Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
Buffalo drops four sports
Author Message
Bookmark and Share
Bull_Is_Back Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 6,047
Joined: Oct 2016
Reputation: 541
I Root For: Buffalo
Location:
Post: #61
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
(04-15-2017 02:52 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(04-14-2017 12:42 PM)kreed5120 Wrote:  The caliber of education one receives at community colleges or a branch campus isn't the same level of quality that one receives at a main campus and we both know that.
Certainly not. You go to the main campus of a research University, and you take your University requirement classes from a TA who was picked for their promise as a future researcher, not for their teaching prowess.

That was not my experience.... I had one class taught by a TA, I was a summer session of an algorithms course.

At UB the TA's did (1) lab classes and (2) most of the office hours, though you could get to the professors more limited hours if you needed him.

Maybe Akron is different.

Quote:I don't know what is the matter with the Wayne branch campus of Akron, but in most branch campuses, your odds of having an experienced professor with a commitment to teaching for a freshman class is higher than at the main campus.

Citation?

EDIT: You know, on further review I think several of my geneds were taught by TA's... So maybe for non major track courses you have a point.
(This post was last modified: 04-17-2017 07:54 PM by Bull_Is_Back.)
04-17-2017 07:53 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
kreed5120 Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,096
Joined: Feb 2016
Reputation: 54
I Root For: Akron
Location:
Post: #62
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
At Akron the only 2 classes that I remember having TA's for were public speaking and sociology. There might have been 1-2 others. Overall any course of significant value to my degree was taught by an actual professor. Bruce is definitely exaggerating the number of TA's used, at least at Akron between the years of 2007-2012 when I attended. In fact, several of my gen eds in addition to having a professor also had sit-in TA's who would observe the class then would be available for private tutoring during office hours. I'm not sure where Bruce attended. Maybe all his gen eds were taught be TA's there. I kind of just let him go with it as I didn't find it important enough to the conversation to dispute.
(This post was last modified: 04-17-2017 11:21 PM by kreed5120.)
04-17-2017 11:11 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
BruceMcF Online
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 13,108
Joined: Jan 2013
Reputation: 763
I Root For: Reds/Buckeyes/.
Location:
Post: #63
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
(04-17-2017 07:53 PM)Bull_Is_Back Wrote:  
(04-15-2017 02:52 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(04-14-2017 12:42 PM)kreed5120 Wrote:  The caliber of education one receives at community colleges or a branch campus isn't the same level of quality that one receives at a main campus and we both know that.
Certainly not. You go to the main campus of a research University, and you take your University requirement classes from a TA who was picked for their promise as a future researcher, not for their teaching prowess.

That was not my experience.... I had one class taught by a TA, I was a summer session of an algorithms course.

At UB the TA's did (1) lab classes and (2) most of the office hours, though you could get to the professors more limited hours if you needed him.

Maybe Akron is different.
Maybe I'm being too vague when talking about "TA's" and "professor" ... I was really thinking of all instructors and adjuncts when I was writing "TA's".

Speaking from the other side of that job market, there may be more of those than some students may suspect:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/noodleeduca...-you-care/
https://www.aaup.org/article/who-are-par...PXK1WclGUk
https://www.aaup.org/issues/contingency/...ound-facts
04-18-2017 03:16 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Bull_Is_Back Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 6,047
Joined: Oct 2016
Reputation: 541
I Root For: Buffalo
Location:
Post: #64
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
(04-18-2017 03:16 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  Maybe I'm being too vague when talking about "TA's" and "professor" ... I was really thinking of all instructors and adjuncts when I was writing "TA's".

Ok well I am sure there are more adjunct's but Adjunct is not a title that reflects at all on the professors expertise or teaching experience. It is, in the end, just an employment relationship status.

They may not have been at that institution very long, or are "semi retired", or simply love to teach but make more in private industry.

My graduate Computer Vision instructor was an adjunct

http://www.cse.buffalo.edu/people/?u=peter

And it was one of the most enjoyable and informative classes I took in the course of my Degree.

FWIW I've been an adjunct instructor but not at the University level, so yes, CC and branch campuses use them as well. If I left my job to be an instructor I'd likely take a huge pay cut.

Quote:Speaking from the other side of that job market, there may be more of those than some students may suspect:

I'm sure there are.... But Adjunct instructors are often at Universities for decades (I took computer vision back in the late 90's and he's still there).
04-18-2017 09:41 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
kreed5120 Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,096
Joined: Feb 2016
Reputation: 54
I Root For: Akron
Location:
Post: #65
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
It's not fair to categorize adjunct professors as lesser because they don't have tenure. I had some really great professors who had full-time 8-5 jobs and taught 1-2 classes on the side. I had some tenure professors that were absolutely terrible. In all I attended college for 5 years acquiring 2 majors and my favorite professor was an adjunct professor who taught retirement planning. He was a big shot at Fidelity and brought real world experiences to the classroom. His course was very challenging, but informative. He taught because he wanted to give back to the community, not because he was looking for a paycheck.
04-18-2017 11:35 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
BruceMcF Online
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 13,108
Joined: Jan 2013
Reputation: 763
I Root For: Reds/Buckeyes/.
Location:
Post: #66
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
(04-18-2017 11:35 AM)kreed5120 Wrote:  It's not fair to categorize adjunct professors as lesser because they don't have tenure. I had some really great professors who had full-time 8-5 jobs and taught 1-2 classes on the side.
I'm not characterizing adjunct professors as lesser because they don't have tenure ... but the statistics you see there about the growing share of adjunct and other non-tenured faculty is not about a big jump in the number of experienced professionals in various fields that teach one or two classes on the side ... it is the growing number of faculty that have the equivalent of full time work but are treated as part time employees. I'm not a less qualified or experienced University lecturer when I am employed as an instructor on a course at a time basis than when I am employed full time on an ongoing basis, but I'm definitely in a position to do a better job for students in a full time, ongoing position.

And there is also the difference between full time, ongoing academic staff, where the faculty that are focused on research and look on teaching as a chore that is unpleasant for both them and for the students tend to cluster at the main campuses of the higher ranking Universities.

Never mind every University being different ... every department is different ... and every department changes over time ... so there is obviously no simple, mechanical rule that applies to every case, but I continue to maintain that a high school student who blindly assumes, as was suggested above in this thread, that going to a branch campus for their first two years automatically means they are getting a lower quality of education is likely to be making a mistake.
04-18-2017 11:51 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
kreed5120 Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,096
Joined: Feb 2016
Reputation: 54
I Root For: Akron
Location:
Post: #67
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
(04-18-2017 11:51 PM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(04-18-2017 11:35 AM)kreed5120 Wrote:  It's not fair to categorize adjunct professors as lesser because they don't have tenure. I had some really great professors who had full-time 8-5 jobs and taught 1-2 classes on the side.
but I continue to maintain that a high school student who blindly assumes, as was suggested above in this thread, that going to a branch campus for their first two years automatically means they are getting a lower quality of education is likely to be making a mistake.

How many times do I have to spell this out for you? Once again I was stating a 4 year degree at a branch campus < a 4 year degree from a main campus. People were stating students could avoid main campuses altogether to avoid the higher fees and I stated they would be walking away with a lower quality education. By you stating students should transfer after two years to the main campus, you are agreeing that avoiding main campuses altogether really isn't the best of options and for many majors isn't even feasible.

I have no problem with students filling their gen ed requirements at a branch campus to keep costs down. Financially that is the smart thing to do. They still at some point need to transfer to the main campus to achieve their best education possible.

I never stated which has the better gen ed offerings, nor do I really care. Sociology, astronomy, humanities, etc. have added no value to my degree. Taking those courses someplace cheaper alone would be enough to justify someone attending a branch campus.
(This post was last modified: 04-19-2017 06:57 AM by kreed5120.)
04-19-2017 06:23 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
thanksjim Offline
All American
*

Posts: 3,157
Joined: Mar 2008
Reputation: 23
I Root For: KSU
Location:
Post: #68
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
With Buffalo and Akron cutting baseball, I feel KSU should look into finding a new conference in baseball only.
04-21-2017 07:41 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Ohio Poly Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 2,369
Joined: Nov 2015
Reputation: 8
I Root For: Ohio Poly
Location:
Post: #69
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
(04-21-2017 07:41 AM)thanksjim Wrote:  With Buffalo and Akron cutting baseball, I feel KSU should look into finding a new conference in baseball only.

I would recommend looking to the south where the early spring weather is more favorable...
04-21-2017 10:28 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
emu steve Offline
Legend
*

Posts: 39,475
Joined: Jan 2004
Reputation: 83
I Root For: EMU / MAC
Location: DMV - D.C. area
Post: #70
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
(04-03-2017 09:11 AM)BullBoy Wrote:  This is sad, but it is a reality in college athletics and UB was forced to save money so they found the sports that the MAC sponsors, but doesn't have a strong field in (which i mean from a numbers standpoint)... Rowing was just us and EMU.. Soccer was just four full MAC members, men's swimming is similar to soccer, and baseball we just don't have the facility to compete... Once Akron dropped baseballl, I knew we weren't far behind.

We have a lot of unhappy alums today, but college athletics is a business as much as we like that or not and this was a business decision that needed to be made.

Just re-reading:

I wonder IF (IF, IF) EMU would drop rowing? It almost seems like a sport for Title IX reasons.

It would require dropping a men's sport as well for Title IX considerations.
(This post was last modified: 04-22-2017 01:18 PM by emu steve.)
04-22-2017 01:17 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
uakronkid Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 5,824
Joined: Dec 2006
Reputation: 48
I Root For: Akron
Location: Akron
Post: #71
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
If it weren't for needing to fund baseball, MAC teams could become lacrosse powerhouses.
04-22-2017 05:59 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
axeme Offline
Sage
*

Posts: 20,022
Joined: May 2002
Reputation: 125
I Root For: hoops
Location: Location: Location:

Folding@NCAAbbsDonatorsCrappiesCrappiesCrappiesCrappiesCrappies
Post: #72
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
So Akron is adding lacrosse since they dropped baseball?

KSU is adding varsity lacrosse for 2018-19, but is not dropping any sports, especially not baseball. That will raise KSU to 19 sports.
04-22-2017 07:50 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
uakronkid Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 5,824
Joined: Dec 2006
Reputation: 48
I Root For: Akron
Location: Akron
Post: #73
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
Akron's probably not adding any new sports for a while. Lacrosse would be at the top of my list. We have a strong club program.
04-22-2017 08:24 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
zrb2 Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,367
Joined: Apr 2003
Reputation: 16
I Root For: U at Buffalo
Location: Maryland
Post: #74
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
UB men's swimming is not going underwater without a fight. The alumni are trying to put a plan together to save the program...and if not, a lawsuit is planned.

http://buffalonews.com/2017/05/09/ub-swi...t-planned/
05-10-2017 12:04 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
BullBoy Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,206
Joined: Feb 2005
Reputation: 10
I Root For: Buffalo
Location:
Post: #75
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
(05-10-2017 12:04 PM)zrb2 Wrote:  UB men's swimming is not going underwater without a fight. The alumni are trying to put a plan together to save the program...and if not, a lawsuit is planned.

http://buffalonews.com/2017/05/09/ub-swi...t-planned/

If they win this and can endow the men's swimming program, then they will actually have to endow another women's sport as well to remain Title IX compliant.
05-10-2017 01:19 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
BruceMcF Online
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 13,108
Joined: Jan 2013
Reputation: 763
I Root For: Reds/Buckeyes/.
Location:
Post: #76
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
(05-10-2017 01:19 PM)BullBoy Wrote:  
(05-10-2017 12:04 PM)zrb2 Wrote:  UB men's swimming is not going underwater without a fight. The alumni are trying to put a plan together to save the program...and if not, a lawsuit is planned.

http://buffalonews.com/2017/05/09/ub-swi...t-planned/

If they win this and can endow the men's swimming program, then they will actually have to endow another women's sport as well to remain Title IX compliant.
It would seem to be most straightforward would be to endow men & women's swimming.
05-11-2017 07:49 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
BullBoy Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,206
Joined: Feb 2005
Reputation: 10
I Root For: Buffalo
Location:
Post: #77
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
(05-11-2017 07:49 AM)BruceMcF Wrote:  
(05-10-2017 01:19 PM)BullBoy Wrote:  
(05-10-2017 12:04 PM)zrb2 Wrote:  UB men's swimming is not going underwater without a fight. The alumni are trying to put a plan together to save the program...and if not, a lawsuit is planned.

http://buffalonews.com/2017/05/09/ub-swi...t-planned/

If they win this and can endow the men's swimming program, then they will actually have to endow another women's sport as well to remain Title IX compliant.
It would seem to be most straightforward would be to endow men & women's swimming.

But women's swimming didn't get cut.. So if you move women's swimming to an endowment, then your Title IX numbers are still all off.
05-11-2017 08:53 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
axeme Offline
Sage
*

Posts: 20,022
Joined: May 2002
Reputation: 125
I Root For: hoops
Location: Location: Location:

Folding@NCAAbbsDonatorsCrappiesCrappiesCrappiesCrappiesCrappies
Post: #78
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
So all four sports cut were men's? Was UB that far from compliance that it needed to cut that many men's scholarships? Was there women's rowing?
05-11-2017 05:55 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
BullBoy Offline
1st String
*

Posts: 1,206
Joined: Feb 2005
Reputation: 10
I Root For: Buffalo
Location:
Post: #79
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
Yes women's rowing was cut along with three men's sports. Rowing had one of the largest budgets due to the size of the program so it took three men's sports to balance the Title IX numbers associated with rowing.
05-11-2017 07:43 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
BruceMcF Online
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 13,108
Joined: Jan 2013
Reputation: 763
I Root For: Reds/Buckeyes/.
Location:
Post: #80
RE: Buffalo drops four sports
(05-11-2017 08:53 AM)BullBoy Wrote:  But women's swimming didn't get cut.. So if you move women's swimming to an endowment, then your Title IX numbers are still all off.
OK, then if women's sport are so close to full scholarship limits they cannot take up the slack, endow men & women's swimming & shift its budget subsidy to women's lacrosse.
05-12-2017 12:37 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2024 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024 MyBB Group.