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2016 New CUSA Budgets - USA Today
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mturn017 Online
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Post: #31
RE: 2016 New CUSA Budgets - USA Today
(07-07-2017 10:17 AM)Dawgxas Wrote:  I wouldn't put too much stock in this reports, especially among the G5 conferences. Fuzzy accounting at best with some of these schools Ark State, ODU

Some of the G5 schools Revenues are propped up mostly by Student fees, I definitely wouldn't get on here bragging about it.

Truth is La Tech is probably more subsidized than is being reported. Based on how they receive funding, it's a safe bet that anything that they can say is not an athletic expense they would leave on the academic side. If you were forced to include everything related to athletics as VA is and allocate general University overhead to athletics then there's no doubt your athletic budget would be higher. But so would your subsidy.

There's nothing "fuzzy" about those ticket sales and contributions though.
07-07-2017 10:32 AM
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Post: #32
RE: 2016 New CUSA Budgets - USA Today
(07-07-2017 09:30 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  
(07-06-2017 11:28 PM)dahbeed Wrote:  
(07-06-2017 09:58 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  
(07-06-2017 09:49 PM)dahbeed Wrote:  
(07-06-2017 09:44 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  Ark St has there own way of counting money and it's different from everyone else. If you look at donations they went over $700,000 once in 10 years then it goes up to over 6 million then drops to a little over 2 million.

If I had to guess they are adding building funds into their revenues.

What's the over/under on the ArkyState internets po-po pull you over for mentioning them? Officer Arkstfan arriving in ...... Or maybe my boy Winston the Woof.

He's (Winston) negatived rep me I believe 10 times out of 21 that I have and BamaScorpio69 6 times. Guess I rub them the wrong way.

Ark St fan must be busy because we been doing this for freaking 12 years. I post about their numbers and POP! there he is. Chief use to do it often also. Use to tell me they are different the "Ark St way"

I forgot about Chief. I believe he's the editor of the Arky State Pravda. He and Arkstfan can explain anything into an Arky State windfall. I wish I could buy a set of the red colored glasses those guys wear. They'd make me a little more forgiving when we pull a Western.

WKUYG just has a hate boner for us. I've given him the IRS tax return numbers for our booster club and he says BUT USATODAY. Then when USATODAY numbers look good for us he calls bull****.

Whatever.

We picked up nearly $5 million when Centennial Bank bought Liberty Bank and paid the entire naming rights fee remaining upfront as part of the closing costs of the transaction. Picked up another $5 million when the owner of Centennial Bank wrote a personal check for $5 million. Losers want to say its fake accounting.

The numbers USA today use is numbers each school files with the government. And even with the one time $10,000,000 from the bank that would be under Contributions & Rights / Licensing. I will repeat this one more time. Ark St is listing building funds in with their numbers and one time donations. I know for a fact at Western those are not counting in as Revenues. Houchen paid $5,000,000 for the naming rights to Western's stadium in 2007 but you will not see that in Western's numbers.

Western is adding new video boards in Diddle Arena and for football at the cost of 2.5 million dollars. Paid for by private donations. You do not see that in the numbers on USA Today.

Below is what you sent me...it's far from a public doc but I take your word those numbers are correct. So tell me which government form is Ark ST lying on? The IRS or the ones USA Today got from ask or a open records request?

If you click on the breakdown of the numbers below is the amount being spent by Western and ARK ST. in the most common forms...Coaching / Staff, Scholarships, Facilities / Overhead.

Western

$9,644,170
$6,335,700
$3,500,730

ARK ST

$7,201,988
$6,755,420
$2,061,827

Yet ARK ST is spending $27,082,809 in OTHER which is 19 million more than 2 years earlier.

As I said Ark St is adding in building funds where other schools don't do that. At least not Western

Below is the "IRS" numbers Arkstfan sent me

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AState tax returns.
To: WKUYG
From 1099's filed with the IRS by the Red Wolf Foundation.
Year is what year it was in July when the fiscal year started.
This is from the revenue line of each return, it is signed under penalty of perjury and the risk of prosecution for filing a false return.
2002 $1,520,699
2003 $1,822,344
2004 $1,517,000
2005 $1,561,806
2006 $1,348,602
2007 $1,583,110
2008 $1,572,927
2009 $2,435,279
2010 $2,183,311
2011 $2,657,240
2012 $3,288,308
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More tax
To: WKUYG
2013 $5,543,925
2014 $6,071,620
2015 $7,500,866
07-07-2017 11:15 AM
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Post: #33
RE: 2016 New CUSA Budgets - USA Today
Here's ARK St football record over the years of the budget shown on USA Today. Going by the fact most schools will have increase donations after record winning seasons. ARK st should have seen major increases in donations, tickets sold, "other" in 2012 or 2013 following back to back 10 win seasons. But that did not happen the large increase came after a drop in wins..8 in 2013 and 7 in 2014

CAPITOL BUILDING FUNDS is the only way the ARK ST numbers adds up.

2016 8 5
2015 9 4
2014 7 6
2013 8 5
2012 10 3
2011 10 3
2010 4 8
2009 4 8
2008 6 6
2007 5 7
2006 6 6
2005 6 6

[Image: akst-L.jpg]
(This post was last modified: 07-07-2017 11:27 AM by WKUYG.)
07-07-2017 11:25 AM
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Side Show Joe Offline
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Post: #34
RE: 2016 New CUSA Budgets - USA Today
(07-07-2017 09:35 AM)ESE84 Wrote:  
(07-07-2017 07:57 AM)wh49er Wrote:  
(07-06-2017 08:01 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  Rice shouldn't be ranked 14th. They probably have more money then everyone in C-USA combined. They just don't have to report it.

If you're talking about endowment money, then it isn't even close. I imagine their sports budget is on par with the rest of the conference.

It is not too hard to find. This report puts total spending just over $37 M for 2015-2016, which means we just nose out Charlotte for second place in C-USA spending.

http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/rice...Report.pdf


University support is $23M, and Endowment Payout is $2.1M.

Charlotte is listed 3rd in spending. North Texas is 2nd. Charlotte is listed 2nd in revenue.

I knew Rice had a very healthy budget. Add in the very deep pockets of their small fan base and it is easy to see why the OP should not have placed Rice 14th.
07-07-2017 12:45 PM
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Post: #35
RE: 2016 New CUSA Budgets - USA Today
Below is a link to the 2016-2017 NCAA Agreed Upon Procedures that must be followed by all NCAA institutions for reports due January 15, 2018. The definitions are basically the same as for 2015-2016 reports.

2017 Agreed Upon Procedures

As part of those procedures, here the definition of Other Operating Revenues (page 28):
"Input any operating revenues received by athletics in the report year which cannot be classified into one of the stated categories.

If the figure is greater than 10% of total revenues, please report the top three activities included in this category in the comments section."

Other Operating Expenses (page 35):
"Input any operating expenses paid by athletics in the report year which cannot be classified into one of the stated categories, including:
• Non-team travel (conferences, etc.).
• Team banquets and awards.

If the figure is greater than 10% of total expenses, please report the top three activities included in this category in the comments section."

Those are the only other revenue and other expense categories that are to be used in the NCAA report.

Contributions (page 25):
"Input contributions provided and used by athletics in the reporting year...." (emphasis is as shown in the linked document)

Since all of the revenue and expense categories used to generate the figures compiled by USA Today from the NCAA reports are supposed to be for operating revenues and expenses, revenues and expenses related to capital projects are supposed to be excluded from these figures. Capital expenditures have their own category (page 37) that is reported separately and should not be included as part of the operating expense figures:
"Input cost of athletics related capital expenditures for the reporting year."
(This post was last modified: 07-07-2017 03:18 PM by FriscoDawg.)
07-07-2017 02:20 PM
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Post: #36
RE: 2016 New CUSA Budgets - USA Today
(07-07-2017 10:17 AM)Dawgxas Wrote:  I wouldn't put too much stock in this reports, especially among the G5 conferences. Fuzzy accounting at best with some of these schools Ark State, ODU

Some of the G5 schools Revenues are propped up mostly by Student fees, I definitely wouldn't get on here bragging about it.

AState cut it's university support of athletics by $1.39 million. It's in the report. 30.3% of the AState budget came from the university or students.

It's nice having an alum who started a bank in 1998 and now has grown it past $10 billion in assets and is 117th largest bank holding company in the nation. Also doesn't hurt to have the largest rice producer in the country as a corporate sponsor, nor to have your top fan and former governor on the board of directors of the largest poultry company in the world.

Winning is opening wallets.

Learfield signed on for $1.6 million a year. Not many G5's getting that, though I know UNLV is one that is doing better.
07-07-2017 04:19 PM
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Post: #37
RE: 2016 New CUSA Budgets - USA Today
(07-07-2017 11:15 AM)WKUYG Wrote:  
(07-07-2017 09:30 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  
(07-06-2017 11:28 PM)dahbeed Wrote:  
(07-06-2017 09:58 PM)WKUYG Wrote:  
(07-06-2017 09:49 PM)dahbeed Wrote:  What's the over/under on the ArkyState internets po-po pull you over for mentioning them? Officer Arkstfan arriving in ...... Or maybe my boy Winston the Woof.

He's (Winston) negatived rep me I believe 10 times out of 21 that I have and BamaScorpio69 6 times. Guess I rub them the wrong way.

Ark St fan must be busy because we been doing this for freaking 12 years. I post about their numbers and POP! there he is. Chief use to do it often also. Use to tell me they are different the "Ark St way"

I forgot about Chief. I believe he's the editor of the Arky State Pravda. He and Arkstfan can explain anything into an Arky State windfall. I wish I could buy a set of the red colored glasses those guys wear. They'd make me a little more forgiving when we pull a Western.

WKUYG just has a hate boner for us. I've given him the IRS tax return numbers for our booster club and he says BUT USATODAY. Then when USATODAY numbers look good for us he calls bull****.

Whatever.

We picked up nearly $5 million when Centennial Bank bought Liberty Bank and paid the entire naming rights fee remaining upfront as part of the closing costs of the transaction. Picked up another $5 million when the owner of Centennial Bank wrote a personal check for $5 million. Losers want to say its fake accounting.

The numbers USA today use is numbers each school files with the government. And even with the one time $10,000,000 from the bank that would be under Contributions & Rights / Licensing. I will repeat this one more time. Ark St is listing building funds in with their numbers and one time donations. I know for a fact at Western those are not counting in as Revenues. Houchen paid $5,000,000 for the naming rights to Western's stadium in 2007 but you will not see that in Western's numbers.

Western is adding new video boards in Diddle Arena and for football at the cost of 2.5 million dollars. Paid for by private donations. You do not see that in the numbers on USA Today.

Below is what you sent me...it's far from a public doc but I take your word those numbers are correct. So tell me which government form is Ark ST lying on? The IRS or the ones USA Today got from ask or a open records request?

If you click on the breakdown of the numbers below is the amount being spent by Western and ARK ST. in the most common forms...Coaching / Staff, Scholarships, Facilities / Overhead.

Western

$9,644,170
$6,335,700
$3,500,730

ARK ST

$7,201,988
$6,755,420
$2,061,827

Yet ARK ST is spending $27,082,809 in OTHER which is 19 million more than 2 years earlier.

As I said Ark St is adding in building funds where other schools don't do that. At least not Western

Below is the "IRS" numbers Arkstfan sent me

arkstfan Away
Sorry folks
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Posts: 19,509
Joined: Feb 2004
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I Root For: Fresh Starts
Location:

AState tax returns.
To: WKUYG
From 1099's filed with the IRS by the Red Wolf Foundation.
Year is what year it was in July when the fiscal year started.
This is from the revenue line of each return, it is signed under penalty of perjury and the risk of prosecution for filing a false return.
2002 $1,520,699
2003 $1,822,344
2004 $1,517,000
2005 $1,561,806
2006 $1,348,602
2007 $1,583,110
2008 $1,572,927
2009 $2,435,279
2010 $2,183,311
2011 $2,657,240
2012 $3,288,308
arkstfan Away
Sorry folks
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Posts: 19,509
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More tax
To: WKUYG
2013 $5,543,925
2014 $6,071,620
2015 $7,500,866

Then WKU isn't filling out the form correctly. If you look at the way the NCAA wants it completed, capital costs are supposed to be included. If you borrowed money to build it is required to be included in expenses.
07-07-2017 04:21 PM
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KAjunRaider Offline
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Post: #38
RE: 2016 New CUSA Budgets - USA Today
Let's face it....... we are all po' folks when it comes to college athletics when compared to the Silver Spooners

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07-07-2017 04:25 PM
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ODU2017 Online
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Post: #39
RE: 2016 New CUSA Budgets - USA Today
(07-07-2017 04:25 PM)KAjunRaider Wrote:  Let's face it....... we are all po' folks when it comes to college athletics when compared to the Silver Spooners

[Image: po-folks.jpg]
I just don't get why a school in the middle of nowhere gets to represent my entire state. ODU has 20k students, sits in the middle of a 1 million person metro area and is treated like it's irrelevant.

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07-07-2017 08:35 PM
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Hood-rich Offline
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Post: #40
RE: 2016 New CUSA Budgets - USA Today
(07-07-2017 08:57 AM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  The only thing that strikes me as odd about ODU's numbers is this.

If ODU is selling more tickets or similar amount of tickets at higher prices and also receiving more from fundraising it would be rational to expect that ODU would also be selling more stuff thus the licensing revenue would be higher than everyone else's in the league, but it is not. This appears to be a significant anomaly. Consider Hawaii with similar ticket sales and contribution revenues but licensing more than double ODU's. The whole range between 60 to 70 bears this out.

In fact, ODU's licensing revenue is similar to C-USA schools with much lower revenues in the other two categories. This includes numbers similar to MT and we are terrible at merchandise pushing and licensing agreements. So, for me (and I'm not bashing ODU in anyway) something doesn't add up there. Just my 2 cents.
it's called a ridiculous subsidy.

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07-07-2017 10:37 PM
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