Just curious what's going on at Memphis. I'd rather not visit MT.org. What's the outlook? Trending up? Down? Too early to say?
Frankly speaking I expected Memphis to go a different direction than a retread. All that said, I'd be thrilled to have him at ECU which isn't saying much.
(04-05-2017 02:13 PM)Hood-rich Wrote: Just curious what's going on at Memphis. I'd rather not visit MT.org. What's the outlook? Trending up? Down? Too early to say?
Frankly speaking I expected Memphis to go a different direction than a retread. All that said, I'd be thrilled to have him at ECU which isn't saying much.
To be fair, Tubby isn't a retread as the term is really known. Tubby was hired away from Texas Tech after leading them to the NCAA tournament. They tried hard to keep him, offering him a lifetime contract.
The retread term typically is applied to veteran coaches who failed at their last stop, or didn't meet expectations, and its believed they'll be a better fit elsewhere.
(04-05-2017 02:13 PM)Hood-rich Wrote: Just curious what's going on at Memphis. I'd rather not visit MT.org. What's the outlook? Trending up? Down? Too early to say?
Frankly speaking I expected Memphis to go a different direction than a retread. All that said, I'd be thrilled to have him at ECU which isn't saying much.
MT.org hates him.
I think he could have been good. But the culture and the issues around the program are too toxic. He hasn't handle them well either. Local Media has been against him from day one because he just doesn't deal with them.
Hopefully, he can build good pieces for the next coach. But he's more than likely gone in two years.
I think Tubby will have Memphis respectable once he gets his guys in there. Keep him there long enough and he will make the NCAA tournament.
The real issue is his guys aren't typically the stud recruits that Calipari and to a lesser extent Pastner were landing.
Memphis is a different type of job. You have to have a coach that is willing to play ball with the city's HS and AAU coaches AND that will be out in the city marketing the program. Tubby has shown no inclination to do any of those things.
(04-05-2017 02:38 PM)aTxTIGER Wrote: Memphis is a different type of job. You have to have a coach that is willing to play ball with the city's HS and AAU coaches AND that will be out in the city marketing the program. Tubby has shown no inclination to do any of those things.
Georgetown just hired Ewing, do you think Hardaway could be next at Memphis? What you just laid out is in his wheelhouse. Who do Memphis fans prefer over Tubby?
Well I don't think things are trending up for Tubby in Memphis right now.. Had a down year and just lost 2 of their best 3 guys (regardless of their attitudes). Tubby is a good coach though. If he really puts in the effort and time on the trail Memphis should be in solid shape in 18-19 or 19-20.
I remember Penny's name came up in the last coaching cycle. If Tubby is an ultimate failure, I think Penny would be the way to go. Has Penny ever wanted to be an asst. coach?
(04-05-2017 02:38 PM)aTxTIGER Wrote: Memphis is a different type of job. You have to have a coach that is willing to play ball with the city's HS and AAU coaches AND that will be out in the city marketing the program. Tubby has shown no inclination to do any of those things.
No offense is meant by this statement and I know that we're an albatross. BUT.. IMHO that's why y'all can't advance in the tournament. Memphis relies too much on raw talent / out "street balling" their competition. I especially felt this way when you had Calipari and Pastner. Calipari just had OVERWHELMING talent, especially for CUSA.
Contrast that style to Cincy and SMU who in my opinion play more fundamentally based basketball with above average talent. Who is having more sucess?
Maybe you need a Tubby Smith type of coach. I'm not sure the raw talent approach works at the non P5 level unless it's a special situation (Memphis + Cal / CUSA).
(This post was last modified: 04-05-2017 03:24 PM by Hood-rich.)
(04-05-2017 02:38 PM)aTxTIGER Wrote: Memphis is a different type of job. You have to have a coach that is willing to play ball with the city's HS and AAU coaches AND that will be out in the city marketing the program. Tubby has shown no inclination to do any of those things.
No offense is meant by this statement and I know that we're an albatross. BUT.. IMHO that's why y'all can't advance in the tournament. Memphis relies too much on raw talent / out "street balling" their competition. I especially felt this way when you had Calipari and Pastner. Calipari just had OVERWHELMING talent, especially for CUSA.
Contrast that style to Cincy and SMU who in my opinion play more fundamentally based basketball with above average talent. Who is having more sucess?
Maybe you need a Tubby Smith type of coach. I'm not sure the raw talent approach works at the non P5 level unless it's a special situation (Memphis + Cal / CUSA).
The fans and media won't allow it. The pressure on the kids here is insane. Completely toxic for the local kids.
(04-05-2017 02:38 PM)aTxTIGER Wrote: Memphis is a different type of job. You have to have a coach that is willing to play ball with the city's HS and AAU coaches AND that will be out in the city marketing the program. Tubby has shown no inclination to do any of those things.
No offense is meant by this statement and I know that we're an albatross. BUT.. IMHO that's why y'all can't advance in the tournament. Memphis relies too much on raw talent / out "street balling" their competition. I especially felt this way when you had Calipari and Pastner. Calipari just had OVERWHELMING talent, especially for CUSA.
Contrast that style to Cincy and SMU who in my opinion play more fundamentally based basketball with above average talent. Who is having more sucess?
Maybe you need a Tubby Smith type of coach. I'm not sure the raw talent approach works at the non P5 level unless it's a special situation (Memphis + Cal / CUSA).
The fans and media won't allow it. The pressure on the kids here is insane. Completely toxic for the local kids.
So they feel entitled to being a feeder program for Tiger basketball?
(04-05-2017 02:38 PM)aTxTIGER Wrote: Memphis is a different type of job. You have to have a coach that is willing to play ball with the city's HS and AAU coaches AND that will be out in the city marketing the program. Tubby has shown no inclination to do any of those things.
No offense is meant by this statement and I know that we're an albatross. BUT.. IMHO that's why y'all can't advance in the tournament. Memphis relies too much on raw talent / out "street balling" their competition. I especially felt this way when you had Calipari and Pastner. Calipari just had OVERWHELMING talent, especially for CUSA.
Contrast that style to Cincy and SMU who in my opinion play more fundamentally based basketball with above average talent. Who is having more sucess?
Maybe you need a Tubby Smith type of coach. I'm not sure the raw talent approach works at the non P5 level unless it's a special situation (Memphis + Cal / CUSA).
(04-05-2017 02:25 PM)FlyingTiger2016 Wrote: the culture and the issues around the program are too toxic.
Can you expand on this? That sounds really bad regarding whether or not Memphis can return to form.
The locker room was a mess, and the fan base is intense. Locker room issues are a holdover from Pastner, but honestly not exactly his fault. I blame his numerous assistants.
The locker room issues will be fixed. Tubby will leave a clean program for the next coach. Unless Jamal Johnson is the next Steph Curry, I don't think Tubby can last after year 3. He's going to have a roster of JUCOs next year, and he would have to hit on all of them.
Post Tubby. There's is a question if we will recruit local as well in the future, but you can built a decent program with the second tier talent in the city. There's a crazy amount of talent in the 1-3 range in this city.
It's sad because you could win a national title with all the talent in this city for the next 3 years. 2019 could easily have 3 top twenty players in the county.
(04-05-2017 02:38 PM)aTxTIGER Wrote: Memphis is a different type of job. You have to have a coach that is willing to play ball with the city's HS and AAU coaches AND that will be out in the city marketing the program. Tubby has shown no inclination to do any of those things.
No offense is meant by this statement and I know that we're an albatross. BUT.. IMHO that's why y'all can't advance in the tournament. Memphis relies too much on raw talent / out "street balling" their competition. I especially felt this way when you had Calipari and Pastner. Calipari just had OVERWHELMING talent, especially for CUSA.
Contrast that style to Cincy and SMU who in my opinion play more fundamentally based basketball with above average talent. Who is having more sucess?
Maybe you need a Tubby Smith type of coach. I'm not sure the raw talent approach works at the non P5 level unless it's a special situation (Memphis + Cal / CUSA).
Street balling? Jeez.
SMH. At least you didnt say thugball.
What? Out athlete-ing, not as organized offensively, more reliant on fast breaks, etc... how about that? I've played both, most people know what I mean when I say that. They don't come much whiter than me and I grew up on blacktops.
(This post was last modified: 04-05-2017 04:13 PM by Hood-rich.)
(04-05-2017 04:04 PM)Hood-rich Wrote: Well, if he's fired I hope ECU can land him.
He'd be great at ECU. He's a good coach. But he just doesnt fit at Memphis. He's unwilling to build relationships with people you need to build relationships with at this job.
(04-05-2017 04:04 PM)Hood-rich Wrote: Well, if he's fired I hope ECU can land him.
He'd be great at ECU. He's a good coach. But he just doesnt fit at Memphis. He's unwilling to build relationships with people you need to build relationships with at this job.
Tubby would have been a much better fit in Memphis following Calipari. The brand was at an all-time high and he would be beating local kids off with a stick to play for the Tigers.
Josh took his toll on the Tigers brand. It was played out in the media and it was not pretty. Tubby doesn't have the advantages that Pastner had when he took the job.
I believe Tubby will get the job done. I'd love to see him hire a top notch recruiter. However, its looking like he's falling back on what he knows in terms of procuring players. It's not easy to recruit to a place like Lubbock, Texas.
(04-05-2017 02:38 PM)aTxTIGER Wrote: Memphis is a different type of job. You have to have a coach that is willing to play ball with the city's HS and AAU coaches AND that will be out in the city marketing the program. Tubby has shown no inclination to do any of those things.
No offense is meant by this statement and I know that we're an albatross. BUT.. IMHO that's why y'all can't advance in the tournament. Memphis relies too much on raw talent / out "street balling" their competition. I especially felt this way when you had Calipari and Pastner. Calipari just had OVERWHELMING talent, especially for CUSA.
Contrast that style to Cincy and SMU who in my opinion play more fundamentally based basketball with above average talent. Who is having more sucess?
Maybe you need a Tubby Smith type of coach. I'm not sure the raw talent approach works at the non P5 level unless it's a special situation (Memphis + Cal / CUSA).
(04-05-2017 02:38 PM)aTxTIGER Wrote: Memphis is a different type of job. You have to have a coach that is willing to play ball with the city's HS and AAU coaches AND that will be out in the city marketing the program. Tubby has shown no inclination to do any of those things.
No offense is meant by this statement and I know that we're an albatross. BUT.. IMHO that's why y'all can't advance in the tournament. Memphis relies too much on raw talent / out "street balling" their competition. I especially felt this way when you had Calipari and Pastner. Calipari just had OVERWHELMING talent, especially for CUSA.
Contrast that style to Cincy and SMU who in my opinion play more fundamentally based basketball with above average talent. Who is having more sucess?
Maybe you need a Tubby Smith type of coach. I'm not sure the raw talent approach works at the non P5 level unless it's a special situation (Memphis + Cal / CUSA).
(04-05-2017 04:04 PM)Hood-rich Wrote: Well, if he's fired I hope ECU can land him.
He'd be great at ECU. He's a good coach. But he just doesnt fit at Memphis. He's unwilling to build relationships with people you need to build relationships with at this job.
Tubby would have been a much better fit in Memphis following Calipari. The brand was at an all-time high and he would be beating local kids off with a stick to play for the Tigers.
Josh took his toll on the Tigers brand. It was played out in the media and it was not pretty. Tubby doesn't have the advantages that Pastner had when he took the job.
I believe Tubby will get the job done. I'd love to see him hire a top notch recruiter. However, its looking like he's falling back on what he knows in terms of procuring players. It's not easy to recruit to a place like Lubbock, Texas.
Before Cal, Tigers teams were heavily local, but Cal didnt recruit Memphis. He went the national prep school route. Pastner actually recruited well with Memphis kids--at one point 4 or so years ago, all 5 starters were local and he had at least 1 top ten class. The problem with Pastner wasn't his recruiting, it was his coaching. which ultimately cost him recruits his last two years of course.
(This post was last modified: 04-06-2017 09:57 AM by cotton1991.)
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