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Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
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k2tigers Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
agree with Johnson or Brewton
04-16-2017 11:51 AM
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Ttaylor Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
I'm going to go with Jamal Johnson. This kid can flat out shoot the ball naturally and with such grace.
04-16-2017 11:54 AM
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Motor City Sam Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
(04-16-2017 10:10 AM)450bench Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 09:13 AM)memtiger1987 Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 09:05 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  These are the JUCO ALL-AMERICANS from last year with their college stats, name of college, and JUCO Stats in parenthesis:

Colton Weisbrod 15.1/8.1/.9 - Lamar (21/11/2)
Kevin Simms 13.4 / 5 / 1.9 - Arkansas State (20/10/4)
Bashir Ahmed 13.4/5/5/1.2 - St. Johns (20/8/2)
Jaylen Barford 12.8/3.8/2.0 - Arkansas (26/7/5)
Niem Stevenson 8.7/3.8/1.5 Texas Tech (17/8/2)
Devin Davis 8.2/5.2/.9 - Houston (17/8/2)
Braian Angola Rodas 4.6/1.6/1.2 - Florida State (21/7/4)
Julian Walters 4/1.8/1.6 - ETSU (19/5/2)
Kavell Bigby-Williams 3/2.8/.2 - Oregon (17/14/1)


These were the best of the best and none came close to matching what they did in JUCO.

The three best scorers were at low D1 schools and St. Johns', who was 14-17 last year.

The three players who played at high D1 schools averages less than half of what they did at JUCO and a couple other completely crapped the bed.

So, basically, for our best JUCO's, cut the scoring in half and for others, slash it a bit more.

Last vear, Rivers went for 6.4 and 3.5 (in 22 mpg) at Memphis. At SWTCC he went for 13 and 7 in 22 mpg.

The opportunity to score should be there with this team. My guess is that every guy you listed didn't come into a situation like Memphis. 2 kids with any D1 experience.

This^

So many factors go into how a player transitions from JUCO to D1. Really hard to make predictions based on where someone else was ranked in prior years. As was stated above, most don't come into opportunities where they are going to have the kind of opportunities that will be available for the Memphis team. And, while some won't want to hear it, most didn't come into a situation with a coach like Smith. We all saw how much better Crawford, the Lawsons, and Martin played last year as opposed to 2015-16. Coaching makes a big difference.

Two guys on that list that were big scoring JUCO guards are Angola Rodas and Stevenson. Angola Rodas got buried in a very deep backcourt at Florida State, including returning high school all Americans and another high scoring JUCO guard. Stevenson was at Texas Tech, and the Red Raiders brought back two upper-class guards and also added another JUCO and a grad transfer at the same time they added Stevenson. I think in a different situation, both players would have produced more.

Smith recruited a JUCO guy to Tech in the class of 2014 named Dev Williams. Lindy's Sports ranked him number 61 nationally in the class of 2014 JUCO players. He wasn't as highly regarded as Brewton or Darrington, but he scored 10.8 and 10.5 ppg in his two years at Tech, with some big games and clutch shots. I think our JUCO players are going to do well next season.
04-16-2017 12:13 PM
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salukiblue Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
(04-16-2017 11:50 AM)UofMemphis Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 09:05 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  These are the JUCO ALL-AMERICANS from last year with their college stats, name of college, and JUCO Stats in parenthesis:

Colton Weisbrod 15.1/8.1/.9 - Lamar (21/11/2)
Kevin Simms 13.4 / 5 / 1.9 - Arkansas State (20/10/4)
Bashir Ahmed 13.4/5/5/1.2 - St. Johns (20/8/2)
Jaylen Barford 12.8/3.8/2.0 - Arkansas (26/7/5)
Niem Stevenson 8.7/3.8/1.5 Texas Tech (17/8/2)
Devin Davis 8.2/5.2/.9 - Houston (17/8/2)
Braian Angola Rodas 4.6/1.6/1.2 - Florida State (21/7/4)
Julian Walters 4/1.8/1.6 - ETSU (19/5/2)
Kavell Bigby-Williams 3/2.8/.2 - Oregon (17/14/1)


These were the best of the best and none came close to matching what they did in JUCO.

The three best scorers were at low D1 schools and St. Johns', who was 14-17 last year.

The three players who played at high D1 schools averages less than half of what they did at JUCO and a couple other completely crapped the bed.

So, basically, for our best JUCO's, cut the scoring in half and for others, slash it a bit more.

Last vear, Rivers went for 6.4 and 3.5 (in 22 mpg) at Memphis. At SWTCC he went for 13 and 7 in 22 mpg.

so who said they expected the JuCo kids to average here what they averaged at their JuCo?

I thought the question was who is going to lead us in scoring next season?

I'd say either Jamal Johnson or Brewton.

Just using the numbers in the context of scoring at the next level (re: leading scorer).

It won't be:
Azab
the three Frosh
Rivers
Thornton

Only choices left (as of now)
Martin 10.3 in D1 ball
Davenport (16 ppg In JUCO)
Brewton (20 ppg in JUCO)

As of now with only three guards on the roster, one swingman, one center, and four power forwards, the balance is a mess.

Gotta get at least one more guard.

I'll go with Martin making another step up to about 14 ppg next year, with Brewton at about 11 ppg. If we get Darrington or Larry Bird 2.0, I'll adjust.

I'll take a known D1 commodity and certified team leader to bear the brunt of scoring.
(This post was last modified: 04-16-2017 12:22 PM by salukiblue.)
04-16-2017 12:22 PM
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macgar32 Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
(04-16-2017 09:05 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  These are the JUCO ALL-AMERICANS from last year with their college stats, name of college, and JUCO Stats in parenthesis:

Colton Weisbrod 15.1/8.1/.9 - Lamar (21/11/2)
Kevin Simms 13.4 / 5 / 1.9 - Arkansas State (20/10/4)
Bashir Ahmed 13.4/5/5/1.2 - St. Johns (20/8/2)
Jaylen Barford 12.8/3.8/2.0 - Arkansas (26/7/5)
Niem Stevenson 8.7/3.8/1.5 Texas Tech (17/8/2)
Devin Davis 8.2/5.2/.9 - Houston (17/8/2)
Braian Angola Rodas 4.6/1.6/1.2 - Florida State (21/7/4)
Julian Walters 4/1.8/1.6 - ETSU (19/5/2)
Kavell Bigby-Williams 3/2.8/.2 - Oregon (17/14/1)


These were the best of the best and none came close to matching what they did in JUCO.

The three best scorers were at low D1 schools and St. Johns', who was 14-17 last year.

The three players who played at high D1 schools averages less than half of what they did at JUCO and a couple other completely crapped the bed.

So, basically, for our best JUCO's, cut the scoring in half and for others, slash it a bit more.

Last vear, Rivers went for 6.4 and 3.5 (in 22 mpg) at Memphis. At SWTCC he went for 13 and 7 in 22 mpg.

Two High D1 buried on Talented teams...Won't happen here.

Secondly no one is expecting them to Perform at the same level as Juco, just somewhat match what some of these guys put up last year since we are getting the best of the best (2 or 3 of them at least) and we are not playing in a high D1 league.

If we get 25-30 points between the 3 (if we get the 3rd) Juco All Americans with them playing reasonable minutes I don't think that is out of the realm of possibility.
(This post was last modified: 04-16-2017 12:55 PM by macgar32.)
04-16-2017 12:37 PM
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snowtiger Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
Martin, unless there's a chemistry issue

Edit: The team ain't done yet
(This post was last modified: 04-16-2017 01:56 PM by snowtiger.)
04-16-2017 01:37 PM
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memtiger1987 Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
(04-16-2017 12:22 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 11:50 AM)UofMemphis Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 09:05 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  These are the JUCO ALL-AMERICANS from last year with their college stats, name of college, and JUCO Stats in parenthesis:

Colton Weisbrod 15.1/8.1/.9 - Lamar (21/11/2)
Kevin Simms 13.4 / 5 / 1.9 - Arkansas State (20/10/4)
Bashir Ahmed 13.4/5/5/1.2 - St. Johns (20/8/2)
Jaylen Barford 12.8/3.8/2.0 - Arkansas (26/7/5)
Niem Stevenson 8.7/3.8/1.5 Texas Tech (17/8/2)
Devin Davis 8.2/5.2/.9 - Houston (17/8/2)
Braian Angola Rodas 4.6/1.6/1.2 - Florida State (21/7/4)
Julian Walters 4/1.8/1.6 - ETSU (19/5/2)
Kavell Bigby-Williams 3/2.8/.2 - Oregon (17/14/1)


These were the best of the best and none came close to matching what they did in JUCO.

The three best scorers were at low D1 schools and St. Johns', who was 14-17 last year.

The three players who played at high D1 schools averages less than half of what they did at JUCO and a couple other completely crapped the bed.

So, basically, for our best JUCO's, cut the scoring in half and for others, slash it a bit more.

Last vear, Rivers went for 6.4 and 3.5 (in 22 mpg) at Memphis. At SWTCC he went for 13 and 7 in 22 mpg.

so who said they expected the JuCo kids to average here what they averaged at their JuCo?

I thought the question was who is going to lead us in scoring next season?

I'd say either Jamal Johnson or Brewton.

Just using the numbers in the context of scoring at the next level (re: leading scorer).

It won't be:
Azab
the three Frosh
Rivers
Thornton

Only choices left (as of now)
Martin 10.3 in D1 ball
Davenport (16 ppg In JUCO)
Brewton (20 ppg in JUCO)

As of now with only three guards on the roster, one swingman, one center, and four power forwards, the balance is a mess.

Gotta get at least one more guard.

I'll go with Martin making another step up to about 14 ppg next year, with Brewton at about 11 ppg. If we get Darrington or Larry Bird 2.0, I'll adjust.

I'll take a known D1 commodity and certified team leader to bear the brunt of scoring.

I'd really like to see one more big and Darrington..
04-16-2017 01:41 PM
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Ttaylor Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
(04-16-2017 12:13 PM)Motor City Sam Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 10:10 AM)450bench Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 09:13 AM)memtiger1987 Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 09:05 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  These are the JUCO ALL-AMERICANS from last year with their college stats, name of college, and JUCO Stats in parenthesis:

Colton Weisbrod 15.1/8.1/.9 - Lamar (21/11/2)
Kevin Simms 13.4 / 5 / 1.9 - Arkansas State (20/10/4)
Bashir Ahmed 13.4/5/5/1.2 - St. Johns (20/8/2)
Jaylen Barford 12.8/3.8/2.0 - Arkansas (26/7/5)
Niem Stevenson 8.7/3.8/1.5 Texas Tech (17/8/2)
Devin Davis 8.2/5.2/.9 - Houston (17/8/2)
Braian Angola Rodas 4.6/1.6/1.2 - Florida State (21/7/4)
Julian Walters 4/1.8/1.6 - ETSU (19/5/2)
Kavell Bigby-Williams 3/2.8/.2 - Oregon (17/14/1)


These were the best of the best and none came close to matching what they did in JUCO.

The three best scorers were at low D1 schools and St. Johns', who was 14-17 last year.

The three players who played at high D1 schools averages less than half of what they did at JUCO and a couple other completely crapped the bed.

So, basically, for our best JUCO's, cut the scoring in half and for others, slash it a bit more.

Last vear, Rivers went for 6.4 and 3.5 (in 22 mpg) at Memphis. At SWTCC he went for 13 and 7 in 22 mpg.

The opportunity to score should be there with this team. My guess is that every guy you listed didn't come into a situation like Memphis. 2 kids with any D1 experience.

This^

So many factors go into how a player transitions from JUCO to D1. Really hard to make predictions based on where someone else was ranked in prior years. As was stated above, most don't come into opportunities where they are going to have the kind of opportunities that will be available for the Memphis team. And, while some won't want to hear it, most didn't come into a situation with a coach like Smith. We all saw how much better Crawford, the Lawsons, and Martin played last year as opposed to 2015-16. Coaching makes a big difference.

Two guys on that list that were big scoring JUCO guards are Angola Rodas and Stevenson. Angola Rodas got buried in a very deep backcourt at Florida State, including returning high school all Americans and another high scoring JUCO guard. Stevenson was at Texas Tech, and the Red Raiders brought back two upper-class guards and also added another JUCO and a grad transfer at the same time they added Stevenson. I think in a different situation, both players would have produced more.

Smith recruited a JUCO guy to Tech in the class of 2014 named Dev Williams. Lindy's Sports ranked him number 61 nationally in the class of 2014 JUCO players. He wasn't as highly regarded as Brewton or Darrington, but he scored 10.8 and 10.5 ppg in his two years at Tech, with some big games and clutch shots. I think our JUCO players are going to do well next season.

^^^^This Right Here^^^^
04-16-2017 01:54 PM
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salukiblue Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
(04-16-2017 01:41 PM)memtiger1987 Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 12:22 PM)salukiblue Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 11:50 AM)UofMemphis Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 09:05 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  These are the JUCO ALL-AMERICANS from last year with their college stats, name of college, and JUCO Stats in parenthesis:

Colton Weisbrod 15.1/8.1/.9 - Lamar (21/11/2)
Kevin Simms 13.4 / 5 / 1.9 - Arkansas State (20/10/4)
Bashir Ahmed 13.4/5/5/1.2 - St. Johns (20/8/2)
Jaylen Barford 12.8/3.8/2.0 - Arkansas (26/7/5)
Niem Stevenson 8.7/3.8/1.5 Texas Tech (17/8/2)
Devin Davis 8.2/5.2/.9 - Houston (17/8/2)
Braian Angola Rodas 4.6/1.6/1.2 - Florida State (21/7/4)
Julian Walters 4/1.8/1.6 - ETSU (19/5/2)
Kavell Bigby-Williams 3/2.8/.2 - Oregon (17/14/1)


These were the best of the best and none came close to matching what they did in JUCO.

The three best scorers were at low D1 schools and St. Johns', who was 14-17 last year.

The three players who played at high D1 schools averages less than half of what they did at JUCO and a couple other completely crapped the bed.

So, basically, for our best JUCO's, cut the scoring in half and for others, slash it a bit more.

Last vear, Rivers went for 6.4 and 3.5 (in 22 mpg) at Memphis. At SWTCC he went for 13 and 7 in 22 mpg.

so who said they expected the JuCo kids to average here what they averaged at their JuCo?

I thought the question was who is going to lead us in scoring next season?

I'd say either Jamal Johnson or Brewton.

Just using the numbers in the context of scoring at the next level (re: leading scorer).

It won't be:
Azab
the three Frosh
Rivers
Thornton

Only choices left (as of now)
Martin 10.3 in D1 ball
Davenport (16 ppg In JUCO)
Brewton (20 ppg in JUCO)

As of now with only three guards on the roster, one swingman, one center, and four power forwards, the balance is a mess.

Gotta get at least one more guard.

I'll go with Martin making another step up to about 14 ppg next year, with Brewton at about 11 ppg. If we get Darrington or Larry Bird 2.0, I'll adjust.

I'll take a known D1 commodity and certified team leader to bear the brunt of scoring.

I'd really like to see one more big and Darrington..

As must.

Can't roll with three guards. None of four PF on the roster should be at the 5.
04-16-2017 02:01 PM
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Tiger1983 Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
My guess is Martin. The lack of experience and talent and holding the ball late in the shot clock will force Martin to shoot a lot. By sheer volume of shots hoisted, he may make enough to lead the team in scoring.
04-16-2017 02:46 PM
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snowtiger Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
(04-16-2017 02:46 PM)Tiger1983 Wrote:  My guess is Martin. The lack of experience and talent and holding the ball late in the shot clock will force Martin to shoot a lot. By sheer volume of shots hoisted, he may make enough to lead the team in scoring.

That's actually a good analysis. The ball will be in his hands and Martin will have to shoot, or the shot clock buzzer will reverberate through the airwaves.
04-16-2017 03:00 PM
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ncrdbl1 Online
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Post: #32
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
Do not know their personalities and what type girls will be on campus next year. But most will likely score a few times.
04-16-2017 03:06 PM
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bmcgee81 Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
I don't care what they average, as long as they score more points than the team they are playing against
04-17-2017 08:38 AM
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salukiblue Offline
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Post: #34
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
(04-16-2017 07:38 AM)NigelTufnel Wrote:  Brewton? He averaged 20 in JC. Martin? He averaged 10 last year and is likely to be a bigger part of the offense, but he also shot just 28% from 3.

Obviously, I hope someone steps up and averages 20; but it seems more likely that the leading scorer is going to be a 12-13 ppg guy and the points get spread out.

Tubby's got a big job with this roster. It could work, but he better get some serious buy in from the guys to defend at a really high level.

Problem is Brewton shot 22% from three last year. Davenport shot 29% last year from three and Thornton went for 24%.

Plus, I don't know if any one on the roster is capable of scoring in the post.

Azab? I have two things to go by: he went for 8 and 6 in high school and apparently he can tear it up at the Funch vs. intramural all stars.

Rivers: Certainly wasn't a post option last year.

Thornton: undersized at 6'6-6'7 and didn't see a lot of back down or face up in his game.

Davenport: Tagged with the dreaded "athlete" moniker. A scout praised his potential "high ceiling" but we only have him for two years. Likely a big contributor in the open floor, on breaks, and cleaning up rebounds. Only 180 pounds (and 6'7-6'8).

Enoh: By all accounts will be a project and shouldn't be expected to get real rotation minutes.

Generally, you can get by with suspect post play with good outside shooting. I guess the "hope" is that a freshman will just roll up in here and shoot 37% in his first year of D1 ball, or that four other players will make huge improvements in 3pt % despite two years of less than ideal numbers.
(This post was last modified: 04-17-2017 09:00 AM by salukiblue.)
04-17-2017 08:43 AM
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Tiger1983 Offline
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Post: #35
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
(04-17-2017 08:43 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 07:38 AM)NigelTufnel Wrote:  Brewton? He averaged 20 in JC. Martin? He averaged 10 last year and is likely to be a bigger part of the offense, but he also shot just 28% from 3.

Obviously, I hope someone steps up and averages 20; but it seems more likely that the leading scorer is going to be a 12-13 ppg guy and the points get spread out.

Tubby's got a big job with this roster. It could work, but he better get some serious buy in from the guys to defend at a really high level.

Problem is Brewton shot 22% from three last year. Davenport shot 29% last year from three and Thornton went for 24%.

Plus, I don't know if any one on the roster is capable of scoring in the post.

Azab? I have two things to go by: he went for 8 and 6 in high school and apparently he can tear it up at the Funch vs. intramural all stars.

Rivers: Certainly wasn't a post option last year.

Thornton: undersized at 6'6-6'7 and didn't see a lot of back down or face up in his game.

Davenport: Tagged with the dreaded "athlete" moniker. A scout praised his potential "high ceiling" but we only have him for two years. Likely a big contributor in the open floor, on breaks, and cleaning up rebounds. Only 180 pounds (and 6'7-6'8).

Enoh: By all accounts will be a project and shouldn't be expected to get real rotation minutes.

Generally, you can get by with suspect post play with good outside shooting. I guess the "hope" is that a freshman will just roll up in here and shoot 37% in his first year of D1 ball, or that four other players will make huge improvements in 3pt % despite two years of less that ideal numbers.

We really, really need Darrington.
04-17-2017 09:00 AM
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TOGC Offline
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Post: #36
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
If we pick up Darrington, Haruna, and one more TBA, I think we've upgraded at every position except the four. And we have a slightly deeper bench. How well they learn to play as a team will determine how far they go.
04-17-2017 09:07 AM
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HometownTiger Offline
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Post: #37
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
As it stands today - probably Brewton. Think it'll be he or Darrington if he signs.
04-17-2017 09:09 AM
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Tiger87 Offline
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Post: #38
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
(04-16-2017 02:46 PM)Tiger1983 Wrote:  The lack of experience and talent and holding the ball late in the shot clock will force Martin to shoot a lot.

Why do you think that? New players doesn't necessarily lead to holding the ball. From what I hear, the worry would be they don't hold the ball long enough.
04-17-2017 10:43 AM
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Tiger87 Offline
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Post: #39
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
(04-17-2017 08:43 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  
(04-16-2017 07:38 AM)NigelTufnel Wrote:  Brewton? He averaged 20 in JC. Martin? He averaged 10 last year and is likely to be a bigger part of the offense, but he also shot just 28% from 3.

Obviously, I hope someone steps up and averages 20; but it seems more likely that the leading scorer is going to be a 12-13 ppg guy and the points get spread out.

Tubby's got a big job with this roster. It could work, but he better get some serious buy in from the guys to defend at a really high level.

Problem is Brewton shot 22% from three last year. Davenport shot 29% last year from three and Thornton went for 24%.

Plus, I don't know if any one on the roster is capable of scoring in the post.

Azab? I have two things to go by: he went for 8 and 6 in high school and apparently he can tear it up at the Funch vs. intramural all stars.

Rivers: Certainly wasn't a post option last year.

Thornton: undersized at 6'6-6'7 and didn't see a lot of back down or face up in his game.

Davenport: Tagged with the dreaded "athlete" moniker. A scout praised his potential "high ceiling" but we only have him for two years. Likely a big contributor in the open floor, on breaks, and cleaning up rebounds. Only 180 pounds (and 6'7-6'8).

Enoh: By all accounts will be a project and shouldn't be expected to get real rotation minutes.

Generally, you can get by with suspect post play with good outside shooting. I guess the "hope" is that a freshman will just roll up in here and shoot 37% in his first year of D1 ball, or that four other players will make huge improvements in 3pt % despite two years of less than ideal numbers.

Dang. Can't hit from outside, can't score in the post. Jucos efficiency gets cut in half. What are we looking at from the team, like 40 ppg? We may not actually win a single game, unless we can hold them to 30.
04-17-2017 10:49 AM
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jgardne Offline
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Post: #40
RE: Who leads the team in Scoring next year?
(04-16-2017 11:10 AM)salukiblue Wrote:  The guy at Lamar played 31 mpg and the stAte guy played 27 mpg. That is vs low D1 talent on a low D1 roster and they still don't come close to production at JUCO.

You don't get it. JUCO is just as tough as AAC and these guys will duplicate their JUCO stats. Hell, maybe even improve them.

Pass the kool-aid
04-17-2017 10:53 AM
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