How has the transformation happened that has taken an 0-12 team in 2015 to a bowl in 2016 at 6-6 to an AAC title threat? That's pretty darn fast and impressive.

As a fan of a team that is likely to be 0-12 this season, I really need to know.

Can't say for sure since I don't follow them, but if you look at the years surrounding the winless season UCF was always a really good G5 team so it's not like they didn't have any talent or players who knew how to win. Was probably a case of that plus the right hire leading to a quick turnaround after Murphy's Law happened.

Who you should really be asking are Miami fans, we went through a winless 2013 and finally started to emerge from the darkness halfway through last season. It's never easy to rebuild from those depths, but UTEP has enough resources in place that if you get the right coach and stay patient for a year or two you'll be fine.

Ucf has gone winless 2x under o’leary and it was mostly cause of his old school coaching attitude and not recruiting fully. We’d have the odd year curse bc he would only play the 1’s and not play for depth later. Frost had turned it around with actual recruiting to his system and a huge cultural change. These players are smart and hard workers. Florida has tons of talent which is why Frost was able to do it quickly. It’s part of the reason he took the job bc he didn’t have to travel far to get everything he needed.

(10-01-2017 03:08 PM)jaredf29 Wrote:  Ucf has gone winless 2x under o’leary and it was mostly cause of his old school coaching attitude and not recruiting fully. We’d have the odd year curse bc he would only play the 1’s and not play for depth later. Frost had turned it around with actual recruiting to his system and a huge cultural change. These players are smart and hard workers. Florida has tons of talent which is why Frost was able to do it quickly. It’s part of the reason he took the job bc he didn’t have to travel far to get everything he needed.

That old school coaching philosophy is exactly what coach Kugler has had at UTEP. After the loss to Army yesterday he was asked if he would pass more going forward and his answer was "I hope not". He stepped down this afternoon so as soon as a new AD is on board, he/she can put their stamp on UTEP athletics immediately with a new football coach. I wish Kugler the best in the future but it turned out he just couldn't build a winner, especially trying to use smash mouth football.

Is Kugler at UTEP the first FBS coaching casualty of the season?

Having watched my share of coaching failures. I suspect the UCF problem was the bad years being magnified by players losing faith in the staff. If the players don't believe, a team will underachieve vs capability in a dramatic manner.

Doubt their talent ever fell too much.

(10-02-2017 09:55 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  Having watched my share of coaching failures. I suspect the UCF problem was the bad years being magnified by players losing faith in the staff. If the players don't believe, a team will underachieve vs capability in a dramatic manner.

Doubt their talent ever fell too much.

This is it exactly. That team was not a winless team from a talent level. It was a perfect storm where the starting QB went down early and we had only a RS-FR and a FR QB behind him. You had an OC who had just been promoted (so that he could be O'Leary's successor as HC) and he was clueless. Then O'Leary started cussing the QBs every time they made a mistake and pulling the more talented one to put in the guy who couldn't hit the broad side of the barn. Top that all off with O'Leary basically trying to rain down fear onto the rest of the team, and the wheels fell off.

Had O'Leary not promoted his buttboy to OC, we win several games that year, as a our previous OC had built the offense and was good at handling the QBs. Even if Holman had still gotten injured, I think he would have handled the young QBs much better and put them in a better chance to succeed. We might have ended up 3-9 or so, but that's a hell of a lot better than 0-12.

(10-01-2017 01:03 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  How has the transformation happened that has taken an 0-12 team in 2015 to a bowl in 2016 at 6-6 to an AAC title threat? That's pretty darn fast and impressive.

As a fan of a team that is likely to be 0-12 this season, I really need to know.

Complete culture change from one of fear to one of fun. I've never seen a UCF team playing harder with more heart and determination than these two years under Frost.

Also, the S&C was huge. Marshall hired our Asst S&C coach several years ago, and he was apparently the secret to our success. The S&C really dropped O'Leary's last couple of years and we started getting dominated in the trenches. Frost brought in a new S&C staff that has done wonders, and they're also very modern about their techniques versus O'Leary's guys that were more old school trying to set lifting records for the sake of it.

And finally, Frost has recruited his ass off. He's had pretty much the best G5 class both years and been better than many P5s. And I think if the recruiting services were honest and valued G5 commits like they do P5 commits, we'd have had classes ranked in the low 30s/high 40s at worst.

(10-01-2017 04:32 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  Is Kugler at UTEP the first FBS coaching casualty of the season?

Yes he is. Here is an article speculating on potential replacements.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/7-n...ar-AAsMYJa

Schools like a UCF can turn it around quickly by simply recruiting the talented Florida players around them. USF was also down a few years ago. Willie Taggart came in and recruited like a mad man and turned it around relatively quickly also, going from 2-10 to 11-2 in 3 years. It also helps to recruit a star QB. I am convinced that you need to do that ASAP when taking over. Taggart signed Quinton Flowers, after a bunch of warm bodies had been rotating at the QB position, and the rest is history. UCF seems to have done the same thing with McKenzie Milton (although I personally think his arm strength is somewhat suspect). Milton kinda reminds me of former USF QB Matt Grothe...an undersized QB with an average arm, but with moxie, and playmaking ability, who is an accurate passer and can run.

Have any coaches won consistently at UTEP?

(10-02-2017 01:36 PM)Hood-rich Wrote:  Have any coaches won consistently at UTEP?

Had a string of good seasons in the 60's or early 70's.

It's a tough gig, the support is there if they find the right person.

(10-02-2017 01:36 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  Schools like a UCF can turn it around quickly by simply recruiting the talented Florida players around them. USF was also down a few years ago. Willie Taggart came in and recruited like a mad man and turned it around relatively quickly also, going from 2-10 to 11-2 in 3 years. It also helps to recruit a star QB. I am convinced that you need to do that ASAP when taking over. Taggart signed Quinton Flowers, after a bunch of warm bodies had been rotating at the QB position, and the rest is history. UCF seems to have done the same thing with McKenzie Milton (although I personally think his arm strength is somewhat suspect). Milton kinda reminds me of former USF QB Matt Grothe...an undersized QB with an average arm, but with moxie, and playmaking ability, who is an accurate passer and can run.

As much as I hope Grothe chokes on a bag of dicks, I think it's a good comparison, and I hope McKenzie shows as much grit as Grothe often did when times get tough.

(10-02-2017 01:53 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(10-02-2017 01:36 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  Schools like a UCF can turn it around quickly by simply recruiting the talented Florida players around them. USF was also down a few years ago. Willie Taggart came in and recruited like a mad man and turned it around relatively quickly also, going from 2-10 to 11-2 in 3 years. It also helps to recruit a star QB. I am convinced that you need to do that ASAP when taking over. Taggart signed Quinton Flowers, after a bunch of warm bodies had been rotating at the QB position, and the rest is history. UCF seems to have done the same thing with McKenzie Milton (although I personally think his arm strength is somewhat suspect). Milton kinda reminds me of former USF QB Matt Grothe...an undersized QB with an average arm, but with moxie, and playmaking ability, who is an accurate passer and can run.

As much as I hope Grothe chokes on a bag of dicks, I think it's a good comparison, and I hope McKenzie shows as much grit as Grothe often did when times get tough.

Grothe still has a presence on twitter and loves to put down UCF.

(10-02-2017 02:10 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(10-02-2017 01:53 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(10-02-2017 01:36 PM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  Schools like a UCF can turn it around quickly by simply recruiting the talented Florida players around them. USF was also down a few years ago. Willie Taggart came in and recruited like a mad man and turned it around relatively quickly also, going from 2-10 to 11-2 in 3 years. It also helps to recruit a star QB. I am convinced that you need to do that ASAP when taking over. Taggart signed Quinton Flowers, after a bunch of warm bodies had been rotating at the QB position, and the rest is history. UCF seems to have done the same thing with McKenzie Milton (although I personally think his arm strength is somewhat suspect). Milton kinda reminds me of former USF QB Matt Grothe...an undersized QB with an average arm, but with moxie, and playmaking ability, who is an accurate passer and can run.

As much as I hope Grothe chokes on a bag of dicks, I think it's a good comparison, and I hope McKenzie shows as much grit as Grothe often did when times get tough.

Grothe still has a presence on twitter and loves to put down UCF.

Yes, it's going to be glorious when we beat you this year and end your dream season.

Mike Price had some success will see if he can do to continue this year

(10-02-2017 09:01 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Mike Price had some success will see if he can do to continue this year

I wouldn't really have any expectations. The current coaching staff will resent having him brought in instead of one of their own promoted. And he's not going to be in a position to really make many changes because they're not his coaches or his players. And there's not enough time in a weekly practice to make a meaningful scheme change.

I actually think bringing a guy out of retirement like this is borderline moronic.

(10-03-2017 08:34 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(10-02-2017 09:01 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  Mike Price had some success will see if he can do to continue this year

I wouldn't really have any expectations. The current coaching staff will resent having him brought in instead of one of their own promoted. And he's not going to be in a position to really make many changes because they're not his coaches or his players. And there's not enough time in a weekly practice to make a meaningful scheme change.

I actually think bringing a guy out of retirement like this is borderline moronic.

Mike Price still has a lot of good capital with the fans, and lives part-time in El Paso, and has a good track record. Instead of upsetting the staff by promoting one, they are keeping them in place and bringing in Price. If they promoted one of the coordinators as interim, but ended up wanting another staff member long-term, that would be worse.

At this point, we have nothing to lose if Price takes over for the rest of the season while we get a new coach.

(10-01-2017 04:23 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  That old school coaching philosophy is exactly what coach Kugler has had at UTEP. After the loss to Army yesterday he was asked if he would pass more going forward and his answer was "I hope not".

Are you confusing Kugler with Army's Jeff Monken? That question/response was exactly what the sideline reporter said after halftime - when he was telling the audience what Monken had said.