Mark Giannotto @mgiannotto
This means 6-9 F Mike Parks has signed his LOI to become 4th JUCO recruit for Memphis basketball this offseason Go Tigers!

Did Mark G try to make that tweet fit into our lowering the bar OP with the count?

#4wasunnecessary

(04-28-2017 12:09 PM)truest blue tiger Wrote:  Boy, this is a tough room, good grief, I guess hearing players talking in a positive way about him doesn't count. Even Markel was on Greg and Eli today and had nothing but praise for coach. Even T. Black and AA, and A. Turner all said that Coach TS will get it done here because he's a great coach. But this place, after 1, ONE, season have already put him and the program in a coffin, and have started nailing the lid shut. Sheesh, at least wait and see how things work out, but I forget, this forum is full of soothsayers'!!!

Of course, no one can completely predict the future, but there are certain factors influencing college basketball performance indicating likely future outcomes. To date, we have less talent and less experience than the squad that failed to make the post-season last year and Tubby is no miracle worker. The most likely outcome is regression from last year's bad season (by Tiger standards).

(04-28-2017 05:24 PM)Tiger1983 Wrote:  

(04-28-2017 12:09 PM)truest blue tiger Wrote:  Boy, this is a tough room, good grief, I guess hearing players talking in a positive way about him doesn't count. Even Markel was on Greg and Eli today and had nothing but praise for coach. Even T. Black and AA, and A. Turner all said that Coach TS will get it done here because he's a great coach. But this place, after 1, ONE, season have already put him and the program in a coffin, and have started nailing the lid shut. Sheesh, at least wait and see how things work out, but I forget, this forum is full of soothsayers'!!!

Of course, no one can completely predict the future, but there are certain factors influencing college basketball performance indicating likely future outcomes. To date, we have less talent and less experience than the squad that failed to make the post-season last year and Tubby is no miracle worker. The most likely outcome is regression from last year's bad season (by Tiger standards).

And some choose to ignore the factors, which is OK. And some wanna yell at those who merely point out the data.

Trigger warning: We are fans. As fans, we've always discussed the stats of recruits. Why do we change this fan past time to fit some new unproven recruiting jag we are on.

The bar was lower when Pastner was hired.

Our program has no bar now. I am headed out to find one soon.

(04-28-2017 06:36 PM)Smith Wrote:  The bar was lower when Pastner was hired.

No way

(04-28-2017 12:09 PM)truest blue tiger Wrote:  Boy, this is a tough room, good grief, I guess hearing players talking in a positive way about him doesn't count. Even Markel was on Greg and Eli today and had nothing but praise for coach. Even T. Black and AA, and A. Turner all said that Coach TS will get it done here because he's a great coach. But this place, after 1, ONE, season have already put him and the program in a coffin, and have started nailing the lid shut. Sheesh, at least wait and see how things work out, but I forget, this forum is full of soothsayers'!!!

Totally agree. Again, about 75% into the season, most would probably have said Tubby was overachieving in his first year. Everyone forgets that because of the train wreck the season became in the final weeks. I believe that was more player-related than staff-related.

If message boarders had their way, we'd see a new coach every year. Give this staff some time. I believe they've trimmed the fat and picked up some pieces they feel fit the program. Does anyone really believe those who left will move on and light up college basketball? Dedric is probably the most-likely one to do that, but is he going to average a near double-double at Kansas? I wouldn't bet the farm on that.

Piling on is easy. Stepping back and evaluating honestly when all the pieces are in place is the right thing. If the Tigers step back next year, we'll have a different conversation. But hell, does it have to rain on naysayers houses EVERY day?

(04-28-2017 06:36 PM)Smith Wrote:  The bar was lower when Pastner was hired.

WRONG!

(04-28-2017 07:32 PM)snowtiger Wrote:  Our program has no bar now. I am headed out to find one soon.

Ok, who lowered the bar? Did the powers that be that are responsible for paying his huge salary do it? Did the players themselves do it? At the end of the day, all of us want a good to great program. But I've heard some complaining about the star power of the players that we are landing. Complaining about us not going head to head with the Kansas, KY, and North Carolina's of the world. But remind me, what school did Cliff Alexander attend, what about Alex Poythress, Tony Parker and others. We did land Shaq Goodwin though. But coach isn't in position now to get 5 stars yet. Hopefully he can rebuild the brand so that we are an attractive option again. But at this point, unless we have some bag men, put the effort into building a team. Hopefully these guys can jell, and maybe one of the players can come out of nowhere, ala Cameron Payne, and do great things. I just want to let it play out.

(04-28-2017 08:19 PM)truest blue tiger Wrote:  Ok, who lowered the bar? Did the powers that be that are responsible for paying his huge salary do it? Did the players themselves do it? At the end of the day, all of us want a good to great program. But I've heard some complaining about the star power of the players that we are landing. Complaining about us not going head to head with the Kansas, KY, and North Carolina's of the world. But remind me, what school did Cliff Alexander attend, what about Alex Poythress, Tony Parker and others. We did land Shaq Goodwin though. But coach isn't in position now to get 5 stars yet. Hopefully he can rebuild the brand so that we are an attractive option again. But at this point, unless we have some bag men, put the effort into building a team. Hopefully these guys can jell, and maybe one of the players can come out of nowhere, ala Cameron Payne, and do great things. I just want to let it play out.

(04-28-2017 09:45 PM)I_LUV_MEMPHISTIGERS Wrote:  Give Tubby Credit -

He inherited an 8-win Minnesota program and coached them to the NCAA tournament by his 2nd season there. Then he inherited an 11-win Texas Tech program that had not seen the NCAA in the previous 7 seasons and coached them to the NCAA tournament by his 3rd season there.
He's demonstrated on more than one occasion he only needs time, not credit, for his accomplishments, to build a program to national relevance.
Memphis will be fine. Tubby Smith's resume does not suggest Memphis is going to sink into the abyss of irrelevance under his 5-year contract here.

Wow, this makes entirely too much sense!

(04-28-2017 07:32 PM)snowtiger Wrote:  Our program has no bar now. I am headed out to find one soon.

Yet, you were the biggest cheerleader when the program's bar melted into oblivion under wonder boy...right?

(04-28-2017 08:06 PM)Penny Lane Wrote:  

(04-28-2017 06:36 PM)Smith Wrote:  The bar was lower when Pastner was hired.

WRONG!

Hired an assistant coach with zero head coaching experience to follow a hall of fame coach? That's not lowering the bar? Hmmm!

(04-28-2017 01:18 PM)NJ1 Wrote:  

(04-28-2017 12:09 PM)truest blue tiger Wrote:  Boy, this is a tough room, good grief, I guess hearing players talking in a positive way about him doesn't count. Even Markel was on Greg and Eli today and had nothing but praise for coach. Even T. Black and AA, and A. Turner all said that Coach TS will get it done here because he's a great coach. But this place, after 1, ONE, season have already put him and the program in a coffin, and have started nailing the lid shut. Sheesh, at least wait and see how things work out, but I forget, this forum is full of soothsayers'!!!

Let's be careful to make a distinction between "this place" and a few individuals.

And it's also wise to consider whether some of those individuals may have, for one personal reason or another, "already put the program in a coffin" as soon as he was hired, before he ever coached a single game. Humans are pattern-seeking creatures. Once we've decided something is true, every subsequent event tends to be seen within that context.

Wow, there's help available for these kinds of individuals

(04-28-2017 01:08 PM)Tiger87 Wrote:  

(04-28-2017 10:45 AM)jgardne Wrote:  I feel like a true HOF coach ought to be beloved somewhere. What school that he's been at still sings his praises? Maybe Tulsa or Georgia? Is anybody at Texas Tech pining?

Well UK put him in their HOF. Minny's administration admitted they made a mistake in the way they treated him. TT's prez wanted him to sleep-over so he could match our offer to him. so...

Damn, right!!

(04-28-2017 09:45 PM)I_LUV_MEMPHISTIGERS Wrote:  Give Tubby Credit -

He inherited an 8-win Minnesota program and coached them to the NCAA tournament by his 2nd season there. Then he inherited an 11-win Texas Tech program that had not seen the NCAA in the previous 7 seasons and coached them to the NCAA tournament by his 3rd season there.

He's demonstrated on more than one occasion he only needs time, not credit, for his accomplishments, to build a program to national relevance.
Objective historical results, IMO, are the most reliable data-points to project future outcomes. They supersede all pre-conceived subjective assumptions of current data subjectively projecting future outcomes.

Memphis will be fine. Tubby Smith's resume does not suggest Memphis is going to sink into the abyss of irrelevance under his 5-year contract here. Rather, quite the opposite.

I will ask AGAIN: why is a supposedly HOF coach reduced to taking two of the worst jobs in the nation if he is so good?

(04-28-2017 06:36 PM)Smith Wrote:  The bar was lower when Pastner was hired.

Hell yeah!

(04-28-2017 01:20 PM)cscottl1981 Wrote:  

(04-28-2017 12:13 PM)jgardne Wrote:  

(04-28-2017 12:09 PM)truest blue tiger Wrote:  Boy, this is a tough room, good grief, I guess hearing players talking in a positive way about him doesn't count. Even Markel was on Greg and Eli today and had nothing but praise for coach. Even T. Black and AA, and A. Turner all said that Coach TS will get it done here because he's a great coach. But this place, after 1, ONE, season have already put him and the program in a coffin, and have started nailing the lid shut. Sheesh, at least wait and see how things work out, but I forget, this forum is full of soothsayers'!!!

He's such a great coach that Markel is leaving to play for Ole Miss. reconcile that. Is Ole Miss likely an NCAA tourney team next year?

There has been so much turnover since Markel signed with Memphis (his whole recruiting class transferred out). It's amazing he lasted as long as he did. I'm guessing he would have left earlier if he could have transferred w/out sitting out a year. Good job putting all of the blame on the current coach though.

^^^^THIS^^^^