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Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
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SpeedkingATL Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
I have no issue with playing Liberty on occasion as we have in the past, but would not want it on a normal "conference like" basis as I would prefer the flexibility of having a choice of rather to play them or not. Apps OOC scheduling has been pretty good as of late and Liberty would not be a preferred opponent to be locked into most years going forward. For sports other than Football, doesn't make much difference.
03-02-2017 11:02 AM
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panama Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
Pass
03-02-2017 11:05 AM
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CoastalAlum2011 Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 11:02 AM)SpeedkingATL Wrote:  I have no issue with playing Liberty on occasion as we have in the past, but would not want it on a normal "conference like" basis as I would prefer the flexibility of having a choice of rather to play them or not. Apps OOC scheduling has been pretty good as of late and Liberty would not be a preferred opponent to be locked into most years going forward. For sports other than Football, doesn't make much difference.



For sports other than football, they remain in the "Big" South.
03-02-2017 11:13 AM
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Bobcat2013 Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 11:00 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 10:52 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  I wouldn't mind hosting them in a guarantee game that they pay us for. Makes no sense but they have the money right? I don't really wish failure upon them but I am curious about what would happen if they cannot manage to get the required number of FBS home games. Would the NCAA force them back down? Probably not but I'd wanna see what happens.

If we schedule them before they get up to FBS numbers at least we might be able to beat them.

On the other hand maybe we should build a scheduling relationship with them? If they travel well or have a large enough fan base they could be an extremely attractive option in a few years if they can manage some success. Maybe if we're nice to them now maybe they can help us out if ,God forbid, they somehow surpass the schools in our conference.

Why don't we offer that deal to NMSU? At least everyone can participate in the benefits of that.

I'd be for that as well but they don't have the fanbase, money, facilities, or potential for growth that Liberty does.
03-02-2017 11:20 AM
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SpeedkingATL Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 11:13 AM)CoastalAlum2011 Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 11:02 AM)SpeedkingATL Wrote:  I have no issue with playing Liberty on occasion as we have in the past, but would not want it on a normal "conference like" basis as I would prefer the flexibility of having a choice of rather to play them or not. Apps OOC scheduling has been pretty good as of late and Liberty would not be a preferred opponent to be locked into most years going forward. For sports other than Football, doesn't make much difference.



For sports other than football, they remain in the "Big" South.

Smart strategy on Liberty's part but I can't see any G-5 biting.
03-02-2017 11:20 AM
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rokamortis Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
I wonder if the proposed scheduling agreement would allow Liberty to participate in the conference's contracted bowls.
03-02-2017 11:50 AM
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Tom in Lazybrook Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 11:50 AM)rokamortis Wrote:  I wonder if the proposed scheduling agreement would allow Liberty to participate in the conference's contracted bowls.

Why would we consider doing that for ANY team not in our conference?

So Coastal would get pushed out of a bowl for the benefit of Liberty? Hell no. Not just hell no for Liberty, hell no for anyone. Liberty is welcome to find its own bowl outlets or to just take their spot in the 'last pick' bowl pool if one exists.
(This post was last modified: 03-02-2017 12:12 PM by Tom in Lazybrook.)
03-02-2017 12:10 PM
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CoastalAlum2011 Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 11:50 AM)rokamortis Wrote:  I wonder if the proposed scheduling agreement would allow Liberty to participate in the conference's contracted bowls.

What would be one single solitary benefit to the Sun Belt to allow that to happen?

A bigger question: Can anyone name even ONE benefit to pursuing this?

Negotiations are all about leverage. In this situation, the Sun Belt would have 100% of the leverage compared to Liberty's 0%.

I currently have no ill will at all towards Karl Benson, but if this were to happen without a financial windfall for the conference membership, I'll quickly find some ill will. I refuse to believe Karl is that dumb.

I don't share the inflammatory "they discriminate!!!" argument that others express, however, from a business perspective, there is absolutely ZERO incentive for the Sun belt to come to the table to even discuss this with Liberty unless they're throwing so much money at us that we would all be able to build brand new football stadiums for our programs with zero financing.
(This post was last modified: 03-02-2017 12:20 PM by CoastalAlum2011.)
03-02-2017 12:18 PM
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boroeagle2 Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
[Image: gross_no_thank_you_supernatural.gif]
03-02-2017 12:18 PM
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Bobcat87 Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 12:10 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 11:50 AM)rokamortis Wrote:  I wonder if the proposed scheduling agreement would allow Liberty to participate in the conference's contracted bowls.

Why would we consider doing that for ANY team not in our conference?

So Coastal would get pushed out of a bowl for the benefit of Liberty? Hell no. Not just hell no for Liberty, hell no for anyone. Liberty is welcome to find its own bowl outlets or to just take their spot in the 'last pick' bowl pool if one exists.

I'm with Tom on this one . . . In the history of Bad Ideas . . this one's waaaay way up there. With all this conference has gone through to expand bowl tie ins, it make no sense to even think about giving one away. . . Not to Liberty, not to anyone not wearing a conference patch.
03-02-2017 12:21 PM
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SENOREIDA Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 11:50 AM)rokamortis Wrote:  I wonder if the proposed scheduling agreement would allow Liberty to participate in the conference's contracted bowls.

Then they should compete for a conference title as well? Hell, just invite them in! There is no way in hell they will take benefits away from conference members without being in the conference. 01-wingedeagle
03-02-2017 12:25 PM
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rokamortis Offline
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Post: #32
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 12:10 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 11:50 AM)rokamortis Wrote:  I wonder if the proposed scheduling agreement would allow Liberty to participate in the conference's contracted bowls.

Why would we consider doing that for ANY team not in our conference?

So Coastal would get pushed out of a bowl for the benefit of Liberty? Hell no. Not just hell no for Liberty, hell no for anyone. Liberty is welcome to find its own bowl outlets or to just take their spot in the 'last pick' bowl pool if one exists.

(03-02-2017 12:21 PM)Bobcat87 Wrote:  I'm with Tom on this one . . . In the history of Bad Ideas . . this one's waaaay way up there. With all this conference has gone through to expand bowl tie ins, it make no sense to even think about giving one away. . . Not to Liberty, not to anyone not wearing a conference patch.


(03-02-2017 12:25 PM)SENOREIDA Wrote:  Then they should compete for a conference title as well? Hell, just invite them in! There is no way in hell they will take benefits away from conference members without being in the conference. 01-wingedeagle


I'm not saying the SBC or any G5 conference would or should consider it. Some have compared this idea to the ND / ACC scheduling agreement and bowl access is one aspect of it. I'm still trying to figure out why a G5 conference would consider a scheduling agreement like this in the first place. I keep coming back to it is more beneficial to Liberty than any conference. So is Liberty paying? If so, they may want bowl access if they are willing to pay enough ...
(This post was last modified: 03-02-2017 12:47 PM by rokamortis.)
03-02-2017 12:45 PM
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Tom in Lazybrook Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 12:45 PM)rokamortis Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 12:10 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 11:50 AM)rokamortis Wrote:  I wonder if the proposed scheduling agreement would allow Liberty to participate in the conference's contracted bowls.

Why would we consider doing that for ANY team not in our conference?

So Coastal would get pushed out of a bowl for the benefit of Liberty? Hell no. Not just hell no for Liberty, hell no for anyone. Liberty is welcome to find its own bowl outlets or to just take their spot in the 'last pick' bowl pool if one exists.

I'm not saying the SBC should or would consider it. Some have compared this idea to the ND / ACC scheduling agreement and bowl access is one aspect of it. I'm still trying to figure out why a G5 conference would consider a scheduling agreement like this in the first place. I keep coming back to it is more beneficial to Liberty than any conference. So is Liberty paying? If so, they may want bowl access if they are willing to pay enough ...

We shouldn't be selling ourselves. Big boy conferences don't do that. If we don't wish to be perceived as a joke, then lets not act like we are.

If Coastal, Troy, or Ga Southern want to do a home and home with LU, they're welcome to do so.
(This post was last modified: 03-02-2017 12:57 PM by Tom in Lazybrook.)
03-02-2017 12:47 PM
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rokamortis Offline
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Post: #34
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 12:47 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 12:45 PM)rokamortis Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 12:10 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 11:50 AM)rokamortis Wrote:  I wonder if the proposed scheduling agreement would allow Liberty to participate in the conference's contracted bowls.

Why would we consider doing that for ANY team not in our conference?

So Coastal would get pushed out of a bowl for the benefit of Liberty? Hell no. Not just hell no for Liberty, hell no for anyone. Liberty is welcome to find its own bowl outlets or to just take their spot in the 'last pick' bowl pool if one exists.

I'm not saying the SBC should or would consider it. Some have compared this idea to the ND / ACC scheduling agreement and bowl access is one aspect of it. I'm still trying to figure out why a G5 conference would consider a scheduling agreement like this in the first place. I keep coming back to it is more beneficial to Liberty than any conference. So is Liberty paying? If so, they may want bowl access if they are willing to pay enough ...

We shouldn't be selling ourselves. Big boy conferences don't do that. If we don't wish to be perceived as a joke, then lets not act like we are.

If Coastal, Troy, or Ga Southern want to do a home and home with LU, they're welcome to do so.

I think you are taking this discussion on a hypothetical a little personally. Also, I'm discussing from a general G5 perspective, not linking this specifically to the SBC.

I'm not saying it is a good idea but most ADs and presidents are looking for revenue. Think of the CUSA and how they are struggling due to lost TV revenue - you don't think they may consider a proposal where they get paid to schedule home and home games with another G5 school? Even if that might give that school access to their bowls?
03-02-2017 01:20 PM
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arkstfan Away
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Post: #35
Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 10:24 AM)Curtisc83 Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 10:16 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  I'm not upset about Liberty. I think they took the right approach with the NCAA because I don't think the must invite rule is on solid legal ground.

As to a scheduling agreement. If there are Sun Belt members who are having a hard time filling their slots for home/home schedule agreements then by all means sign on to play Liberty.

Something that is more formalized where the conference is telling members that two out of every four years or two out of six years you give up a non-conference date to play Liberty and the league handles the scheduling of that? The question quickly becomes "What's in it for me?"

Exposure on their network? No thanks. Most of the stations I've looked up are low power religious stations unavailable on many cable and satellite systems and a mix of national channels buried deep in the program guide. I have a rooftop antenna and getting the Little Rock affiliate is a challenge. Some days won't come in at all. Hard or impossible to find while the announcers are employed by Liberty and we are just this weeks villain facing the good guys / home team and the graphics are employing Liberty logos prominently. I don't see any benefit in that, I'll take the hit or miss quality of ESPN3. If they were taking ESPN3 pool announcers and using ESPN graphics and ESPN is willing to let them distribute those games elsewhere, that's not a bad deal.

But money talks. If Liberty is offering say $200,000 for a trip to play them and willing to take $100,00 for returning the game, that isn't program changing money but it's a better deal than any of us get for home and home and I suspect the AD's will be willing to listen.

I don't think there will be any goodness of our heart deals and I really don't think what Liberty offers in television would be considered to hold any value, that doesn't mean a mutually beneficial agreement is impossible.

LU does all production in house and ESPN just rebroadcasts it. We have our own announcers and production team for LFSN, this is why our games look so high quality. If you can't get the local channel or ESPN 3 then it will be free online. Just go to the Flames athletic page or Flames FB page for the link for the game.

Missed all the part about your announcers and graphics being pro-Liberty. Pass.
03-02-2017 02:35 PM
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Pounce FTW Offline
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Post: #36
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 02:35 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  Missed all the part about your announcers and graphics being pro-Liberty. Pass.

I will note that when GSU played basketball at Liberty a few years back, their announcers were some of the nicest I've ever heard. Seemed like they were nothing but complimentary toward our players.

I'll also note that I want GSU to face Liberty on the gridiron again to help erase a bad memory I have.

I don't like the proposal that is the subject of this thread, however.
03-02-2017 03:38 PM
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AtlantaJag Offline
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Post: #37
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
Liberty has a lot of "evolving" to do before an official relationship with them is acceptable.
03-02-2017 03:43 PM
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Florida RedWolf Offline
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Post: #38
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 12:21 PM)Bobcat87 Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 12:10 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 11:50 AM)rokamortis Wrote:  I wonder if the proposed scheduling agreement would allow Liberty to participate in the conference's contracted bowls.

Why would we consider doing that for ANY team not in our conference?

So Coastal would get pushed out of a bowl for the benefit of Liberty? Hell no. Not just hell no for Liberty, hell no for anyone. Liberty is welcome to find its own bowl outlets or to just take their spot in the 'last pick' bowl pool if one exists.

I'm with Tom on this one . . . In the history of Bad Ideas . . this one's waaaay way up there. With all this conference has gone through to expand bowl tie ins, it make no sense to even think about giving one away. . . Not to Liberty, not to anyone not wearing a conference patch.




One guy's bad idea. No need to think it would ever be considered. For all the reasons given, it will not happen.
03-02-2017 06:03 PM
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Florida RedWolf Offline
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Post: #39
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
(03-02-2017 10:44 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  
(03-02-2017 08:38 AM)Ewglenn Wrote:  "This scheduling agreement could allow the Flames to play 4-6 games per season against another G5 conference, such as the Conference USA or Sun Belt, and then schedule another 4-6 games against other Independent schools and Power 5 opponents with 1 FCS game per season."

Apparently Liberty is trying to get a Notre Dame/ACC agreement. The SBC and CUSA are being the main ones talked about. Would y'all be interested in this? Would this be essentially a tryout for them to get into the conference if needed later on? I'm just looking to see what the pros and cons in yalls mind would be of agreeing to this.

Why would we agree to this? There's nothing in it for our teams. Nothing. At all. Their TV network is a big ole nothing. Why take the reputational hit of being aligned with LU? I don't get the benefit.

Why are we willing to help Liberty when we aren't willing to help out Idaho or NMSU? Destroy the programs that helped us out and help out the program that wont hire Gays or Jews? Absolutely ridiculous.

I'll be rather unhappy if USA or the Belt affirms LU's discriminatory practices and subjects our fans to discriminatory treatment.

There should be no alignment (which is an endorsement) of Liberty's discrimination by the Sun Belt Conference. If a member institution wishes to subject its students, faculty, athletes, fans and staff to LU, that's between them and their fans (and their LGBT and aligned student, faculty, alumni, and student groups - by the way - expect them to be involved if this happens).

Any school working with LU is affirming keeping Jews and Gays out of employment and participation in FBS athletics and employment. Full stop.

Again, if we're giving away 'scheduling alliances', I'd argue that NMSU is more deserving, UMass can probably offer more (basketball), and LU cant offer much to us.




Think you are all wet on this one. The Lord that Liberty and it's students worship was a Jew and he asked all followers to love their neighbors. Sometimes things get a little twisted and I think this may be one of them.
03-02-2017 06:17 PM
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msm96wolf Offline
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Post: #40
RE: Scheduling agreement with Liberty?
I actually think CUSA would be the better for the partner idea. They need more TV exposure than any conference. I do think Liberty would be willing to pay for the visiting teams. I think Liberty does have the ability to have a BYU type of success in football. I do think think the following schools: Charlotte, ODU, App & Coastal would be good H/H series. My money is on BYU being willing to schedule H/H with them with NMSU, UMASS and Army.

Personally, I hope Liberty is successful. I would like to see other schools that may want to move to FBS as independent. If the are willing to spend, then why shouldn't they be allowed.
03-02-2017 06:17 PM
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