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8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
8 U.S Code 1182 subsection (f)

Whenever the President finds that the entry of ANY aliens or ANY CLASS of aliens into the United States would be detrimental to the interests of the United States, he may by proclamation, and for such period as HE SHALL DEEM necessary, SUSPEND the entry of ALL aliens or ANY CLASS of aliens as IMMIGRANTS or NON IMMIGRANTS, or impose on the entry of aliens ANY restrictions HE MAY DEEM to be appropriate.

(CAPS for emphasis added)

The court can rule that they feel this statute is unconstitutional and strike down the Presidents proclamation on that ground. That is their prerogative and perfectly fine. That of course is NOT what they did. Instead they chose to totally ignore this statue and to rule on the Presidents proclamation under this statue without even a mention of how that proclamation violates that statue. The ruling is outrageous and smacks of judicial activism and partisanship. The 9th circuit is an embarrassment to the judicial system and the nation.

I don't know what the President will do. I hope he amends the EO to clarify that aliens with Green Cards and aliens with Visas are exempt and add a several other countries to the list....including SA, Egypt and the UAE.
02-10-2017 09:45 AM
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john01992 Offline
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Post: #2
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
A republican judge ruled against trump.
02-10-2017 09:47 AM
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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Post: #3
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
(02-10-2017 09:47 AM)john01992 Wrote:  A republican judge ruled against trump.

Relevance?
02-10-2017 09:50 AM
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MonarchManiac Offline
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Post: #4
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
(02-10-2017 09:47 AM)john01992 Wrote:  A republican judge ruled against trump.

What does that have to do with anything?
02-10-2017 09:50 AM
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john01992 Offline
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Post: #5
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
(02-10-2017 09:50 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  
(02-10-2017 09:47 AM)john01992 Wrote:  A republican judge ruled against trump.

Relevance?

yeah. obviously trump was wrong.
02-10-2017 09:50 AM
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Machiavelli Offline
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Post: #6
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
because that is what we have reduced the court system to. Which political party appointed them.
02-10-2017 09:51 AM
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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Post: #7
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
(02-10-2017 09:50 AM)john01992 Wrote:  
(02-10-2017 09:50 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  
(02-10-2017 09:47 AM)john01992 Wrote:  A republican judge ruled against trump.

Relevance?

yeah. obviously trump was wrong.

What in EO violated 1182? Ill wait.07-coffee3
02-10-2017 09:52 AM
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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Post: #8
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
(02-10-2017 09:51 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  because that is what we have reduced the court system to. Which political party appointed them.

THIS. The same BS happened with Obama. The just went to Texas and did the same thing. I don't respect that court either.07-coffee3
02-10-2017 09:54 AM
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Post: #9
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
(02-10-2017 09:51 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  because that is what we have reduced the court system to. Which political party appointed them.

Harry Blackmun, John Paul Stevens, David Souter, Lewis Powell.

Republicans have frequently screwed up and appointed closet liberals, including some of the most liberal people ever on the Supreme Court.
02-10-2017 09:55 AM
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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Post: #10
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
(02-10-2017 09:55 AM)bullet Wrote:  
(02-10-2017 09:51 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  because that is what we have reduced the court system to. Which political party appointed them.

Harry Blackmun, John Paul Stevens, David Souter, Lewis Powell.

Republicans have frequently screwed up and appointed closet liberals, including some of the most liberal people ever on the Supreme Court.

I think though generally that in the SCOTUS they seem to mostly get it right. This BS in the circuit courts is getting out of hand.
02-10-2017 09:57 AM
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Post: #11
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/02/0...wrong.html

Discussion of the law involved.

"...Neither the judge in Washington State nor the court has offered anything approaching a detailed discussion of 8 U.SC. §1182 (f), the law which specifically gives the president authority to suspend the entry of any aliens into the U.S. if he believes their entry would be "detrimental to the interests of the United States."  Unless this statutory provision is unconstitutional, the president has acted completely within the law.
The Ninth Circuit gives lip service to the fact that "courts owe substantial deference to the immigration and national security policy determinations of the political branches - an uncontroversial principle that is well-grounded in our jurisprudence."
Inexplicably, it then proceeds to give no deference to the president’s policy determination that a temporary suspension is necessary to ensure that adequate vetting procedures are in place.
The court also gives no deference to the decision of Congress to delegate its plenary power over immigration to the president on this issue.
The Ninth Circuit also claims that there is "no evidence that any alien from any of the countries named in the Order has perpetrated a terrorist attack in the United States."  But as Washington Examiner journalist Byron York reports, that’s simply not true. In fact, there is plenty of this sort of evidence:
Last year the Senate Judiciary Subcommittee on Immigration and the National Interest released information showing that at least 60 people born in the seven countries had been convicted — not just arrested, but convicted — of terror-related offenses in the United States since Sept. 11, 2001. And that number did not include more recent cases like Abdul Artan, a Somali refugee who wounded 11 people during a machete attack on the campus of Ohio State University last November.
Instead of discussing the relevant statute under which the president acted, the Ninth Circuit instead engages in an extensive discussion of its concern that the executive branch is failing to provide due process to aliens barred from entry into the United States.  While it can certainly be argued that permanent resident aliens may have certain due process rights before their residency status can be cancelled, the White House has already said the order does not apply to permanent residents.
The court's apparent opinion that other aliens who don't live in the U.S. have due process rights if they are refused entry can only be true if they have a constitutional right to enter the U.S. That is an absurd proposition yet that is the end result of the court's opinion: that a foreign alien can demand a hearing and due process rights if one of our embassies refuses to give the alien a visa.
So far in the numerous lawsuits that have been filed against this EO, the only Federal judge to get it right is Nathaniel Gorton of the District Court of Massachusetts.  He analyzed the relevant statute, 8 U.S.C. §1182(f), and concluded that the EO is fully within the president's authority: "the decision to prevent aliens from entering the country is a 'fundamental sovereign attribute' realized through the legislative and executive branches that is 'largely immune from judicial control.'"  Contrary to the Ninth Circuit, Gorton says the EO is "facially legitimate and bona fide."
The Ninth Circuit’s ruling has as little basis in the law as the original decision by the district court judge. It is just another example of arrogant federal courts grabbing power from the legislative and executive branches in violation of basic separation-of-powers principles.  
After the decision was announced, President Trump tweeted, "the security of our nation is at stake."  He is right.  
02-10-2017 10:07 AM
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Post: #12
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
(02-10-2017 09:57 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  
(02-10-2017 09:55 AM)bullet Wrote:  
(02-10-2017 09:51 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  because that is what we have reduced the court system to. Which political party appointed them.

Harry Blackmun, John Paul Stevens, David Souter, Lewis Powell.

Republicans have frequently screwed up and appointed closet liberals, including some of the most liberal people ever on the Supreme Court.

I think though generally that in the SCOTUS they seem to mostly get it right. This BS in the circuit courts is getting out of hand.

This ruling is ridiculous.

The liberals on the Supreme Court have frequently "written legislation" instead of interpreting it. Roe v. Wade is a piece of compromise legislation, not an interpretation of the law.
02-10-2017 10:09 AM
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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Post: #13
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
(02-10-2017 10:07 AM)bullet Wrote:  http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/02/0...wrong.html

Discussion of the law involved.

"...Neither the judge in Washington State nor the court has offered anything approaching a detailed discussion of 8 U.SC. §1182 (f), the law which specifically gives the president authority to suspend the entry of any aliens into the U.S. if he believes their entry would be "detrimental to the interests of the United States."  Unless this statutory provision is unconstitutional, the president has acted completely within the law.
The Ninth Circuit gives lip service to the fact that "courts owe substantial deference to the immigration and national security policy determinations of the political branches - an uncontroversial principle that is well-grounded in our jurisprudence."
Inexplicably, it then proceeds to give no deference to the president’s policy determination that a temporary suspension is necessary to ensure that adequate vetting procedures are in place.
The court also gives no deference to the decision of Congress to delegate its plenary power over immigration to the president on this issue.
The Ninth Circuit also claims that there is "no evidence that any alien from any of the countries named in the Order has perpetrated a terrorist attack in the United States."  But as Washington Examiner journalist Byron York reports, that’s simply not true. In fact, there is plenty of this sort of evidence:
Last year the Senate Judiciary Subcommittee on Immigration and the National Interest released information showing that at least 60 people born in the seven countries had been convicted — not just arrested, but convicted — of terror-related offenses in the United States since Sept. 11, 2001. And that number did not include more recent cases like Abdul Artan, a Somali refugee who wounded 11 people during a machete attack on the campus of Ohio State University last November.
Instead of discussing the relevant statute under which the president acted, the Ninth Circuit instead engages in an extensive discussion of its concern that the executive branch is failing to provide due process to aliens barred from entry into the United States.  While it can certainly be argued that permanent resident aliens may have certain due process rights before their residency status can be cancelled, the White House has already said the order does not apply to permanent residents.
The court's apparent opinion that other aliens who don't live in the U.S. have due process rights if they are refused entry can only be true if they have a constitutional right to enter the U.S. That is an absurd proposition yet that is the end result of the court's opinion: that a foreign alien can demand a hearing and due process rights if one of our embassies refuses to give the alien a visa.
So far in the numerous lawsuits that have been filed against this EO, the only Federal judge to get it right is Nathaniel Gorton of the District Court of Massachusetts.  He analyzed the relevant statute, 8 U.S.C. §1182(f), and concluded that the EO is fully within the president's authority: "the decision to prevent aliens from entering the country is a 'fundamental sovereign attribute' realized through the legislative and executive branches that is 'largely immune from judicial control.'"  Contrary to the Ninth Circuit, Gorton says the EO is "facially legitimate and bona fide."
The Ninth Circuit’s ruling has as little basis in the law as the original decision by the district court judge. It is just another example of arrogant federal courts grabbing power from the legislative and executive branches in violation of basic separation-of-powers principles.  
After the decision was announced, President Trump tweeted, "the security of our nation is at stake."  He is right.  

This pretty much sums it up. The ruling by Robarts and the 9th circuit totally disregards the law. There is no defense of it.
02-10-2017 10:14 AM
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Hood-rich Offline
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Post: #14
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
Seems like an open and shut case to me. Not sure what the problem is with the ban.
02-10-2017 10:24 AM
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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Post: #15
RE: 8 U.S Code 1182 (f)
(02-10-2017 10:24 AM)Hood-rich Wrote:  Seems like an open and shut case to me. Not sure what the problem is with the ban.

I agree.

Here is my question to these judges.

If the POTUS has information that an attack is imminent and the best intel says that someone is coming in via air from one of these 7 countries in the next couple of months to initiate that attack...What is his course of action?

U.S Code 1182 (f) is specifically written to give the POTUS the power to INSTANTLY address a threat of this kind in the way he sees fit. We have no idea if the POTUS has intel or not and I doubt anyone would make a case that that information should be made public for obvious reasons.

Bottom line. By blocking the Presidents EO...These judges may well be putting America in danger of an attack. They HAVE to give the POTUS the benefit of the doubt here. We are talking about national security and the political infighting is putting the nation in danger.
02-10-2017 11:18 AM
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