I'm looking over their schedule and it seems like they typically are only able to schedule 4-5 P5 teams a year. With the vast majority of these games being played the first few weeks. Why not just make a pitch the the AAC/ESPN about a 7 game conference & keeping their TV deal.

Would it violate contracts to work out a deal that allows BYU to televise any game now picked up by ESPN on it's own network? Furthermore, it would allow BYU to keep it's SOS extremely high by having the option to schedule up to five P5 teams. Then they would of course get some good games within conference play to.

And the biggest benefit would be having access to the AAC championship game/Access bowl. My idea would be something like if there were ever a tie say a 7-1 Memphis and a 7-0 BYU the team that plays more conference games win the tie breaker by default unless it is a head to head loss.

(11-21-2017 02:33 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  I'm looking over their schedule and it seems like they typically are only able to schedule 4-5 P5 teams a year. With the vast majority of these games being played the first few weeks. Why not just make a pitch the the AAC/ESPN about a 7 game conference & keeping their TV deal.

Would it violate contracts to work out a deal that allows BYU to televise any game now picked up by ESPN on it's own network? Furthermore, it would allow BYU to keep it's SOS extremely high by having the option to schedule up to five P5 teams. Then they would of course get some good games within conference play to.

And the biggest benefit would be having access to the AAC championship game/Access bowl. My idea would be something like if there were ever a tie say a 7-1 Memphis and a 7-0 BYU the team that plays more conference games win the tie breaker by default unless it is a head to head loss.

Absolutely. But, the details you suggest turn it into conference membership, not a Notre Dame type deal. It would likely be 4 or 5 games; not 7. And, there would be some bowl affiliation, although BYU would not likely be available for the NY6 bid via the AAC. (they'd have to earn it as an at large selection).

BYU is getting more P6 games, including some later-season P5 games. For instance, 2020 has six P5 opponents, with two in November (including one November home game). In 2021, there are seven P5 opponents and three P5 games in October and November (at least one back-half home game).

Although I like the idea of a 7-game conference schedule, I don't think the AAC would go for that.

How would this benefit the AAC?

(11-21-2017 02:51 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  How would this benefit the AAC?

2 or 3 of the BYU-AAC games would be part of the AAC TV deal. To have it as an official affiliation brings value to the next TV contract.

BYU would likely bring another P5 bowl game to the AAC bowl lineup. Such as the Las Vegas Bowl v. the PAC or the Cactus Bowl v. the PAC or B12.

(11-21-2017 02:43 PM)YNot Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 02:33 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  I'm looking over their schedule and it seems like they typically are only able to schedule 4-5 P5 teams a year. With the vast majority of these games being played the first few weeks. Why not just make a pitch the the AAC/ESPN about a 7 game conference & keeping their TV deal.

Would it violate contracts to work out a deal that allows BYU to televise any game now picked up by ESPN on it's own network? Furthermore, it would allow BYU to keep it's SOS extremely high by having the option to schedule up to five P5 teams. Then they would of course get some good games within conference play to.

And the biggest benefit would be having access to the AAC championship game/Access bowl. My idea would be something like if there were ever a tie say a 7-1 Memphis and a 7-0 BYU the team that plays more conference games win the tie breaker by default unless it is a head to head loss.

Absolutely. But, the details you suggest turn it into conference membership, not a Notre Dame type deal. It would likely be 4 or 5 games; not 7. And, there would be some bowl affiliation, although BYU would not likely be available for the NY6 bid via the AAC. (they'd have to earn it as an at large selection).

BYU is getting more P6 games, including some later-season P5 games. For instance, 2020 has six P5 opponents, with two in November (including one November home game). In 2021, there are seven P5 opponents and three P5 games in October and November (at least one back-half home game).

Although I like the idea of a 7-game conference schedule, I don't think the AAC would go for that.

I'd think bigger. I'd do a 4-5 game scheduling agreement with BYU added as full olympic sports member. The travel is a little ugly, but BYU represents a high quality olympic sports program with a strong following and the AAC would represent an upgrade in opponent quality for BYU olympic sports. Its a win-win. I think it would end up working very well for both parties.

(11-21-2017 02:54 PM)YNot Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 02:51 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  How would this benefit the AAC?

2 or 3 of the BYU-AAC games would be part of the AAC TV deal. To have it as an official affiliation brings value to the next TV contract.

BYU would likely bring another P5 bowl game to the AAC bowl lineup. Such as the Las Vegas Bowl v. the PAC or the Cactus Bowl v. the PAC or B12.

BYU willing to give up TV games to the AAC?

(11-21-2017 03:00 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 02:54 PM)YNot Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 02:51 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  How would this benefit the AAC?

2 or 3 of the BYU-AAC games would be part of the AAC TV deal. To have it as an official affiliation brings value to the next TV contract.

BYU would likely bring another P5 bowl game to the AAC bowl lineup. Such as the Las Vegas Bowl v. the PAC or the Cactus Bowl v. the PAC or B12.

BYU willing to give up TV games to the AAC?

No, BYU would visit 2 or 3 AAC schools each year - the rights to which games would be held by the AAC. If those games are officially locked in during the life of the media deal, that provides nice value for the next AAC TV contract.

(11-21-2017 02:55 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 02:43 PM)YNot Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 02:33 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  I'm looking over their schedule and it seems like they typically are only able to schedule 4-5 P5 teams a year. With the vast majority of these games being played the first few weeks. Why not just make a pitch the the AAC/ESPN about a 7 game conference & keeping their TV deal.

Would it violate contracts to work out a deal that allows BYU to televise any game now picked up by ESPN on it's own network? Furthermore, it would allow BYU to keep it's SOS extremely high by having the option to schedule up to five P5 teams. Then they would of course get some good games within conference play to.

And the biggest benefit would be having access to the AAC championship game/Access bowl. My idea would be something like if there were ever a tie say a 7-1 Memphis and a 7-0 BYU the team that plays more conference games win the tie breaker by default unless it is a head to head loss.

Absolutely. But, the details you suggest turn it into conference membership, not a Notre Dame type deal. It would likely be 4 or 5 games; not 7. And, there would be some bowl affiliation, although BYU would not likely be available for the NY6 bid via the AAC. (they'd have to earn it as an at large selection).

BYU is getting more P6 games, including some later-season P5 games. For instance, 2020 has six P5 opponents, with two in November (including one November home game). In 2021, there are seven P5 opponents and three P5 games in October and November (at least one back-half home game).

Although I like the idea of a 7-game conference schedule, I don't think the AAC would go for that.

I'd think bigger. I'd do a 4-5 game scheduling agreement with BYU added as full olympic sports member. The travel is a little ugly, but BYU represents a high quality olympic sports program with a strong following and the AAC would represent an upgrade in opponent quality for BYU olympic sports. Its a win-win. I think it would end up working very well for both parties.

Minor upgrade for Men's Basketball from WCC (although the addition of WSU should tip the scales more for AAC this year). Replacing Coastal trips with trips across the country for all sports.. BYU could probably afford the extra trips, how would AAC members feel sending volleyball to Utah?

UTAH

That's the main reason BYU will insist in being independent and stay in the WCC as long as Gonzaga is there and a P5 invite comes.

(11-21-2017 02:55 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  I'd think bigger. I'd do a 4-5 game scheduling agreement with BYU added as full olympic sports member. The travel is a little ugly, but BYU represents a high quality olympic sports program with a strong following and the AAC would represent an upgrade in opponent quality for BYU olympic sports. Its a win-win. I think it would end up working very well for both parties.

I agree. But that won't happen unless there are other western schools on board. For instance, let's say the AAC adds Boise and SDSU for all sports. THEN, the AAC could attract BYU's and Gonzaga's attention for Olympic sports. In this instance, the majority of conference road games would be in the Pacific, Mountain, or Central time zones and the travel for all sports would be manageable. Basketball might see one cross-country two-game road trip each season. Some Olympic sports might not ever travel to the Eastern time zone.

In this instance, the football scheduling agreement and bowl affiliation would be very similar to the Notre Dame-ACC deal.

(11-21-2017 03:05 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Minor upgrade for Men's Basketball from WCC (although the addition of WSU should tip the scales more for AAC this year). Replacing Coastal trips with trips across the country for all sports.. BYU could probably afford the extra trips, how would AAC members feel sending volleyball to Utah?

Include Gonzaga, SDSU, and Boise and its a MAJOR upgrade from the WCC. Most WCC gyms only fit 2-3K - and see attendance double or triple when BYU basketball visits - and only Gonzaga and SMC move the needle.

The chance to host conference home games against Wichita, Cincinnati, UConn, Memphis, SMU, Tulsa, Houston, etc. and keep the Gonzaga game and add back the SDSU rivalry would be game-changing.

AAC would be a downgrade both in competition and travel for certain Olympic sports, such as women's soccer and softball. However, BYU places a few sports in the MPSF - like men's volleyball, swimming & diving, and indoor track & field - and could keep them there.

(11-21-2017 03:15 PM)YNot Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 03:05 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Minor upgrade for Men's Basketball from WCC (although the addition of WSU should tip the scales more for AAC this year). Replacing Coastal trips with trips across the country for all sports.. BYU could probably afford the extra trips, how would AAC members feel sending volleyball to Utah?

Include Gonzaga, SDSU, and Boise and its a MAJOR upgrade from the WCC. Most WCC gyms only fit 2-3K - and see attendance double or triple when BYU basketball visits - and only Gonzaga and SMC move the needle.

The chance to host conference home games against Wichita, Cincinnati, UConn, Memphis, SMU, Tulsa, Houston, etc. and keep the Gonzaga game and add back the SDSU rivalry would be game-changing.

AAC would be a downgrade both in competition and travel for certain Olympic sports, such as women's soccer and softball. However, BYU places a few sports in the MPSF - like men's volleyball, swimming & diving, and indoor track & field - and could keep them there.

Didn't specify the others in the Original Post :) More western schools would alleviate travel concerns (especially missed class time)

(11-21-2017 02:51 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  How would this benefit the AAC?

Overall SOS boost because with BYU playing 5 P5 games beating BYU would be a quality win or loss.

Also I'm thinking BYU joins for Olympic sports? I don't follow college basketball that much but isn't BYU considered a power?

(11-21-2017 03:05 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 02:55 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 02:43 PM)YNot Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 02:33 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  I'm looking over their schedule and it seems like they typically are only able to schedule 4-5 P5 teams a year. With the vast majority of these games being played the first few weeks. Why not just make a pitch the the AAC/ESPN about a 7 game conference & keeping their TV deal.

Would it violate contracts to work out a deal that allows BYU to televise any game now picked up by ESPN on it's own network? Furthermore, it would allow BYU to keep it's SOS extremely high by having the option to schedule up to five P5 teams. Then they would of course get some good games within conference play to.

And the biggest benefit would be having access to the AAC championship game/Access bowl. My idea would be something like if there were ever a tie say a 7-1 Memphis and a 7-0 BYU the team that plays more conference games win the tie breaker by default unless it is a head to head loss.

Absolutely. But, the details you suggest turn it into conference membership, not a Notre Dame type deal. It would likely be 4 or 5 games; not 7. And, there would be some bowl affiliation, although BYU would not likely be available for the NY6 bid via the AAC. (they'd have to earn it as an at large selection).

BYU is getting more P6 games, including some later-season P5 games. For instance, 2020 has six P5 opponents, with two in November (including one November home game). In 2021, there are seven P5 opponents and three P5 games in October and November (at least one back-half home game).

Although I like the idea of a 7-game conference schedule, I don't think the AAC would go for that.

I'd think bigger. I'd do a 4-5 game scheduling agreement with BYU added as full olympic sports member. The travel is a little ugly, but BYU represents a high quality olympic sports program with a strong following and the AAC would represent an upgrade in opponent quality for BYU olympic sports. Its a win-win. I think it would end up working very well for both parties.

Minor upgrade for Men's Basketball from WCC (although the addition of WSU should tip the scales more for AAC this year). Replacing Coastal trips with trips across the country for all sports.. BYU could probably afford the extra trips, how would AAC members feel sending volleyball to Utah?

That would be a win to in some sense wouldn't it? Unless I'm mistaken in some sports you are not required to play every team in the conference correct? Just in the conference tournament.

(11-21-2017 03:24 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 02:51 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  How would this benefit the AAC?

Overall SOS boost because with BYU playing 5 P5 games beating BYU would be a quality win or loss.

Also I'm thinking BYU joins for Olympic sports? I don't follow college basketball that much but isn't BYU considered a power?

Not this year.

BYU has a good basketball program usually - 11 straight 20+ win seasons

(11-21-2017 03:05 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Minor upgrade for Men's Basketball from WCC (although the addition of WSU should tip the scales more for AAC this year). Replacing Coastal trips with trips across the country for all sports.. BYU could probably afford the extra trips, how would AAC members feel sending volleyball to Utah?

How do Wichita and SMU feel about sending volleyball to UConn, Temple, and UCF?

Wichita-BYU = 996 miles
Tulsa-BYU = 1,172
SMU-BYU = 1,201 miles
Houston-BYU = 1,435

Memphis-Temple = 1,016 miles
Wichita-UCF = 1,399 miles
UConn-USF = 1,266
SMU-Temple = 1,471
Tulsa-UConn = 1,501 miles

(11-21-2017 02:51 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  How would this benefit the AAC?

I'm not co-signing the details of this specific deal, but a deal where BYU plays 4-6 AAC teams a year on a rotating basis, and BYU "joins" the AAC for purposes of bowl negotiations next cycle, would bring moderate benefits all around. The assumption is that BYU-AAC games would replace AAC-G5 or BYU-G5 games, so there's some value added there to the TV package.

Having BYU in the mix would help the AAC get Hawaii/Pacific/Mountain time zone bowl spots, and BYU would get to go east from time to time. Plus the BYU-AAC would be more attractive for Texas bowls.

This may all be too trivial to worry about, which is why a deal hasn't been done already. AAC already has a couple of Hawaii Bowl spots, the Poinsettia Bowl doesn't have a stadium anymore AFAIK, and having a Texas bowl wasn't a priority for Aresco last go-round, and now they have the Frisco Bowl anyway.

(11-21-2017 03:56 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 02:51 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  How would this benefit the AAC?

I'm not co-signing the details of this specific deal, but a deal where BYU plays 4-6 AAC teams a year on a rotating basis, and BYU "joins" the AAC for purposes of bowl negotiations next cycle, would bring moderate benefits all around. The assumption is that BYU-AAC games would replace AAC-G5 or BYU-G5 games, so there's some value added there to the TV package.

Having BYU in the mix would help the AAC get Hawaii/Pacific/Mountain time zone bowl spots, and BYU would get to go east from time to time. Plus the BYU-AAC would be more attractive for Texas bowls.

This may all be too trivial to worry about, which is why a deal hasn't been done already. AAC already has a couple of Hawaii Bowl spots, the Poinsettia Bowl doesn't have a stadium anymore AFAIK, and having a Texas bowl wasn't a priority for Aresco last go-round, and now they have the Frisco Bowl anyway.

FWIW, I suggest that BYU, Army, and AAC affiliate for bowls. That affiliation could likely improve everyone's bowl scenarios. The AAC's 2017 bowl lineup looks like this:

- NY6 (hopefully)
- Miliitary v. ACC/ND
- Birmingham v. SEC
- Gasparilla v. CUSA
- Hawaii v. MWC
- Boca Raton v. CUSA
- Cure v. Sun Belt
- Frisco v. TBD

Add BYU and Army to the mix and I honestly think you add two P5 bowl opponents:

-Las Vegas or Cactus v. PAC
-Armed Forces v. B12/B1G

4 or 5 bowl games against P5 opponents is better than 2 or 3, even if BYU and Army frequently play in those additional P5 bowl games.

(11-21-2017 03:09 PM)YNot Wrote:  

(11-21-2017 02:55 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  I'd think bigger. I'd do a 4-5 game scheduling agreement with BYU added as full olympic sports member. The travel is a little ugly, but BYU represents a high quality olympic sports program with a strong following and the AAC would represent an upgrade in opponent quality for BYU olympic sports. Its a win-win. I think it would end up working very well for both parties.

I agree. But that won't happen unless there are other western schools on board. For instance, let's say the AAC adds Boise and SDSU for all sports. THEN, the AAC could attract BYU's and Gonzaga's attention for Olympic sports. In this instance, the majority of conference road games would be in the Pacific, Mountain, or Central time zones and the travel for all sports would be manageable. Basketball might see one cross-country two-game road trip each season. Some Olympic sports might not ever travel to the Eastern time zone.

In this instance, the football scheduling agreement and bowl affiliation would be very similar to the Notre Dame-ACC deal.

Well, its not like Notre Dame is located in the middle of the ACC. The travel frankly is a plus for BYU, which sees its athletic teams as an outreach program for LDS. Traveling regularly to the east, where the LDS religion has much less exposure is probably a value added proposition for BYU. The travel would be a pain in the arse for the AAC teams, but it would be limited and BYU would be a worth while game. I dont think there would be any appetite at this time in adding any other western schools. There just isnt any desire to send volleyball to Boise or women's basketball to San Diego.

(11-21-2017 03:08 PM)UTEPDallas Wrote:  UTAH

That's the main reason BYU will insist in being independent and stay in the WCC as long as Gonzaga is there and a P5 invite comes.

Agreed.

In a vacuum, the AAC is a better overall basketball conference than the WCC, but the WCC (without any football ties) doesn't have the G5 image baggage... which is what BYU is trying to avoid entirely and that will be the case as long as Utah is in the Pac-12. I'd say the same thing for any partial membership proposal for BYU and MWC or any other G5 conference, for that matter. We can argue all day about whether BYU would better off in terms of bowls or scheduling or anything else, but keeping its image of superiority over Utah is paramount. Even though all of us here know that Utah is better off in the Pac-12 compared to BYU being independent, BYU can still argue that the only reason why it's able to pull off independence at all in the first place is that it has a larger and more national fan base than Utah.

Plus, if BYU isn't going to be a in P5 conference, then it wants Texas-like control. That's something that it can exert with complete independence in football and being the relative athletic department budget monster in the WCC. At the same time, I honestly don't think BYU is worried about scheduling games against the AAC, MWC or other G5 schools. BYU could have as many games against G5 schools as it wants, but that's not the goal of the school at all.

Finally, in any conference realignment analysis, we all need to step back and identify who has the leverage. In this case, BYU makes more TV money than any G5 school as an independent and is in a basketball/Olympic sports league that's an institutional and geographic fit with at least one other marquee brand of Gonzaga. BYU has all of the leverage in this situation, so its needs and wants supersede any needs and wants of the AAC, MWC or any other G5 conference.