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Will Ohio State out trigger a move to 8-team playoff?
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BadgerMJ Online
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Post: #61
RE: Will Ohio State out trigger a move to 8-team playoff?
I don't think ANYTHING will happen until a few of things get settled.

The number of conference games each conference plays and the scheduling of FCS opponents to start. I don't care what some people say, the Oregon States and Illinois of the world STILL have more talent and ability than an FCS team. A horrifically bad Illinois team is still a tougher game than a FCS team. Sorry, but that's just the truth. Until all conferences are on equal footing, there will never be agreement on expanding a playoff.

The committee also needs to decide what are the EXACT criteria they'll use to determine the teams. Even if you go with "wild card" teams, there still needs to be objective numbers to determine who "gets in". It can't vary from year to year depending on who's on the committee and which way the wind happens to be blowing.

Even if all this gets settled, there has to be a guaranteed spot/auto-qualifying for the P5 champions. Without that, it's a non-starter.
12-04-2017 09:41 AM
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FloridaJag Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Will Ohio State out trigger a move to 8-team playoff?
The College Football Playoff committee got it wrong: Alabama is in on brand loyalty only

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/co...917333001/
12-04-2017 09:49 AM
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The Cutter of Bish Offline
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Post: #63
RE: Will Ohio State out trigger a move to 8-team playoff?
(12-04-2017 09:38 AM)FloridaJag Wrote:  The Bowls don't mean anything.

I agree. But those three will be bringing in better money than the other conference bowlers.
12-04-2017 09:54 AM
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Frank the Tank Offline
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Post: #64
RE: Will Ohio State out trigger a move to 8-team playoff?
(12-04-2017 09:12 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 09:08 AM)esayem Wrote:  It’s been more or less quiet on the Ohio State front because the Buckeyes got in at Penn State’s expense last year, and actually lost to them, unlike Alabama (who did not play OSU, of course).

To maximize the CCGs and Cinderella stories, auto-bids should be implemented in the future. The rest of an eight team playoff should be made-up of three wildcards to reward a commendable regular season, I’m not sure a G5 “champ” rule would go over. No changes to the six major bowl games need to be made.

I was the original advocate of a twelve team playoff, but I think that would be years and years away.

To me, it doesn't make conceptual sense to have an automatic G5 entry unless we have 16 teams in the playoffs. With 8 teams, chances are, the 8th best P5 team is better than the best G5 team, and since #8 is also probably a legit title contender, that's too high a price to pay for auto-inclusion. The G5 champ could be eligible for one of the three wild-cards like everyone else.

I understand what you're saying, although I'd personally include the "G5 champ" as an auto-bid. Will that necessarily be the strongest team? No. However, if we're providing auto-bids to each of the P5 champs in an 8-team playoff (and I think that's the *only* real reason why we'd move from 4 to 8 teams), then there's some equity in providing 1 spot to the G5. It also moves quite a bit of emphasis to the P5 conference championship games since there's a world of difference between having 3 at-large bids available to 2 at-large bids. I'm someone that is all for having representation in this format for schools that didn't win their conference along with independents (as I believe teams like this year's Alabama team are definitely playoff-worthy), but I'd like the P5 conference championship games to be as close to de facto elimination games as possible. IMHO, having only 2 at-large spots for grabs compared to 3 at-large spots preserves much of the week-to-week pressure (as you really can't feel safe at all outside of winning your conference) and debate that many people find to be a positive feature in the current 4-team playoff system (yet still having a completely unambiguous on-the-field way for the P5 champs to each get into the playoff without having subjective beauty contests involved).
(This post was last modified: 12-04-2017 11:07 AM by Frank the Tank.)
12-04-2017 11:06 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #65
RE: Will Ohio State out trigger a move to 8-team playoff?
(12-04-2017 09:49 AM)FloridaJag Wrote:  The College Football Playoff committee got it wrong: Alabama is in on brand loyalty only

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/co...917333001/

I could buy that if the choice came down to Alabama vs say TCU or even a Washington.

But nobody is a bigger brand than Ohio State, they are right there with Alabama. So "brand" cannot possibly explain it.

No, Alabama was just more deserving. One fewer loss was decisive, and should have been. Plus, the nature of that loss. I mean, could you imagine Alabama losing to Iowa by 30?

That's just impossible. 07-coffee3
12-04-2017 11:10 AM
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The Cutter of Bish Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Will Ohio State out trigger a move to 8-team playoff?
Consider another possible outcome where Alabama never lost to Auburn, but lost to UGA in the conference final. Pretty darn sure both UGA and Bama are showing up in the bracket again.

There was a way the Big Ten could have found their way into the playoff. Blame Wisconsin falling short. And really, given how beatable Ohio State is, they should have gotten it done.
12-04-2017 11:24 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #67
RE: Will Ohio State out trigger a move to 8-team playoff?
(12-04-2017 11:24 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  Consider another possible outcome where Alabama never lost to Auburn, but lost to UGA in the conference final. Pretty darn sure both UGA and Bama are showing up in the bracket again.

There was a way the Big Ten could have found their way into the playoff. Blame Wisconsin falling short. And really, given how beatable Ohio State is, they should have gotten it done.

I thought the B1G title game went as badly for the B1G as it could possibly have gone. Had Wisconsin won the game, then they'd have made the playoffs. Also, had Ohio State did what they did three years ago, blown Wisconsin out, then Ohio State probably gets in over Alabama.

The worst outcome was what happened - Ohio State wins, but unimpressively.
12-04-2017 12:06 PM
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Frog in the Kitchen Sink Offline
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Post: #68
RE: Will Ohio State out trigger a move to 8-team playoff?
I think the current system is preposterous, but there is no other option, I fear. 8 simply doesn't work logistically with the CCG and bowl season limitations.
12-04-2017 12:18 PM
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Kittonhead Offline
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Post: #69
RE: Will Ohio State out trigger a move to 8-team playoff?
(12-04-2017 12:18 PM)Frog in the Kitchen Sink Wrote:  I think the current system is preposterous, but there is no other option, I fear. 8 simply doesn't work logistically with the CCG and bowl season limitations.
So if we go to 8 teams would the point be to dismiss the 9th or 10th best teams stake as national champions?

Does anyone think the 9th or 10th rated CFP team deserve national championship? That is usually a 10-3 P5 team finishing 3rd in its conference.

The distinction is more when it comes to the 3rd, 4th and 5th teams. Include the 3rd and 4th, dismiss the 5th. The 5th squares off against a team rated 7th, 8th, 9th in the CFP further discrediting any national title claim.
(12-04-2017 05:55 AM)chargeradio Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 01:46 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 12:19 AM)AntiG Wrote:  This year is the perfect case for a 8 team playoff. UCF basically can win the NY6 bowl and claim that they should have a share of the championship since they finished as the only undefeated team in FBS this season, and the B1G has a legit beef for being left out for a team that didn't even win their own division, nevermind conference.

5 P5 champions
1 top G5 champ
2 at-large bids
Seeding order is based on their ranking

1 Clemson (ACC champ)
8 UCF (G5 champ)

4 Alabama (At-large)
5 Ohio State (B1G champ)

3 Georgia (SEC champ)
6 Wisconsin (At-large)

2 Oklahoma (B12 champ)
7 USC (P12 champ)

You basically eliminate the legit controversies with this setup since all 5 power conference champs + top G5 champ gets in. If in the future an indy like ND or Army; or any other G5 champ want in, run the table and get ranked.

How about an 8 team playoff with G5 autobids?

#1 Clemson
#2 Oklahoma
#3 Georgia
AAC Champ UCF
MAC Champ Toledo
MWC Champ Boise
SBC Champ Troy
CUSA Champ FAU

Bring some affirmative action to the sport....04-cheers

1 Clemson (AQ) vs 16 Troy (AQ)
8 USC (AQ) vs 9 Penn State
4 Alabama vs 13 Boise State (AQ)
5 Ohio State (AQ) vs 12 UCF (AQ)
2 Oklahoma (AQ) vs 15 Toledo (AQ)
7 Auburn vs 10 Miami
3 Georgia (AQ) vs 14 FAU (AQ)
6 Wisconsin vs 11 Washington


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12-04-2017 12:42 PM
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Attackcoog Online
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Post: #70
RE: Will Ohio State out trigger a move to 8-team playoff?
(12-04-2017 11:06 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 09:12 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(12-04-2017 09:08 AM)esayem Wrote:  It’s been more or less quiet on the Ohio State front because the Buckeyes got in at Penn State’s expense last year, and actually lost to them, unlike Alabama (who did not play OSU, of course).

To maximize the CCGs and Cinderella stories, auto-bids should be implemented in the future. The rest of an eight team playoff should be made-up of three wildcards to reward a commendable regular season, I’m not sure a G5 “champ” rule would go over. No changes to the six major bowl games need to be made.

I was the original advocate of a twelve team playoff, but I think that would be years and years away.

To me, it doesn't make conceptual sense to have an automatic G5 entry unless we have 16 teams in the playoffs. With 8 teams, chances are, the 8th best P5 team is better than the best G5 team, and since #8 is also probably a legit title contender, that's too high a price to pay for auto-inclusion. The G5 champ could be eligible for one of the three wild-cards like everyone else.

I understand what you're saying, although I'd personally include the "G5 champ" as an auto-bid. Will that necessarily be the strongest team? No. However, if we're providing auto-bids to each of the P5 champs in an 8-team playoff (and I think that's the *only* real reason why we'd move from 4 to 8 teams), then there's some equity in providing 1 spot to the G5. It also moves quite a bit of emphasis to the P5 conference championship games since there's a world of difference between having 3 at-large bids available to 2 at-large bids. I'm someone that is all for having representation in this format for schools that didn't win their conference along with independents (as I believe teams like this year's Alabama team are definitely playoff-worthy), but I'd like the P5 conference championship games to be as close to de facto elimination games as possible. IMHO, having only 2 at-large spots for grabs compared to 3 at-large spots preserves much of the week-to-week pressure (as you really can't feel safe at all outside of winning your conference) and debate that many people find to be a positive feature in the current 4-team playoff system (yet still having a completely unambiguous on-the-field way for the P5 champs to each get into the playoff without having subjective beauty contests involved).

I like the auto-bids for conference champs because it rewards actual performance on the field and minimizes the influence of subjective opinions in the selection process. I like the G5 auto-bid in an 8 team playoff because it makes the playoff actually accessible to the 50% of FBS that is currently effectively ineligible for the playoff. Basically, such a G5 bid would treat the 65 or so non-P5 schools as a single huge conference. That's a reasonable solution for a long time access issue. It's a nice compromise that solves the difficult issues of trying to compare G5 teams to P5 teams in an era where the two play each other infrequently and schedule SOS varies widely. The reality is the top G5 has generally been a pretty good team and has more often than not shown itself to be a capable top 10 opponent. The Cinderella aspect should provide an intriguing new angle to the CFP. 04-cheers
(This post was last modified: 12-04-2017 01:03 PM by Attackcoog.)
12-04-2017 12:56 PM
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