If UC wins their remaining games where they should be favored, we should reach 30 wins. Cronin will have averaged 25 wins over the last 7 years here. With UC basketball being "back", the AAC being the top heavy conference that it is, along with a newly refurbished arena, I could see 25 win averages being realistic for a long time. That would work out to a 22-9 or 23-8 regular season and 1 or two wins in the conf tourney, and 1 win in the ncaa tourney. I know it's unreasonable to expect that every year for decades, but given our situation, I think that it is at least possible for the next decade.

Long story short, what if we keep Cronin for two decades, till he is 65, winning at this pace before he retires? He would have 800 wins and would be near the top of the list of mens major div 1 coaching history. And if he coached at this rate till 70, would be over 900 wins and be higher than bob Knight, Dean Smith, rupp, etc...

I know the odds of that happening are extremely small, with bad stretches, chances of him quitting or being fired at some point, health reasons, or just coaching longevity being rare in general. But if I had to pick any coach in the nation that is likely to be in the same job in 2037, he would be towards the top of the list, just due to age, him being at his Alma mater, and performing "well enough" not to get fired any time soon.

Now I'm not trying to say Cronin is anywhere near the coaching league as rupp, Knight, etc... Heck some timestimes I don't even like him and have wished for a different coach at times within the last few years. But given that he was kept this up for the last 7 years already, and the near future looks pretty good too, it just made me think about the long term future of uc's program.

Let's see if he can make a deep run with this crew this year...it's been argued that this is his most talented bunch. If he can't penetrate now, then he won't penetrate in the foreseeable future, and it wouldn't be in UC's best interest to keep him around since the AD will need to put a good product on the floor to pay for the debt they have accrued with all the renovations that have taken and will take place.

For MBB to be viable, you have to have a program that penetrates the tourney at least once every 3 years or so to keep revenue coming in. If you can't do that, you need to revamp the program.

Champaign-Urbana calling. What does it offer? Only $$$$$.

Question, will his former wife let him move Sammy? Will Hep move?

(03-05-2017 09:01 AM)Not Duane Wrote:  For MBB to be viable, you have to have a program that penetrates the tourney at least once every 3 years or so to keep revenue coming in. If you can't do that, you need to revamp the program.

Completely disagree. You move on when the program is consistently weak or in disarray - see Georgetown or Memphis under Pastner. Pressing reset because of a few years of where you have bad luck, or bad matchups in a quirky single elimination tournament is unreasonable. Do people understand how few program altering coaches are out there? How easy it is to make a bad hire and set things back 4 years?

To me this sounds like people warming up the Fire Mick bus just in case he doesn't reach a sweet 16. Even then, the third game thread will be full of "we suck, why can't we __" comments. No wonder he flirted with UNLV.

If people can't appreciate Mick after this season, they can locate the problem easily each morning as they shave.

(03-05-2017 10:01 AM)EffinBJ Wrote:  

(03-05-2017 09:01 AM)Not Duane Wrote:  For MBB to be viable, you have to have a program that penetrates the tourney at least once every 3 years or so to keep revenue coming in. If you can't do that, you need to revamp the program.

Completely disagree. You move on when the program is consistently weak or in disarray - see Georgetown or Memphis under Pastner. Pressing reset because of a few years of where you have bad luck, or bad matchups in a quirky single elimination tournament is unreasonable. Do people understand how few program altering coaches are out there? How easy it is to make a bad hire and set things back 4 years?

To me this sounds like people warming up the Fire Mick bus just in case he doesn't reach a sweet 16. Even then, the third game thread will be full of "we suck, why can't we __" comments. No wonder he flirted with UNLV.

If people can't appreciate Mick after this season, they can locate the problem easily each morning as they shave.

+1, totally agree

It's the same ole **** every other thread. There is a clear contingent of "I like Mick, but...". Just waiting to pour out the hate at the first sign of weakness.

"Why can't he keep the foot on the gas pedal? Why can't he keep the tempo up? Why are we playing stall ball? We will never make a run in the tourney because of our offense. Mick needs to hire someone to coach offense."

It happens every March. It happens after every loss. It happens mid-game every time, when the other team goes on a run and we miss a few shots.

When ever we lose- it's Mick's fault. I mean I guess all other teams are **** that we should beat 100% of the time and not ever should they be a little more lucky or shoot a higher % than us. Heaven forbid they would have better talent or just be a better team. To some of you all, we lost before it even begins.

Only one team wins the NCAA championship. Only four teams make the final four. But our program has been in the tournament every fuckin year since Mick finally resurrected it from the death penalty, and in the toughest basketball league in the history of the game not to mention. Not many teams have that run of success. I know it's not good enough for some people, but damn- that's a pretty big accomplishment. Afterall, you gotta be in it to win it.

And to all of you guys who think someone is going to come into Cincinnati and do a better job than one of its most loyal sons... just who is that guy? Who is that coach that is going to come in here and do that? Actually when Mick chooses to leave or gets fired and we end up with some sad sack that misses the tourney every damn year- yes- I will be saying I told you so in every damn thread.

Honestly, I just want a winner. We are all starved for a winner. I get it. But give the man a fuckin break. Let him get his facility in place. Let this year happen. Let next year happen. Let the year after that happen. If we start tankin' then bombs away. All the guy as done so far is win.

Sorry. /rant off.

You can't base everything on ncaa tournament runs particularly when you find yourself outside of the p5 conferences. He took over a train wreck, and from what i see(and i've been a season ticket holder for over 30 yrs) he's progressively getting more talent in spite of some setbacks beyond his control. I think his team next year may even be better, and with a new facility i like the future. A big plus also is he gets kids who stick around, and have been very good off the court. You need to look no rather than down a x to see what turnover and not geting kids who stay in the program for 4 yrs does.

He needs to get UC to the point when they are a legitimate final four contender on a fairly regular basis. The tournament is a crapshoot so I'm not going to judge him on that alone. If the program is winning games, competing for conference championship, earning high seeds and the metrics look good he should be here as long as he wants. It seems like Mick is getting the program back to the level it needs to be at. I want to see a legit National Title contender every few years too. This year's team is a fringe final four contender and would be a legit contender if they were better away from the Shoe. Hopefully we see that over the next week.

(03-05-2017 09:01 AM)Not Duane Wrote:  Let's see if he can make a deep run with this crew this year...it's been argued that this is his most talented bunch. If he can't penetrate now, then he won't penetrate in the foreseeable future, and it wouldn't be in UC's best interest to keep him around since the AD will need to put a good product on the floor to pay for the debt they have accrued with all the renovations that have taken and will take place.

For MBB to be viable, you have to have a program that penetrates the tourney at least once every 3 years or so to keep revenue coming in. If you can't do that, you need to revamp the program.

It's guard play that typically wins in the NCAAs, we should have that for 2 more years after this year, minimum. Personally I think we'll have better teams the next two years over this. Especially as I think Evans is a 2 guard at the next level that can defend the 3 at this level, so we've really been a 3 guard offense.

Who knows, it's a year to year thing. As I said in another thread, what he has done off the court is outstanding ( graduations, law, clean program, etc. ) of which I am very grateful. On the court, we now have a consistent winner, getting better recruits but still need better, are we perceived again as a national program ( that comes with consistent tourney runs or consistent top 5 rankings ), probably not but are getting there. Who knows what happens two or three years from now, maybe Evans or Brooks or Scott transform themselves into the next KMart, for now I am more than happy with MC but we'll see what the future brings.

Perhaps we need to adjust our expectations. I wonder if the level of recruit is about the best we can get in this crappy conference?

What is wrong with being in the NCAA almost every year and then occasionally make the Sweet 16/Elite 8?

Put yourself in the recruits shoes and ask ESPN/2 on all Cable Packages or CBS only available on the 400 channel package?

(03-05-2017 09:58 AM)doss2 Wrote:  Champaign-Urbana calling. What does it offer? Only $$$$$.

Question, will his former wife let him move Sammy? Will Hep move?

Due to his family situation one job that would terrify me if it opens up is OSU. I do wonder with Mick's frustration with scheduling and his recent comments regarding the tournament if he's at the point that he'd take a ticket out to a strong P5 in this region.

I know I am one that wants the Bearcats to win every game no matter what in any sport.

(03-05-2017 10:05 AM)bearcat29 Wrote:  

(03-05-2017 10:01 AM)EffinBJ Wrote:  

(03-05-2017 09:01 AM)Not Duane Wrote:  For MBB to be viable, you have to have a program that penetrates the tourney at least once every 3 years or so to keep revenue coming in. If you can't do that, you need to revamp the program.

Completely disagree. You move on when the program is consistently weak or in disarray - see Georgetown or Memphis under Pastner. Pressing reset because of a few years of where you have bad luck, or bad matchups in a quirky single elimination tournament is unreasonable. Do people understand how few program altering coaches are out there? How easy it is to make a bad hire and set things back 4 years?

To me this sounds like people warming up the Fire Mick bus just in case he doesn't reach a sweet 16. Even then, the third game thread will be full of "we suck, why can't we __" comments. No wonder he flirted with UNLV.

If people can't appreciate Mick after this season, they can locate the problem easily each morning as they shave.

+1, totally agree

+2
Although the trips in a row stat is a bit misleading, how many P5 teams would love to have that resume' even being one and out? Right now, I will take Mick all day every day

(03-05-2017 10:25 AM)Bearcatbdub Wrote:  And to all of you guys who think someone is going to come into Cincinnati and do a better job than one of its most loyal sons... just who is that guy? Who is that coach that is going to come in here and do that? Actually when Mick chooses to leave or gets fired and we end up with some sad sack that misses the tourney every damn year- yes- I will be saying I told you so in every damn thread.
Sorry. /rant off.

This is EXACTLY the same refrain we heard when Huggins was released. You can't have it both ways--if you acknowledge that HOF coaches don't grow on trees, then this exact argument could have been made when Huggins was relieved of duty...on the other hand, if it's so impossible to find a coach to come in and fill big shoes...then you can't really explain Cronin's success.

It's either a straw man argument or an admission that a huge mistake was made when Huggins was let go.

Take your pick.

will people quit saying mick took a train wrecked team and turned us around. Ak had 6 guys in big east and almost made tournament with suspended starters. Coming into UC job mick was known at the time as top 5 recruiter in country. He seen open roster with previous team having mostly all SR and thought it was go be easy getting his own group of players. we had oj mayo and bill walker right in our city plus other high skilled local players. mick and his early arrogance for NY city kids cost him his first few years. downey was told we didn't have open spot but we had D8 transfers on team. Mick best team would get destroyed by huggins 5 best team. we have starters on this year team that wouldve had walk on here in 90's

(03-05-2017 01:12 PM)bulldog23 Wrote:  will people quit saying mick took a train wrecked team and turned us around. Ak had 6 guys in big east and almost made tournament with suspended starters. Coming into UC job mick was known at the time as top 5 recruiter in country. He seen open roster with previous team having mostly all SR and thought it was go be easy getting his own group of players. we had oj mayo and bill walker right in our city plus other high skilled local players. mick and his early arrogance for NY city kids cost him his first few years. downey was told we didn't have open spot but we had D8 transfers on team. Mick best team would get destroyed by huggins 5 best team. we have starters on this year team that wouldve had walk on here in 90's

That may be one of the reasons that the BOT and Zimpher ditched Huggins--had those 3 come to UC, you'd have had a squad as talented as the 1999-2000 group with Kenyon Martin. I suspect that would have made Huggins even harder to oust.

(03-05-2017 01:21 PM)Not Duane Wrote:  

(03-05-2017 01:12 PM)bulldog23 Wrote:  will people quit saying mick took a train wrecked team and turned us around. Ak had 6 guys in big east and almost made tournament with suspended starters. Coming into UC job mick was known at the time as top 5 recruiter in country. He seen open roster with previous team having mostly all SR and thought it was go be easy getting his own group of players. we had oj mayo and bill walker right in our city plus other high skilled local players. mick and his early arrogance for NY city kids cost him his first few years. downey was told we didn't have open spot but we had D8 transfers on team. Mick best team would get destroyed by huggins 5 best team. we have starters on this year team that wouldve had walk on here in 90's

That may be one of the reasons that the BOT and Zimpher ditched Huggins--had those 3 come to UC, you'd have had a squad as talented as the 1999-2000 group with Kenyon Martin. I suspect that would have made Huggins even harder to oust.

plus we had the big white guy commited to come here.

(03-05-2017 01:12 PM)bulldog23 Wrote:  will people quit saying mick took a train wrecked team and turned us around. Ak had 6 guys in big east and almost made tournament with suspended starters. Coming into UC job mick was known at the time as top 5 recruiter in country. He seen open roster with previous team having mostly all SR and thought it was go be easy getting his own group of players. we had oj mayo and bill walker right in our city plus other high skilled local players. mick and his early arrogance for NY city kids cost him his first few years. downey was told we didn't have open spot but we had D8 transfers on team. Mick best team would get destroyed by huggins 5 best team. we have starters on this year team that wouldve had walk on here in 90's

You nailed it. A great coach can turn a program around in 3 years tops.

I am positive Huggins ouster and its timing had zero to do with the recruiting class. Zippo. That scenario was some combination of bad publicity from player arrests, grad rates, Huggins DUI, and Zimpher's megalomania.

Regards that class/trio - they came after Bob had taken a year off, so it's not as though their arrival was imminent. There is nothing to say Mayo wouldn't have gone to USC anyway. They did cheat to get him, remember.