https://twitter.com/ToddMilewski/status/...3167416327

Baseball and women's hockey in successive years. They ain't messing around.

More complete story http://www.grandforksherald.com/sports/4...ens-hockey

NCAA needs some serious reforms in how athletics is run. Too much red ink out there. States are starting to push back on the open check books. To keep up with the Jones, all the secondary sports are being cut to run the circus' main event.

http://www.grandforksherald.com/sports/4...ens-hockey

Some administrators insisted in the past that the women's hockey team play in the main 12k arena, rather than an adjoining 1k OLYMPIC arena. Even Wisco and Minnie play in smaller venues. This will create many weekends where that venue can create revenue with concerts and BB games. With many Euros and Canadians on scholarship, it was expensive but still produced Olympians The coach was paid more than men's basketball. Women's hockey averaged nearly 1000 at UND, which was fourth in the nation, but didn't produce revenue or championships.

M/W swimming also appears to be cut. Would have rather seen M/W tennis cut, but the Big Sky will punish us if we don't sponsor it for one more year. We're down to 17 sports it appears. If the endowment drive for men's golf doesn't meet its goal, it will be 16 sports. Baseball was cut last spring.

If WH is really being cut how does that affect UND's title 9 requirements? Do they need to add a sport? I have to admit, I'm really surprised that they cut a hockey program. That said, Women's Hockey is not a closely watched sport, at the college level or national team level.

(03-29-2017 02:44 PM)NoDak Wrote:  http://www.grandforksherald.com/sports/4...ens-hockey

Some administrators insisted in the past that the women's hockey team play in the main 12k arena, rather than an adjoining 1k OLYMPIC arena. Even Wisco and Minnie play in smaller venues. This will create many weekends where that venue can create revenue with concerts and BB games. With many Euros and Canadians on scholarship, it was expensive but still produced Olympians The coach was paid more than men's basketball. Women's hockey averaged nearly 1000 at UND, which was fourth in the nation, but didn't produce revenue or championships.

M/W swimming also appears to be cut. Would have rather seen M/W tennis cut, but the Big Sky will punish us if we don't sponsor it for one more year. We're down to 17 sports it appears.

(03-29-2017 02:34 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  More complete story http://www.grandforksherald.com/sports/4...ens-hockey

NCAA needs some serious reforms in how athletics is run. Too much red ink out there. States are starting to push back on the open check books. To keep up with the Jones, all the secondary sports are being cut to run the circus' main event.

You have to blame the greed of the P5 and the sports networks that caused this issue. P5 created all these rules and hoops for everybody to follow to a point it is even biting themselves in the behind. The major reforms is do away with all these rules and start over. Second, reform conferences into regional conference. Third, Take the top half of D2, and merged with D1. 4th. Merged the other half of D2 with D3. 4th, allow the public NAIA schools to be duel membership with the NCAA and NAIA. It could get exposure for the NAIA schools.

(03-29-2017 02:54 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(03-29-2017 02:34 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  More complete story http://www.grandforksherald.com/sports/4...ens-hockey

NCAA needs some serious reforms in how athletics is run. Too much red ink out there. States are starting to push back on the open check books. To keep up with the Jones, all the secondary sports are being cut to run the circus' main event.

You have to blame the greed of the P5 and the sports networks that caused this issue. P5 created all these rules and hoops for everybody to follow to a point it is even biting themselves in the behind. The major reforms is do away with all these rules and start over. Second, reform conferences into regional conference. Third, Take the top half of D2, and merged with D1. 4th. Merged the other half of D2 with D3. 4th, allow the public NAIA schools to be duel membership with the NCAA and NAIA. It could get exposure for the NAIA schools.

Just too many problems with this to take seriously.

(03-29-2017 02:53 PM)jacksfan29 Wrote:  If WH is really being cut how does that affect UND's title 9 requirements? Do they need to add a sport? I have to admit, I'm really surprised that they cut a hockey program. That said, Women's Hockey is not a closely watched sport, at the college level or national team level.

Believe it or not....

Quote:How will this decision impact UND’s Title IX compliance? Providing gender-equitable participation opportunities weighed heavily in UND’s decision. Following last year’s elimination of baseball, as expected male student-athletes were under-represented within the UND Athletics Department in 2016-17. The current changes will re-balance the UND Athletics Department so that UND will continue to comply in 2017-18 with Title IX’s participation requirements. Additionally, the changes are balanced so that UND will continue to comply with Title IX’s scholarship provisions as UND implements the funding changes required for membership in the Summit League

Ironic, huh?

UND athletics had to make up a projected $1.3 million deficit that had to be cut.

Womens hockey ran a $1.45 million deficit
Womens Swimming & Diving had a $0.55 million deficit
Men S & D lost $ 0.33 million

Each of them generated less than $40 k in revenue

The swimming pool needs major capital upgrades, as it is 40 years old.
The weekends that used to be women's hockey can now be revenue weekends for concerts and bb.

With all team sports in the Big Sky having won it's championships there, spending on each of those sports can be increased.

UND is majority male (~53%) due to strong male enrollment in its aerospace and engineering schools offsetting nursing, so Title IX is not hard to meet like at some schools.

Western Kentucky was in the same boat when it moved to FBS.

Strange that the B1G doesn't have women's hockey. The Michigan's and Notre Dame don't offer it. The WCHA offers womens hockey, but it only contains two members on both mens and womens side: Bemidji St and Minn St-Mankato. Ohio St, Minnie and Wisco of the B1G play womens there, and St Cloud St and Minn-Duluth and UND play there too on the womens side. Penn St is in a separate league with schools like Robert Morris, Syracuse, Mercyhurst, Canisius, Niagara and Lindenwood. Would make sense for Lindenwood or Penn St to move over to the WCHA now or Ohio St to move to the CAA. The women's WCHA is almost all powerful, as UMD, UM, and UW have won all the NCAA championships except for two by Clarkson. UND was almost always a bridesmaid to the NCAA tournament.

If there is any plans to start a B1G women's league without UND, that could have doomed UND's sponsorship, as we would be left in with DII Minnesota schools. Last fall when all sports were reviewed, eight sports were specifically exempted, including women's hockey. Something must have changed. The legislature cut higher ed funding even more because of oil prices, so more cuts were needed.

(03-29-2017 06:46 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  Western Kentucky was in the same boat when it moved to FBS.

Still expecting a major gifted capital announcements by this summer. Our old bb arena and swimming complex might be demolished then, making way for hopefully new on campus athletic facilities, offices, weight lighting space, etc.

- If Big Ten wanted to sponsor women's hockey, it would've done so. That's never happening because only Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Ohio St have it in the WCHA (with Penn St in a smaller conf).

Don't think that hurts UND joining at all.

- I'm fine with these cuts. Like you said, pool renovations, it was only a 25m pool anyway, and now the old gym can be torn down. WHCY very expensive without much to show for it, and frees up dates in the main arena, again like you said.

- Now aligns NDSU and UND sports offerings with the exceptions of:

UND - has M/W Tennis and M hockey
NDSU - has baseball and wrestling

- Tennis and golf are cheap. Just need clubs/racquets and balls. Practice off-campus.

The US Dept of Education has a specific website tracking Title IX related data (participation vs enrollment).

For UND (2015-16 reported data):

Full-time undergrad enrollment:
Male - 4902 (54%)
Female - 4159 (46%)

Unduplicated Participant Count:
Male - 245 (53.6%) ... including 22 Swim & 29 Baseball
Female - 212 (46.4%) ... including 35 Swim & 25 Hockey

... removing the participants from the dropped sports:
Male - 194 (56.1%)
Female - 152 (43.9%)

(03-29-2017 08:22 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  - If Big Ten wanted to sponsor women's hockey, it would've done so. That's never happening because only Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Ohio St have it in the WCHA (with Penn St in a smaller conf).

Don't think that hurts UND joining at all.

- I'm fine with these cuts. Like you said, pool renovations, it was only a 25m pool anyway, and now the old gym can be torn down. WHCY very expensive without much to show for it, and frees up dates in the main arena, again like you said.

- Now aligns NDSU and UND sports offerings with the exceptions of:

UND - has M/W Tennis and M hockey
NDSU - has baseball and wrestling

- Tennis and golf are cheap. Just need clubs/racquets and balls. Practice off-campus.

Mpls:

The old field house was quite a complex in its day. Had a 25 yd pool on one side with HPER offices, the basketball space had an indoor 160 yd indoor track, and later they built a 50 m pool with racquet ball courts on the other side. Since it was an alleyway from the football stadium and a short distance from the olde hockey barn, it was the center of UND athletics for a couple generations. Most of the state high school championships used to be staged there, many events and conventions, and hosted Presidents like JFK and Reagan for speeches. It was looked at remodeling the space for a student wellness center, but it has asbestos, so it was cheaper to build from scratch.

(03-29-2017 08:28 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  The US Dept of Education has a specific website tracking Title IX related data (participation vs enrollment).

For UND (2015-16 reported data):

Full-time undergrad enrollment:
Male - 4902 (54%)
Female - 4159 (46%)

Unduplicated Participant Count:
Male - 245 (53.6%) ... including 22 Swim & 29 Baseball
Female - 212 (46.4%) ... including 35 Swim & 25 Hockey

... removing the participants from the dropped sports:
Male - 194 (56.1%)
Female - 152 (43.9%)

Womens T&F and X Country aren't at their maxes even now. If we had too, just add beach volleyball. Practically all the facilities are new, and our 300 m indoor track/fb practice center is just in its first year. There is no reason that Volleyball should not be on par with Wichita St or UNi going forward, so why not augment the program with beach scholarship players.

Love hockey. Love women's tennis, volleyball, beach volleyball, swimming, gymnastics. But women's hockey is just horrendous quality. I once read the Canada women's team played in a midget league and batted .500. That's hockey's equivalent of high school football. God bless any school that financially can make women's hockey work.

Summit has increased scholarship requirements above the Big Sky. Whatever savings will wind up meeting those requirements

Minnesota Gophers Women's Hockey

Revenues: $ 351 k
Expenses: $2377 k
Loss ($2026 k)

Minnesota women's hockey owns their own arena, so they can rent it out. Men's hockey makes about $1.8 million, so their total hockey programs don't break even. Minnesota leads the nation in women's hockey attendance, but they still lose $2 mill a year.

UND has just thrown in the towel in competing with the Gophers women's team, as there is no purpose in losing so much money for the sake of developing US, Canadian, and Euro Olympians. Only the games against the Gophers and Badgers attracted crowds of more than 2-3000, and that was by charging a single dollar for admission. Not a single full DI school will now compete in women's hockey outside the Big Ten west of Pennsylvania.

It's no wonder Minnesota DII's don't move to DI as most of them have huge money pits in DI women's hockey. Minn St-Moorhead had to fundraise for both men's and women's DI hockey for its state board to allow it. It only made 75% of the goal of nearly $30 mill, so the state said no. Women's hockey seems mandated by Minnesota authorities if a male team exists.

As long as P5 schools like the Gophers, Badgers and Buckeyes are willing to lose millions in the sport, they is nothing to gain but deficits for others.