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2 Penn St. ex-administrators plead guilty in sex abuse case
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TerryD Offline
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Post: #31
RE: 2 Penn St. ex-administrators plead guilty in sex abuse case
(03-14-2017 09:20 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  
(03-13-2017 04:55 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  When a university - by a coaching staff, an athletic department and an administration - values winning football games over protecting children from a serial child predator

Penn St didn't do that (value ___ over ___). As has been correctly noted: the actions were those taken solely by a few individuals, who took it upon themselves to carry out incredible acts of negligence.

Criminals are punished by the criminal justice system.

You can't punish an entire school because a couple individuals acted on their own. That's absurd.


(03-13-2017 06:40 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  A collection of buildings is cheaper than a penn state degree.

$18k a year for a PA resident. Maybe not the most affordable, but hardly a private school cost.


(03-13-2017 07:07 PM)BearcatJerry Wrote:  A Cincy employee committed a series of crimes over at least ten years--some of which took place on the University facilities. The Administration was suspicious but undertook no investigation, but allowed the employee to retire. But still the retired employee was granted access to the University facilities, during which time the crimes continued. His criminal activity was observed and reported by an Assistant Coach and still no action was taken...

In other words, a few individuals took it upon themselves to commit incredible crimes and acts of negligence.

Then you fire them, charge them with crimes, and lock them up.

Nothing more can be said.


MAYBE if the entire school had made a pact to hide the crimes, you might have a point. But 5 people out of tens of thousands??? Absurd.



(03-13-2017 09:12 PM)CrazyPaco Wrote:  very sick individual.

If calling out the absurdity of punishing an entire university for the actions of individuals makes me sick, then I'm sick.

If calling out the illogical and entirely emotionally driven hatred agenda of those who hate(d) Paterno, Penn State, and people who live(d) in Central PA makes me sick, then I'm sick.

If calling out the witch hunt against Penn State for what it is, a witch hunt, makes me sick, then call me Sickie McSicko, mf'er!


The five are the leaders of the entity or organization or "group of buildings" (sic).

You punish the entity to deter this type of stuff happening in the future.
03-14-2017 11:21 AM
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MplsBison Online
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Post: #32
RE: 2 Penn St. ex-administrators plead guilty in sex abuse case
(03-14-2017 11:21 AM)TerryD Wrote:  The five are the leaders of the entity or organization

An absolutely arbitrary observation, which should carry zero logical weight.


(03-14-2017 11:21 AM)TerryD Wrote:  You punish the entity to deter this type of stuff happening in the future.

A typical human conclusion: illogical, driven by emotional hatred, and ultimately ineffective, as it does not address the root cause of the problem.
03-14-2017 11:36 AM
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BearcatJerry Offline
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Post: #33
RE: 2 Penn St. ex-administrators plead guilty in sex abuse case
(03-14-2017 11:36 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  A typical human conclusion: illogical, driven by emotional hatred, and ultimately ineffective, as it does not address the root cause of the problem.

What problem, exactly?
03-14-2017 12:35 PM
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MplsBison Online
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Post: #34
RE: 2 Penn St. ex-administrators plead guilty in sex abuse case
(03-14-2017 12:35 PM)BearcatJerry Wrote:  What problem, exactly?

That individuals in the university's administration and executive leadership positions would choose to take the actions of covering up crimes.
03-14-2017 01:17 PM
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nzmorange Offline
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Post: #35
RE: 2 Penn St. ex-administrators plead guilty in sex abuse case
(03-14-2017 09:20 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  
(03-13-2017 04:55 PM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:  When a university - by a coaching staff, an athletic department and an administration - values winning football games over protecting children from a serial child predator

Penn St didn't do that (value ___ over ___). As has been correctly noted: the actions were those taken solely by a few individuals, who took it upon themselves to carry out incredible acts of negligence.

Criminals are punished by the criminal justice system.

You can't punish an entire school because a couple individuals acted on their own. That's absurd.


(03-13-2017 06:40 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  A collection of buildings is cheaper than a penn state degree.

$18k a year for a PA resident. Maybe not the most affordable, but hardly a private school cost.


(03-13-2017 07:07 PM)BearcatJerry Wrote:  A Cincy employee committed a series of crimes over at least ten years--some of which took place on the University facilities. The Administration was suspicious but undertook no investigation, but allowed the employee to retire. But still the retired employee was granted access to the University facilities, during which time the crimes continued. His criminal activity was observed and reported by an Assistant Coach and still no action was taken...

In other words, a few individuals took it upon themselves to commit incredible crimes and acts of negligence.

Then you fire them, charge them with crimes, and lock them up.

Nothing more can be said.


MAYBE if the entire school had made a pact to hide the crimes, you might have a point. But 5 people out of tens of thousands??? Absurd.


(03-13-2017 09:12 PM)CrazyPaco Wrote:  very sick individual.

If calling out the absurdity of punishing an entire university for the actions of individuals makes me sick, then I'm sick.

If calling out the illogical and entirely emotionally driven hatred agenda of those who hate(d) Paterno, Penn State, and people who live(d) in Central PA makes me sick, then I'm sick.

If calling out the witch hunt against Penn State for what it is, a witch hunt, makes me sick, then call me Sickie McSicko, mf'er!

It's more for out of state, and it's more for grad school. $18k is the cheapest tuition amount (excluding scholarships, etc.), and that's still the most expensive in the nation for a public school* (or at least close to it). But I think that you missed my point. If schools really were nothing more than a collection of buildings, then why what, other than weather, separates one school from another?

*I know PSU is technically state-related, but it's historically public, and it's public/private status and/or exact tuition amount aren't really my point.
03-14-2017 04:09 PM
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MplsBison Online
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Post: #36
RE: 2 Penn St. ex-administrators plead guilty in sex abuse case
(03-14-2017 04:09 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  If schools really were nothing more than a collection of buildings, then why what, other than weather, separates one school from another?

The trivial answer to that, of course, is the particular faculty that work at the school. (assuming the facilities of the schools being compared are equivalent)

Otherwise, if all other factors were the same (tuition, weather, physical location, etc.), then the name of the school itself is irrelevant and they could just be called school A, school B, etc. The people make the school, not the other way around.
(This post was last modified: 03-14-2017 04:27 PM by MplsBison.)
03-14-2017 04:26 PM
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Native Georgian Offline
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Post: #37
RE: 2 Penn St. ex-administrators plead guilty in sex abuse case
(03-13-2017 02:05 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  Penn St fb should have been deep sixed for three years. I said it then and I say it now. But the almighty dollar is more important than justice.
But that would've required PSU to give up something that's important to them. No amount of $$$$ could make them do that on their own.
03-14-2017 04:31 PM
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nzmorange Offline
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Post: #38
RE: 2 Penn St. ex-administrators plead guilty in sex abuse case
(03-14-2017 04:26 PM)MplsBison Wrote:  
(03-14-2017 04:09 PM)nzmorange Wrote:  If schools really were nothing more than a collection of buildings, then why what, other than weather, separates one school from another?

The trivial answer to that, of course, is the particular faculty that work at the school. (assuming the facilities of the schools being compared are equivalent)

Otherwise, if all other factors were the same (tuition, weather, physical location, etc.), then the name of the school itself is irrelevant and they could just be called school A, school B, etc. The people make the school, not the other way around.

I think that's the point that the people arguing against you are trying to make.
03-14-2017 05:05 PM
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GoldenWarrior11 Offline
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Post: #39
RE: 2 Penn St. ex-administrators plead guilty in sex abuse case
SMU was given the death penalty due to the actions of individuals leading and involved with the football program. This situation - strictly based on the level of involvement (coaches, athletic department and administration - is exactly the same. The only question is weighing the severity of paying players under the table is as bad as allowing/overlooking a university employee to abuse children - which, apparently, is not as bad to some.

I, personally, believe Penn State should have been given the death penalty - based on the consequences SMU got. Having said that, I also believe that Miami and Baylor should have been given a similar penalty (as I do for UNC). However, I have less than zero say in those matters. Those are just my personal opinions.

Until the NCAA comes down hard on institutions for these outrageous scandals, they will continue to make the news every few years. Schools will continue to sweep it under the rug, hire new individuals that say all the right things, but that doesn't change the gross injustices that have occurred in collegiate athletics - publicly nevertheless.
03-14-2017 05:37 PM
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TerryD Offline
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Post: #40
RE: 2 Penn St. ex-administrators plead guilty in sex abuse case
(03-14-2017 11:36 AM)MplsBison Wrote:  
(03-14-2017 11:21 AM)TerryD Wrote:  The five are the leaders of the entity or organization

An absolutely arbitrary observation, which should carry zero logical weight.


(03-14-2017 11:21 AM)TerryD Wrote:  You punish the entity to deter this type of stuff happening in the future.

A typical human conclusion: illogical, driven by emotional hatred, and ultimately ineffective, as it does not address the root cause of the problem.


Typical Bison over generalization and excuse mongering for wrongdoers.

Knee jerk reaction to any punishment handed out by the NCAA or the schools themselves.

Hint: You ain't that enlightened and magnanimous, even though you may think so.

You just seem to coddle offenders.
03-15-2017 07:48 AM
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