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U.S. eliminated from World Cup
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wmubroncopilot Offline
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Post: #21
RE: U.S. eliminated from World Cup
(10-11-2017 10:51 PM)ChicagoMan Wrote:  
(10-11-2017 06:33 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  
(10-11-2017 04:49 PM)ChicagoMan Wrote:  
(10-11-2017 02:06 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  This idea that guys have to be capped X number of times is just BS. If a guy is playing regularly in a top four European league, whether born here or not, they are a better damn option than half the old guard MLS guys we put out there. National teams are based on talent. The idea that we have to carefully brood chemistry for a team that plays 10 competitive matches in their busiest years is how we ended up with this aging mess. Then to say we would've had to make roster changes if we made it? Insane.

And again, I will not argue for Klinsmann and will not argue that we have a talent issue this cycle. But if you seriously think we didn't have the players to DRAW Trinidad's B team (B+ if we're generous) in a do or die, or get a result against Costa Rica at home for that matter, you're nuts. That is on Bruce, and it's perfectly possible to acknowledge both.

No, it's not BS, Germany does that now, you know, the same Germany your hero came from right? Jurgen stuck with these old guard players all along. And Johnson sucks donkey balls. He can stay away from USMNT.

Jurbag should have been fired after the World Cup. Terrible TD, he took credit for development that was happening organically and he was just TD in name only.

Metro dbag that he is.

Germany has so much talent that they brought basically a U23 team to the Confederations Cup against a bunch of top teams' A squads and won it anyway. We aren't Germany.

Although that brings up a good point, Bruce should have brought in an actual youth team for the Gold Cup, and all the supporters I knew at the time agreed. We learned little to nothing from that tournament because he didn't play anyone new for the knockouts when we actually had sort of tough games.

It's pretty clear you've run out of arguments, and that the extent of your soccer knowledge is from watching the USMNT for a while. That's fine, but don't try to pass the Bruce Arena garbage fire as acceptable because you remember when he won some World Cup games 15 years ago. There is a reason that hire was widely panned. And you've refused to address any points regarding him. Just "it's all Jurgen's fault".

You confused little metro, I did address your "points" as their being pointless. We're in this situation due to Jurbag. I have been watching EPL since way before you were born. It's clear you think that because you have some rudimentary soccer knowledge and follow European soccer that you are the only one "qualified" to discuss. What a poser arrogant take. Why am I not surprised?

You sound like those gay guys out there that yell at other gay guys for not being GAY enough. You do that too?

03-lmfao Bruce should have brought youth in for the Gold Cup for Jurgen doesn't do anything for five years and it's ok? THAT is rich.

You're take is exactly the problem with the soccer culture in this country, your type of faux expert attitude.

BTW, Jason LaCanforna has a great take on how "not inclusive" the sport is and why we don't develop elite talent in this country.

I'm sorry, I don't believe you. If you knew anything you'd never have served up that garbage take about being better off going through the NCAA than our "club mentality".

And I still have yet to defend Klinsmann, but keep piling on that strawman.
10-11-2017 11:16 PM
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ChicagoMan Offline
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Post: #22
RE: U.S. eliminated from World Cup
(10-11-2017 11:16 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  
(10-11-2017 10:51 PM)ChicagoMan Wrote:  
(10-11-2017 06:33 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  
(10-11-2017 04:49 PM)ChicagoMan Wrote:  
(10-11-2017 02:06 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  This idea that guys have to be capped X number of times is just BS. If a guy is playing regularly in a top four European league, whether born here or not, they are a better damn option than half the old guard MLS guys we put out there. National teams are based on talent. The idea that we have to carefully brood chemistry for a team that plays 10 competitive matches in their busiest years is how we ended up with this aging mess. Then to say we would've had to make roster changes if we made it? Insane.

And again, I will not argue for Klinsmann and will not argue that we have a talent issue this cycle. But if you seriously think we didn't have the players to DRAW Trinidad's B team (B+ if we're generous) in a do or die, or get a result against Costa Rica at home for that matter, you're nuts. That is on Bruce, and it's perfectly possible to acknowledge both.

No, it's not BS, Germany does that now, you know, the same Germany your hero came from right? Jurgen stuck with these old guard players all along. And Johnson sucks donkey balls. He can stay away from USMNT.

Jurbag should have been fired after the World Cup. Terrible TD, he took credit for development that was happening organically and he was just TD in name only.

Metro dbag that he is.

Germany has so much talent that they brought basically a U23 team to the Confederations Cup against a bunch of top teams' A squads and won it anyway. We aren't Germany.

Although that brings up a good point, Bruce should have brought in an actual youth team for the Gold Cup, and all the supporters I knew at the time agreed. We learned little to nothing from that tournament because he didn't play anyone new for the knockouts when we actually had sort of tough games.

It's pretty clear you've run out of arguments, and that the extent of your soccer knowledge is from watching the USMNT for a while. That's fine, but don't try to pass the Bruce Arena garbage fire as acceptable because you remember when he won some World Cup games 15 years ago. There is a reason that hire was widely panned. And you've refused to address any points regarding him. Just "it's all Jurgen's fault".

You confused little metro, I did address your "points" as their being pointless. We're in this situation due to Jurbag. I have been watching EPL since way before you were born. It's clear you think that because you have some rudimentary soccer knowledge and follow European soccer that you are the only one "qualified" to discuss. What a poser arrogant take. Why am I not surprised?

You sound like those gay guys out there that yell at other gay guys for not being GAY enough. You do that too?

03-lmfao Bruce should have brought youth in for the Gold Cup for Jurgen doesn't do anything for five years and it's ok? THAT is rich.

You're take is exactly the problem with the soccer culture in this country, your type of faux expert attitude.

BTW, Jason LaCanforna has a great take on how "not inclusive" the sport is and why we don't develop elite talent in this country.

I'm sorry, I don't believe you. If you knew anything you'd never have served up that garbage take about being better off going through the NCAA than our "club mentality".

And I still have yet to defend Klinsmann, but keep piling on that strawman.

I give a rip what you believe or don't. You're more than welcome to say that to my face Saturday btw, man up metrofitz. 07-coffee3

Oh, you've defended Jurbag, here and elsewhere, regarding his selection of players and that he was a good TD. So don't play word games now.
(This post was last modified: 10-11-2017 11:29 PM by ChicagoMan.)
10-11-2017 11:28 PM
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brovol Online
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Post: #23
RE: U.S. eliminated from World Cup
(10-10-2017 09:04 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  Good thing we hired Fat Bruce.

Exactly.
10-12-2017 05:05 AM
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Charm City Bronco Offline
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Post: #24
RE: U.S. eliminated from World Cup
(10-11-2017 10:51 PM)ChicagoMan Wrote:  BTW, Jason LaCanforna has a great take on how "not inclusive" the sport is and why we don't develop elite talent in this country.

La Canfora is a world class tool and doesn't have any new insight that anyone with half a brain and pays attention to soccer in the US has.

Soccer in the US (and the US Soccer Federation) is built around money. It's around only rich white suburbanite families who have the money to play in ridiculously expensive travel tournament and training sessions and excludes poor minority families who are much more talented but can't afford to play in the stupid travel tournaments, which are the only way to get noticed by college scouts.

People always ask "how can a nation of 300 million people lose to Trinidad and Tobago?" This is why.

FCK MLS
10-12-2017 07:05 AM
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Charm City Bronco Offline
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Post: #25
RE: U.S. eliminated from World Cup
(10-12-2017 05:05 AM)brovol Wrote:  
(10-10-2017 09:04 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  Good thing we hired Fat Bruce.

Exactly.

USSF rot runs way deeper than Arena. The foundation USSF is built on is shakier than ground in CDMX.
10-12-2017 07:08 AM
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ChicagoMan Offline
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Post: #26
RE: U.S. eliminated from World Cup
(10-12-2017 07:05 AM)Charm City Bronco Wrote:  
(10-11-2017 10:51 PM)ChicagoMan Wrote:  BTW, Jason LaCanforna has a great take on how "not inclusive" the sport is and why we don't develop elite talent in this country.

La Canfora is a world class tool and doesn't have any new insight that anyone with half a brain and pays attention to soccer in the US has.

Soccer in the US (and the US Soccer Federation) is built around money. It's around only rich white suburbanite families who have the money to play in ridiculously expensive travel tournament and training sessions and excludes poor minority families who are much more talented but can't afford to play in the stupid travel tournaments, which are the only way to get noticed by college scouts.

People always ask "how can a nation of 300 million people lose to Trinidad and Tobago?" This is why.

FCK MLS

He is....but this time you two are in lockstep. I've felt the same way.

Rich kids from the shrub burbs aren't always your best athletes. Our pay to play soccer culture is hardly inclusive and the snobbism that it creates turns people off. Has for decades.

Until we get away from that model, third world countries with poverty conditions will still be beating us. Those guys hardly have a pay for play system.

You guys might want to note that the teams advancing to the World Cup ahead of us are full of MLS players. This isn't solely an "MLS thing", it's an American thing.
10-12-2017 07:21 AM
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GullLake Offline
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Post: #27
RE: U.S. eliminated from World Cup
Interesting perspectives.

While I am not immersed in the youth-soccer culture, I do know that "Club" teams are becoming more & more cut-throat and self-serving. It becomes more about $ than kids.

Soccer is not the only sport where "Club" or AAU has too much of a presence. Basketball, volleyball, baseball/softball, and swimming have similar issues.

When kids are discouraged by club coaches from competing for their school and/or playing multi-sports, it is an issue of selfishness.
10-12-2017 09:01 AM
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wmubroncopilot Offline
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Post: #28
RE: U.S. eliminated from World Cup
(10-12-2017 07:08 AM)Charm City Bronco Wrote:  
(10-12-2017 05:05 AM)brovol Wrote:  
(10-10-2017 09:04 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  Good thing we hired Fat Bruce.

Exactly.

USSF rot runs way deeper than Arena. The foundation USSF is built on is shakier than ground in CDMX.

This is absolutely true; and so are the points about pay-to-play, etc.

However... these are kind of two separate issues. The system is why the US has been unable to take the next step to compete on a world stage. We still have PLENTY of talent, right now, to get results in T&T and CONCACAF in general and get to the WC. That falls on the players and the senior NT coach.

Some have suggested this may be a good thing, that it will finally force system wide change. I would like to think so, but I'm not all that confident.

Gulati after the game: "You don't make wholesale changes on a ball being two inches wide or two inches in."

Arena: "There's nothing wrong with what we're doing. Certainly as our league grows, it advances the national team program. We have some good young players come up.

"Nothing has to change. To make any kind of crazy changes I think would be foolish. We're building a good system in our professional league. We have players playing abroad of some quality."

If Gulati doesn't resign or get voted out there is a serious problem.
10-12-2017 11:03 AM
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ChicagoMan Offline
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Post: #29
RE: U.S. eliminated from World Cup
(10-12-2017 11:03 AM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  
(10-12-2017 07:08 AM)Charm City Bronco Wrote:  
(10-12-2017 05:05 AM)brovol Wrote:  
(10-10-2017 09:04 PM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  Good thing we hired Fat Bruce.

Exactly.

USSF rot runs way deeper than Arena. The foundation USSF is built on is shakier than ground in CDMX.

This is absolutely true; and so are the points about pay-to-play, etc.

However... these are kind of two separate issues. The system is why the US has been unable to take the next step to compete on a world stage. We still have PLENTY of talent, right now, to get results in T&T and CONCACAF in general and get to the WC. That falls on the players and the senior NT coach.

Some have suggested this may be a good thing, that it will finally force system wide change. I would like to think so, but I'm not all that confident.

Gulati after the game: "You don't make wholesale changes on a ball being two inches wide or two inches in."

Arena: "There's nothing wrong with what we're doing. Certainly as our league grows, it advances the national team program. We have some good young players come up.

"Nothing has to change. To make any kind of crazy changes I think would be foolish. We're building a good system in our professional league. We have players playing abroad of some quality."

If Gulati doesn't resign or get voted out there is a serious problem.

Gulati has to be challenged to be voted out. So far there hasn't been one. Both Gulati and Arena are wrong on this. It needs to change. Our kids play better ball than the older guys, and I'm not talking the MLS crew that played Gold Cup. The future is bright, but the missing generation still exists for many of the reasons that we discussed.

I think Bruce has to be done. He was always a bandaid to this mess that Jurgen created. Kind of like Davis after Knight, worked short term, wasn't going to long term.

Well, onto other soccer now we're out. I'm just glad Kronke is ruining Arsenal like he does every other franchise he owns. That'll be fun to watch play out. 03-phew
(This post was last modified: 10-12-2017 11:19 AM by ChicagoMan.)
10-12-2017 11:17 AM
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ChicagoMan Offline
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Post: #30
RE: U.S. eliminated from World Cup
10-12-2017 11:27 AM
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