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Big West rejects UC San Diego
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jdgaucho Offline
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Big West rejects UC San Diego
The Big West has voted no on UC San Diego.

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/spor...story.html
04-06-2017 11:59 PM
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ThunderDan49 Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-06-2017 11:59 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  The Big West has voted no on UC San Diego.

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/spor...story.html

Just so that I know I read this right, the only way UCSD could move up to D1 is if they joined the Big West and not any other conference that would be similar in stature?
04-07-2017 12:30 AM
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Stugray2 Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
UCSD Athletic Director Earl Edwards: “We are still going to pursue moving to Division I with the hope that things will change in the relatively near future.”
comment from the article writer
A fact-finding report published before May’s student referendum said UCSD must receive a Big West invite by Sept. 15, 2018, or the student approval is null and void.

However as you know I inquired into the matter and discovered the language of the referendum only specifies D-I, although the campaign literature says "such as the Big West" (the hedge is in there, although I think the intent was BW or bust).

The WAC now has 18 months to convince UCSD to join. If for no other reason than, when the Big West decides to expand they will already be D-I. “I think UC San Diego is still going to be very attractive as a Division I school at some point in time in the future,” Big West commissioner Dennis Farrell said. “I’m not here to tell them what they should do in the future. There’s nothing negative about UC San Diego. I can only say glowing, positive things about them.”

That sort of says, go get through the D-I transition with somebody else and then come to us.
04-07-2017 12:44 AM
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jdgaucho Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
On Thursday, Farrell said the schools are pleased with the balance they have between the UC and Cal State institutions.

I'm wondering if that opens the door for Cal State Bakersfield? With them and UCSD, it maintains the Cal State - UC balance. Furthermore, the BW isn't a fan of 11 teams so I think if those two end up joining it will grow to 12.

But who's #12? Grand Canyon, NMSU, Seattle?
04-07-2017 12:59 AM
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ThunderDan49 Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-07-2017 12:59 AM)jdgaucho Wrote:  On Thursday, Farrell said the schools are pleased with the balance they have between the UC and Cal State institutions.

I'm wondering if that opens the door for Cal State Bakersfield? With them and UCSD, it maintains the Cal State - UC balance. Furthermore, the BW isn't a fan of 11 teams so I think if those two end up joining it will grow to 12.

But who's #12? Grand Canyon, NMSU, Seattle?

Based on the geographical grouping I would say that GCU would be the most likely. However, if the WAC continues it's RPI surge, it is unlikely that GCU or NMSU jump ship to a conference with a lower RPI ranking, since that is what the committee looks at. If both of them jump, it is to a conference that offers the possibility of multiple bids for the dance rather than jump to another one bid conference.

EDIT: That means if both want to stay in a Western conference, GCU would have to join the PAC-12 or the WCC and New Mexico State would likely also have the option of joining the Big 12
(This post was last modified: 04-07-2017 01:16 AM by ThunderDan49.)
04-07-2017 01:10 AM
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jdgaucho Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
The WAC this season was ranked right around where the BW had been the previous two years. In 2015-2016 the BW had four top-100 teams. And fell off a cliff.

The WAC needs to show it can have more than just one productive season.
04-07-2017 01:18 AM
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Stugray2 Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
Or Sac State, or if the lack of a stadium after the Q forces SDSU to end football. SJSU might shelf football, but that is a decade off.

Even numbers are a fan obsession, not one of the Big West. I really don't understand that fear of 9 or 11. That mentality caused the Big 12 to pass on Louisville when they added West Virginia, and that is likely the difference between that conference being stable instead of waiting for Texas and Oklahoma to leave. Or it can lead to Karl Benson insisting upon the CCU Cheer team.

In more seriousness I don't think there is a 12th. Farrell has pressure simply to keep the UC and CSU numbers equal. And I don't think the league has changed their mind about CSUB. They are waiting on a SDSU/SJSU/Sac State to balance UCSD. The same UC Chancellors that reject GCU having contact with the P12 object to GCU in the BW.
04-07-2017 01:20 AM
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ThunderDan49 Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-07-2017 01:20 AM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Or Sac State, or if the lack of a stadium after the Q forces SDSU to end football. SJSU might shelf football, but that is a decade off.

Even numbers are a fan obsession, not one of the Big West. I really don't understand that fear of 9 or 11. That mentality caused the Big 12 to pass on Louisville when they added West Virginia, and that is likely the difference between that conference being stable instead of waiting for Texas and Oklahoma to leave. Or it can lead to Karl Benson insisting upon the CCU Cheer team.

In more seriousness I don't think there is a 12th. Farrell has pressure simply to keep the UC and CSU numbers equal. And I don't think the league has changed their mind about CSUB. They are waiting on a SDSU/SJSU/Sac State to balance UCSD. The same UC Chancellors that reject GCU having contact with the P12 object to GCU in the BW.

The only P12 big wig that doesn't want to play GCU is ASU's. Majerle said earlier this week in an interview that the U of A head coach was more than willing to play us again, as long as it was down in Tuscon again (likely cause the Havocs that did travel down to Tuscon were already disruptive enough).
04-07-2017 01:30 AM
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Stugray2 Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-07-2017 01:30 AM)ThunderDan49 Wrote:  The only P12 big wig that doesn't want to play GCU is ASU's. Majerle said earlier this week in an interview that the U of A head coach was more than willing to play us again, as long as it was down in Tuscon again (likely cause the Havocs that did travel down to Tuscon were already disruptive enough).
Publicly

The UC Chancellors look down on BYU and Baylor. Big Difference between the Chancellors and the ADs who simply want good opponents. If you think the UC Chancellors are a little bit left wing, you have way over estimated influence of conservative concepts on them; they are much further left and anti-faith and anti-profit (other than for themselves, which is simply justified compensation they rationalize) than you can imagine.
04-07-2017 01:45 AM
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jdgaucho Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-07-2017 01:20 AM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Or Sac State, or if the lack of a stadium after the Q forces SDSU to end football. SJSU might shelf football, but that is a decade off.

Even numbers are a fan obsession, not one of the Big West. I really don't understand that fear of 9 or 11. That mentality caused the Big 12 to pass on Louisville when they added West Virginia, and that is likely the difference between that conference being stable instead of waiting for Texas and Oklahoma to leave. Or it can lead to Karl Benson insisting upon the CCU Cheer team.

In more seriousness I don't think there is a 12th. Farrell has pressure simply to keep the UC and CSU numbers equal. And I don't think the league has changed their mind about CSUB. They are waiting on a SDSU/SJSU/Sac State to balance UCSD. The same UC Chancellors that reject GCU having contact with the P12 object to GCU in the BW.

I'm going to respond to your points starting from the top.

a sub-275 Sac State program is likely not the answer. The Hornet's Nest makes CSUN's venue look like a palace.
San Jose took great strides forward but need to keep it up. The BW had four top-100 teams a year ago, three just two years ago. It's important to try and maintain that level if possible. San Jose and Sac State haven't come close.

9 members is not a problem. It's where the BW is at right now. But in its near 50 year history it has never been an 11 member conference. They say 10 is ideal for a non-football conference. That's not possible as long as Hawaii is around, unless there is a second member added who is outside the State of California.

One thing Bakersfield has done these last two years, is prove they can win at the D1 level. An NCAA appearance and NIT semifinal says as much.
04-07-2017 02:13 AM
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jdgaucho Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-07-2017 01:45 AM)Stugray2 Wrote:  
(04-07-2017 01:30 AM)ThunderDan49 Wrote:  The only P12 big wig that doesn't want to play GCU is ASU's. Majerle said earlier this week in an interview that the U of A head coach was more than willing to play us again, as long as it was down in Tuscon again (likely cause the Havocs that did travel down to Tuscon were already disruptive enough).
Publicly

The UC Chancellors look down on BYU and Baylor. Big Difference between the Chancellors and the ADs who simply want good opponents. If you think the UC Chancellors are a little bit left wing, you have way over estimated influence of conservative concepts on them; they are much further left and anti-faith and anti-profit (other than for themselves, which is simply justified compensation they rationalize) than you can imagine.

The Pac-12's ban on scheduling GCU was lifted at the beginning of this school year. Only ASU is maintaining it. GCU will be in a conference with USC and UCLA in men's volleyball, for what that's worth.
04-07-2017 02:30 AM
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NMSUPistolPete Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
If Cal Baptist was able to get voted into the WAC for 2018, UC San Diego only need to apply for WAC membership and I am sure they will be well on its' way to Division 1.
(This post was last modified: 04-07-2017 02:49 AM by NMSUPistolPete.)
04-07-2017 02:48 AM
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ThunderDan49 Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-07-2017 02:48 AM)NMSUPistolPete Wrote:  If Cal Baptist was able to get voted into the WAC for 2018, UC San Diego only need to apply for WAC membership and I am sure they will be well on its' way to Division 1.

Yeah I definitely think that the WAC would have zero issue with wanting to add a school like UCSD. It would help with academic prestige, it would give both CSUB and GCU a reasonable travel partner with Cal Baptist and UCSD all being within a reasonable distance from the respective schools, and expansion could possibly keep GCU and NMSU in the conference keeping a higher RPI for the conference.
04-07-2017 03:27 AM
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SoCalBobcat78 Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-07-2017 01:18 AM)jdgaucho Wrote:  The WAC this season was ranked right around where the BW had been the previous two years. In 2015-2016 the BW had four top-100 teams. And fell off a cliff.

The WAC needs to show it can have more than just one productive season.

If you look at the post on top 16 Mid-Major schools for basketball recruiting in 2017, you won't find a Big West school in the list. You will find two WAC schools, four WCC schools and San Diego State. The trend is not good for the Big West. UCSD was not the school the Big West needed at this time.

The Big West had an unusually good season in 2016 and an unusually bad season in 2017. They are probably somewhere in between as a conference. In 2018, the WAC and the Big West will be playing conference games in the same city, Riverside.

CBU is moving into a new arena that will open in May. UCR plays in an older, smaller facility. CBU had better attendance than UCR as a D2 school. They will have a bigger budget. The WAC games will be more entertaining, especially when schools like NMSU and GCU come to Riverside. The WAC is CBU and the Big West is UCR. One is growing and the future looks bright. The other is just okay with a future that looks very much the same as today.
04-07-2017 09:52 AM
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NMSTFan Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-07-2017 09:52 AM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  
(04-07-2017 01:18 AM)jdgaucho Wrote:  The WAC this season was ranked right around where the BW had been the previous two years. In 2015-2016 the BW had four top-100 teams. And fell off a cliff.

The WAC needs to show it can have more than just one productive season.

If you look at the post on top 16 Mid-Major schools for basketball recruiting in 2017, you won't find a Big West school in the list. You will find two WAC schools, four WCC schools and San Diego State. The trend is not good for the Big West. UCSD was not the school the Big West needed at this time.

The Big West had an unusually good season in 2016 and an unusually bad season in 2017. They are probably somewhere in between as a conference. In 2018, the WAC and the Big West will be playing conference games in the same city, Riverside.

CBU is moving into a new arena that will open in May. UCR plays in an older, smaller facility. CBU had better attendance than UCR as a D2 school. They will have a bigger budget. The WAC games will be more entertaining, especially when schools like NMSU and GCU come to Riverside. The WAC is CBU and the Big West is UCR. One is growing and the future looks bright. The other is just okay with a future that looks very much the same as today.


So how does the WAC as a conference sell itself to UCSD? Why are we better than the Big West
04-07-2017 10:46 AM
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gleadley Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
The WAC doesn't have to pitch itself against BW to UCSD. Hurd needs to pitch the WAC against remaining D2. UCSD has no other D1 option at this point, do they?
04-07-2017 11:01 AM
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jdgaucho Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
Bigger markets and travel all around the west would work for just about any D2 call ups - except UC San Diego. You think Denver's snobby? UC San Diego would probably throw up at the thought of Grand Canyon, UMKC, Chicago State and Utah Valley. Not quite their academic peers.

I guess we'll see how much they really want D1 athletics.
04-07-2017 11:01 AM
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jdgaucho Offline
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
For the record, I see GCU's potential so their academics don't matter much to me. The academics excuse went out the window after Boise was invited in 2012.

And yes, I am a UCSB alum.
04-07-2017 11:03 AM
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-07-2017 01:45 AM)Stugray2 Wrote:  
(04-07-2017 01:30 AM)ThunderDan49 Wrote:  The only P12 big wig that doesn't want to play GCU is ASU's. Majerle said earlier this week in an interview that the U of A head coach was more than willing to play us again, as long as it was down in Tuscon again (likely cause the Havocs that did travel down to Tuscon were already disruptive enough).
Publicly

The UC Chancellors look down on BYU and Baylor. Big Difference between the Chancellors and the ADs who simply want good opponents. If you think the UC Chancellors are a little bit left wing, you have way over estimated influence of conservative concepts on them; they are much further left and anti-faith and anti-profit (other than for themselves, which is simply justified compensation they rationalize) than you can imagine.

I think everyone should look down at Baylor.
04-07-2017 11:12 AM
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RE: Big West rejects UC San Diego
(04-07-2017 11:01 AM)gleadley Wrote:  The WAC doesn't have to pitch itself against BW to UCSD. Hurd needs to pitch the WAC against remaining D2. UCSD has no other D1 option at this point, do they?

This is the truth. Show that there is more to a D1 WAC than remaining behind in the D2 shadows.
04-07-2017 11:28 AM
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