(02-01-2017 08:14 PM)Old Blue Wrote:  My grand kids love to go exploring in the woods. I guess like most little kids. What would happen if they stumbled upon this guys weed operation? My guess is it wouldn't go over too well for them. I'm sick of having to feel sorry for the selfish ones in our society. If your gonna grow, grow indoors....better yet, leave the drugs alone.

I have a few friends who grow in the woods and even state land, I know they would just tell the children to run along, but I understand this might not always be the case. Growing indoors is the safest way until your energy company reports abnormal energy usage and you have cops come raid your home like you're some hardened criminal, you might even end up shot over a couple grams of weed. What exactly made him selfish though?

Why is it okay for pharma companies to get kids hooked to oxy but someone who wants to grow pot is a criminal? I've lost 3 friends to heroin, they started with medical oxy products prescribed to them in high school, I watched my aunt struggle to live without taking oxy that was prescribed to her, I haven't however lost anyone to weed, not from it or contributed by it, I've found that those that heavily use marijuana do lose their drive however.

When does the question become what is the problem, the production/use or the law? The law creates a black market, creates criminals, results in the deaths of perps, innocents, and officers alike. It is not unlike alcohol during prohibition, that time when The Mob and other gangs grew tremendously in size.

And why is Hemp itself illegal to grow? A plant that doesn't create enough THC to smoke for pleasure. Anyone care to explain that one? You can make stuff such as blocks using hemp (Hempcrete) and Hemp Oil which can be used in paints, lubricants, fuel, plastics, soap, shampoo, detergents, and other things. Just to name a couple of things.

Am I the only one that remembers Fit said he taught kids to run from the police?

(02-04-2017 02:22 AM)gdunn Wrote:  Am I the only one that remembers Fit said he taught kids to run from the police?

If anything Fit should teach them their rights when interacting with a cop along with what defines reasonable suspicion and probable cause, that would do far more to protect them than telling them to run away.

The kid should not have ran..but... I don't blame the cops or the tazer manufacture. I chalk it up to another victim of the war on drugs...especially Cannabis.

(02-04-2017 07:54 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  The kid should not have ran..but... I don't blame the cops or the tazer manufacture. I chalk it up to another victim of the war on drugs...especially Cannabis.

I'll agree to all of that.

(02-04-2017 07:54 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  The kid should not have ran..but... I don't blame the cops or the tazer manufacture. I chalk it up to another victim of the war on drugs...especially Cannabis.

I think we will probably agree on the laws need to be changed for pot in every state and the federal system. Hell I think criminal codes need to be change for a lot of drug offenses. Most people in prison for selling are users that sell to their friends...who got busted and wore a wire. Or to support their habit.

But this person is dead for one reason only. He ran. Not because of the laws. He ran. If the possession laws were changed...he still runs. He runs because even if the law allows people to grow their own...a lot of people will grow more than the law allows.

If this kid knew he was breaking the law on that day. He most likely would have still broke the law on the amount you are allow to grow. So he still runs.

(02-02-2017 12:11 AM)DexterDevil Wrote:  Why is it okay for pharma companies to get kids hooked to oxy but someone who wants to grow pot is a criminal? I've lost 3 friends to heroin, they started with medical oxy products prescribed to them in high school, I watched my aunt struggle to live without taking oxy that was prescribed to her, I haven't however lost anyone to weed, not from it or contributed by it, I've found that those that heavily use marijuana do lose their drive however.

Three friends? Your screening process on the front end might need some streamlning. Usually they do not start cold on oxy. Usually there is a recreational drug history there in advance.

(02-04-2017 08:18 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(02-02-2017 12:11 AM)DexterDevil Wrote:  Why is it okay for pharma companies to get kids hooked to oxy but someone who wants to grow pot is a criminal? I've lost 3 friends to heroin, they started with medical oxy products prescribed to them in high school, I watched my aunt struggle to live without taking oxy that was prescribed to her, I haven't however lost anyone to weed, not from it or contributed by it, I've found that those that heavily use marijuana do lose their drive however.

Three friends? Your screening process on the front end might need some streamlning. Usually they do not start cold on oxy. Usually there is a recreational drug history there in advance.

So my friends who weren't involved in anything who started with medically prescribed oxy products, I'm just supposed to "screen" out of my life? As if I don't care for their well-being and don't think it is my job to try and help them? I'm just supposed to stop being their friend and watch them die? **** you dude, your moral standards are ******, you shouldn't turn people away for their faults, you should accept them and try to help them. All my friends who started with recreational drugs, well they still only do recreational drugs, and most do not do them regularly and have never tried anything more serious than shrooms.

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People who do heroin do it to feel nothing, people who smoke weed want to laugh and eat, people who do ecstasy want to get high and not care what goes on around them.

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(02-04-2017 06:59 PM)DexterDevil Wrote:  People who do heroin do it to feel nothing, people who smoke weed want to laugh and eat, people who do ecstasy want to get high and not care what goes on around them.

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Ive got a very good friend that has a son that is an addict. This kid has literally bankrupted them. He is been in and out of rehab 6 different times. Sadly..there are just people that are programmed for addiction...be it drugs, sex, gambling,booze..ect..ect..ect. Just the idea that someone would put a needle in their arm and inject themselves with a substance that they know is dangerous blows my mind. I guess they think...."I will be the one that can handle this...everyone else is a damn loser."

(02-04-2017 08:35 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(02-04-2017 06:59 PM)DexterDevil Wrote:  People who do heroin do it to feel nothing, people who smoke weed want to laugh and eat, people who do ecstasy want to get high and not care what goes on around them.

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Ive got a very good friend that has a son that is an addict. This kid has literally bankrupted them. He is been in and out of rehab 6 different times. Sadly..there are just people that are programmed for addiction...be it drugs, sex, gambling,booze..ect..ect..ect. Just the idea that someone would put a needle in their arm and inject themselves with a substance that they know is dangerous blows my mind. I guess they think...."I will be the one that can handle this...everyone else is a damn loser."

Yeah I'm not exactly positive as to what drives them to a needle, depression or hated of themselves maybe. Just know that from explanations that it's like nothingness, was a time of peace for them. My friends at least. I know I'm programmed for addiction and I'm glad I know that, keeps me wary of drugs and unwilling to do them.

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Don't grow weed and don't run.

It is easy.

(02-02-2017 12:11 AM)DexterDevil Wrote:  Why is it okay for pharma companies to get kids hooked to oxy but someone who wants to grow pot is a criminal? I've lost 3 friends to heroin, they started with medical oxy products prescribed to them in high school, I watched my aunt struggle to live without taking oxy that was prescribed to her, I haven't however lost anyone to weed, not from it or contributed by it, I've found that those that heavily use marijuana do lose their drive however.

Without addressing your other comments which I generally agree with... I have an issue with this.

1) How did pharma get them hooked? Doctors have to write prescriptions. I'm not saying pharma can't influence/encourage docs... but docs still have to write it.
2) The person has to take it. When you pick up your meds, you get a note talking about the addictive nature of these drugs. You don't like it, don't take it. There are dozens of other medications that a physician should (and in the overwhelming percentage of cases do) prescribe before they get to Oxy, especially for 'kids.'

My experience is not unique at all, though I'm not saying it represents anyone you know...

but generally speaking OXY is only prescribed for chronic or EXCEPTIONAL pain (like cancer). More often we get people coming in with non-descript pain symptoms who then claim that 'nothing else works for them'. 99 times out of 100, we STILL won't give it to them... Of course then we get bad patient satisfaction scores from them... and the government penalizes us as a result.

The biggest area of 'oxy abuse' imo is in nursing homes.

My point is that if the drug is legal, then it's not 'on big pharma' for making sure it isn't abused or doesn't 'hook' anyone. It's on docs, the people themselves and the government.

I agree with your comparison to pot... but the same is true of alcohol.

Unless this was many years ago doctors usually gives a scrip for hydrocodone unless it's a injury that put you in the hospital. Then only 1 scrip and they send you to pain management if it will be a on going problem. Especially over the last 5 to 8 years. I cannot see a doctor giving high school kids OXY. With what we know today (over the last 10 years) if a doctor gave my child something usually given for major chronic pain. I'm going to call them out on it.

I have a lot of experience in this area and something is not adding up...seems like a few steps are being left out from injury in HS to getting hooked on OXY. I've lost many people that I grew up with (I'm 57) and family to death and prison from addictions. Bad doctors over prescribe but usually it's the pain pill mills. I know if it was my son as a parent I would be taking my child to a doctor I know and in most cases doctors are very afraid to over scribe on pain meds.

(02-02-2017 12:11 AM)DexterDevil Wrote:  

(02-01-2017 08:14 PM)Old Blue Wrote:  My grand kids love to go exploring in the woods. I guess like most little kids. What would happen if they stumbled upon this guys weed operation? My guess is it wouldn't go over too well for them. I'm sick of having to feel sorry for the selfish ones in our society. If your gonna grow, grow indoors....better yet, leave the drugs alone.

I have a few friends who grow in the woods and even state land, I know they would just tell the children to run along, but I understand this might not always be the case. Growing indoors is the safest way until your energy company reports abnormal energy usage and you have cops come raid your home like you're some hardened criminal, you might even end up shot over a couple grams of weed. What exactly made him selfish though?

Why is it okay for pharma companies to get kids hooked to oxy but someone who wants to grow pot is a criminal? I've lost 3 friends to heroin, they started with medical oxy products prescribed to them in high school, I watched my aunt struggle to live without taking oxy that was prescribed to her, I haven't however lost anyone to weed, not from it or contributed by it, I've found that those that heavily use marijuana do lose their drive however.

When does the question become what is the problem, the production/use or the law? The law creates a black market, creates criminals, results in the deaths of perps, innocents, and officers alike. It is not unlike alcohol during prohibition, that time when The Mob and other gangs grew tremendously in size.

And why is Hemp itself illegal to grow? A plant that doesn't create enough THC to smoke for pleasure. Anyone care to explain that one? You can make stuff such as blocks using hemp (Hempcrete) and Hemp Oil which can be used in paints, lubricants, fuel, plastics, soap, shampoo, detergents, and other things. Just to name a couple of things.

I'm guessing he doesn't own the property he's growing on. That is what makes it selfish. You unknowingly involve the landowner into your criminal enterprise.

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(02-05-2017 07:32 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(02-02-2017 12:11 AM)DexterDevil Wrote:  Why is it okay for pharma companies to get kids hooked to oxy but someone who wants to grow pot is a criminal? I've lost 3 friends to heroin, they started with medical oxy products prescribed to them in high school, I watched my aunt struggle to live without taking oxy that was prescribed to her, I haven't however lost anyone to weed, not from it or contributed by it, I've found that those that heavily use marijuana do lose their drive however.

Without addressing your other comments which I generally agree with... I have an issue with this.

1) How did pharma get them hooked? Doctors have to write prescriptions. I'm not saying pharma can't influence/encourage docs... but docs still have to write it.

Pharma companies send reps to doctors offices and hospitals pushing their products, they are not solely responsible as you say.

2) The person has to take it. When you pick up your meds, you get a note talking about the addictive nature of these drugs. You don't like it, don't take it. There are dozens of other medications that a physician should (and in the overwhelming percentage of cases do) prescribe before they get to Oxy, especially for 'kids.'

Most people trust their doctors not to put their life in harms way, to put the interest of the patient before themselves, so most don't read those notes and just go get it filled (which is absolutely a problem as well, people should learn to be more free thinking and aware)

My experience is not unique at all, though I'm not saying it represents anyone you know...

but generally speaking OXY is only prescribed for chronic or EXCEPTIONAL pain (like cancer). More often we get people coming in with non-descript pain symptoms who then claim that 'nothing else works for them'. 99 times out of 100, we STILL won't give it to them... Of course then we get bad patient satisfaction scores from them... and the government penalizes us as a result.

All were post surgery when they got the medication, organ issues and the such were what put them in there, in the case of my aunt she was raped and had intestinal problems, luckily she never went for anything harder and after 20 years was finally to kick every type of pill she was on

My point is that if the drug is legal, then it's not 'on big pharma' for making sure it isn't abused or doesn't 'hook' anyone. It's on docs, the people themselves and the government.

It's definitely a combination of factors

I agree with your comparison to pot... but the same is true of alcohol.

Dexter... Thanks for the polite response. I was not trying to 'call you out' and you thankfully didn't take it that way.

Every situation is unique for certain.

What's SUPPOSED to happen as WKU implied, is that the surgeon or ER doc is supposed to give you a short script and that is the end of it. They take you from that to other less addictive things fairly quickly. People have to go back again and again in order to get more meds... and of course, those sorts of things are monitored by the state and are pointed out to docs.... docs can be held personally liable in some instances.

This is a relatively new thing (past decade or so) and it seems your situation was before then...

Pain Management Clinics and similar can be bad news... and if they get their hooks into you, they're just like a Heroin dealer.

22 years old is a kid?

Was just speaking to one of my docs about this....

We agreed that 'pain management' in a hospital is supposed to take you from a 8 or 9 down to a 3 or 4. For chronic issues (like my back) I live every day at a 3.

Somewhere along the lines, we decided to make 'pain' a clinical indicator. The ACA then doubled down on it by making 'patient satisfaction' (INCLUDING pain management) a reimbursement issue.

If you're like me and have a back issue, or a variety of other ailments... you're NEVER going to be much better than a 2 or 3.

Suck it up, buttercup.