Here are the final Top 10 rankings from the 2016 football season (G5 teams determined by votes received in AP poll):

1. Clemson/Western Michigan/James Madison
2. Alabama/South Florida/Youngstown State
3. USC/San Diego State/North Dakota State
4. Washington/Western Kentucky/Eastern Washington
5. Oklahoma/Air Force/South Dakota State
6. Ohio State/Boise State/Richmond
7. Penn State/Tulsa/Sam Houston State
8. Florida State/BYU/Wofford
9. Wisconsin/Temple/Jacksonville State
10. Michigan/Houston/Coastal Carolina

If these teams were matched against one another on a neutral site with neutral officials (i know, typically a foreign concept to P5 schools in these types of games, lol), which do you think would be more competitive:

P5 vs G5 or G5 vs FCS?

(04-27-2017 02:02 PM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  Here are the final Top 10 rankings from the 2016 football season (G5 teams determined by votes received in AP poll):

1. Clemson/Western Michigan/James Madison
2. Alabama/South Florida/Youngstown State
3. USC/San Diego State/North Dakota State
4. Washington/Western Kentucky/Eastern Washington
5. Oklahoma/Air Force/South Dakota State
6. Ohio State/Boise State/Richmond
7. Penn State/Tulsa/Sam Houston State
8. Florida State/BYU/Wofford
9. Wisconsin/Temple/Jacksonville State
10. Michigan/Houston/Coastal Carolina

If these teams were matched against one another on a neutral site with neutral officials (i know, typically a foreign concept to P5 schools in these types of games, lol), which do you think would be more competitive:

P5 vs G5 or G5 vs FCS?

That's tough to say. It's probably wider between top of G5 and top of FCS but it's more of a matter of depth. The very, very top FCS would probably be competitive against the top of the G5 but I believe it falls off much quicker than the top of the G5 compared to the top of the P5.

(04-27-2017 02:17 PM)BePcr07 Wrote:  

(04-27-2017 02:02 PM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  Here are the final Top 10 rankings from the 2016 football season (G5 teams determined by votes received in AP poll):

1. Clemson/Western Michigan/James Madison
2. Alabama/South Florida/Youngstown State
3. USC/San Diego State/North Dakota State
4. Washington/Western Kentucky/Eastern Washington
5. Oklahoma/Air Force/South Dakota State
6. Ohio State/Boise State/Richmond
7. Penn State/Tulsa/Sam Houston State
8. Florida State/BYU/Wofford
9. Wisconsin/Temple/Jacksonville State
10. Michigan/Houston/Coastal Carolina

If these teams were matched against one another on a neutral site with neutral officials (i know, typically a foreign concept to P5 schools in these types of games, lol), which do you think would be more competitive:

P5 vs G5 or G5 vs FCS?

That's tough to say. It's probably wider between top of G5 and top of FCS but it's more of a matter of depth. The very, very top FCS would probably be competitive against the top of the G5 but I believe it falls off much quicker than the top of the G5 compared to the top of the P5.

I dunno.

I'm thinking the P5 teams would go 10-0 against the G5, while the FCS might win a couple versus the G5.

My head hurts even trying to figure out what's going on here. The new season can't get here soon enough.

(04-27-2017 02:27 PM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(04-27-2017 02:17 PM)BePcr07 Wrote:  

(04-27-2017 02:02 PM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  Here are the final Top 10 rankings from the 2016 football season (G5 teams determined by votes received in AP poll):

1. Clemson/Western Michigan/James Madison
2. Alabama/South Florida/Youngstown State
3. USC/San Diego State/North Dakota State
4. Washington/Western Kentucky/Eastern Washington
5. Oklahoma/Air Force/South Dakota State
6. Ohio State/Boise State/Richmond
7. Penn State/Tulsa/Sam Houston State
8. Florida State/BYU/Wofford
9. Wisconsin/Temple/Jacksonville State
10. Michigan/Houston/Coastal Carolina

If these teams were matched against one another on a neutral site with neutral officials (i know, typically a foreign concept to P5 schools in these types of games, lol), which do you think would be more competitive:

P5 vs G5 or G5 vs FCS?

That's tough to say. It's probably wider between top of G5 and top of FCS but it's more of a matter of depth. The very, very top FCS would probably be competitive against the top of the G5 but I believe it falls off much quicker than the top of the G5 compared to the top of the P5.

I dunno.

I'm thinking the P5 teams would go 10-0 against the G5, while the FCS might win a couple versus the G5.

I don't know. It's tough to just guess.

I know this would never happen but it would be really cool if this is how they did non-conference scheduling. #1 P5 plays #1 G5 and #1 FCS. Would give a matchup that would otherwise go largely unnoticed otherwise a little more of a story line.

OK and USAFA would be a good game. Mich and Houston would be also.
But in those P5/G5 matchups, I'd expect the P5 to be 9-1.

That said, in those G5/FCS games, I could see the G5 going 6-4.
Madison is real; NDSU gives everyone headaches; SDSU can stop the run; Richmond is very athletic; and Jax might be favored over Temple.

In terms of resources, it's a bigger gap between the Elite G5-Elite FCS.

Head Coach Salary:
Elite P5: 4 - 6 million (except Michigan, at an absurd $9 million)
Elite G5: 1.7 - 2.2 million (except Houston, at 3.3 million)
Elite FCS: $200k - $430k (except Liberty, at $750k)

Assistant Coach salary pool:
Elite P5: 4-5.5 million
Elite G5: 1.8 - 2.4 million
Elite FCS: unknown, but I looked up Northern Iowa (who is #3 in head coach salary) online . Their assistant football coaches make between $37k - $92k.

FCS head coach's salaries:
http://www.aseaofred.com/scanning-fcs-coaches-salaries/

If we are talking about that list exact list, and assuming it's early in the year so injuries aren't a huge factor against the FCS lack of depth, I would guess the gap is bigger between P5-G5. It wouldn't be unrealistic to think that the P5 would go 9-1 or 10-0. The same can't be said for the top FCS vs top G5. At a minimum those FCS schools would go 3-7, but could win 4-5 of them. Lastly, the top FCS vs the top P5 would obviously likely be 10-0, but depending on match ups, I wouldn't count out NDSU, JMU, or EWU to spring the upset.

(04-27-2017 06:16 PM)Shox Wrote:  If we are talking about that list exact list, and assuming it's early in the year so injuries aren't a huge factor against the FCS lack of depth, I would guess the gap is bigger between P5-G5. It wouldn't be unrealistic to think that the P5 would go 9-1 or 10-0. The same can't be said for the top FCS vs top G5. At a minimum those FCS schools would go 3-7, but could win 4-5 of them. Lastly, the top FCS vs the top P5 would obviously likely be 10-0, but depending on match ups, I wouldn't count out NDSU, JMU, or EWU to spring the upset.

You honestly think the FCS could win 4-5 of them? Really?

Let's look at how those 10 FCS schools ACTUALLY performed against FBS:
James Madison - lost to UNC 56-28
Youngstown - lost to West Virginia 38-21
North Dakota - lost to Bowling Green 27-26
EWU - beat Washington State 45-42
South Dakota State - lost to TCU 59-41
Richmond - beat Virginia 37-20
Wofford - lost to Ole Miss 38-13
Jacksonville State - lost to LSU 34-13

That's 2-6 against a much worse schedule than the top-10 G5 schools.

One of the wins was against a 2-10 Virginia team, which hardly counts. And North Dakota lost to Bowling Green for crying out loud. Bowling Green was 4-8 including a 74-point loss to Memphis.

Well Houston actually beat 2 teams that were ranked top-10. (Louisville would have ended up top-10 if they had beat Houston). The other 4 top-10 P5 vs top-10 G5 games were wins for the P-5: USF lost to Florida State, Tulsa lost to Ohio State, Temple lost to Penn State, and WMU lost to Wisconsin

Let's look at the top-10 G5 against all P5 schools:
W - Western Michigan over Northwestern
W - Western Michigan over Illinois (this one probably shouldn't count)
L - Western Michigan to Wisconsin
W - USF over South Carolina
W - USF over Syracuse
L - USF to Florida State
L - WKU to Alabama
L - WKU to Vanderbilt
W - Boise vs Washington State
W - Boise vs Oregon State
L - Boise vs Baylor
L - Tulsa to Ohio State
L - Temple to Penn State
L - Temple to Wake Forest
W - Houston vs Louisville
W - Houston vs Oklahoma

So if you don't count BYU they went 8-8 against all P-5, and 2-4 against top-10 P5. Not great, but not hopelessly bad either.

(BYU went 3-3 vs P5).

(04-27-2017 06:51 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  

(04-27-2017 06:16 PM)Shox Wrote:  If we are talking about that list exact list, and assuming it's early in the year so injuries aren't a huge factor against the FCS lack of depth, I would guess the gap is bigger between P5-G5. It wouldn't be unrealistic to think that the P5 would go 9-1 or 10-0. The same can't be said for the top FCS vs top G5. At a minimum those FCS schools would go 3-7, but could win 4-5 of them. Lastly, the top FCS vs the top P5 would obviously likely be 10-0, but depending on match ups, I wouldn't count out NDSU, JMU, or EWU to spring the upset.

You honestly think the FCS could win 4-5 of them? Really?

Let's look at how those 10 FCS schools ACTUALLY performed against FBS:
James Madison - lost to UNC 56-28
Youngstown - lost to West Virginia 38-21
North Dakota - lost to Bowling Green 27-26
EWU - beat Washington State 45-42
South Dakota State - lost to TCU 59-41
Richmond - beat Virginia 37-20
Wofford - lost to Ole Miss 38-13
Jacksonville State - lost to LSU 34-13

That's 2-6 against a much worse schedule than the top-10 G5 schools.

One of the wins was against a 2-10 Virginia team, which hardly counts. And North Dakota lost to Bowling Green for crying out loud. Bowling Green was 4-8 including a 74-point loss to Memphis.

North Dakota wasn't in the final FCS top 10 - North Dakota State was. NDSU won 23-21 at Iowa last season.

(04-27-2017 06:51 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  

(04-27-2017 06:16 PM)Shox Wrote:  If we are talking about that list exact list, and assuming it's early in the year so injuries aren't a huge factor against the FCS lack of depth, I would guess the gap is bigger between P5-G5. It wouldn't be unrealistic to think that the P5 would go 9-1 or 10-0. The same can't be said for the top FCS vs top G5. At a minimum those FCS schools would go 3-7, but could win 4-5 of them. Lastly, the top FCS vs the top P5 would obviously likely be 10-0, but depending on match ups, I wouldn't count out NDSU, JMU, or EWU to spring the upset.

You honestly think the FCS could win 4-5 of them? Really?

Let's look at how those 10 FCS schools ACTUALLY performed against FBS:
James Madison - lost to UNC 56-28
Youngstown - lost to West Virginia 38-21
North Dakota - lost to Bowling Green 27-26
EWU - beat Washington State 45-42
South Dakota State - lost to TCU 59-41
Richmond - beat Virginia 37-20
Wofford - lost to Ole Miss 38-13
Jacksonville State - lost to LSU 34-13

That's 2-6 against a much worse schedule than the top-10 G5 schools.

One of the wins was against a 2-10 Virginia team, which hardly counts. And North Dakota lost to Bowling Green for crying out loud. Bowling Green was 4-8 including a 74-point loss to Memphis.

Youngstown State made it a game against West Virginia.
North Dakota lost by 1.
South Dakota State was in the upset alert ticker on ESPN until the fourth.
LSU was no Ole Miss or Auburn that Jacksonville could play.
James Madison could actually compete in the ACC if they got invited.
Youngstown State could beat Pittsburgh.

Some of these top FCS schools could fit in the middle of the pack of any P5 conferences anyday.

(04-27-2017 07:23 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(04-27-2017 06:51 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  

(04-27-2017 06:16 PM)Shox Wrote:  If we are talking about that list exact list, and assuming it's early in the year so injuries aren't a huge factor against the FCS lack of depth, I would guess the gap is bigger between P5-G5. It wouldn't be unrealistic to think that the P5 would go 9-1 or 10-0. The same can't be said for the top FCS vs top G5. At a minimum those FCS schools would go 3-7, but could win 4-5 of them. Lastly, the top FCS vs the top P5 would obviously likely be 10-0, but depending on match ups, I wouldn't count out NDSU, JMU, or EWU to spring the upset.

You honestly think the FCS could win 4-5 of them? Really?

Let's look at how those 10 FCS schools ACTUALLY performed against FBS:
James Madison - lost to UNC 56-28
Youngstown - lost to West Virginia 38-21
North Dakota - lost to Bowling Green 27-26
EWU - beat Washington State 45-42
South Dakota State - lost to TCU 59-41
Richmond - beat Virginia 37-20
Wofford - lost to Ole Miss 38-13
Jacksonville State - lost to LSU 34-13

That's 2-6 against a much worse schedule than the top-10 G5 schools.

One of the wins was against a 2-10 Virginia team, which hardly counts. And North Dakota lost to Bowling Green for crying out loud. Bowling Green was 4-8 including a 74-point loss to Memphis.

Youngstown State made it a game against West Virginia.
North Dakota lost by 1.
South Dakota State was in the upset alert ticker on ESPN until the fourth.
LSU was no Ole Miss or Auburn that Jacksonville could play.
James Madison could actually compete in the ACC if they got invited.
Youngstown State could beat Pittsburgh.

Some of these top FCS schools could fit in the middle of the pack of any P5 conferences anyday.

Umm no...the toll of playing 11 out of 12 games versus P5/G5 teams would decimate their lineups.

I think the bigger gap is top G5 against top FCS UNLESS you have one of those really good NDSU teams.

This is pointless to discuss. FBS has 35% more scholarships than FCS.

JMU was leading UNC well into the 1st half, then the #2 NFL draft QB went to work with 3 draftable WRs. They also had 2 RBs who will be in NFL camps.

Depth matters in football.

(04-27-2017 06:51 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  

(04-27-2017 06:16 PM)Shox Wrote:  If we are talking about that list exact list, and assuming it's early in the year so injuries aren't a huge factor against the FCS lack of depth, I would guess the gap is bigger between P5-G5. It wouldn't be unrealistic to think that the P5 would go 9-1 or 10-0. The same can't be said for the top FCS vs top G5. At a minimum those FCS schools would go 3-7, but could win 4-5 of them. Lastly, the top FCS vs the top P5 would obviously likely be 10-0, but depending on match ups, I wouldn't count out NDSU, JMU, or EWU to spring the upset.

You honestly think the FCS could win 4-5 of them? Really?

IMO, 4-5 is too many. But, I don't have much doubt that the best FCS would win more out of 10 vs the best G5 than the best G5 would against Alabama/Clemson. They wouldn't win any.

(04-28-2017 08:50 AM)JMU2004 Wrote:  This is pointless to discuss. FBS has 35% more scholarships than FCS.

JMU was leading UNC well into the 1st half, then the #2 NFL draft QB went to work with 3 draftable WRs. They also had 2 RBs who will be in NFL camps.

Depth matters in football.

That's not actually the case.

FBS teams are allowed 85 full scholarships — one per player

FCS teams have 63 scholarships, but those can be split among up to 85 players.

So we aren't talking about a roster filled with walk-ons (at least among the fully funded FCS programs).

(04-27-2017 06:51 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  

(04-27-2017 06:16 PM)Shox Wrote:  If we are talking about that list exact list, and assuming it's early in the year so injuries aren't a huge factor against the FCS lack of depth, I would guess the gap is bigger between P5-G5. It wouldn't be unrealistic to think that the P5 would go 9-1 or 10-0. The same can't be said for the top FCS vs top G5. At a minimum those FCS schools would go 3-7, but could win 4-5 of them. Lastly, the top FCS vs the top P5 would obviously likely be 10-0, but depending on match ups, I wouldn't count out NDSU, JMU, or EWU to spring the upset.

You honestly think the FCS could win 4-5 of them? Really?

Let's look at how those 10 FCS schools ACTUALLY performed against FBS:
James Madison - lost to UNC 56-28
Youngstown - lost to West Virginia 38-21
North Dakota - lost to Bowling Green 27-26
EWU - beat Washington State 45-42
South Dakota State - lost to TCU 59-41
Richmond - beat Virginia 37-20
Wofford - lost to Ole Miss 38-13
Jacksonville State - lost to LSU 34-13

That's 2-6 against a much worse schedule than the top-10 G5 schools.

One of the wins was against a 2-10 Virginia team, which hardly counts. And North Dakota lost to Bowling Green for crying out loud. Bowling Green was 4-8 including a 74-point loss to Memphis.

You do realize the OP listed NORTH DAKOTA STATE, not NORTH DAKOTA? Big difference. NDSU took down Iowa last year and haven't lost to a P5 or G5 opponent in years. I'll take 3 wins in the matchups listed for the top G5. JMU, NDSU and SDSU with EWU as a possible 4th.

The gap between the top P5 and G5 is huge with a few exceptions Cincinnati, Houston, Boise, schools that really aren't G5. The gap between the top G5 outside of those few listed and the very top of FCS is not very big. Ask yourself why the G5 stopped scheduling NDSU. Take a look at G5 games NDSU have played. Ask yourself why G5s won't schedule SDSU. We have been trying for years to get games with the MAC or MWC and we finally got CSU to bite in 2020. Last time NDSU went into Ft Collins it was a blowout, by NDSU. SDSU would beat Air Force by two or three scores last season. JMU were fast, physical and deep. Much stronger then any G5 I watched outside of the three listed above. You may want to re-think G5. Most schools are no overly impressive and most aren't very deep.