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2017 MLB Awards finalists revealed
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dbackjon Offline
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Post: #21
RE: 2017 MLB Awards finalists revealed
Of those, Clemens should be in (Steriod wing), Halladay will be in.

Kershaw is an interesting case - not there yet, IMHO.
11-16-2017 04:22 PM
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stever20 Offline
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Post: #22
RE: 2017 MLB Awards finalists revealed
(11-16-2017 04:21 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Pitcher # of Awards
Roger Clemens 7 should be in HOF
Randy Johnson 5
Steve Carlton 4
Greg Maddux 4
Tom Seaver 3
Sandy Koufax 3
Pedro MartĂ­nez 3

Max Scherzer 3
Jim Palmer 3
Clayton Kershaw 3 will be in HOF
Tom Glavine 2
Tim Lincecum 2
Roy Halladay 2 will be in HOF
Johan Santana 2
Gaylord Perry 2
Denny McLain 2
Corey Kluber 2
Bret Saberhagen 2
Bob Gibson 2




Bolded in HOF
really of guys with even 2 Cy's- only Lincecum, Santana, McLain, Saberhagen with no chance- and still too early with Kluber(but he's tracking well)....
11-16-2017 05:07 PM
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Brookes Owl Offline
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Post: #23
RE: 2017 MLB Awards finalists revealed
(11-16-2017 04:22 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Of those, Clemens should be in (Steriod wing), Halladay will be in.

Kershaw is an interesting case - not there yet, IMHO.

This is straight up trolling.
11-16-2017 05:08 PM
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dbackjon Offline
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Post: #24
RE: 2017 MLB Awards finalists revealed
(11-16-2017 05:08 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 04:22 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Of those, Clemens should be in (Steriod wing), Halladay will be in.

Kershaw is an interesting case - not there yet, IMHO.

This is straight up trolling.

Nope - he hasn't pitched long enough. If his career ended today, he wouldn't make it.

Only one modern starter (excluding Dennis Eckersley, who relieved as well) is in the hall with under 200 wins - Sandy Koufax, at 162. Kershaw has 144. If he pitches another 2-3 years at this level, yes.
11-16-2017 06:50 PM
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dbackjon Offline
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Post: #25
RE: 2017 MLB Awards finalists revealed
Stanton and Altuve.
11-16-2017 07:05 PM
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stever20 Offline
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Post: #26
RE: 2017 MLB Awards finalists revealed
(11-16-2017 06:50 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 05:08 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 04:22 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Of those, Clemens should be in (Steriod wing), Halladay will be in.

Kershaw is an interesting case - not there yet, IMHO.

This is straight up trolling.

Nope - he hasn't pitched long enough. If his career ended today, he wouldn't make it.

Only one modern starter (excluding Dennis Eckersley, who relieved as well) is in the hall with under 200 wins - Sandy Koufax, at 162. Kershaw has 144. If he pitches another 2-3 years at this level, yes.
um, no. First off, if something happened to him he would get a sympathy vote which would if he was close push him over. But even w/o that- he'd be in so easily and with such a high percentage it'd make your head spin. He would be close to unanimous.
11-16-2017 09:51 PM
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dbackjon Offline
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Post: #27
RE: 2017 MLB Awards finalists revealed
(11-16-2017 09:51 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 06:50 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 05:08 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 04:22 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Of those, Clemens should be in (Steriod wing), Halladay will be in.

Kershaw is an interesting case - not there yet, IMHO.

This is straight up trolling.

Nope - he hasn't pitched long enough. If his career ended today, he wouldn't make it.

Only one modern starter (excluding Dennis Eckersley, who relieved as well) is in the hall with under 200 wins - Sandy Koufax, at 162. Kershaw has 144. If he pitches another 2-3 years at this level, yes.
um, no. First off, if something happened to him he would get a sympathy vote which would if he was close push him over. But even w/o that- he'd be in so easily and with such a high percentage it'd make your head spin. He would be close to unanimous.

Um no. Take your homer glasses off
11-17-2017 12:19 AM
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stever20 Offline
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Post: #28
RE: 2017 MLB Awards finalists revealed
(11-17-2017 12:19 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 09:51 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 06:50 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 05:08 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 04:22 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Of those, Clemens should be in (Steriod wing), Halladay will be in.

Kershaw is an interesting case - not there yet, IMHO.

This is straight up trolling.

Nope - he hasn't pitched long enough. If his career ended today, he wouldn't make it.

Only one modern starter (excluding Dennis Eckersley, who relieved as well) is in the hall with under 200 wins - Sandy Koufax, at 162. Kershaw has 144. If he pitches another 2-3 years at this level, yes.
um, no. First off, if something happened to him he would get a sympathy vote which would if he was close push him over. But even w/o that- he'd be in so easily and with such a high percentage it'd make your head spin. He would be close to unanimous.

Um no. Take your homer glasses off

Um, I'm not a Dodgers fan. Brookes Owl will get an absolute kick for you saying that :)

First off, Kershaw has won 3 Cy Young's The ONLY person eligible who isn't in the HOF is Roger Clemens, and we all know why he's not in the HOF. It's definitely not performance.

One thing you need to do is forget about the wins stat. It's largely meaningless now. Heck, we saw it just yesterday with the Cy Young. Kershaw led in wins by 2 and lost.

In MLB history, Kershaw right now is #54 all time in fWAR. in BR- he's #68 in their WAR. His 2.36 career ERA is #24 all time. His raw strikeouts- #68- and k/9 innings #8. He would be such an easy induction- the ONLY drama IMO would be is he unanimous? Sorry but you're dead wrong on this one.
11-17-2017 01:07 AM
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stever20 Offline
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Post: #29
RE: 2017 MLB Awards finalists revealed
and sure enough on FG there's a thing about the AL Cy Young race, and commenters saying they're dumbfounded that Sale got snubbed

I'll admit I'm a bit surprised the margin was 28-2, but when you have a 2.25-2.90 difference in ERA, with the guy with the 2.25 having the better record(as unimportant as that is to most now)- I don't see how almost anyone could be surprised by Kluber winning it.

I did see this- which is from an actual voter for the award.....

So what to do? To get another data point, I went to two pitchers’ game logs to see how they performed against offenses that scored more than the major-league average of runs (753, as per Baseball-Reference.com).
Each pitcher made 10 such regular-season starts. Sale faced the Yankees five times, the Indians and Twins twice each and the Rangers once. He totaled a 4.52 ERA in 61 2/3 innings, with 83 strikeouts and 17 walks.
Kluber started twice each against the Yankees and Rangers and once each against the Astros, Twins, Red Sox, Dodgers, Diamondbacks and Rockies. He totaled a 2.29 ERA in 74 2/3 innings, with 96 strikeouts and 15 walks.

(gee, sounds like something I'd do!)
11-17-2017 09:33 AM
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Brookes Owl Offline
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Post: #30
RE: 2017 MLB Awards finalists revealed
(11-17-2017 12:19 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 09:51 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 06:50 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 05:08 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  
(11-16-2017 04:22 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Of those, Clemens should be in (Steriod wing), Halladay will be in.

Kershaw is an interesting case - not there yet, IMHO.

This is straight up trolling.

Nope - he hasn't pitched long enough. If his career ended today, he wouldn't make it.

Only one modern starter (excluding Dennis Eckersley, who relieved as well) is in the hall with under 200 wins - Sandy Koufax, at 162. Kershaw has 144. If he pitches another 2-3 years at this level, yes.
um, no. First off, if something happened to him he would get a sympathy vote which would if he was close push him over. But even w/o that- he'd be in so easily and with such a high percentage it'd make your head spin. He would be close to unanimous.

Um no. Take your homer glasses off

03-lmfao03-lmfao03-lmfao03-lmfao03-lmfao03-lmfao03-lmfao

I don't know what's funnier, that you're calling stever a Dodger homer, or that you think wins are actually a relevant pitching stat.

I won't repeat all the stats stever quoted, but I'll add one that's very telling. ERA- of 62. Sixty ******* two. His ERA has been 38% better than the league. That is MLB's best ERA- for starters with at least 1500 IP. For some context, here's the top 20 all time ERA-...

1 Clayton Kershaw 62
2 Pedro Martinez 67
3 Walter Johnson 68
4 Lefty Grove 68
5 Ed Walsh 69
6 Al Spalding 69
7 Addie Joss 70
8 Roger Clemens 70
9 Mordecai Brown 71
10 Pete Alexander 73
11 Johan Santana 73
12 Kid Nichols 73
13 Cy Young 74
14 Christy Mathewson 74
15 Rube Waddell 74
16 Noodles Hahn 75
17 Sandy Koufax 75
18 Whitey Ford 75
19 Harry Brecheen 75
20 Randy Johnson 75
11-17-2017 05:12 PM
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