Many of us on here predict the demise of the Big 12 at the end of the GOR. The Big Ten, SEC, and Pac 12 are the top contenders for the big prizes of Texas and Oklahoma. Schools like Kansas, Oklahoma St, and Texas Tech get tossed around as companions depending on who goes where.

As one thread posits: could the ACC get in on the fracas and offer a ND type deal to Texas?

If the ACC were to offer and Texas reciprocated interest could their be any possible movement of other Lonestar Big 12 programs to the ACC to facilitate/grease/appease the move and would Tobacco Road tolerate it as the cost of doing business?

I think Baylor is toxic. But, T.C.U. as an entry into the DFW market should be considered, but only if Texas is headed to the ACC as a partial. Those two schools put the ACC on the map in the state of Texas even though Texas remains a football independent.

Outside of that contingency the only Big 12 school that might find itself a home in the ACC is West Virginia. The Eers would give them a solid sports program like Louisville, with what proved to be a competitive hoops and baseball program last year to go along with football. They are a good geographic fit for the ACC would love to reignite rivalries with Pitt and Va Tech, and they add content value.

But if Texas doesn't head to the ACC as a partial then I don't see T.C.U. being anything but a geographical outlier.


EDIT: BTW, logistically and financially Texas to the ACC as a partial is much more complicated to pull off than many might think.
1. The partial would be for all other Longhorn sports outside of football. That's a lot of travel money for Title IX and non revenue sports.
2. Texas made a touch over 50 million in TV revenue last year counting the LHN. I'm sure the ACCN will pay nicely someday but not initially. I just don't see how the LHN can ever be rolled into the ACCN in any kind of short term period of time. And if Texas keeps the LHN and gets a partial payment for the 5 ACC games they schedule, will ESPN want to make up 24 million plus that Texas would need to make on the rest of it's T1 & T2 football games to keep making a little over 50 million? It would be a tough arrangement for a network already losing money on the LHN.
3. Would not the better solution be for Texas to join the ACC fully in Football but not for minor sports. That way they could keep the LHN's 15 million and if the ACC with Texas full in merited 35 million base pay per school then it might be more reasonably workable. They would be the inverse of Notre Dame so that W.V.U. could join fully with them and football and all other sports would now have 16 full time members. Just a thought.

Agree that Baylor is toxic.

Tech, on its own, is in the middle of nowhere.

TCU, best option, but need a partner. By itself, DFW is way outside the ACC footprint.

Just how long do you guys think that Baylor will be toxic? When SMU wrecked their program in the late 80s with pay for play they never recovered but a lot of that had to deal with the death penalty and sanctions. It remains to be seen what the NCAA will do to them but I think it's possible for them to restore their image. Penn St seems to be doing a nice job moving past their embarrassment but as a blue blood I think it's easier for them.

TCU - would draw some interest as a #2 but not as a #1

Baylor - none, primarily for the reasons listed above

Texas Tech - none. They are closer to the PAC12 than the ACC.

(08-04-2017 05:25 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Just how long do you guys think that Baylor will be toxic?

A while. Maybe a decade or more. I imagine that there will be significant restrictions put on athletics by the administration to go along with the NCAA penalties.

Quote:Penn St seems to be doing a nice job moving past their embarrassment but as a blue blood I think it's easier for them.

Baylor's only example of winning in the past 20 years was under Briles and they have nowhere near the history or the appeal of being a state flagship like Penn State.

TCU yes, the other two no. If the ACC has to take another "little brother" from the Big XII, I would prefer OSU. Houston might even be a better choice than Baylor or Texas Tech - it's closer what better recruiting.

(08-04-2017 05:12 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  Agree that Baylor is toxic.

Tech, on its own, is in the middle of nowhere.

TCU, best option, but need a partner. By itself, DFW is way outside the ACC footprint.

Baylor will be fine long term. Briles was just following Frank Beamer's game plan for program development. If that type of behavior for football players was in the national consciousness 30 years ago, Virginia Tech would have been thought to be toxic too!

The only way the ACC expands into Texas is with Texas. TCU &/or Houston would make nice travel partners for them. I'm against Texas as a partial but would be for JR suggestion of them being a football only member.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

(08-05-2017 09:35 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-04-2017 05:12 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  Agree that Baylor is toxic.

Tech, on its own, is in the middle of nowhere.

TCU, best option, but need a partner. By itself, DFW is way outside the ACC footprint.

Baylor will be fine long term. Briles was just following Frank Beamer's game plan for program development. If that type of behavior for football players was in the national consciousness 30 years ago, Virginia Tech would have been thought to be toxic too!

Turning a blind eye to dog fighting and general thuggery is quite different than the institutional cover up of sexual assault & rape against coeds. I would liken Tech to Miami and organized crime influences in the 80's or Oklahoma under Switzer. Baylor's crimes are in a classification that only Penn State has attained.

To the point Kaplony brought up above, even for DFW and Houston:

- DFW/Houston road distance to Charlotte is roughly 1000mi
- DFW/Houston road distance to Phoenix is roughly 1100mi

(08-05-2017 10:54 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(08-05-2017 09:35 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-04-2017 05:12 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  Agree that Baylor is toxic.

Tech, on its own, is in the middle of nowhere.

TCU, best option, but need a partner. By itself, DFW is way outside the ACC footprint.

Baylor will be fine long term. Briles was just following Frank Beamer's game plan for program development. If that type of behavior for football players was in the national consciousness 30 years ago, Virginia Tech would have been thought to be toxic too!

Turning a blind eye to dog fighting and general thuggery is quite different than the institutional cover up of sexual assault & rape against coeds. I would liken Tech to Miami and organized crime influences in the 80's or Oklahoma under Switzer. Baylor's crimes are in a classification that only Penn State has attained.

Not to mention the fact the hypocrisy of a fan of an institution that engaged in systematic and institutionalized academic fraud for decades talking about the misdeeds of another institution.

(08-05-2017 10:54 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(08-05-2017 09:35 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-04-2017 05:12 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  Agree that Baylor is toxic.

Tech, on its own, is in the middle of nowhere.

TCU, best option, but need a partner. By itself, DFW is way outside the ACC footprint.

Baylor will be fine long term. Briles was just following Frank Beamer's game plan for program development. If that type of behavior for football players was in the national consciousness 30 years ago, Virginia Tech would have been thought to be toxic too!

Turning a blind eye to dog fighting and general thuggery is quite different than the institutional cover up of sexual assault & rape against coeds. I would liken Tech to Miami and organized crime influences in the 80's or Oklahoma under Switzer. Baylor's crimes are in a classification that only Penn State has attained.

Switzer's OU is a good analogy for VT. Though I suspect there have been many other places where players and those around them were way out of control, and they were just lucky not to have it blow up in public like OU in 1989, or UNLV in 1991 when the hot tub photo with "The Fixer" became public.

(08-05-2017 11:12 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  To the point Kaplony brought up above, even for DFW and Houston:

- DFW/Houston road distance to Charlotte is roughly 1000mi
- DFW/Houston road distance to Phoenix is roughly 1100mi

The former is comparable to the distance from Atlanta to Syracuse. The latter is comparable, if not slightly better than Miami to Pittsburgh

(08-05-2017 10:54 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(08-05-2017 09:35 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-04-2017 05:12 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  Agree that Baylor is toxic.

Tech, on its own, is in the middle of nowhere.

TCU, best option, but need a partner. By itself, DFW is way outside the ACC footprint.

Baylor will be fine long term. Briles was just following Frank Beamer's game plan for program development. If that type of behavior for football players was in the national consciousness 30 years ago, Virginia Tech would have been thought to be toxic too!

Turning a blind eye to dog fighting and general thuggery is quite different than the institutional cover up of sexual assault & rape against coeds. I would liken Tech to Miami and organized crime influences in the 80's or Oklahoma under Switzer. Baylor's crimes are in a classification that only Penn State has attained.

The dog fighting came much later JR
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/49ers-qb-acquitted-of-rape/

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1997-...s-crawford

http://articles.dailypress.com/1996-01-0...-brzonkala

http://www.soonerfans.com/forums/showthr...-Rap-Sheet

https://www.si.com/college-football/2015...t-behavior

(08-05-2017 11:15 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-05-2017 10:54 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(08-05-2017 09:35 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-04-2017 05:12 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  Agree that Baylor is toxic.

Tech, on its own, is in the middle of nowhere.

TCU, best option, but need a partner. By itself, DFW is way outside the ACC footprint.

Baylor will be fine long term. Briles was just following Frank Beamer's game plan for program development. If that type of behavior for football players was in the national consciousness 30 years ago, Virginia Tech would have been thought to be toxic too!

Turning a blind eye to dog fighting and general thuggery is quite different than the institutional cover up of sexual assault & rape against coeds. I would liken Tech to Miami and organized crime influences in the 80's or Oklahoma under Switzer. Baylor's crimes are in a classification that only Penn State has attained.

Not to mention the fact the hypocrisy of a fan of an institution that engaged in systematic and institutionalized academic fraud for decades talking about the misdeeds of another institution.

"You don't have to be a legal genius, which I am certainly not, in order to spot that the NCAA has no jurisdiction here and they have no case here. Because the NCAA is not alleging that North Carolina committed academic fraud. In fact the term academic fraud or academic misconduct can be found nowhere in the notices of allegations that they put out."

http://scout.com/college/north-carolina/...-105784615

(08-05-2017 06:25 PM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-05-2017 11:15 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-05-2017 10:54 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(08-05-2017 09:35 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-04-2017 05:12 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  Agree that Baylor is toxic.

Tech, on its own, is in the middle of nowhere.

TCU, best option, but need a partner. By itself, DFW is way outside the ACC footprint.

Baylor will be fine long term. Briles was just following Frank Beamer's game plan for program development. If that type of behavior for football players was in the national consciousness 30 years ago, Virginia Tech would have been thought to be toxic too!

Turning a blind eye to dog fighting and general thuggery is quite different than the institutional cover up of sexual assault & rape against coeds. I would liken Tech to Miami and organized crime influences in the 80's or Oklahoma under Switzer. Baylor's crimes are in a classification that only Penn State has attained.

Not to mention the fact the hypocrisy of a fan of an institution that engaged in systematic and institutionalized academic fraud for decades talking about the misdeeds of another institution.

"You don't have to be a legal genius, which I am certainly not, in order to spot that the NCAA has no jurisdiction here and they have no case here. Because the NCAA is not alleging that North Carolina committed academic fraud. In fact the term academic fraud or academic misconduct can be found nowhere in the notices of allegations that they put out."

http://scout.com/college/north-carolina/...-105784615

If the NCAA has no jurisdiction over academic matters then it would certainly be strange if they alleged academic misconduct so that's a moot point.

What matters, nonetheless, is that UNC committed a serious ethical and academic violation. Saying UNC did nothing wrong is like saying Penn State didn't enable child molestation simply because NCAA rules didn't technically prohibit it

Quote:Also from Jay Bilas:

"So according to NCAA rules this is not academic fraud. I may not like it and you may not like it, but that's the way it is."

(08-05-2017 06:25 PM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-05-2017 11:15 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  

(08-05-2017 10:54 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(08-05-2017 09:35 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(08-04-2017 05:12 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  Agree that Baylor is toxic.

Tech, on its own, is in the middle of nowhere.

TCU, best option, but need a partner. By itself, DFW is way outside the ACC footprint.

Baylor will be fine long term. Briles was just following Frank Beamer's game plan for program development. If that type of behavior for football players was in the national consciousness 30 years ago, Virginia Tech would have been thought to be toxic too!

Turning a blind eye to dog fighting and general thuggery is quite different than the institutional cover up of sexual assault & rape against coeds. I would liken Tech to Miami and organized crime influences in the 80's or Oklahoma under Switzer. Baylor's crimes are in a classification that only Penn State has attained.

Not to mention the fact the hypocrisy of a fan of an institution that engaged in systematic and institutionalized academic fraud for decades talking about the misdeeds of another institution.

"You don't have to be a legal genius, which I am certainly not, in order to spot that the NCAA has no jurisdiction here and they have no case here. Because the NCAA is not alleging that North Carolina committed academic fraud. In fact the term academic fraud or academic misconduct can be found nowhere in the notices of allegations that they put out."

http://scout.com/college/north-carolina/...-105784615

https://www.insidehighered.com/quicktake...-probation

Quote:The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill will not lose accreditation over the academic fraud that occurred there, but it will face one year of probation, the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools Commission on Colleges announced Thursday. In October, the university released a detailed report about widespread and long-lasting academic fraud at the university. For 20 years, some employees at the university knowingly steered about 1,500 athletes toward no-show courses that never met and were not taught by any faculty members, and in which the only work required was a single research paper that received a high grade no matter the content.

(08-04-2017 05:25 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  Just how long do you guys think that Baylor will be toxic?

Over the last 15 years, two Baylor presidents have had to resign due (at least in part) to huge athletic scandals. Robert Sloan and Ken Starr.

It will take at least a generation (20 years) of good behavior before the school regains respect among its peers.

If the Big 12 gets raided before that length of time is up, Baylor has two choices:

1. If the Big 12 survives, stay in the Big 12 and rebuild it.
2. If the Big 12 dissolves, go to the American or Mountain West.

3. Join Louisville, Syracuse, Miami, and North Carolina in the All Cheaters Conference.

(08-06-2017 08:26 AM)chargeradio Wrote:  3. Join Louisville, Syracuse, Miami, and North Carolina in the All Cheaters Conference.

With the forthcoming news, does this mean Kentucky will be joining as well?