools, you really need a billionaire FB fan or very large corporate sponsor to pony up a big chunck of $
12-04-2017 08:36 PM
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rocketpaul Offline
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Post: #32
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 08:36 PM)northcoastRocket Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 06:58 PM)UTROCKET Wrote:  Why doesn't UT set up an athletic coaching success fund similar to UCF? I'm getting sick of us not being able to lock down a coach for more than a couple of years. We should easily be able to offer 2 million to our head coach each year. Cut Coach K's salary in half (unless he wins the MAC this year, he does not deserve how much he is currently making)

We need to wake up as an athletic department. Football is the face of this university and helps our marketing department (both academic and athletics) a great amount. It's time we start paying our head football coach the amount he deserves for putting the university on a national stage.

How do we do this? Ask alumni, students and supporters to step up in order for us to bring a coach with stability to UT. WE NEED TO CREATE A FUND ASAP AND MARKET IT TO ALL OF ROCKETNATION AND NORTHWEST OHIO. We need to reach out to the large corporations locally to help sustain a major football team that represents all of Northwest Ohio (ProMedica, Mercy, Owens Illinois/Corning, Marathon, WellTower, etc.

Having a good football program at UT does so much for our university and also for the entire Toledo region. It's time we ask others to step up financially in order to bring a long term head coach to Toledo. This university deserves it and its completely possible if our AD would step up to the plate and create a coaching success fund!

Worst case scenario? We don't raise enough money or it fails. Guess what? At least we can say we TRIED to bring in a coach that looks at UT as a great gig, one that pays well and provides a great opportunity to win consistently.

So, to support a $2M recurring expense, an endowment would have to have at least $50M. UT's total endowment for all purposes right now is about $400M. If you told people that 1/8th of your total endowment was going to just pay the football coach's salary, I would guess you would lose half your donors for other purposes.

Also, it won't do any good to pay a huge salary to the HC if all the assistants are only gonna get pays $50 or $75K each. You need to spend money on assistants to have a top notch program, and that can quickly add up to a couple million more $ for all the staff.

Although there might not be a specific HC salary fund in the endowment, there are a number of different athletic dept and/or football team funds managed by the UT Foundation. One of those is an athletic coach incentives fund, which is used to pay some part of the bonuses that the coaches get payed. Anyone can contribute to any of those funds, or can start up they're own with specific purposes designated.

If you want to compete with the big money schools, you really need a billionaire FB fan or very large corporate sponsor to pony up a big chunck of $
Don't think there is A Corp sponsor in Toledo that can compete with Disney or Universal
12-04-2017 08:39 PM
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ToledoMike Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 07:02 PM)Toledo_Storm Wrote:  UT is by far a top tier G5 job. I know we have all beat this drum before, but we need to get out of the MAC. Getting out of the MAC would yes cost us more, but it would also bring in more money to the University to make great hires.

Yes - in terms of training facilities, stadium (ambiance, not size), campus, fan base, recruiting, history etc.

No - in terms of salary, it is middle of the pack and trails behind the AAC, Mtn West, and CUSA. http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/
That said, a coaching job here is just like any other good paying job in Toledo. Even if you don't make as much, your money goes a lot further here than in most other places. And, we don't have to deal with hurricanes, earthquakes etc. However, if you would like more sun and warmer weather...we will always have that against us, whether we stay in the MAC or not.

I would love to see us join another conference, but I don't see it happening for us, or any other schools in the MAC for that matter. I have never heard this to be a goal of the institution, and like others have said, the travel budget would likely be 3 times or more what it is now to join CUSA or the AAC. How are you going to pay a coach more then? Unless there is a big breakup of conferences and a realignment, we will probably be playing in the MAC for decades to come IMHO.
12-04-2017 09:13 PM
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falconplucker Offline
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Post: #34
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
I think the MAC, Sun Belt, Conference USA, and everyone else who isn't deljusional about becoming a Power 5 school some day, should form a new division with a real playoff system. It would be more exciting than the bowl scraps most receive.
12-04-2017 10:05 PM
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inductchuck16 Offline
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Post: #35
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 06:58 PM)UTROCKET Wrote:  Why doesn't UT set up an athletic coaching success fund similar to UCF? I'm getting sick of us not being able to lock down a coach for more than a couple of years. We should easily be able to offer 2 million to our head coach each year. Cut Coach K's salary in half (unless he wins the MAC this year, he does not deserve how much he is currently making)

We need to wake up as an athletic department. Football is the face of this university and helps our marketing department (both academic and athletics) a great amount. It's time we start paying our head football coach the amount he deserves for putting the university on a national stage.

How do we do this? Ask alumni, students and supporters to step up in order for us to bring a coach with stability to UT. WE NEED TO CREATE A FUND ASAP AND MARKET IT TO ALL OF ROCKETNATION AND NORTHWEST OHIO. We need to reach out to the large corporations locally to help sustain a major football team that represents all of Northwest Ohio (ProMedica, Mercy, Owens Illinois/Corning, Marathon, WellTower, etc.

Having a good football program at UT does so much for our university and also for the entire Toledo region. It's time we ask others to step up financially in order to bring a long term head coach to Toledo. This university deserves it and its completely possible if our AD would step up to the plate and create a coaching success fund!

Worst case scenario? We don't raise enough money or it fails. Guess what? At least we can say we TRIED to bring in a coach that looks at UT as a great gig, one that pays well and provides a great opportunity to win consistently.

This is thinking big, I like it. I would love to see this kind of effort put towards our football program. Look how much attention our entire University/City received when we beat Arkansas. That's just one example of many as to why there needs to be a very strong focus on the football program.
12-04-2017 10:49 PM
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inductchuck16 Offline
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Post: #36
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 07:02 PM)Toledo_Storm Wrote:  UT is by far a top tier G5 job. I know we have all beat this drum before, but we need to get out of the MAC. Getting out of the MAC would yes cost us more, but it would also bring in more money to the University to make great hires.

If you don't dream it, you can never achieve it. I'd really like to think Rocket Nation thinks Toledo could and should compete in a conference with better opportunities for us.
12-04-2017 10:50 PM
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Carolina Rocket Offline
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Post: #37
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-04-2017 10:05 PM)falconplucker Wrote:  I think the MAC, Sun Belt, Conference USA, and everyone else who isn't deljusional about becoming a Power 5 school some day, should form a new division with a real playoff system. It would be more exciting than the bowl scraps most receive.

That's a solid list. I really like the second guy.
12-05-2017 06:40 AM
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Boca Rocket Offline
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Post: #38
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
(12-05-2017 06:40 AM)Carolina Rocket Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 10:05 PM)falconplucker Wrote:  I think the MAC, Sun Belt, Conference USA, and everyone else who isn't deljusional about becoming a Power 5 school some day, should form a new division with a real playoff system. It would be more exciting than the bowl scraps most receive.

That's a solid list. I really like the second guy.

No. Out of the top 60 FBS teams, 48 of them will never sniff the Championship Playoffs. Recently, NIU has gone to the Orange Bowl and WMU to a NY6 Bowl. Toledo has been close. Just need the program to keep moving ahead. To develop a lower level playoff system is to give up. Appreciate the fact that with all the money UM has poured into their program, the Wolverines are at about the same level as UT this season. What needs to be done is to fight the P5's attempts to drive programs that could compete in P5 into a lower Division. It will end up stealing recruits and money from G5. G5 is making inroads and P5 is fighting it. Much of the push is from the most successful programs. When G5's are beating P5's with less financial resources and lower staff salaries, eventually administrators are going to wake up and realize they are over paying for what they are getting. Are coaching basic football skills that different from coaches? You're paying for acquiring talent, implementing schemes, game day adjustment, etc. 80% of wins are probably talent mismatches.
(This post was last modified: 12-05-2017 11:11 AM by Boca Rocket.)
12-05-2017 11:11 AM
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bcunn3128 Away
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Post: #39
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
Thanks for playing, everyone!

Looks like we only need 1 name on the list after all. We'll worry about next season after it happens.
12-05-2017 11:42 AM
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MotoRocket Offline
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Post: #40
RE: Who's on YOUR list?
My concern is I don't know how good O'Brien is at getting us a coach if Candle were to leave - especially if it happens this year. He got Beckman and he improved the situation, but more importantly, he had a couple of guys come with him that were easy fits to be the next HC. I don't know as that we have that anymore if Candle were to leave. Going out into the open market is a bit of a crap shoot. Sorry, but I don't think O'Brien is the guy I want doing that. As it turns out, the guy he got from the outside is dead as a head coach in NCAA football. Sounded to me that by the time he left Toledo, the players couldn't stand him either. And while some of that was because of the timing and his lack of "commitment to the team" that he expected from them, it sounds like there were other reasons as well. Those reasons caught up to him at Illinois.
12-05-2017 01:13 PM
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