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Will 2018 be better?
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crex043 Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Will 2018 be better?
(11-20-2017 11:23 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 11:21 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 11:11 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 09:35 AM)djtothemoney Wrote:  They had an interesting quote in the Enquirer this morning where Fickell somewhat called out his Seniors. I'm thinking this is a lot like the 2010 season, look for a big improvement next year.

Who would have thought our ST would have gotten worse when we actually added a coach?

Very few special teams coaches in the country have the necessary knowledge to make the visible parts of ST (kicking/punting) better, and the ones that do are not pretty obvious. The coverage schemes have been much better though, that much can be on DR being a good add who knows how to instill gap integrity and contain dynamics in KOC/PC.

I had a college coach recently ask me how I turned a backup midfielder into a D2 kicker and an offensive tackle into a D1 caliber punter at my high school...when I responded with "I actually know how to do what they're doing" he straight up told me that I'm the first he's ever met in 30 years of coaching. There just are not a lot of knowledgeable coaches when it comes to kicking dynamics who are employed on staffs, because a majority of the people with that knowledge are either former players with enough money to not want to deal with the crap OR people who aren't given respect because they never played the game. Luckily my HC understood that my ability to kick a 60-yarder on a warm day coupled with 4 years of college soccer and a willingness to work my ass off to understand the aspects of the game I hadn't picked up previously was worth it, and gave me a shot 5 years ago. Now things are definitely looking up in multiple areas on the coaching side, but unfortunately many coaches DON'T see the potential positive there.

Moral of the story, most ST Coaches don't know a lick about kicking so they can't really improve their people...but they do know schemes and we've been much better there. Just look at our net punt and net KO yardages this year versus the last few.

Always appreciate having our resident special teams expert on Bearcat Banter. Thanks for the insight.

Agreed... maybe Fick needs to give the guy a call. #Just sayin

He will... but first thing's first - Bohn needs to call doss to assure him that 3-9 records are not acceptable so he will re-up his private lounge lease at Nippert.
 
11-20-2017 11:37 AM
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BeerCat Offline
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Post: #32
RE: Will 2018 be better?
(11-20-2017 11:23 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 11:21 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 11:11 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 09:35 AM)djtothemoney Wrote:  They had an interesting quote in the Enquirer this morning where Fickell somewhat called out his Seniors. I'm thinking this is a lot like the 2010 season, look for a big improvement next year.

Who would have thought our ST would have gotten worse when we actually added a coach?

Very few special teams coaches in the country have the necessary knowledge to make the visible parts of ST (kicking/punting) better, and the ones that do are not pretty obvious. The coverage schemes have been much better though, that much can be on DR being a good add who knows how to instill gap integrity and contain dynamics in KOC/PC.

I had a college coach recently ask me how I turned a backup midfielder into a D2 kicker and an offensive tackle into a D1 caliber punter at my high school...when I responded with "I actually know how to do what they're doing" he straight up told me that I'm the first he's ever met in 30 years of coaching. There just are not a lot of knowledgeable coaches when it comes to kicking dynamics who are employed on staffs, because a majority of the people with that knowledge are either former players with enough money to not want to deal with the crap OR people who aren't given respect because they never played the game. Luckily my HC understood that my ability to kick a 60-yarder on a warm day coupled with 4 years of college soccer and a willingness to work my ass off to understand the aspects of the game I hadn't picked up previously was worth it, and gave me a shot 5 years ago. Now things are definitely looking up in multiple areas on the coaching side, but unfortunately many coaches DON'T see the potential positive there.

Moral of the story, most ST Coaches don't know a lick about kicking so they can't really improve their people...but they do know schemes and we've been much better there. Just look at our net punt and net KO yardages this year versus the last few.

Always appreciate having our resident special teams expert on Bearcat Banter. Thanks for the insight.

Agreed... maybe Fick needs to give the guy a call. #Just sayin

Agreed on all accounts. Or maybe he can contact Fickell? I’m not really kidding. Seems like a lot of the useful teaching that kickers get comes from camps or special instruction. Am I right Bearcatman?
 
11-20-2017 11:39 AM
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Bearcats#1 Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Will 2018 be better?
(11-20-2017 11:37 AM)crex043 Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 11:23 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 11:21 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 11:11 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 09:35 AM)djtothemoney Wrote:  They had an interesting quote in the Enquirer this morning where Fickell somewhat called out his Seniors. I'm thinking this is a lot like the 2010 season, look for a big improvement next year.

Who would have thought our ST would have gotten worse when we actually added a coach?

Very few special teams coaches in the country have the necessary knowledge to make the visible parts of ST (kicking/punting) better, and the ones that do are not pretty obvious. The coverage schemes have been much better though, that much can be on DR being a good add who knows how to instill gap integrity and contain dynamics in KOC/PC.

I had a college coach recently ask me how I turned a backup midfielder into a D2 kicker and an offensive tackle into a D1 caliber punter at my high school...when I responded with "I actually know how to do what they're doing" he straight up told me that I'm the first he's ever met in 30 years of coaching. There just are not a lot of knowledgeable coaches when it comes to kicking dynamics who are employed on staffs, because a majority of the people with that knowledge are either former players with enough money to not want to deal with the crap OR people who aren't given respect because they never played the game. Luckily my HC understood that my ability to kick a 60-yarder on a warm day coupled with 4 years of college soccer and a willingness to work my ass off to understand the aspects of the game I hadn't picked up previously was worth it, and gave me a shot 5 years ago. Now things are definitely looking up in multiple areas on the coaching side, but unfortunately many coaches DON'T see the potential positive there.

Moral of the story, most ST Coaches don't know a lick about kicking so they can't really improve their people...but they do know schemes and we've been much better there. Just look at our net punt and net KO yardages this year versus the last few.

Always appreciate having our resident special teams expert on Bearcat Banter. Thanks for the insight.

Agreed... maybe Fick needs to give the guy a call. #Just sayin

He will... but first thing's first - Bohn needs to call doss to assure him that 3-9 records are not acceptable so he will re-up his private lounge lease at Nippert.

CALL Doss!? Guys like Doss get in-person meetings.
 
(This post was last modified: 11-20-2017 12:05 PM by Bearcats#1.)
11-20-2017 11:51 AM
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BearcatMan Online
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Post: #34
RE: Will 2018 be better?
(11-20-2017 11:39 AM)BeerCat Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 11:23 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 11:21 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 11:11 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 09:35 AM)djtothemoney Wrote:  They had an interesting quote in the Enquirer this morning where Fickell somewhat called out his Seniors. I'm thinking this is a lot like the 2010 season, look for a big improvement next year.

Who would have thought our ST would have gotten worse when we actually added a coach?

Very few special teams coaches in the country have the necessary knowledge to make the visible parts of ST (kicking/punting) better, and the ones that do are not pretty obvious. The coverage schemes have been much better though, that much can be on DR being a good add who knows how to instill gap integrity and contain dynamics in KOC/PC.

I had a college coach recently ask me how I turned a backup midfielder into a D2 kicker and an offensive tackle into a D1 caliber punter at my high school...when I responded with "I actually know how to do what they're doing" he straight up told me that I'm the first he's ever met in 30 years of coaching. There just are not a lot of knowledgeable coaches when it comes to kicking dynamics who are employed on staffs, because a majority of the people with that knowledge are either former players with enough money to not want to deal with the crap OR people who aren't given respect because they never played the game. Luckily my HC understood that my ability to kick a 60-yarder on a warm day coupled with 4 years of college soccer and a willingness to work my ass off to understand the aspects of the game I hadn't picked up previously was worth it, and gave me a shot 5 years ago. Now things are definitely looking up in multiple areas on the coaching side, but unfortunately many coaches DON'T see the potential positive there.

Moral of the story, most ST Coaches don't know a lick about kicking so they can't really improve their people...but they do know schemes and we've been much better there. Just look at our net punt and net KO yardages this year versus the last few.

Always appreciate having our resident special teams expert on Bearcat Banter. Thanks for the insight.

Agreed... maybe Fick needs to give the guy a call. #Just sayin

Agreed on all accounts. Or maybe he can contact Fickell? I’m not really kidding. Seems like a lot of the useful teaching that kickers get comes from camps or special instruction. Am I right Bearcatman?

I'd say it's about 25/75 between self-taught and camps. Kohl's has the biggest player Rolodex and the widest reaching coaching/training arm (what I do in the off-season), but most of the people in training are open volunteers, which I'm fine with TBH. The truth of the matter is that kicking dynamics are literally quarter inch adjustments, and unless you've made them yourself OR done the due diligence to spot them you won't be able to help...in a way it's a lot like golf, there are swing coaches who work with ALL the golfers, but would never be able to make it on one guy's entourage because it's too specialized for the money. Most kids start out with a passion for it (whether through soccer or just seeing it on TV and wanting to do it) but get frustrated when they realize how hard it is to get from the median to greatness. The path to kicking is littered by thousands of kids who were soccer players who tried a few times to kick the football the same way and were disappointed with the results....there are very few who get to the camp side of things, and even fewer who listen to the adjustments. It definitely helps being able to physically go out there and show them you know what you're talking about, but that will only last for so much longer for me personally.

A lot of STCs in college are former ST players who understand the coverage/blocking aspects (which is honestly just as important, if not moreso than the kicking aspects), but the ones who understand both can write their own checks and are few and far between. You can tell who they are by the amount of product the send to the NFL consistently. Georgia's ST for the 00's is the greatest example...just look at that guy's track record. The truth of the matter is that HC's don't really value a person's knowledge in ST because they know they won't be there long if they're good at their job. It's kind of the first stepping stone for most head coaches, and the ones who stay in that area long are normally given a negative stigma.
 
11-20-2017 12:02 PM
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JPBearcat3 Offline
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Post: #35
RE: Will 2018 be better?
Channeling my inner-Lush here: Have you ever wished you'd get picked for one of those Jeff Wyler halftime kicks? I'll hang up and listen...
 
11-20-2017 12:50 PM
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bearcatmark Offline
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Post: #36
RE: Will 2018 be better?
(11-20-2017 12:50 PM)JPBearcat3 Wrote:  Channeling my inner-Lush here: Have you ever wished you'd get picked for one of those Jeff Wyler halftime kicks? I'll hang up and listen...

On a similar note... Shouldn't we contact Toyota and bring back Punt for Prizes?

That was the greatest...40 yard punt..have to land it in the bed of the truck (and stay there) for you to win the truck...go get it.
 
11-20-2017 12:52 PM
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rosewater Offline
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Post: #37
RE: Will 2018 be better?
(11-20-2017 11:21 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 11:11 AM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 09:35 AM)djtothemoney Wrote:  They had an interesting quote in the Enquirer this morning where Fickell somewhat called out his Seniors. I'm thinking this is a lot like the 2010 season, look for a big improvement next year.

Who would have thought our ST would have gotten worse when we actually added a coach?

Very few special teams coaches in the country have the necessary knowledge to make the visible parts of ST (kicking/punting) better, and the ones that do are not pretty obvious. The coverage schemes have been much better though, that much can be on DR being a good add who knows how to instill gap integrity and contain dynamics in KOC/PC.

I had a college coach recently ask me how I turned a backup midfielder into a D2 kicker and an offensive tackle into a D1 caliber punter at my high school...when I responded with "I actually know how to do what they're doing" he straight up told me that I'm the first he's ever met in 30 years of coaching. There just are not a lot of knowledgeable coaches when it comes to kicking dynamics who are employed on staffs, because a majority of the people with that knowledge are either former players with enough money to not want to deal with the crap OR people who aren't given respect because they never played the game. Luckily my HC understood that my ability to kick a 60-yarder on a warm day coupled with 4 years of college soccer and a willingness to work my ass off to understand the aspects of the game I hadn't picked up previously was worth it, and gave me a shot 5 years ago. Now things are definitely looking up in multiple areas on the coaching side, but unfortunately many coaches DON'T see the potential positive there.

Moral of the story, most ST Coaches don't know a lick about kicking so they can't really improve their people...but they do know schemes and we've been much better there. Just look at our net punt and net KO yardages this year versus the last few.

Always appreciate having our resident special teams expert on Bearcat Banter. Thanks for the insight.

x2
 
11-20-2017 12:52 PM
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CliftonAve Offline
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Post: #38
RE: Will 2018 be better?
(11-20-2017 12:52 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 12:50 PM)JPBearcat3 Wrote:  Channeling my inner-Lush here: Have you ever wished you'd get picked for one of those Jeff Wyler halftime kicks? I'll hang up and listen...

On a similar note... Shouldn't we contact Toyota and bring back Punt for Prizes?

That was the greatest...40 yard punt..have to land it in the bed of the truck (and stay there) for you to win the truck...go get it.

Haha... I remember that deal. The odds of hitting that are worse than hitting the Toyota truck in center field at Great American.
 
11-20-2017 12:54 PM
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BearcatMan Online
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Post: #39
RE: Will 2018 be better?
(11-20-2017 12:52 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 12:50 PM)JPBearcat3 Wrote:  Channeling my inner-Lush here: Have you ever wished you'd get picked for one of those Jeff Wyler halftime kicks? I'll hang up and listen...

On a similar note... Shouldn't we contact Toyota and bring back Punt for Prizes?

That was the greatest...40 yard punt..have to land it in the bed of the truck (and stay there) for you to win the truck...go get it.

I have twice actually, once was a drawing up here in high school and I won $500 from my dismayed and furious Athletic Director and another time in 2007 at UC but they pulled me when they checked my student ID and realized who I was 03-lmfao.

One time I'd love to get pulled at Lions game...I could really use a couple thousand dollars every now and again. Hell I'd tell them double or nothing if they move it back to 50 and let me get my cleats.

The punting would be much harder for me since I sprial, those sorts of contests are hard as hell when you have to worry about 10-15 yards worth of rotational fade.
 
(This post was last modified: 11-20-2017 01:09 PM by BearcatMan.)
11-20-2017 01:06 PM
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Billy_Bearcat Offline
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Post: #40
RE: Will 2018 be better?
(11-20-2017 01:06 PM)BearcatMan Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 12:52 PM)bearcatmark Wrote:  
(11-20-2017 12:50 PM)JPBearcat3 Wrote:  Channeling my inner-Lush here: Have you ever wished you'd get picked for one of those Jeff Wyler halftime kicks? I'll hang up and listen...

On a similar note... Shouldn't we contact Toyota and bring back Punt for Prizes?

That was the greatest...40 yard punt..have to land it in the bed of the truck (and stay there) for you to win the truck...go get it.

I have twice actually, once was a drawing up here in high school and I won $500 from my dismayed and furious Athletic Director and another time in 2007 at UC but they pulled me when they checked my student ID and realized who I was 03-lmfao.

One time I'd love to get pulled at Lions game...I could really use a couple thousand dollars every now and again. Hell I'd tell them double or nothing if they move it back to 50 and let me get my cleats.

The punting would be much harder for me since I sprial, those sorts of contests are hard as hell when you have to worry about 10-15 yards worth of rotational fade.

You are my interwebs man crush by the way. Don’t tell Rath or mark.
 
11-20-2017 01:59 PM
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