Great season from either a great coach or greatest coach Louis Rowe!

Where is NJ97's input on this poll?

(03-04-2017 01:26 PM)Wear Purple Wrote:  

(03-04-2017 01:21 PM)2Buck Wrote:  

(03-04-2017 01:04 PM)Water Boy Wrote:  

(03-04-2017 12:16 PM)HyperDuke Wrote:  The data is piling up for this poll. Perception is Reality & 100% of the perception shown here is that Rowe is the GREATEST.

Sorry to put a damper on your poll. As great as Rowe's move was yesterday, I cannot condone placing a title of greatest on someone just for a first-round CAA victory over Drexel. Judging from the past Drexel and bye are not very different.

Now if Rowe gets kicked out of today's game to spark another win, that would change my mind.

You're missing the beauty of his greatness. How many coaches have achieved their greatest victory by coaching in absentia? Do you not appreciate the power of such coaching abilities?

Bobby Cox was the king of it. He was ejected 161 times in his Hall of Fame career. That's essentially an entire season of games.

Lou Rowe needs to follow that blueprint. It took him 30 games to figure out how to motivate these seniors. I wouldn't want to play JMU now that the magic formula has been uncovered.

:>)

I'm sorry, I hate to destroy the atmosphere of positive energy on this thread, but Bobby Cox was not the king of ejections. All hail the king:

https://youtu.be/TGZUKHtW7vg

(03-05-2017 07:32 AM)jmuroadwarrior Wrote:  Where is NJ97's input on this poll?

I've never said that Lou Rowe was a great coach or even a good coach. I think he's a coach who is learning and will get better. All I have said is that it's his first season at JMU and the guy he replaced was not a great coach. If you expected a great coach- whether someone with some head coaching experience or someone who was a first time coach I think you aren't being realistic given where JMU MBB is and has been. That doesn't mean that Coach Rowe can't be successful. The coach at Charleston struggled his first season as well and has gotten better each season. He won coach of the year this season.

BTW I think the whole "great coach" thing is often over rated. The Xs and Os part of it. There are a lot of arm chair coaches out there. A successful head coach has to motivate, has to recruit, has to mentor young men. I think Lou Rowe has good attributes there.

(03-04-2017 09:00 PM)Hart Foundation Wrote:  Oops. My alternate game of HORSE stopped at the letter G.
The annual season public evaluation Bourne likes to give will be laughable when he releases his assessment.

My prediction - Bourne goes silent. No acknowledgement of his hiring botch or the long term implications it has on the new Convo fund raising.
It will be worthy of a complete and utter rant.
Not just complete.
Not just utter.
But complete and utter.

Let's go back in time a year ago. The thread that you authored- Egg Laid.

Egg Laid

"There is no other way to describe it. I'm sure the vultures will be out calling for Brady's job, but this one is all on the players. There were no surprises with W&M's zone. They played it for extended stretches in both of the previous games this year. The players couldn't convert shots from anywhere on the court and that is why it is called Basket-Ball. You have to put the ball in the basket to be successful.
It is all on the players.

This team is chock full of upperclassmen and only one Sophomore got any minutes. They choked. They sucked. They looked like their bungholes tightened up.
Statistically it was the Dukes 2nd worst shooting game of the year. Egg laid.
For 3pt shooting was their 6th worst performance of the year. Egg laid.
All of this against a zone defense. No ball pressure at all. Egg laid.

We were looking for Ron Curry to lead the team and he played great this year showing himself to be one of the best in the league on BOTH ends of the court.
He laid an egg today.
He had is worst shooting game of the year for overall FG% at 5-19. He also had his worst game of the year for 3pt FG% at 2-11. Egg laid.

Congrats to W&M for not choking and playing their normal game. They shot 51% and were 48% on the year. Good on them for showing they are an excellent offensive team. Shaver hid their defensive deficiencies well with the zone and JMU continued to miss shot after shot. Bad shooting makes zone defenses look great and it is certainly a better gamble for W&M rather than having players out-athlete them in man-to-man.

JMU never gave them anything to worry about with an ice cold shooting performance in the biggest game of the year. It was an unbelievable 20-0 run in the first half when the Dukes couldn't have taken a dump in the toilet if they were sitting right on top of it. The Dukes wouldn't have beaten the worst team in the CAA today with that type of shooting.

What a flame out for a team that played some exciting and very good basketball. If you had asked an uneducated fan if today's JMU basketball team was in the top 100 RPI rankings, they would have said no way. They looked worse than Drexel routinely looks on offense"

So with Brady's teams when they didn't show up in the CAA T it was on the players- they choked including one of the best players in JMU history Ron Curry. But with Rowe's team all year long (who by the way fought harder than Brady's teams) and yesterday who actually represented JMU MBB well (especially relative to the prior two years teams) it's on Rowe. Yeah ok- AGENDA FAKE NEWS! You should be ashamed of yourself.

Btw JMU MBB will be ok and I really think Rowe will be as well. Curry, Bowles, the current players- they all love Rowe. That's the facts Jack! You sir have an agenda- Brady lover Rowe hater. Coaching is more than Xs and Os which you know little to nothing about. Let's use Shaq Brown as an example- Coach Rowe in his introductory press conference pointed to Shaq (not by name) but when he told a young man to take his hoodie off. Shaqs seasons had ups and downs (some maybe related to injuries). Rowe never called Shaq out in the press- he kept him in the rotation and got Brown to even play some defense towards the end of the season. You go ask Shaq Brown what he thinks of Lou Rowe the man and the coach. Rowe will continue to connect with players and the talent level will rise in the Burg. That will result in wins in the post season.

21-11 regressed to 10-23 this year and you are trying to defend it. Silly.

Hint - nobody cares about the soft skills if you don't win. i.e. Former players and current players "love him" as a coach, the team "fought harder" whatever that means. Winning is the priority, then you can be concerned about soft skills. Many fired coaches learned this long ago.

10-23 is the biggest underachievement I've ever seen for JMU basketball considering the amount of starters and key bench players that returned from a strong team.
Does anyone think the body of work indicates JMU played up to their potential? Do you think they overachieved at any point this year? A good coach makes the whole greater than the sum of the parts. Was that the case this year?
Rowe is responsible for a minus 11 in win regression which breaks a record for a one year collapse.

I'm sorry that I've hurt your feelings.
I like Louis Rowe. I do not like him as a head coach.
You have to be able to separate the two.
This is big boy basketball and Bourne botched the hire during a crucial period in the drive for an $88 million new arena.

You've shown yourself to be a huge hypocrite. Last year you blamed the players for their poor performance in the quarterfinals. You suggested that Ron Curry was responsible. This year you blame the coaching. The season was terrible- no denying that. What is also undeniable is that Brady being in his 8th season (after a stinker the year prior to Hofstra) as head coach was responsible for laying an egg last year. Those were his players it was on him to have them prepared to compete and execute his game plan. He's accountable the same way Lou Rowe is accountable as a first year head coach who inherited a group of role players this season.

The Dukes played yesterday like I would expect a team in their final game of the season to play. Brady's teams the prior two years were not prepared, and not up to the task of even being competitive in the quarterfinals game. That is part of why he is no longer here. Rowe will get a shot to improve as he should with his players and after year 3 we will know if he is a terrible coach or not- we and you don't know that to be the case today. You didn't know that early in the season when you were already saying it either. Just because you were upset that Brady got canned after 8 years and you didn't like the hire doesn't make it fair to go after the head coach when with the prior head coach you did everything you could to defend him and make excuses for him.

End result is the same- JMU lost in the quarters. Onward and upward from here.

I don't want to get too involved in a serious discussion about Rowe because it's obvious certain people engage in faulty logic to support their predetermined position.

HOWEVER, the idea that wins & losses tells the story is ludicrous. Anyone with eyeballs could tell you effort & intensity that was absent in last year's tournament was present in this year's tournament. That tells me Rowe might have it in him to be a good coach. As I said much earlier in the year, anyone who pretends to know how good a coach Rowe can be for us (based only off year 1) is foolish.

And it's fair game to assail our athletic "leaders" for hiring an inexperienced coach on the cheap. But can we separate that criticism from the Rowe criticism? Seems like there are those who mash those two concepts together interchangeably & I find that intellectually dishonest.

I think for Coach Rowe and the mbb program the ceiling is the roof!
Kidding, I hope Coach can do well. I don't think he will do worse than Sherm or Keener. Maybe with the new convo coming and if Houston can stay 4 more years he will get lucky and better recruits will come.

I am with Hyper and NJDuke. Looking forward to next year. I think our two transfers will impress as will our incoming freshman. Hoping we land a graduate transfer that can play or one JC. Go Dukes.

Hart:

I thought we should keep Brady and agree that a good coach will get the most out of his players. Once we hired Rowe, I wrote our AD and King to express to them that the hire was underwhelming and a huge risk. I knew if this season did not go well, criticism would rain down on them. I would have chosen a coach who like Houston, had been a successful head coach elsewhere and was ready for a promotion.

Does anyone else remember how bad this team was when Curry went out last year?

Perhaps this year was not an exceptional coaching job but Lou did show that he could get the players on this years roster to play hard. After an abysmal start to the season, his team managed to go 8-12 in their conference schedule. That is a fairly impressive turn around after a 1-11 start(not counting EMU). He also did this after losing one of his best players for the rest of the season.

I am not sure how Lou will do but I like his character. I like that he is a Duke. I like that he did not make excuses and that he led a team of less talented players to compete hard in every game. It gives me hope that with more talent, better results will happen.

I honestly believe JMU will have a better record next year. I also believe Lou will attract better talent and the program will have less drama. I am not sure just how good of a coach Lou will become but I would rather take my chances with a quality human being who is also an alum than with a guy like Withers who it too big time for tiny Harrisonburg and non-P5 JMU.

I am looking forward to next season and hope the days of 20 loss seasons are behind us.

(03-05-2017 10:57 PM)JMUNation Wrote:  Hart:

I thought we should keep Brady and agree that a good coach will get the most out of his players. Once we hired Rowe, I wrote our AD and King to express to them that the hire was underwhelming and a huge risk. I knew if this season did not go well, criticism would rain down on them. I would have chosen a coach who like Houston, had been a successful head coach elsewhere and was ready for a promotion.

Does anyone else remember how bad this team was when Curry went out last year?

Perhaps this year was not an exceptional coaching job but Lou did show that he could get the players on this years roster to play hard. After an abysmal start to the season, his team managed to go 8-12 in their conference schedule. That is a fairly impressive turn around after a 1-11 start(not counting EMU). He also did this after losing one of his best players for the rest of the season.

I am not sure how Lou will do but I like his character. I like that he is a Duke. I like that he did not make excuses and that he led a team of less talented players to compete hard in every game. It gives me hope that with more talent, better results will happen.

I honestly believe JMU will have a better record next year. I also believe Lou will attract better talent and the program will have less drama. I am not sure just how good of a coach Lou will become but I would rather take my chances with a quality human being who is also an alum than with a guy like Withers who it too big time for tiny Harrisonburg and non-P5 JMU.

I am looking forward to next season and hope the days of 20 loss seasons are behind us.

I've tried stating this a few other times in different threads. The team played hard for Rowe. That says something.

I differ with you on Brady. I liked him, but the players seemed to not buy in with his coaching. There was also way too much drama. I liked Brady as a person and I think he knew basketball, but it didn't seem he ever had a strong hold of the players and program. Glad to leave that behind. Rowe's head coaching skills are being learned on the job, but his leadership/bonding skills seem natural. I'm sure it is what has made him a great recruiter.

Halz:

I actually agree with all you said. I liked Matt enough that I went to the VCU vs LaSalle game in hopes I would get to chat with him. I waved to him as I walked the baseline and he asked me to hold up. He came over between drills and we briefly caught up. That was really nice of him to take the time to say hello.

Matt is a good coach but he has his weaknesses like all of us. You identify those weaknesses very well.

(03-06-2017 08:20 AM)JMUNation Wrote:  Halz:

I actually agree with all you said. I liked Matt enough that I went to the VCU vs LaSalle game in hopes I would get to chat with him. I waved to him as I walked the baseline and he asked me to hold up. He came over between drills and we briefly caught up. That was really nice of him to take the time to say hello.

Matt is a good coach but he has his weaknesses like all of us. You identify those weaknesses very well.

I've tuned into a couple La Salle games that I would have otherwise skipped over. I hope he learned from his weaknesses and makes the most of his next opportunity. I think a break was good for both of us. I would love to see him succeed in the future.

(03-04-2017 10:46 AM)Hart Foundation Wrote:  Fact based JMU performance in the Keener round...
Keener 0-4
Rowe 1-0

He is clearly better than Keener as we had hoped.
I will play this vote like HORSE and give him a G for now. Win tonight and he will get a R. Win the semis and he will get an E. Win the finals and he will get an A. At that point I would throw in the T for the Title.

I'm embarrassed by how long it took me to realize that you were spelling 'great' and not 'horse.' In my defense, it is Monday morning and I have had less caffeine than I am accustomed.

(03-05-2017 09:54 AM)HyperDuke Wrote:  I don't want to get too involved in a serious discussion about Rowe because it's obvious certain people engage in faulty logic to support their predetermined position.

HOWEVER, the idea that wins & losses tells the story is ludicrous. Anyone with eyeballs could tell you effort & intensity that was absent in last year's tournament was present in this year's tournament. That tells me Rowe might have it in him to be a good coach. As I said much earlier in the year, anyone who pretends to know how good a coach Rowe can be for us (based only off year 1) is foolish.

Then your poll should have said, "Might be a Great Coach" rather than simply "Great Coach", though, I realize it's not my poll.

(03-05-2017 09:57 AM)HyperDuke Wrote:  And it's fair game to assail our athletic "leaders" for hiring an inexperienced coach on the cheap. But can we separate that criticism from the Rowe criticism? Seems like there are those who mash those two concepts together interchangeably & I find that intellectually dishonest.

I think that's a really fair question. I am probably one of those that have connected the two in the past. I have felt (and still feel) that this program needed someone experienced as a head coach with success, even if that success was in a lesser conference or division. The fact that we went back to the JMU well and chose a guy that really didn't have any significant success to hang his hat on really bothered me. While I have appreciated his candor in saying he had a lot to learn his first year as head coach, I didn't like the fact that he was using this job as his learning experience. IMO, JMU MBB head coach job shouldn't be the first stop. We are better than that.

All of that aside, now on to Rowe. He definitely learned a lot this season. I like the fact that he's man enough to admit he needed to change some things- from the style of play he wants to run to his demeanor on the sideline. That speaks to me as a guy that isn't arrogant enough to say it's his way or the highway. He did inherit a mess. 7 seniors is not a balanced squad, nor did many have the talent to justify being a Div I basketball player.
The record doesn't tell the whole story. This team played hard for him and something needs to be said for that. We still had waaaay too many turnovers and very dumb decisions.
I do think we'll see a better team next season, but will take at least another year to find out our true potential. If nothing changes, he needs to go.
Lastly, I will say this: if he does take us to the promised land and turns out to be a great coach, I think we have him for as long as we want him. He bleeds purple and gold and I feel he really wants us to be great.

one year from now, we will all know how good of a coach and recruiter he is

I wanted to jump in and offer my opinion, in case any one cares. Take it easy on me I am new to the boards, you guys are pros!
I am very let down from this past season, I certainly expected more , with so many returning players. I watched only 3 games this year which is an all time low.One thing I feel that was so missed this year, as many of you have said is a true point guard. I feel as if the best two players on the team were Snowden and Brown, however it appears they had lots of problems with confidence or whatever, not sure.
With that being said I am excited about next year, I think we should expect 16-18 wins. On paper all of the 6 current incoming recruits appear to have some skills, however we all know that can mean little alot of the time.
I do think Rowe needs to get another point via the Juco route as well as another big Juco. Which would certainly balance the classes a bit as well.Maybe hold back the other open ship. I do feel like the team played the best they could, since I feel the talent level was way down from what I have seen in years past. With all that being said, as frustrated as I have been this year, I do not know what type of stuff went on behind the scenes that Rowe had to deal with that is not public. I am excited and wish the season started tomorrow. I long for the days of the Lefty years when it was so hard to get tickets and we played big teams and won several of them. Hopefully they return sooner than later. I proudly wear my JMU gear,
Lets go Dukes. Hopefully the Ladies can get us to the NCAA this weekend!