In areas where the insurers are leaving the market place. Are these areas where
medicaid wasn't expanded? I know when Rubio got the GOP to remove the insurance corridors that hurt the ACA. The insurance companies are there to make a profit. It's going to be interesting where we find urselves in a year.

Damn, Mach, just enjoy your vacation.

(03-24-2017 08:17 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  In areas where the insurers are leaving the market place. Are these areas where
medicaid wasn't expanded? I know when Rubio got the GOP to remove the insurance corridors that hurt the ACA. The insurance companies are there to make a profit. It's going to be interesting where we find urselves in a year.

Tennessee has not expanded Medicaid.

Well I think you have your answer why people are leaving the market place. No?

Yes

Many of the states that refused to expand Medicaid did so on purpose because they didn't want Obamacare to have success. Despite this, 20 million more people still got insurance.

(03-24-2017 10:24 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  Yes

Many of the states that refused to expand Medicaid did so on purpose because they didn't want Obamacare to have success. Despite this, 20 million more people still got insurance.

Those 20 million new people with insurance...

Working Americans are paying for. And do you have a figure on the millions of people who's coverage went down but cost went up?

Can't just point to the number of people now with coverage and say wow that's great. You also need to look at all of those that already had insurance and how they were affected.

Lets get real about what mandated coverage will do. It ALWAYS drives up the price for those paying for it. Just it did with mandated car insurance. Cost of getting it skyrocket.. As a 22 year old I paid $6 a month for basic liability and $12 for full coverage. 30 years later, my 22 year old son pays $225 a month for full coverage. I had a $50 deductible and he has $1,000.

If we really want everyone to have insurance we need to stop driving up cost for silly trips to the doctor and hospital...

stop taking little Johnny to the doctor for a common cold...nothing they can do anyways. Wait 5 to 7 days to see if his runny nose starts to dry up. We need for employers to stop requiring a doctors excuse for a missed day of work. If you trip or bang your elbow, foot, knee, don't run to a doctor just because it swells a little bit and hurts...

hurting and swelling is the bodies way of dealing with the injury. If after a week it doesn't get any better. Go to the doctor.

Unneeded trips to the doctor and hospital is what's driving up cost and the #1 reason insurance is not affordable for all.

A. Its not 20 million people. its about 11 million.

B. For the 11 million people who now get free insurance and subsidized healthcare, about 80 million people have lost access to affordable healthcare while facing skyrocketing insurance rates. Insurance that they must pay for that dont get to use.

Those 20 million new people with insurance...




Working Americans are paying for. And do you have a figure on the millions of people who's coverage went down but cost went up?

To some extent yes. But we would be paying their medical expenses anyway if they end up sick in the hospital. At least this way, they are paying a portion of the cost.



Lets get real about what mandated coverage will do. It ALWAYS drives up the price for those paying for it. Just it did with mandated car insurance. Cost of getting it skyrocket.. As a 22 year old I paid $6 a month for basic liability and $12 for full coverage. 30 years later, my 22 year old son pays $225 a month for full coverage. I had a $50 deductible and he has $1,000.

And inflation had nothing to do with that?

If we really want everyone to have insurance we need to stop driving up cost for silly trips to the doctor and hospital...

That can be fixed. In many other countries they have "gate keepers" which are clinic type places were they can diagnose and determine whether or not you actually need to see a doctor or just have some chicken soup and a nap.

stop taking little Johnny to the doctor for a common cold...nothing they can do anyways. Wait 5 to 7 days to see if his runny nose starts to dry up. We need for employers to stop requiring a doctors excuse for a missed day of work. If you trip bang your elbow don't run to a doctor just because it swells a little bit and hurts...

hurting and swelling is the bodies way of dealing with the injury. If after a week it doesn't get any better. Go to the doctor.

Unneeded trips to the doctor and hospital is what's driving up cost and the #1 reason insurance is not affordable for all.
[/quote]

On this we can agree.

Basically here's the problem, with the individual market:

it's the imperfect confluence of greedy insurance companies, looking to maximize profits, and consumers who are either poor or cheap a___es.


The requirements that the insurer's products have to provide, are basic human rights.

But they want too much money for them, and the consumers in that market either can't pay that much or refuse to because of ideology.



The employer market has been paying for those things, for a long time.

(03-24-2017 10:24 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  Yes

Many of the states that refused to expand Medicaid did so on purpose because they didn't want Obamacare to have success. Despite this, 20 million more people still got insurance.

Nice spin.


South Carolina did not expand Medicaid because they were fiscally disciplined enough to know that the federal money eventually dries up and it would bankrupt South Carolina when it did.

(03-24-2017 10:49 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  Those 20 million new people with insurance...




Working Americans are paying for. And do you have a figure on the millions of people who's coverage went down but cost went up?

To some extent yes. But we would be paying their medical expenses anyway if they end up sick in the hospital. At least this way, they are paying a portion of the cost.



Lets get real about what mandated coverage will do. It ALWAYS drives up the price for those paying for it. Just it did with mandated car insurance. Cost of getting it skyrocket.. As a 22 year old I paid $6 a month for basic liability and $12 for full coverage. 30 years later, my 22 year old son pays $225 a month for full coverage. I had a $50 deductible and he has $1,000.

And inflation had nothing to do with that?

If we really want everyone to have insurance we need to stop driving up cost for silly trips to the doctor and hospital...

That can be fixed. In many other countries they have "gate keepers" which are clinic type places were they can diagnose and determine whether or not you actually need to see a doctor or just have some chicken soup and a nap.

stop taking little Johnny to the doctor for a common cold...nothing they can do anyways. Wait 5 to 7 days to see if his runny nose starts to dry up. We need for employers to stop requiring a doctors excuse for a missed day of work. If you trip bang your elbow don't run to a doctor just because it swells a little bit and hurts...

hurting and swelling is the bodies way of dealing with the injury. If after a week it doesn't get any better. Go to the doctor.

Unneeded trips to the doctor and hospital is what's driving up cost and the #1 reason insurance is not affordable for all.

On this we can agree.
[/quote]

Of course inflation had some to do with it but not going from $12 a month with a $50 deductible to $225 with a $1,000. My cost doubled with in 12 months way back then.

I'm all for the poor having health insurance but not at a huge out of pocket cost to those working families. We could get both if we just found a way to go back to those days (I was a child) of not running to the hospital or doctor for every little pain or the common cold.

But when something is mandated by our government...cost always go up

(03-24-2017 11:02 AM)Kaplony Wrote:  would bankrupt South Carolina when it did.

No, it would just mean that SC residents would have to actually start paying an appropriate amount of state taxes.

(03-24-2017 11:04 AM)WKUYG Wrote:  My cost doubled with in 12 months way back then.

Because you got more coverage.


The insurance industry is as cut and dried as it gets, when determining prices. They have a whole, actual science devoted to it.

You pay more, because you get more. You get less, you pay less.

(03-24-2017 10:24 AM)Fitbud Wrote:  Yes

Many of the states that refused to expand Medicaid did so on purpose because they didn't want Obamacare to have success. Despite this, 20 million more people still got insurance.

Research that number and you will realize how full of **** it is.

(03-24-2017 10:52 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  Basically here's the problem, with the individual market:

it's the imperfect confluence of greedy insurance companies, looking to maximize profits, and consumers who are either poor or cheap a___es.

Baseless personal opinion not back by any evidence at all. More to the point, some is contradictory to existing laws.

(03-24-2017 10:52 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  The requirements that the insurer's products have to provide, are basic human rights.

bull****. health insurance itself is not a "basic human right".

(03-24-2017 10:52 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  But they want too much money for them, and the consumers in that market either can't pay that much or refuse to because of ideology.

The employer market has been paying for those things, for a long time.

Personal responsibility. You, like most far left ideologues, seem to have no understanding of such a simple concept.

LOL "research"

Made up data, to support the position you already believe was true.

(03-24-2017 11:33 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  

(03-24-2017 11:04 AM)WKUYG Wrote:  My cost doubled with in 12 months way back then.

Because you got more coverage.


The insurance industry is as cut and dried as it gets, when determining prices. They have a whole, actual science devoted to it.

You pay more, because you get more. You get less, you pay less.

Boy did you ever **** that up. Please walk up to an actuary and tell them insurance is as simple as you think it is.

(03-24-2017 10:52 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  Basically here's the problem, with the individual market:

it's the imperfect confluence of greedy insurance companies, looking to maximize profits, and consumers who are either poor or cheap a___es.


The requirements that the insurer's products have to provide, are basic human rights.

But they want too much money for them, and the consumers in that market either can't pay that much or refuse to because of ideology.



The employer market has been paying for those things, for a long time.

So much wrong with this....

(03-24-2017 11:45 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  health insurance itself is not a "basic human right".

I didn't say it was! Try re-reading.

(03-24-2017 11:45 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  Personal responsibility

Is a morally and intellectually bankrupt excuse that conservatives use when they pass laws robbing society of tax money that is owed by the rich.

(03-24-2017 11:48 AM)200yrs2late Wrote:  Please walk up to an actuary and tell them insurance is as simple as you think it is.

Point me to one, he/she will agree. That is the basic principle.