TR,

Actually, the ACC is an equal revenue sharing conference. The NCAA Credits precisely work that way in the ACC, the money is divided up among the 15 schools. It has how the ACC has operated since day one. First link I found, http://www.technicianonline.com/sports/a...d16d5.html didn't really want to to an extensive google, you are welcome too.

(06-15-2017 12:40 PM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Luke Winn‏Verified account
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Deep in that NCAA release: Louisville argued its penalties should be downgraded because the sex acts/stripteases weren't worth all that much

Yeah only worth 5- 10 dollars at best !

Give the money to the teams Louisville beat in the tourney.


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Seems I remember the buyout to the AAC had already included the NCAA tournament credits and future payouts if I'm not mistaken that was part of negoated part when We left the AAC. Not sure what will happen but that bridge might have already been crossed with UL and AAC.

(06-15-2017 02:35 PM)CardFan1 Wrote:  Seems I remember the buyout to the AAC had already included the NCAA tournament credits and future payouts if I'm not mistaken that was part of negoated part when We left the AAC. Not sure what will happen but that bridge might have already been crossed with UL and AAC.

Think totally different things. By NCAA rules, the AAC kept Louisville's units from when they were in the conference. Think the 10 million dollars was totally separate of that.

(06-15-2017 02:10 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  TR,

Actually, the ACC is an equal revenue sharing conference. The NCAA Credits precisely work that way in the ACC, the money is divided up among the 15 schools. It has how the ACC has operated since day one. First link I found, http://www.technicianonline.com/sports/a...d16d5.html didn't really want to to an extensive google, you are welcome too.

but that article does not address at all what happens if a team is penalized by the NCAA

most conference bylaws have provisions for that

while one could argue that since Louisville cheated to get some of those players and thus won and earned money they were not entitled to that the conference as a whole really should not have been entitled to that money

but one can also argue that Louisville cheating and getting caught while other conference members are either not cheating or are better at not getting caught cheating is in fact detrimental to conference members that do not cheat because they are losing conference games to a team that cheated to get players and wins

so there should be some financial penalty to Louisville for doing so

if the conference was set to make $2.5 million per school or $37,500,00 total for 15 teams and Louisville brought in $5 million of that

so then you take $37.5 million minus the $5 million forfeited and get $32.5 million and you still divide that by 15 teams to get $2,166,666 per team then Louisville felt a loss of $333,333, but so did every other team in the conference

so how exactly is that really fair to the other members of the conference that did nothing wrong and that played by the rules and lost games to a team that was cheating

so if you take the $32,500,000 and divide by 14 then you get $2,321,428 and Louisville gets nothing so there is some damages/penalty that others are not feeling

but again you can make the argument that if Louisville was not cheating perhaps some other conference member might have made the tournament and thus that individual program or a couple of programs were impacted as well

or if Louisville had played by the rules and still was just as successful then everyone in the conference would be getting $2.5 million instead of $2,321,428 million

so should Louisville have to suffer the penalty of making everyone in the conference "whole" relative to what the earnings would be if they had the same success without the cheating

and I think one can make the argument that they should be required to do so and thus they should have $5 million held back from their total conference earnings and distributed to the rest of the conference equally

the article you linked discusses nothing about cheating or NCAA infractions or the conference dealings with that

the penalty is only for the 2015 season for the ACC. They had 4 units that year, so roughly a million dollars payable for after the 2016-21 seasons.

(06-15-2017 10:34 AM)Rube Dali Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 10:31 AM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  ...and yet they can't do anything to UNC .... Riddle me that Batman.

UNC is using the Cardinal Richelieu defense. They're merely trying to string this out.

Yeah. Their defense is basically semantics; complaining over the procedural adherence, like UNC was union ground worker fighting a disciplinary charge. Fighting every step.

The worst of their problems is over; their accrediting body said they did enough. What I think makes it worse than other schools who got hit for things; they go through this acting like they don't deserve any sort of punishment. Heck, at least Penn State took something.

Greater point being: at least Louisville will accept punishment for its actions. UNC is just being a bunch of d-bags.

(06-15-2017 02:44 PM)stever20 Wrote:  the penalty is only for the 2015 season for the ACC. They had 4 units that year, so roughly a million dollars payable for after the 2016-21 seasons.

S20,
Three questions if you know the answer

1. Does 2015 equates to the 2014/15 season?

2. If answer one is yes, then does 2012, 2013 and 2014 come from the AAC's credits?

3. If answer two is yes, do you know approximate the hit to the AAC?

(06-15-2017 03:04 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 02:44 PM)stever20 Wrote:  the penalty is only for the 2015 season for the ACC. They had 4 units that year, so roughly a million dollars payable for after the 2016-21 seasons.

S20,
Three questions if you know the answer

1. Does 2015 equates to the 2014/15 season?

2. If answer one is yes, then does 2012, 2013 and 2014 come from the AAC's credits?

3. If answer two is yes, do you know approximate the hit to the AAC?

1- yes
2- yes
3- looks like
2014 3 units
2013 5 units
2012 5 units

so payable would be
2018(12-17 seasons) 13 units
2019(13-18 seasons) 8 units
2020(14-19 seasons) 3 units
so a total of 24 units- or about 6 million dollars.

(06-15-2017 03:11 PM)stever20 Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 03:04 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 02:44 PM)stever20 Wrote:  the penalty is only for the 2015 season for the ACC. They had 4 units that year, so roughly a million dollars payable for after the 2016-21 seasons.

S20,
Three questions if you know the answer

1. Does 2015 equates to the 2014/15 season?

2. If answer one is yes, then does 2012, 2013 and 2014 come from the AAC's credits?

3. If answer two is yes, do you know approximate the hit to the AAC?

1- yes
2- yes
3- looks like
2014 3 units
2013 5 units
2012 5 units

so payable would be
2018(12-17 seasons) 13 units
2019(13-18 seasons) 8 units
2020(14-19 seasons) 3 units
so a total of 24 units- or about 6 million dollars.

Thanks, I am not sure our AAC breathen are quite understanding they are receiving the worst of the Louisville punishment which is kindo of ironic as they celebrate.

Two takeaways:

(1) It looks like Louisville will lose their 2013 National Title. Hard to see how that can be kept if tournament wins have to be vacated, it is very unlikely that at least one ineligible player did not play in any tournament game that year.

(2) There is no way the AAC will benefit at all from this, it won't see any of the tournament credit money that UL forfeits.

(06-15-2017 10:26 AM)stever20 Wrote:  in the long term- the big thing is no additional post season ban.

IMO, in the long term, the big thing would be if the national title is vacated. That's what a program's legacy is ultimately built on, titles.

(06-15-2017 02:40 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 02:10 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  TR,

Actually, the ACC is an equal revenue sharing conference. The NCAA Credits precisely work that way in the ACC, the money is divided up among the 15 schools. It has how the ACC has operated since day one. First link I found, http://www.technicianonline.com/sports/a...d16d5.html didn't really want to to an extensive google, you are welcome too.

but that article does not address at all what happens if a team is penalized by the NCAA

most conference bylaws have provisions for that

while one could argue that since Louisville cheated to get some of those players and thus won and earned money they were not entitled to that the conference as a whole really should not have been entitled to that money

but one can also argue that Louisville cheating and getting caught while other conference members are either not cheating or are better at not getting caught cheating is in fact detrimental to conference members that do not cheat because they are losing conference games to a team that cheated to get players and wins

so there should be some financial penalty to Louisville for doing so

if the conference was set to make $2.5 million per school or $37,500,00 total for 15 teams and Louisville brought in $5 million of that

so then you take $37.5 million minus the $5 million forfeited and get $32.5 million and you still divide that by 15 teams to get $2,166,666 per team then Louisville felt a loss of $333,333, but so did every other team in the conference

so how exactly is that really fair to the other members of the conference that did nothing wrong and that played by the rules and lost games to a team that was cheating

so if you take the $32,500,000 and divide by 14 then you get $2,321,428 and Louisville gets nothing so there is some damages/penalty that others are not feeling

but again you can make the argument that if Louisville was not cheating perhaps some other conference member might have made the tournament and thus that individual program or a couple of programs were impacted as well

or if Louisville had played by the rules and still was just as successful then everyone in the conference would be getting $2.5 million instead of $2,321,428 million

so should Louisville have to suffer the penalty of making everyone in the conference "whole" relative to what the earnings would be if they had the same success without the cheating

and I think one can make the argument that they should be required to do so and thus they should have $5 million held back from their total conference earnings and distributed to the rest of the conference equally

the article you linked discusses nothing about cheating or NCAA infractions or the conference dealings with that

TR,
The ACC will now only get around ~27 mill instead of ~28 mill which is ~1.8 million per team in the ACC with the loss of the 4 credits. Worst case for Louisville is they still get 800k with the Equal Revenue Distribution and have the other 1 Million of there split among 14 teams so they only get 800K of the credits from the NCAA. That is how equal revenue distribution works.

Again, thanks to S20 for providing the credit info.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketb...nt-success

(06-15-2017 03:28 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Two takeaways:

(1) It looks like Louisville will lose their 2013 National Title. Hard to see how that can be kept if tournament wins have to be vacated, it is very unlikely that at least one ineligible player did not play in any tournament game that year.

(2) There is no way the AAC will benefit at all from this, it won't see any of the tournament credit money that UL forfeits.

Ironic, Louisville commits the crime and the AAC ends up getting punished the most financially.

(06-15-2017 03:50 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 03:28 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Two takeaways:

(1) It looks like Louisville will lose their 2013 National Title. Hard to see how that can be kept if tournament wins have to be vacated, it is very unlikely that at least one ineligible player did not play in any tournament game that year.

(2) There is no way the AAC will benefit at all from this, it won't see any of the tournament credit money that UL forfeits.

Ironic, Louisville commits the crime and the AAC ends up getting punished the most financially.

AAC should easily be able to make that up and possibly more by the damages clause in the Conference contracts.

Nah you only lose titles and seasons if allegations are not proven

(06-15-2017 01:27 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 01:17 PM)TodgeRodge Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 12:56 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  Question, does the stripping of wins vacate conference Tournament Credits? Logically, you think it should but NCAA and logic rarely go together. Also, it appears if it does strip the Tourney Credits. Those credits belong to the AAC not the ACC. So the AAC gets screwed and Louisville still reaps the money from the ACC. Does anyone know the precident or answer about the credits when wins are stripped/vacated?

if it was done properly (it is the NCAA so that is in question) the money would be distributed to the conference, the conference would distribute it how they were going to and then Louisville would pay the NCAA back the part that represents their credits amount

so for the AAC that would mean they get the money, split it up to their members (with some getting more because of being there during the BE years) and then Louisville would pay back the NCAA the amount equal to their credits

but knowing the NCAA it might be how you think it could be and that is the NCAA just mails a smaller check and it is up to the conference to figure it out

and it looks like they will lose the 6 years that come from 2015 so that means they will lose some while in the ACC

Six years of conference tourney revenue from Louisville could mean several hundred thousands of dollars (my cursory math is estimating $400-600K) if this article from Forbes is to be believed.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/chrissmith/...f2cff32b05

I wish they'd just do that than do something as meaningless as vacating wins and titles. You can't scrap it and act like it didn't happen, at least to anyone with any memory.

(06-15-2017 11:29 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(06-15-2017 10:26 AM)stever20 Wrote:  in the long term- the big thing is no additional post season ban.

Got off light. They gave them the more lenient prior penalty structure.

Agree. Particularly Pitino!

So did they lose the title or not?