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Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
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billybobby777 Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-18-2017 11:31 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(03-18-2017 09:49 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Most on this board would say yes to the idea of a CUSA split.

There are some problems which I am going to list:

1) CFP contract is for CUSA and not any other new conference that will be formed. This can be adjusted potentially but that is a risk of splitting. The contract is good yet for 9 more seasons so its going to be a while.

2) By the end of the B12 TV deal there may be some realignment. This realignment could give opportunities for schools like SoMiss, WKU and ODU to find a space in the AAC. Do you bother with splitting if the end game is to jump?

3) Where is the value in CUSA anyways? Is there value in creating a better basketball grouping or a better football grouping? I feel like it makes sense to focus on basketball and take in only 1 of the new Florida schools. Perhaps bring in Georgia State because of the media market and basketball.

Marshall
Old Dominion
Western Ky
Middle Tenn
Charlotte
Georgia State
UAB
Florida International

8 team conference that requires a smaller revenue split from the NCAA and CFP.

The SBC would be down to 9 and CUSA down to 6. Nobody in the SBC is going to move to CUSA at that point. SBC could instead invite FAU, SoMiss and UTSA into their conference. SBC has a good football brand these days.

That would leave UTEP, Rice and LaTech as independents. They can play with themselves, New Mexico State and BYU as a group of western independents.

Might be better in the short run to add 2 to each side of CUSA. The conference would then divide into divisions for all sports and would only play schools from the other divisions in championship games. That's basically the same as splitting--but it preserves all the autobids. You could even allow each division to shop it's 2nd tier deal separatelly. For Instance, the West Tier2 rights might be an excellent fit for Fox Sports SW. It might be easier for each division to get regional coverage that way.

Effectively, it's would be 2 conferences sharing one headquarters and a tv deal (to whatever degree that want to negotiate together).

That's the only way. That can't split the conference into two conferences and get a 2nd NCAA auto bid. That's a fact. They also can't split in two and add one of the conferences into the CFP contract, another fact. 2, 8 school divisions will save them money on travel. They don't get any tv money anyway. CUSA made a decision to add all those start up schools. No one forced them too. A lot of us thought they were making a terrible decision then, but they made their bed. Now CUSA can only try to make the most out of a very bad situation. Unless they are able to kick 4 to 6 schools out? Never seen that done, but there's the 2 schools in Florida that the others don't seem to want at all when I read the CUSA boards.
Cheers!
(This post was last modified: 03-18-2017 01:04 PM by billybobby777.)
03-18-2017 12:59 PM
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Georgia_Power_Company Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
Sun Belt teams are really happy with our conference as it is so CUSA would have to look to independents like UMass and NMSU if they want to expand. No Sun Belt teams are leaving for CUSA unless they find a way to add significantly more revenues.

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03-18-2017 01:21 PM
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johnbragg Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-18-2017 12:59 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  ... but there's the 2 schools in Florida that the others don't seem to want at all when I read the CUSA boards.
Cheers!

From everything we hear second- and third-hand about realignment decisions, the coaches want those schools for south Floridq recruiting though.
03-18-2017 01:21 PM
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mturn017 Online
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Post: #24
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-18-2017 12:59 PM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(03-18-2017 11:31 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  
(03-18-2017 09:49 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Most on this board would say yes to the idea of a CUSA split.

There are some problems which I am going to list:

1) CFP contract is for CUSA and not any other new conference that will be formed. This can be adjusted potentially but that is a risk of splitting. The contract is good yet for 9 more seasons so its going to be a while.

2) By the end of the B12 TV deal there may be some realignment. This realignment could give opportunities for schools like SoMiss, WKU and ODU to find a space in the AAC. Do you bother with splitting if the end game is to jump?

3) Where is the value in CUSA anyways? Is there value in creating a better basketball grouping or a better football grouping? I feel like it makes sense to focus on basketball and take in only 1 of the new Florida schools. Perhaps bring in Georgia State because of the media market and basketball.

Marshall
Old Dominion
Western Ky
Middle Tenn
Charlotte
Georgia State
UAB
Florida International

8 team conference that requires a smaller revenue split from the NCAA and CFP.

The SBC would be down to 9 and CUSA down to 6. Nobody in the SBC is going to move to CUSA at that point. SBC could instead invite FAU, SoMiss and UTSA into their conference. SBC has a good football brand these days.

That would leave UTEP, Rice and LaTech as independents. They can play with themselves, New Mexico State and BYU as a group of western independents.

Might be better in the short run to add 2 to each side of CUSA. The conference would then divide into divisions for all sports and would only play schools from the other divisions in championship games. That's basically the same as splitting--but it preserves all the autobids. You could even allow each division to shop it's 2nd tier deal separatelly. For Instance, the West Tier2 rights might be an excellent fit for Fox Sports SW. It might be easier for each division to get regional coverage that way.

Effectively, it's would be 2 conferences sharing one headquarters and a tv deal (to whatever degree that want to negotiate together).

That's the only way. That can't split the conference into two conferences and get a 2nd NCAA auto bid. That's a fact. They also can't split in two and add one of the conferences into the CFP contract, another fact. 2, 8 school divisions will save them money on travel. They don't get any tv money anyway. CUSA made a decision to add all those start up schools. No one forced them too. A lot of us thought they were making a terrible decision then, but they made their bed. Now CUSA can only try to make the most out of a very bad situation. Unless they are able to kick 4 to 6 schools out? Never seen that done, but there's the 2 schools in Florida that the others don't seem to want at all when I read the CUSA boards.
Cheers!


Nobody told the Big East to add a bunch of large public schools that play bad basketball either but they were able to split
03-18-2017 01:40 PM
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Bogg Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
There are a bunch of practical reasons it wouldn't happen, but if you pooled CUSA, SBC, UMass, Liberty, and NMSt, there are three pretty nice regional conferences to be created. Something along the lines of the schools im NM/Texas/Louisiana/Arkansas; Florida/Alabama/Mississippi/Georgia; and the Virginias, Carolinas, WKU, MTSU, and UMass.
03-18-2017 02:46 PM
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jaredf29 Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-18-2017 10:20 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  
(03-18-2017 10:15 AM)jaredf29 Wrote:  
(03-18-2017 09:49 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Most on this board would say yes to the idea of a CUSA split.

There are some problems which I am going to list:

1) CFP contract is for CUSA and not any other new conference that will be formed. This can be adjusted potentially but that is a risk of splitting. The contract is good yet for 9 more seasons so its going to be a while.

2) By the end of the B12 TV deal there may be some realignment. This realignment could give opportunities for schools like SoMiss, WKU and ODU to find a space in the AAC. Do you bother with splitting if the end game is to jump?

3) Where is the value in CUSA anyways? Is there value in creating a better basketball grouping or a better football grouping? I feel like it makes sense to focus on basketball and take in only 1 of the new Florida schools. Perhaps bring in Georgia State because of the media market and basketball.

Marshall
Old Dominion
Western Ky
Middle Tenn
Charlotte
Georgia State
UAB
Florida International

8 team conference that requires a smaller revenue split from the NCAA and CFP.

The SBC would be down to 9 and CUSA down to 6. Nobody in the SBC is going to move to CUSA at that point. SBC could instead invite FAU, SoMiss and UTSA into their conference. SBC has a good football brand these days.

That would leave UTEP, Rice and LaTech as independents. They can play with themselves, New Mexico State and BYU as a group of western independents.

There may be some expanding after the B12 contract is up but it won't be the b12 expanding.

Don't you think if Oklahoma and Texas hit the door the B12 will want to push back to 12 schools?

Houston, Memphis and Cincinnati probably all find spaces with maybe a Colorado State or BYU getting a shot.

That would open up space in the AAC for some CUSA schools.

Not necessarily, without those two it'd just be a Midwestern version of the aac. The P4 would push for an official P4 which would all but guarantee them playoff spots. The rich get richer and the networks devalue the leftover contract.
03-18-2017 03:17 PM
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chargeradio Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
C-USA is stuck in its current form until 2026.

The only real out for a split will be flipping a non-football conference to a FBS conference. The WAC would be the easiest as it already has one FBS member. This would likely push the WAC to 15 (Chicago State exits, Cal Baptist enters). It would take an unprecedented realignment to make it work for everyone:

WAC adds 7 from C-USA
C-USA adds 3 from Sun Belt (USA, GS, GSU)
Sun Belt adds 2 from OVC (JSU, EKU) and 1 from Big South (KSU)
Big South adds 1 from OVC (TTU)
OVC adds 3 from Summit (IUPUI, IPFW, WIU)
Summit adds 3 from Big Sky (UNC, UM, MSU)
Big Sky adds 5 from WAC (SU, CBU, CSUB, UVU, GCU)

With 7 FCS members, the Summit would sponsor football. The MVFC would continue as a 6 team league as long as it sustained no further losses.
03-18-2017 03:20 PM
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MinerInWisconsin Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-18-2017 10:04 AM)bluesox Wrote:  I think some of the western schools would want to join the eastern schools instead of the Texas schools like la tech, s miss and UAB. Not to mention utep and rice might want to join the mwc or aac so the west break off seems shaky. Cusa probably would be better off expanding to 16 with Arkansas state and Georgia state to see how that works before splitting.

La Tech does a lot of recruiting in Texas and has a good number of alumni there as well. I would think they would lean west on this issue although they would badly want USM with them too. If USM and LT stayed with the Texas schools, I would like that conference. UAB would be nice to have also.
03-18-2017 03:36 PM
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Fighting Muskie Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
(03-18-2017 11:13 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(03-18-2017 08:48 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  i don't think the current continuity rules would prohibit both sides from autobids.

Well, you're wrong. Did a deep dive through the current bylaws (2015-16) and the old "X schools played together for Y years" is Not A Thing anymore.

http://csnbbs.com/thread-768543.html

That said, in the NCAA, if the powerful want something, they're likely to get it. And the Powers That Be will not smile on giving the 14 current CUSA schools plus some new friends one of "their" 68 NCAA tournament bids. There's not likely to be much sympathy for FBS schools wanting smaller travel budgets--you're in the big boy division, put on your big boy big wallet pants, is the likely response.

Then explain why the new Big East, anchored by the Catholic 7, received autobids.
03-18-2017 03:49 PM
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Erictelevision Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Would C-USA be better off splitting up?
Could CUSA and SBC trade a western division for an eastern division? (IOW: one conference becoming an eastern conference, the other western)
(This post was last modified: 03-18-2017 05:14 PM by Erictelevision.)
03-18-2017 03:55 PM
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