(07-20-2017 10:01 AM)BullsFanInTX Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 01:54 AM)deb025 Wrote:  

(07-19-2017 10:32 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  [i]
https://twitter.com/USFCollin/status/887...73/photo/1

They need to worry about winning their bowl games first. The AAC has been horrible in their bowl games against fellow G5 opponents the last few years.

Despite going 11-1 vs. G4 conference opponents in 2016 in the regular season and something like 22-2 over the past 2 years. But never let facts get in the way of an agenda.

Look up the AAC's regular season record vs. the G4 for yourself if you don't believe me. AAC has literally won about 90% of games vs. G4 in regular season.

I think he was talking about bowl records, not regular season records?

Why does the Big Ten or Big 12 want to play bowl games vs the AAC? I don't think so ...

Television and sports branding are mature markets. Hype is not going to separate a television network or major sponsor from their money. You have to deliver measurables. How many people watch on TV? How many pay for licensed merchandise? How many people pay to enter the stadium and what price points?

Personally I find the AAC fans speaking of G4 sad and pathetic. If you don't like being G5, got a helluva deal for you. Tear up your participation in the CFP agreement. Forego the chance to be the top G5 and make the Access game. Forego the base and participation money given to G5 schools.

You want to drop out and not be G5 freaking show you have some balls and drop out. Let's all sit back and see if America clamors for the AAC champion to have a permanent spot in the NY6, let's see if America is outraged when the best AAC doesn't play in the NY6 for a MWC, MAC, Sun Belt, or CUSA school.

If AAC is P6 the market will demand inclusion.

(07-20-2017 10:47 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  Television and sports branding are mature markets. Hype is not going to separate a television network or major sponsor from their money. You have to deliver measurables. How many people watch on TV? How many pay for licensed merchandise? How many people pay to enter the stadium and what price points?

Personally I find the AAC fans speaking of G4 sad and pathetic. If you don't like being G5, got a helluva deal for you. Tear up your participation in the CFP agreement. Forego the chance to be the top G5 and make the Access game. Forego the base and participation money given to G5 schools.

You want to drop out and not be G5 freaking show you have some balls and drop out. Let's all sit back and see if America clamors for the AAC champion to have a permanent spot in the NY6, let's see if America is outraged when the best AAC doesn't play in the NY6 for a MWC, MAC, Sun Belt, or CUSA school.

If AAC is P6 the market will demand inclusion.

(07-20-2017 10:19 AM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 12:47 AM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 12:19 AM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  Bowl attrition will affect all the G5 and those slots awarded to 6th seed or lower from P5s as there just isn't the fan interest for travel, or the money involved to be worth it for a lot of these to continue.

The advantage the AAC has is generally speaking better teams with better media exposure/demand that others so they will always be in play for better bowl tie ins.

It depends which G5 school. People will want to go see a Boise State team playing than a Wyoming. Some G5 schools have more exposures and have the name brand that people would come out to see.

Depending on your point of view Boise State is a different play to call. Their long time winning tradition in the BCS era makes them an outlier in that regard. Most of the other successful teams in the MWC don't get the luxuries of media coverage when they are good like Boise does.

Hawaii might be another exception because they keep getting exposure playing PAC 12 and Big 10 schools a lot on tv. They won many games in the past because of Colt Brennan was their QB.
UNR got attention because of Kaepernick.
Yeah, nobody else really.

Here are the schools that I do think that could draw fans.

Boise State
Hawaii (even if Hawaii is playing at home)
UNR
Air Force

Cincinnati
UCF
East Carolina
Memphis
Houston
USF
Navy

SMU were the ticket of the town, but with their death penalty, they were not the same.

Marshall
Southern Mississippi (history stand point)
UTEP when they are winning

Toledo

Arkansas State
Appalachian State

BYU
Army

North Dakota State
Eastern Washington
James Madison
Jacksonville State
South Dakota State

THose are the fans that do travel from the FCS level. When Eastern Washington took on Sam Houston State in Texas for the FCS championship? Eastern Washington fans outnumbered Sam Houston State fans. Same with North Dakota State fans. Some of the Southland conference fans do not show up for the championship games. Like Sam Houston State would get noticed for an FBS conference in the future.
Those 5 FCS fan base along with Delaware and some others in the southeast might be able to bring more fans out if they go FBS. Lamar does show signs that they could grow if they go to FBS.

(07-20-2017 11:01 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 10:47 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  Television and sports branding are mature markets. Hype is not going to separate a television network or major sponsor from their money. You have to deliver measurables. How many people watch on TV? How many pay for licensed merchandise? How many people pay to enter the stadium and what price points?

Personally I find the AAC fans speaking of G4 sad and pathetic. If you don't like being G5, got a helluva deal for you. Tear up your participation in the CFP agreement. Forego the chance to be the top G5 and make the Access game. Forego the base and participation money given to G5 schools.

You want to drop out and not be G5 freaking show you have some balls and drop out. Let's all sit back and see if America clamors for the AAC champion to have a permanent spot in the NY6, let's see if America is outraged when the best AAC doesn't play in the NY6 for a MWC, MAC, Sun Belt, or CUSA school.

If AAC is P6 the market will demand inclusion.

Amazing... Instead of throwing darts at the AAC for fighting to keep up, some of us wonder why the MWC, SBC, cUSA and MAC are not loudly fighting the P5 separation. Are you trying to keep up? Can you compete or not? If not, separate and form your own national championship... which seems to be what AFA suggested this week. We in the AAC want none of that... we want, for as long as we can, to play with the big boys.

Not a single coach, athletic director, board member, or president at a G5 wants a FCS+ division.

(07-20-2017 10:47 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  Television and sports branding are mature markets. Hype is not going to separate a television network or major sponsor from their money. You have to deliver measurables. How many people watch on TV? How many pay for licensed merchandise? How many people pay to enter the stadium and what price points?

Personally I find the AAC fans speaking of G4 sad and pathetic. If you don't like being G5, got a helluva deal for you. Tear up your participation in the CFP agreement. Forego the chance to be the top G5 and make the Access game. Forego the base and participation money given to G5 schools.

You want to drop out and not be G5 freaking show you have some balls and drop out. Let's all sit back and see if America clamors for the AAC champion to have a permanent spot in the NY6, let's see if America is outraged when the best AAC doesn't play in the NY6 for a MWC, MAC, Sun Belt, or CUSA school.

If AAC is P6 the market will demand inclusion.

I think that's the key and I think that's what the P6 thing is about. I think it's largely designed to help build viewership going into the negotiating period for the next tv deal. I think the first step was to spend several years using the national broadcast platform to introduce the league to more people. The second stage is a national marketing campaign designed to create curiosity and interest in the league---the hope being more people will on a whim check out the product to see if there is anything to the "P6" stuff. If the league continues to provide fun to watch competitive teams---more viewers might check out more AAC games if they enjoy what they see. I think it's secondary goal is to promote the league as a higher quality partner for bowl games. Might not work as well there---but it might help grab some better bowls currently tied to other G5 conferences (like the Heart of Dallas Bowl or Ft Worth).

(07-20-2017 10:47 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  Television and sports branding are mature markets. Hype is not going to separate a television network or major sponsor from their money. You have to deliver measurables. How many people watch on TV? How many pay for licensed merchandise? How many people pay to enter the stadium and what price points?

Personally I find the AAC fans speaking of G4 sad and pathetic. If you don't like being G5, got a helluva deal for you. Tear up your participation in the CFP agreement. Forego the chance to be the top G5 and make the Access game. Forego the base and participation money given to G5 schools.

You want to drop out and not be G5 freaking show you have some balls and drop out. Let's all sit back and see if America clamors for the AAC champion to have a permanent spot in the NY6, let's see if America is outraged when the best AAC doesn't play in the NY6 for a MWC, MAC, Sun Belt, or CUSA school.

If AAC is P6 the market will demand inclusion.

The P6 moniker is worth it just for posts like this by G4 fans. I have no illusions about the AAC but why get so worked up about it?

(07-20-2017 12:33 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(07-19-2017 10:40 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  It sounds like it will be every "G" for themselves when bowl negotiations are up.

I think a consolidated effort would be better....4 good bowl games for the conference champions of the G that do not get the autobid.

Holiday
Sun
Liberty
Independence

G against Top 25 ranked P competition. In stadiums not suitable for hosting CFP bowls since they aren't NFL (Holiday about to become a baseball stadium).

The problem is convincing those bowls to drop a P5 tie in favor of a G5 tie. It's going to be tough for Aresco to somehow manage to get one bowl to do it---but 4? That's a really tall order.

I'd do think the 4 champs could probably approach a network about pairing the 4 G5 champs against each other in a set of decent payday bowls aired by maybe Fox or NBC. But I don't think that's what Aresco wants. Sounds like he'd be far more interested in sacrificing payout for a prestigious opponent.

It would come with a nice TV contract split in favor of the P5 participants.

Go 75/25 P5 with the games. Instead of making 3 million on the Sun, a participating P5 could make 4.5 million with 1.5 mil going to the G champ.

It would be nice I think for the Colorados of the world that get snubbed from CFP bowls. They would at least get to play a G champ in a good timeslot rather than buried somewhere on NYD.

P5s have 9 or 10 bowl games, of which maybe 5 are desirable. Programs drawing under 60k are forced down the lineup as it is.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G530AZ using CSNbbs mobile app

(07-20-2017 01:00 PM)Bull Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 11:01 AM)mturn017 Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 10:47 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  Television and sports branding are mature markets. Hype is not going to separate a television network or major sponsor from their money. You have to deliver measurables. How many people watch on TV? How many pay for licensed merchandise? How many people pay to enter the stadium and what price points?

Personally I find the AAC fans speaking of G4 sad and pathetic. If you don't like being G5, got a helluva deal for you. Tear up your participation in the CFP agreement. Forego the chance to be the top G5 and make the Access game. Forego the base and participation money given to G5 schools.

You want to drop out and not be G5 freaking show you have some balls and drop out. Let's all sit back and see if America clamors for the AAC champion to have a permanent spot in the NY6, let's see if America is outraged when the best AAC doesn't play in the NY6 for a MWC, MAC, Sun Belt, or CUSA school.

If AAC is P6 the market will demand inclusion.

Amazing... Instead of throwing darts at the AAC for fighting to keep up, some of us wonder why the MWC, SBC, cUSA and MAC are not loudly fighting the P5 separation. Are you trying to keep up? Can you compete or not? If not, separate and form your own national championship... which seems to be what AFA suggested this week. We in the AAC want none of that... we want, for as long as we can, to play with the big boys.

The AAC would be very stupid not to want what the AFA coach proposed last week, because his proposal was for a 4-team G5 playoff, the winner of which would be entered into an 8-team playoff with the P5.

Since it would be almost a sure thing that an AAC team would be in that 4-team G6 playoff every year, that would mean that every year, an AAC team would be in an actual, direct, automatic win-and-you're-in participation in the playoffs with the P5, something not even the P5 conferences have right now.

(07-20-2017 01:55 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 12:33 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(07-19-2017 10:40 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  It sounds like it will be every "G" for themselves when bowl negotiations are up.

I think a consolidated effort would be better....4 good bowl games for the conference champions of the G that do not get the autobid.

Holiday
Sun
Liberty
Independence

G against Top 25 ranked P competition. In stadiums not suitable for hosting CFP bowls since they aren't NFL (Holiday about to become a baseball stadium).

The problem is convincing those bowls to drop a P5 tie in favor of a G5 tie. It's going to be tough for Aresco to somehow manage to get one bowl to do it---but 4? That's a really tall order.

I'd do think the 4 champs could probably approach a network about pairing the 4 G5 champs against each other in a set of decent payday bowls aired by maybe Fox or NBC. But I don't think that's what Aresco wants. Sounds like he'd be far more interested in sacrificing payout for a prestigious opponent.

It would come with a nice TV contract split in favor of the P5 participants.

Go 75/25 P5 with the games. Instead of making 3 million on the Sun, a participating P5 could make 4.5 million with 1.5 mil going to the G champ.

It would be nice I think for the Colorados of the world that get snubbed from CFP bowls. They would at least get to play a G champ in a good timeslot rather than buried somewhere on NYD.

P5s have 9 or 10 bowl games, of which maybe 5 are desirable. Programs drawing under 60k are forced down the lineup as it is.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G530AZ using CSNbbs mobile app

That makes it more interesting to the P5. That doesn't really help sell the bowl on it (which is the bigger problem). That's why I said the G5s and a tv network could sit down and hammer out a deal to either upgrade 2 current G5 bowls or create 2 totally new high end bowls to serve the purpose and let 2 existing G5 bowls die. Play then sometime between the NYD and the championship game. I think those games could draw pretty darn good tV audiences.

(07-20-2017 02:11 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  The AAC would be very stupid not to want what the AFA coach proposed last week, because his proposal was for a 4-team G5 playoff, the winner of which would be entered into an 8-team playoff with the P5.

And getting beat up in two hard fought games before we even made it to the playoff?

No team (even P5) would survive against a top 7 team with two weeks rest and you coming in on one leg.

Dumb idea!

Even if it were to pass no team would make it to the championship game. I could see the occasional upset into the second round but that's where the dream ends.

(07-20-2017 01:41 PM)malenko2 Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 10:47 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  Television and sports branding are mature markets. Hype is not going to separate a television network or major sponsor from their money. You have to deliver measurables. How many people watch on TV? How many pay for licensed merchandise? How many people pay to enter the stadium and what price points?

Personally I find the AAC fans speaking of G4 sad and pathetic. If you don't like being G5, got a helluva deal for you. Tear up your participation in the CFP agreement. Forego the chance to be the top G5 and make the Access game. Forego the base and participation money given to G5 schools.

You want to drop out and not be G5 freaking show you have some balls and drop out. Let's all sit back and see if America clamors for the AAC champion to have a permanent spot in the NY6, let's see if America is outraged when the best AAC doesn't play in the NY6 for a MWC, MAC, Sun Belt, or CUSA school.

If AAC is P6 the market will demand inclusion.

The P6 moniker is worth it just for posts like this by G4 fans. I have no illusions about the AAC but why get so worked up about it?

Grow where you are planted. I don't give a **** if the AAC and Sun Belt or MAC are ever "pals" but when you want to pretend you are running in the Daytona 500 when you are really driving in a truck series race at Daytona, that's BS that needs calling out.

(07-20-2017 02:48 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 01:41 PM)malenko2 Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 10:47 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  Television and sports branding are mature markets. Hype is not going to separate a television network or major sponsor from their money. You have to deliver measurables. How many people watch on TV? How many pay for licensed merchandise? How many people pay to enter the stadium and what price points?

Personally I find the AAC fans speaking of G4 sad and pathetic. If you don't like being G5, got a helluva deal for you. Tear up your participation in the CFP agreement. Forego the chance to be the top G5 and make the Access game. Forego the base and participation money given to G5 schools.

You want to drop out and not be G5 freaking show you have some balls and drop out. Let's all sit back and see if America clamors for the AAC champion to have a permanent spot in the NY6, let's see if America is outraged when the best AAC doesn't play in the NY6 for a MWC, MAC, Sun Belt, or CUSA school.

If AAC is P6 the market will demand inclusion.

The P6 moniker is worth it just for posts like this by G4 fans. I have no illusions about the AAC but why get so worked up about it?

Grow where you are planted. I don't give a **** if the AAC and Sun Belt or MAC are ever "pals" but when you want to pretend you are running in the Daytona 500 when you are really driving in a truck series race at Daytona, that's BS that needs calling out.

I think that's an overstatement. I think most agree that the AAC is probably the 6th best conference. So, that's obviously not the real issue. Is the real issue the use of the modifier "power"? The Sunbelt moniker is "together we rise". Rise where? The implied portion of that sentence is "together we rise" over everyone else. The MW used the catch phrase "Above the Rest". Lol...we only claim to be #6.

Like I've said before---its a marketing catch phrase designed to create interest and improve perception. It's basically a half full vs half empty slogan. The AAC P6 marketing is a push to be perceived as part of the top 6 rather than a part of the bottom 5. Both are true, but one sounds better if you are trying to sell your product.

I said it before and I will say t again.............. regardless of product on the field/court/etc......... just what have the other conferences been doing outside of embracing the status quo. You don't hear a peep from any of the other commissioners. Why are they not out their marketing their product? Why is it only Aresco that consistently get press about his plans for the conference? I get the frustration that others feel toward him when talking about fans of the other conferences........but I do believe their venting is misplaced on the wrong person. This is marketing 101. If you have a product to sell, you must market it.

(07-20-2017 04:34 PM)otown Wrote:  I said it before and I will say t again.............. regardless of product on the field/court/etc......... just what have the other conferences been doing outside of embracing the status quo. You don't hear a peep from any of the other commissioners. Why are they not out their marketing their product? Why is it only Aresco that consistently get press about his plans for the conference? I get the frustration that others feel toward him when talking about fans of the other conferences........but I do believe their venting is misplaced on the wrong person. This is marketing 101. If you have a product to sell, you must market it.

because the others know that running around trying to act like you are in the club will not make you get in the club

ignoring the facts of:

1. the same number of NCAA votes as every other G5 conference

2. not having a NY6 bowl guarantee for $27.5 to $40 million per year

3. not having a large TV contract for $20+ million per year per team

4. sharing the G5 part of the NCAA football playoff instead of getting $50 million per year for being a P5 member

is not going to make any of that change

saying that "well most years we are the best of the G5 so we are P6 is not going to change any of the above

the AAC homers act like the P5 conferences are called that because the causal fan of college football or the "opinion makers" simply call them that because they feel like calling them that for no marked reason to do so

when the reality is the above list of factors is why EVERYONE calls the P5 the P5 and the G5 the G5

and the only one that is likely (not really all that likely) to change and become remotely differentiating from the other G5 COULD be the TV contract

simply running around selling P6 golf balls and thongs on customink.noinfo is not going to make ESPN rush out and make a NY6 bowl with a payout of $27.5 to $40 million per year for the AAC neither is "well sometimes we occasionally finish better and get the G5 auto bid to the NY6 bowl game in the years that another conference does not get it"

until the AAC starts to make actual progress on differentiating themselves from the other G5 by making ANY progress on several of the above 4 things then their efforts to prove they are somehow different really mean nothing in terms of anything meaningful

(07-20-2017 05:30 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 04:34 PM)otown Wrote:  I said it before and I will say t again.............. regardless of product on the field/court/etc......... just what have the other conferences been doing outside of embracing the status quo. You don't hear a peep from any of the other commissioners. Why are they not out their marketing their product? Why is it only Aresco that consistently get press about his plans for the conference? I get the frustration that others feel toward him when talking about fans of the other conferences........but I do believe their venting is misplaced on the wrong person. This is marketing 101. If you have a product to sell, you must market it.

because the others know that running around trying to act like you are in the club will not make you get in the club

ignoring the facts of:

1. the same number of NCAA votes as every other G5 conference

2. not having a NY6 bowl guarantee for $27.5 to $40 million per year

3. not having a large TV contract for $20+ million per year per team

4. sharing the G5 part of the NCAA football playoff instead of getting $50 million per year for being a P5 member

is not going to make any of that change

saying that "well most years we are the best of the G5 so we are P6 is not going to change any of the above

the AAC homers act like the P5 conferences are called that because the causal fan of college football or the "opinion makers" simply call them that because they feel like calling them that for no marked reason to do so

when the reality is the above list of factors is why EVERYONE calls the P5 the P5 and the G5 the G5

and the only one that is likely (not really all that likely) to change and become remotely differentiating from the other G5 COULD be the TV contract

simply running around selling P6 golf balls and thongs on customink.noinfo is not going to make ESPN rush out and make a NY6 bowl with a payout of $27.5 to $40 million per year for the AAC neither is "well sometimes we occasionally finish better and get the G5 auto bid to the NY6 bowl game in the years that another conference does not get it"

until the AAC starts to make actual progress on differentiating themselves from the other G5 by making ANY progress on several of the above 4 things then their efforts to prove they are somehow different really mean nothing in terms of anything meaningful

So commissioners shouldn't talk up and sell their product? I find that an interesting concept that you are advocating from a business point of view.

(07-20-2017 05:30 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(07-20-2017 04:34 PM)otown Wrote:  I said it before and I will say t again.............. regardless of product on the field/court/etc......... just what have the other conferences been doing outside of embracing the status quo. You don't hear a peep from any of the other commissioners. Why are they not out their marketing their product? Why is it only Aresco that consistently get press about his plans for the conference? I get the frustration that others feel toward him when talking about fans of the other conferences........but I do believe their venting is misplaced on the wrong person. This is marketing 101. If you have a product to sell, you must market it.

because the others know that running around trying to act like you are in the club will not make you get in the club

ignoring the facts of:

1. the same number of NCAA votes as every other G5 conference

2. not having a NY6 bowl guarantee for $27.5 to $40 million per year

3. not having a large TV contract for $20+ million per year per team

4. sharing the G5 part of the NCAA football playoff instead of getting $50 million per year for being a P5 member

is not going to make any of that change

saying that "well most years we are the best of the G5 so we are P6 is not going to change any of the above

the AAC homers act like the P5 conferences are called that because the causal fan of college football or the "opinion makers" simply call them that because they feel like calling them that for no marked reason to do so

when the reality is the above list of factors is why EVERYONE calls the P5 the P5 and the G5 the G5

and the only one that is likely (not really all that likely) to change and become remotely differentiating from the other G5 COULD be the TV contract

simply running around selling P6 golf balls and thongs on customink.noinfo is not going to make ESPN rush out and make a NY6 bowl with a payout of $27.5 to $40 million per year for the AAC neither is "well sometimes we occasionally finish better and get the G5 auto bid to the NY6 bowl game in the years that another conference does not get it"

until the AAC starts to make actual progress on differentiating themselves from the other G5 by making ANY progress on several of the above 4 things then their efforts to prove they are somehow different really mean nothing in terms of anything meaningful

So commissioners shouldn't talk up and sell their product? I find that an interesting concept that you are advocating from a business point of view.

(07-19-2017 10:40 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:  It sounds like it will be every "G" for themselves when bowl negotiations are up.

I think a consolidated effort would be better....4 good bowl games for the conference champions of the G that do not get the autobid.

Holiday
Sun
Liberty
Independence

G against Top 25 ranked P competition. In stadiums not suitable for hosting CFP bowls since they aren't NFL (Holiday about to become a baseball stadium).

Just my guess but only one of these bowls are even possible.

- Holiday - (Doubtful)I think moves to LA and stays B10/P12

- Sun - (Doubtful) P12 and ACC only bowl matchup and CBS, doubtful that matchup goes away

- Liberty - Doubtful B12 vs SEC, doubt that goes away

- Independence (Most Likely that could lose P5s)- ACC vs SEC. This one could be interesting. I think the ACC would like this to move up to the SEC over Birmingham. Otherwise, I could see the ACC try to replace the AAC to have the SEC vs ACC more likely picked over Indy.

One think Aresco and the AAC act likes there are no other conferences that will be looking to improve or add bowls with the AAC. P12 probably wants to increase their bids by one. ACC is looking to improve bowls, may drop St. Pete or Indy. MWC will be looking for bowls since they lost Ponsettia.

To think bowls are primarily about attendance is living 10 years ago. Bowls are more about TV ratings and matchups than fans attending. I think it will be hard to get bowls not to want P5 vs P5 matchups than P5 vs G5 or G5 vs G5. Sorry, if you not in a NYE/NYD bowl, your G5. I agree P5 is not an official designation but G5 is an official designation. AAC, SB, CUSA, MWC and MAC are the G5.