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baseball hall of fame
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Brookes Owl Offline
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Post: #21
RE: baseball hall of fame
Do a reverse order lookup of Hall of Fame ERA. Guess who's number 1? And by a large margin over anyone who's pitched in the last half a century.

03-lmfao
12-11-2017 01:56 PM
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stever20 Online
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Post: #22
RE: baseball hall of fame
(12-11-2017 01:56 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  Do a reverse order lookup of Hall of Fame ERA. Guess who's number 1? And by a large margin over anyone who's pitched in the last half a century.

03-lmfao

but he was the best pitcher of a decade. Sorry but 100% understand why he's going to be in the Hall of Fame.
12-11-2017 02:14 PM
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Brookes Owl Offline
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Post: #23
RE: baseball hall of fame
(12-11-2017 02:14 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(12-11-2017 01:56 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  Do a reverse order lookup of Hall of Fame ERA. Guess who's number 1? And by a large margin over anyone who's pitched in the last half a century.

03-lmfao

but he was the best pitcher of a decade. Sorry but 100% understand why he's going to be in the Hall of Fame.

That's FIP-dependent fWAR. By bWAR he's 12th. Not remotely close to best. Was he top 10 in anything besides starts in the 80s?
12-11-2017 03:14 PM
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stever20 Online
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Post: #24
RE: baseball hall of fame
(12-11-2017 03:14 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  
(12-11-2017 02:14 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(12-11-2017 01:56 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  Do a reverse order lookup of Hall of Fame ERA. Guess who's number 1? And by a large margin over anyone who's pitched in the last half a century.

03-lmfao

but he was the best pitcher of a decade. Sorry but 100% understand why he's going to be in the Hall of Fame.

That's FIP-dependent fWAR. By bWAR he's 12th. Not remotely close to best. Was he top 10 in anything besides starts in the 80s?
Innings, complete games, wins. Led AL in strikeouts.
12-11-2017 03:23 PM
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Brookes Owl Offline
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Post: #25
RE: baseball hall of fame
(12-11-2017 03:23 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(12-11-2017 03:14 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  
(12-11-2017 02:14 PM)stever20 Wrote:  
(12-11-2017 01:56 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  Do a reverse order lookup of Hall of Fame ERA. Guess who's number 1? And by a large margin over anyone who's pitched in the last half a century.

03-lmfao

but he was the best pitcher of a decade. Sorry but 100% understand why he's going to be in the Hall of Fame.

That's FIP-dependent fWAR. By bWAR he's 12th. Not remotely close to best. Was he top 10 in anything besides starts in the 80s?
Innings, complete games, wins. Led AL in strikeouts.

OK - I was being facetious but let's take a look at those stats. Innings? OK, durability, consistency but hardly a quality stat. Complete games? Same thing really. Possibly a measure of quality but not significantly so. Wins? Meh - team stat. Strikeouts! OK, there's something, but wait...it's total Ks, so again while somewhat a "quality" stat it's also a durability stat. His K/9 during the 80s? 5.8! Good enough for 51st best of the 80s (25th in AL). Woo hoo!

I'm just not seeing it. FIP gets him that high fWAR, and as far as I can tell it's because he had a lot of Ks (as much a function of durability as skill when looking at K/9). Very good pitcher and if I was a Tigers fan I'd be happy to have had him. Not the best pitcher of the 80s. Not worthy of Hall of Fame.
But he's certainly not the first guy in who didn't really deserve it.
12-11-2017 03:53 PM
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stever20 Online
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Post: #26
RE: baseball hall of fame
he was the best AL pitcher of the 80's. bar none.

I just think it's so comical the absolute outrage that he got in. And the fact that you have advanced metrics folks using ERA as a reason. that's just LOL funny.
12-11-2017 04:06 PM
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Lush Offline
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Post: #27
RE: baseball hall of fame
he was the best pitcher in the 80's, so what. maybe that decade sucked for pitching. and then throw in alan trammell. it's getting pretty ridiculous
12-11-2017 04:07 PM
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Post: #28
RE: baseball hall of fame
Everyone gets a trophy...
12-11-2017 10:02 PM
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Wedge Offline
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Post: #29
RE: baseball hall of fame
(11-16-2017 04:01 PM)Brookes Owl Wrote:  A guy who can churn out hundreds of quality innings is absolutely the kind of guy you want on your team, but does it really make him elite? Is there an endurance number where you go from "really good for a long time" to "elite volume of effort"? Is this where we discuss guys like Phil Niekro and Gaylord Perry? (who also had multiple elite level seasons each)

Morris isn't close to those guys.

Phil Niekro's best was better than Morris' best. Niekro is already in the Hall, though, as is Perry.

I wouldn't have voted for Morris, but whatever. There are lesser pitchers already in the Hall.
12-12-2017 11:06 AM
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Brookes Owl Offline
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Post: #30
RE: baseball hall of fame
(12-11-2017 04:06 PM)stever20 Wrote:  he was the best AL pitcher of the 80's. bar none.

cuz fWAR? Come on...
12-12-2017 03:58 PM
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