The unofficial online home for fans of the Western Michigan University Broncos. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

November 9, 2013 when we lose in OT to EMU at Rynearson. Guess who is EMU QB-Roback!

PJ Fleck: “Like I said we've got to be better and everything, everything falls on me. We just have to be better, we weren't good enough so when you go back there are so many times we could have put the ball in the end zone, there are so many times we have short yardage that we don't get we have the same guys repeating errors in a tight tense situation. They are going to have to work through that they are going to have to have some experience to work through that. They are in positions sometimes that they have not necessarily been in and they don't have the confidence to do that at times and we have got to improve. "

October 12, 2013 and the Broncos lose their homecoming game to Buffalo 33-0.

PJ Fleck: “Thank you to our fans. Thank you to our student section. Thank you to our community. You all deserve a winner. I feel bad for you. I do. You're all hurting here at homecoming and with alumni. I know you're hurting and I am the guy to blame. I promise you this, you deserve a winner and you will get a winner. I can't tell you when, or promise you when but you will get a winner. You will get a solid winner year after year after year, but I just can't promise you when. I wish I could. I believe in this community and I love this community, and that's why I'm here. I believe in this program and I believe in what we are doing. I believe in our players past, present and future players. I am so darn proud to be your football coach, even though some of you aren't proud to have me as your football coach. I am still proud. I promise you this, you all deserve a winner and I am going to give you a winner eventually."

My point being, PJ Fleck was a great coach who put together a winner at WMU. But it didn't happen overnight, it took awhile. We had some embarrassing losses early on and a lot of folks were disparaging him.

I don't think Tim Lester has as far to go, there is more talent in this program than the 2013 version of the Broncos. But it'll take a couple of seasons to get Wassink where he needs to be as QB. Just like it took Terrell a couple of seasons. And our WRers are getting better each game, you can see it.

Again, P.J. was dealt a completely deck than Lester.

Apples and oranges.

Does it seem like we are getting better from week to week, or does it seem like our best game was week one, and we have regressed if anything? I don't know. With Fleck I honestly remember feeling like he was building the team, and being fairly confident that despite the losses that first year, we would be better in time. There is an excellent chance my instincts are wrong about this, and I certainly hope they are, but this season so far isn't giving me great optimism for the future. Let's see it play out this year and we will all know more.

Kind of goes against the Fleck always just blamed his players narrative, doesn't it?

Guys, Lester when he came in said he was left a loaded program with a great culture, or were we not listening? If Tim Lester didn't come in with the idea of rebuilding, or needing time, why are we as fans making that excuse up for him?

He's going to have plenty of time to show he is the man for the job. So far, I think people have a right to be skeptical.

(10-22-2017 03:19 PM)PezKingGL1 Wrote:  Kind of goes against the Fleck always just blamed his players narrative, doesn't it?

Outside the 1-11 season, under Fleck we also had a couple years where we fell short. We lost games we should've won vs Northern Illinois both those years, came out flat vs Georgia Southern, got steamrolled by Bowling Green St at home, etc.

(10-22-2017 06:13 PM)Bronco14 Wrote:  Outside the 1-11 season, under Fleck we also had a couple years where we fell short. We lost games we should've won vs Northern Illinois both those years, came out flat vs Georgia Southern, got steamrolled by Bowling Green St at home, etc.

Valid point.

(10-22-2017 06:43 PM)brovol Wrote:  

(10-22-2017 06:13 PM)Bronco14 Wrote:  Outside the 1-11 season, under Fleck we also had a couple years where we fell short. We lost games we should've won vs Northern Illinois both those years, came out flat vs Georgia Southern, got steamrolled by Bowling Green St at home, etc.

Valid point.

Yep. 8-5 in 2015 should have been 10-3, possibly 11-2.

Quote:Outside the 1-11 season, under Fleck we also had a couple years where we fell short. We lost games we should've won vs Northern Illinois both those years, came out flat vs Georgia Southern, got steamrolled by Bowling Green St at home, etc.

We shouldn't have been 1-11 that first year. No excuses for anything below 3 wins, no matter how much of a rebuilding program we were becoming.

And what you point out -- yes, we were not optimal in some years. We lost a few games we should have won. That said, many other functional teams that are tough to beat do the same, but we don't think about them so much.

Quote:8-5 in 2015 should have been 10-3, possibly 11-2.

I think that's going too far, though. Losing @GA-Southern wasn't the worst in the world, but How we lost. They were certainly capable and a capable team of beating us at their home in GA that year. We "should" have lost to MSU & @OSU.

Add to that: BGSU who won the MAC, @NIU, and @Toledo -- One Loss would Definitely be Expected, and two losses wouldn't be a WTF. We "shouldn't" have beat ranked Toledo just as much that we "should" have beat BGSU, MAC Champ, at home.

In the end though, I would say @NIU -- that one is the most "should have".

IMO, being 8-4 instead of 7-5, then 9-4 post-bowl is what we "should have been".

But in the realm of "realistically could but not a should" -- I'd say 9-3, then 10-3 post-bowl.

Defending MAC Champs for the 1st time in 30 years > All the other BS.

Is Fleck a douche-bag? Yes.

Did Fleck do his job by winning a championship and dominating CMU? Yes.

Is Fleck gone? Yes.

End of story.

Beat CMU!

(10-23-2017 03:24 PM)GullLake Wrote:  Defending MAC Champs for the 1st time in 30 years > All the other BS.

Is Fleck a douche-bag? Yes.

Did Fleck do his job by winning a championship and dominating CMU? Yes.

Is Fleck gone? Yes.

End of story.

Beat CMU!

Ditto