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Air Force Coach Troy Calhoun Floats G5 Playoff Idea
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billybobby777 Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Air Force Coach Troy Calhoun Floats G5 Playoff Idea
(07-15-2017 07:02 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 06:59 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 06:45 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 06:17 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 06:05 PM)Scoochpooch1 Wrote:  Couldn't disagree more. Only 2010 TCU team would have had any shot of beating top 4 team.

Then they would have lost. Lots of teams have fared poorly in the playoffs. The fact is, the G5's have pretty consistently done well in their bowl game vs teams they "had no chance" to beat. Let it play out on the field. If they are outclassed---they are outclassed. If the G5 wins---they advance.

That sounds nice in theory but it doesn't work.

We know these teams are outclassed. We don't need blowouts to prove it.

I remember watching the 2009 Sugar Bowl when Barry Switzer working for Fox for the game said "Alabama is going to crush Utah" He basically said the game wasn't worth playing. He was right. Utah outclassed Alabama. I know we didn't need to watch Alabama get outclassed by Utah that night to prove who the better team was...but it was fun to watch a lowly MWC scrub team crush a mighty sec team.
The 2 games Ive made the most money on betting was that Sugar Bowl and the Rose Bowl when TCU beat Whiskey....

"Remember that one time!"

That's all you have. It's a tired argument.

Exceptions do not make rules.

I gave 4 examples over a 6 year period. You omitted them on your reply back to me so let me repost:
2004 Utah team
2008 Utah team
2009 Boise St team
2010 TCU team
I didn't even include the 2006 Boise team or the 2009 TCU team. I'm not tired of the argument.
07-16-2017 05:23 PM
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otown Offline
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Post: #32
RE: Air Force Coach Troy Calhoun Floats G5 Playoff Idea
(07-16-2017 05:23 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 07:02 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 06:59 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 06:45 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 06:17 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  Then they would have lost. Lots of teams have fared poorly in the playoffs. The fact is, the G5's have pretty consistently done well in their bowl game vs teams they "had no chance" to beat. Let it play out on the field. If they are outclassed---they are outclassed. If the G5 wins---they advance.

That sounds nice in theory but it doesn't work.

We know these teams are outclassed. We don't need blowouts to prove it.

I remember watching the 2009 Sugar Bowl when Barry Switzer working for Fox for the game said "Alabama is going to crush Utah" He basically said the game wasn't worth playing. He was right. Utah outclassed Alabama. I know we didn't need to watch Alabama get outclassed by Utah that night to prove who the better team was...but it was fun to watch a lowly MWC scrub team crush a mighty sec team.
The 2 games Ive made the most money on betting was that Sugar Bowl and the Rose Bowl when TCU beat Whiskey....

"Remember that one time!"

That's all you have. It's a tired argument.

Exceptions do not make rules.

I gave 4 examples over a 6 year period. You omitted them on your reply back to me so let me repost:
2004 Utah team
2008 Utah team
2009 Boise St team
2010 TCU team
I didn't even include the 2006 Boise team or the 2009 TCU team. I'm not tired of the argument.

I also remember the skewer UCF got shoved up its backside during the 2013 BCS selection show.
07-16-2017 07:35 PM
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DawgNBama Online
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Post: #33
RE: Air Force Coach Troy Calhoun Floats G5 Playoff Idea
(07-15-2017 09:43 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  No matter what expansion happens, the power schools and CFP will say top 8 teams not conference champions. Thus ensuring they don't have to take a G5 champ and keeping the money. Just the reality of the situation.


Even as a G5 fan, I'm afraid you're right unless the G5 can pull off what Scott Cowen and the other G5 presidents pulled off to get the G5 into BCS bowls. That would definitely be the equalizer.

Had a brainstorm while contemplating the college football season vs the college basketball season. NCAA men's basketball has like a preseason NIT, and a lot of tournaments and conference challenge tournaments. If the G5 could do a football equivalent of this, while it would not necessarily guarantee the G5 a spot of at the CFP table, it would make G5 appearances a lot more common, IMO. Basically this, take Calhoun's idea, and instead of doing it at the end of the year, do it at the beginning. I'm sure some wouldn't go for it for various reasons, but I think at the same time, some teams would go for it, and it would bolster strength of schedule for those G5 challengers.
(This post was last modified: 07-17-2017 12:44 AM by DawgNBama.)
07-17-2017 12:34 AM
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ChrisLords Offline
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Post: #34
RE: Air Force Coach Troy Calhoun Floats G5 Playoff Idea
(07-16-2017 08:55 AM)panite Wrote:  Too many games to be played especially for the G5 conferences under this plan. 04-cheers

That's true.

12 game season + CCG, + 2 or 3 game G5 playoff + 3 game CFP playoff. So 18 or 19 games? No one is going to sign off on that.
07-17-2017 04:16 AM
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goodknightfl Offline
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Post: #35
RE: Air Force Coach Troy Calhoun Floats G5 Playoff Idea
A G4 playoff idea is great. Champ from MWC, Cusa, Mac, and Belt seeded 1 to 4.

Everyone else fills the needed spots in their conf bowl games.
(This post was last modified: 07-17-2017 10:30 PM by goodknightfl.)
07-17-2017 10:29 PM
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Kittonhead Offline
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Post: #36
RE: Air Force Coach Troy Calhoun Floats G5 Playoff Idea
(07-16-2017 09:59 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 05:33 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 05:06 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  But "playoff creep" has never been a topic involving Group of Five teams. Air Force coach Troy Calhoun has an idea that would change that. In essence, he wants a four-team Group of Five playoff, the winner of which would then move on to an eight-team College Football Playoff featuring the five Power Five conference champs plus two wild card teams. The Colorado Springs Gazette explained Calhoun's theory ...

http://www.cbssports.com/college-footbal...-overkill/

It would be a fun event...IF it didn't lead to any sort of situation, or a hypothetical possibility of a Boise run or Utah or TCU run of past dozen or so seasons allowing for those teams get into the current 4 team playoff. Non power teams who would likely have played in the 4 team playoff if it had existed:

2004 Utah team--12-0 Fiesta Bowl champs
2008 Utah team--13-0 Sugar Bowl champs
2009 Boise team--14-0 Fiesta Bowl champs
2010 TCU team--13-0 Rose Bowl champs
Those teams do don't belong in any 4 team G5 playoff, they belonged with the big boys in the Big Boy Playoff.

Two of those three programs just ended up being poached by a true power conference, which therein lies the biggest obstacle to a guaranteed spot for a G5 program under the CFP. If a team is truly on the level of competing against the Alabamas, the Florida States, the Clemsons, the Ohio States, etc., then they (the power conferences and networks) won't reward them (the G5) with a playoff spot - they will just poach that program for a power conference to ensure their division and separation.

I have a hard time seeing the G5 getting a guaranteed CFP spot long-term. That won't stop the push from the G5, however, and nor should it. They should be doing everything they can to try and get in before the next wave hits in a couple of years. After that, the separation may be final.

Woah slow down here.

The BCS system had "autobids" for 6 select conferences and a championship game.

The CFP was created to take the Top 4 (solving who belongs in the champ game problem) and no autobids (solving anti-trust issues). It had nothing to do with P5/G5 separation at all.

The playoff was found to be worth more when bowls like the Orange Bowl and Rose Bowl were part of it and the P5 wanted to still have NYD bowls for their champions. The G5 watched its share of the money triple from 7% to 21% and with a guaranteed CFP bowl for its champion.

Quotes from G5 commissioners at the time were to the effect that college football is becoming more integrated than it was. The disappointing factor has been the CFP ranking system putting a huge emphasis on SOS which the G5 can't compete with.

Think a little about the history of the G5. Ten years ago it was MWC, WAC, SBC, CUSA, MAC. Twenty years ago it was WAC, MAC, CUSA. The WAC and CUSA were tweener conferences with voting rights of the BCS 6. The 5 conferences that comprise the G5 don't want to be in a division together.
07-17-2017 11:15 PM
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Kittonhead Offline
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Post: #37
RE: Air Force Coach Troy Calhoun Floats G5 Playoff Idea
(07-17-2017 10:29 PM)goodknightfl Wrote:  A G4 playoff idea is great. Champ from MWC, Cusa, Mac, and Belt seeded 1 to 4.

Everyone else fills the needed spots in their conf bowl games.

Calhoun is talking about a 4 team play-in for an autobid to the 8 team playoff.

That is not the same thing as a separate playoff.

I'd rather go 8 team, no autobid & 8 NYD bowls w/Top 2 G5 participants. I know the AAC doesn't want to be part of the G anymore BUT by the time the P5 is done raiding it there won't be enough left in the AAC to justify a contract bowl.
07-17-2017 11:19 PM
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MAD MACGYVER Offline
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Post: #38
RE: Air Force Coach Troy Calhoun Floats G5 Playoff Idea
(07-15-2017 07:02 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 06:59 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 06:45 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 06:17 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 06:05 PM)Scoochpooch1 Wrote:  Couldn't disagree more. Only 2010 TCU team would have had any shot of beating top 4 team.

Then they would have lost. Lots of teams have fared poorly in the playoffs. The fact is, the G5's have pretty consistently done well in their bowl game vs teams they "had no chance" to beat. Let it play out on the field. If they are outclassed---they are outclassed. If the G5 wins---they advance.

That sounds nice in theory but it doesn't work.

We know these teams are outclassed. We don't need blowouts to prove it.

I remember watching the 2009 Sugar Bowl when Barry Switzer working for Fox for the game said "Alabama is going to crush Utah" He basically said the game wasn't worth playing. He was right. Utah outclassed Alabama. I know we didn't need to watch Alabama get outclassed by Utah that night to prove who the better team was...but it was fun to watch a lowly MWC scrub team crush a mighty sec team.
The 2 games Ive made the most money on betting was that Sugar Bowl and the Rose Bowl when TCU beat Whiskey....

"Remember that one time!"

That's all you have. It's a tired argument.

Exceptions do not make rules.

Non-AQ/G5 beating BCS/P5 teams in BCS/NY6 games is most certainly the norm, not the exception.
[Image: non-aq-g5-vs-bcs-p5-bcs-ny6-bowls-3.png]

[LINK TO IMAGE]
(This post was last modified: 07-18-2017 12:30 AM by MAD MACGYVER.)
07-18-2017 12:23 AM
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micahandme Offline
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Post: #39
RE: Air Force Coach Troy Calhoun Floats G5 Playoff Idea
(07-17-2017 12:34 AM)DawgNBama Wrote:  
(07-15-2017 09:43 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  No matter what expansion happens, the power schools and CFP will say top 8 teams not conference champions. Thus ensuring they don't have to take a G5 champ and keeping the money. Just the reality of the situation.


Even as a G5 fan, I'm afraid you're right unless the G5 can pull off what Scott Cowen and the other G5 presidents pulled off to get the G5 into BCS bowls. That would definitely be the equalizer.

Had a brainstorm while contemplating the college football season vs the college basketball season. NCAA men's basketball has like a preseason NIT, and a lot of tournaments and conference challenge tournaments. If the G5 could do a football equivalent of this, while it would not necessarily guarantee the G5 a spot of at the CFP table, it would make G5 appearances a lot more common, IMO. Basically this, take Calhoun's idea, and instead of doing it at the end of the year, do it at the beginning. I'm sure some wouldn't go for it for various reasons, but I think at the same time, some teams would go for it, and it would bolster strength of schedule for those G5 challengers.

Not a bad idea, but it doesn't feasibly fit into the CFB scheduling model. If G5's want to get aggressive, they need to keep scheduling P5 teams as "away only" paycheck games. Houston--for example--with Oklahoma and Louisville on the schedule last year. Boise State has been shooting for this for the past decade. They need these SOS benchmarks regularly. They can't schedule FCS schools or non-conference G5 games. They need ALL P5 OOC games (as much as possible).

If they really want to be considered "equal"--as I hear all of you small school guys around clambering for--than they need to schedule UP...way UP. No excuses for beating 1 P5 school and then running the table against your weaker G5 counterparts and expecting a spot at the table (looking at you Western Michigan/Marshall/etc.)
07-18-2017 03:45 AM
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MplsBison Offline
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Post: #40
RE: Air Force Coach Troy Calhoun Floats G5 Playoff Idea
MM,

In my opinion, that list should be retooled to remove games for teams that are currently in the P5 (Utah and TCU) and add games for teams that are current in the G5 (Cincy). That would very quickly change the composition of your list.

That basically leaves you with a "Meh" win over Arizona, a "Good for you, but hardly the best FL St team we've ever seen" win, and then the legendary Boise win over Adrian Peterson's 2006 OU team that will be replayed forever.
07-18-2017 10:53 AM
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