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Houston could be next NHL expansion city
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_C2_ Online
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Post: #41
RE: Houston could be next NHL expansion city
So we can roughly translate that to mean an NHL team would get at least twice those numbers. Just guessing.
10-24-2017 08:26 PM
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DawgNBama Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Houston could be next NHL expansion city
(10-24-2017 04:48 AM)_C2_ Wrote:  
(10-23-2017 10:23 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  
(10-21-2017 01:11 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  
(10-21-2017 01:04 PM)Love and Honor Wrote:  Imo they should've moved the Coyotes to Vegas, moved the Panthers to Quebec, and expanded to Seattle and Kansas City. No realignment necessary.

Speaking of the Panthers and Coyotes.... the Coyotes are still owned by the NHL right? Have they had any bidders? Seems like the franchise and the market are ok but the ownership group is on shaky ground. Wasn't there an issue with a rink deal? I can't remember what I had heard about the Panthers but weren't they in a ownership situation too?

I mean, yeah, the Quebec Nordiques 2.0 would be cool but are the economics in that province/city back to where a pro sports team can return?

I would think western cities like Seattle, Portland, or Kansas City would make more sense but then again, at least with Seattle and Portland.... how does the NBA factor in? Seattle still hasn't gotten a team in to replace the Sonics so.... Can Portland support two pro teams?

KC would be interesting.... have they ever had a NBA team? Would the Chiefs take up too much of the fan base? The Royals wouldn't really overlap for games and fans.



IIRC the Coyotes majority shares were recently bought by the guy who purchased them while they were in bankruptcy while the Panthers are owned by some South Florida conglomerate. Neither are on stable ground.

I think Quebec would work out, they have the brand new arena there and it's a bigger metro area than Winnipeg. I don't think Bettman likes the idea of retreating from southern markets however, you get a reliable fan base but a low ceiling while giving up potential but a high risk for failure.

I don't think Portland could support a team with them having the NBA, as mentioned earlier the non-traditional markets have done best in the absence of pro basketball. My aunt lives in Seattle and says that people there would much rather get a new Sonics team than the NHL, but would support hockey pretty well - the problem is that in light of that, building a new arena is tough.

Kansas City would be fine for a team because it's a market made up of a lot of born 'n bred locals. Much of the south and west has so many hockey transplants already committed to their northern team (Exhibit A, me in Tampa), but KC has a lot of local pride. While the Blues are their favorite hockey club now, we aren't very big there.

Quebec has a much higher ceiling than Raleigh. It's not even close. A Southern/Sun Belt team would have to be in the Stanley Cup Finals every year to garner the attention an average Canadian/Frost Belt one would get except LA because it's so big.

LA has lost teams before. It has lost the Rams to St. Louis & the Raiders to Oakland. If someone wants to buy the Kings & move 'em, nobody will stop that individual. LA should have a third NBA franchise because basketball is way more popular over there than hockey.
10-24-2017 11:58 PM
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_C2_ Online
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Post: #43
RE: Houston could be next NHL expansion city
Indeed, the ink was almost dry on the Sacramento Kings move to become the Anaheim Royals.

That said, LA lost the NFL because of renegade owners, not because there wasn't a market for it. It's likely the Chargers will be gone one day again because for a multitude of reasons it was a bad move for them to move up north, poor stadium situation or not.
10-25-2017 12:20 AM
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DawgNBama Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Houston could be next NHL expansion city
That's an excuse. The truth is there really is no market for NFL football in LA. If there was, LA would have moved heaven & earth to get a team (s) long before when they actually got one.

Either that, or I am right about Atlanta having renegade owners owning its hockey team. You can't have it both ways.
10-25-2017 01:24 PM
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Post: #45
RE: Houston could be next NHL expansion city
No, LA's attitude was always that you need us more than we need you, so if you want to be here, you build your own stadium on your dime. The only public funded stadium in LA IIRC is Staples Center, which was built for three teams. Otherwise, they don't build public stadiums in California AFAIK.

Al Davis was the most notoriously renegade owner in all of sports, so I am right and not just making a BS excuse. Few of the other owners liked him and he moved to LA pretty much without their consent. Georgia Frontiere really wasn't much better in people's eyes, seen as a gold digger that inherited the Rams and was not highly respected by other NFL owners. She got a sweetheart deal in St. Louis for a stadium originally funded for what would become either the Carolina Panthers and Jacksonville Jaguars.
10-25-2017 02:16 PM
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Brookes Owl Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Houston could be next NHL expansion city
(10-25-2017 02:16 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  No, LA's attitude was always that you need us more than we need you, so if you want to be here, you build your own stadium on your dime. The only public funded stadium in LA IIRC is Staples Center, which was built for three teams. Otherwise, they don't build public stadiums in California AFAIK.

Al Davis was the most notoriously renegade owner in all of sports, so I am right and not just making a BS excuse. Few of the other owners liked him and he moved to LA pretty much without their consent. Georgia Frontiere really wasn't much better in people's eyes, seen as a gold digger that inherited the Rams and was not highly respected by other NFL owners. She got a sweetheart deal in St. Louis for a stadium originally funded for what would become either the Carolina Panthers and Jacksonville Jaguars.

Agree with all this except that there are still stadium deals in CA with public financing. Levi's as an example. To their credit, the Warrior's new arena is 100% privately financed.
10-25-2017 06:56 PM
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Post: #47
RE: Houston could be next NHL expansion city
Levi's was mostly privately financed though, wasn't it?
10-26-2017 12:22 AM
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lew240z Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Houston could be next NHL expansion city
The city of Santa Clara owns the land and leases it to the Santa Clara Stadium Authority. An ordinance prohibits the use of city funds or a tax increase to build and operate the stadium. The Stadium Authority can and did borrow the construction costs.

Quote:In case of, or more likely in anticipation of, the Santa Clara San Francisco 49ers Stadium becoming a money loser, as has happened with stadiums all around the country, the city of Santa Clara leadership is planning to erect a firewall to prevent them from being liable for the debts of a stadium that can't pay its bills. The firewall is called the Santa Clara Stadium Authority. It is termed a joint powers authority. A joint powers authority must be formed from two or more entities and as a partner the city has chosen its own Redevelopment Agency (officially an agency of the state of California although run by Santa Clara politicians and bureaucrats). The same players will be the head of the Santa Clara Stadium Authority that are the head of the city itself, the city council and the city manager and city attorney. In order to limit their liability in the case of a money losing stadium, the San Francisco 49ers are creating a firewall as well - the Forty Niners Stadium, LLC (Limited Liability Corporation). So if you hear anyone saying that the Santa Clara San Francisco 49ers Stadium deal is a can't miss proposition, ask them why both parties involved created new entities to protect themselves from losses.

The Stadium Authority obtained loans to build the stadium. This loan is to be repaid by a hotel tax and a complicated scheme using private financing.

To sum up, the city leases the land to the Stadium Authority which obtained the construction loans. The Stadium Authority leases the stadium to the Forty Niners Stadium, LLC, a subsidiary of the San Francisco Forty Niners, LTD., which is the team. The Forty Niners Stadium, LLC then subleases the stadium to its parent San Francisco Forty Niners, LTD.

It is a clever scheme. If the stadium fails the Stadium Authority declares bankrupty protecting the City, and The Forty Niners Stadium, LLC declares bankruptcy protecting the team ownership. The lenders are left holding the bag.
(This post was last modified: 10-26-2017 01:52 AM by lew240z.)
10-26-2017 01:47 AM
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