Merging the NIT to feed into the national bracket makes too much sense. You could, in theory, cut the field down in half and get your four over four days with the NIT, then come the "first four." The field kind of expands, still gives one-bid conference regular season champions some life, and you cut down the controversy of those last in/out shenanigans, because everyone is really still in.

The problem with that is...Those past few seasons where nearly or over half of the NIT field are their auto bids, and the at-large pool is sliced. But, I don't see how a full NIT could integrate into a combined field.

(01-30-2017 05:21 AM)exowlswimmer Wrote:  [quote='_C2_' pid='14043950' dateline='1485739045']
D-I reached a saturation point years ago.

About the time uh left the Lone Star Conference!
[/quote]

Amusing...not...

(01-30-2017 05:43 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  Merging the NIT to feed into the national bracket makes too much sense. You could, in theory, cut the field down in half and get your four over four days with the NIT, then come the "first four." The field kind of expands, still gives one-bid conference regular season champions some life, and you cut down the controversy of those last in/out shenanigans, because everyone is really still in.

The problem with that is...Those past few seasons where nearly or over half of the NIT field are their auto bids, and the at-large pool is sliced. But, I don't see how a full NIT could integrate into a combined field.

But why would you cut the field in half? Maybe slash a few teams but most of the teams that make the Dance deserve to be there and most of the rest earned their way via the autobid.

(01-29-2017 08:17 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  D-I reached a saturation point years ago.

Agreed.

And who knows, the Ivy might eventually take Johns Hopkins or MIT out of Div. III.

(01-29-2017 08:10 PM)shizzle787 Wrote:  As of 2018, there will be 353 Division 1 schools. Smaller conferences tend to be content with 10 schools. D-2 upgrades are only going to be able join conferences that have less than 10 schools. These conferences are (# of schools in parenthesis):
America East (9)
Atlantic Sun (9)
Big West (9)
WAC (9)

The Ivy is never expanding so there are only about 4 spots left in the D-1 arms race.
UC-San Diego seems like the leading candidate for the Big West, but who will fill the other three spots?

The P5 will soon break away completely and then there will be plenty of room left for the rest of us.

(01-30-2017 06:01 AM)_C2_ Wrote:  But why would you cut the field in half? Maybe slash a few teams but most of the teams that make the Dance deserve to be there and most of the rest earned their way via the autobid.

That's a relative, loose point, though. "Most of the teams" sometimes might cover 16. It could cover 20-25. It could be ten.

The constant is: there are teams that just don't belong in the NIT, period. The "filler." I mean, maybe you can add a few more by having a bye for top seeds to ensure the worst possible outcome (all single-bid auto-bid conference champs entering the NIT), but, I'd imagine any sort of "merge" would have to not add any/much time to the overall tournament. You'd already have to push the tournament back a week, or streamline the season to move the conference tournaments up a week to keep its place on the calendar. But, adding any extra rounds means extra days. In theory, you could do a field of sixteen to four in two days. You could also use the NIT to be rid of the 10/11/12-seed play-in's, and go back to the 66 field with the (gag me), 16-seed play-in's the Tuesday and Wednesday before Thursday opening round.

I would like to see the NIT become like the Women's NIT, a 64 team deal. It would kill off the CIT, CBI and the Vegas one. Top 16 seeds and regionalize the matchups to keep the travel costs down.

(01-30-2017 11:21 AM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  I would like to see the NIT become like the Women's NIT, a 64 team deal. It would kill off the CIT, CBI and the Vegas one. Top 16 seeds and regionalize the matchups to keep the travel costs down.

As a fan of a team that has been to the NIT a bunch of times in the last 15 years and the NCAA tournament one time.

Nobody cares about the NIT. We're 65th or well I guess 69th now.

I disagree about the saturation of schools at D1. It is more saturated mainly on the east coast. Mainly mid-Atlantic and southeast. Look at Pennsylvania? A large populated state, and not many schools at D1. They are mainly in the Pittsburgh and Philly area. New York could also need some more schools for that large of a state. Maine only have one. Vermont 1 with no football.

Kansas on north could do need some schools at the D1. It could help keep cost down.

Central Oklahoma -Edmond
Rogers State-Claremore
SW Oklahoma State-Weatherford
Cameron- Lawton
Oklahoma Baptist -Shawnee

Those are some large populated areas. Weatherford is the largest in west central Oklahoma.

Colorado Mesa and Colorado State-Pueblo are some nice choices to add where there is no D1 schools at.

Western Washington, Central Washington (Yakima area), Evergreen State (Olympia) are some good ones to add that are not have a school in D1. Pacific Lutheran and Puget Sound in Tacoma could be good choices.

Western Oregon, Willamette, Linfield, Oregon Tech and Eastern Oregon might work.

Montana State-Billings is more eastern part of Montana that could find a spot.

Black Hills State or South Dakota Mines in western South Dakota could have been a key to go with North Dakota in the Big Sky.

Dixie State, Azusa Pacific, Sonoma State, Humboldt State, Chico State and San Bernardino State could be place where other D1 schools are not at.

Arizona might look at making a couple of their 2 year schools into a four year. Mohave CC in Kingman with campuses in Bullhead City and Lake Havasu City. They have a large student body.
Arizona Western in Yuma is another one. That area from Lake Mohave all the way down to Yuma is growing very fast.

Washburn could be a travel partner for UMKC.

Fort Hays State could be for Northern Colorado. Even Chadron State or Nebraska-Kearney could be something to look at. Sioux Falls seems to be on the rise as well. And don't get me started on Minnesota.

(01-30-2017 12:28 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I disagree about the saturation of schools at D1. It is more saturated mainly on the east coast. Mainly mid-Atlantic and southeast. Look at Pennsylvania? A large populated state, and not many schools at D1. They are mainly in the Pittsburgh and Philly area. New York could also need some more schools for that large of a state. Maine only have one. Vermont 1 with no football.

Kansas on north could do need some schools at the D1. It could help keep cost down.

Central Oklahoma -Edmond
Rogers State-Claremore
SW Oklahoma State-Weatherford
Cameron- Lawton
Oklahoma Baptist -Shawnee

Those are some large populated areas. Weatherford is the largest in west central Oklahoma.

Colorado Mesa and Colorado State-Pueblo are some nice choices to add where there is no D1 schools at.

Western Washington, Central Washington (Yakima area), Evergreen State (Olympia) are some good ones to add that are not have a school in D1. Pacific Lutheran and Puget Sound in Tacoma could be good choices.

Western Oregon, Willamette, Linfield, Oregon Tech and Eastern Oregon might work.

Montana State-Billings is more eastern part of Montana that could find a spot.

Black Hills State or South Dakota Mines in western South Dakota could have been a key to go with North Dakota in the Big Sky.

Dixie State, Azusa Pacific, Sonoma State, Humboldt State, Chico State and San Bernardino State could be place where other D1 schools are not at.

Arizona might look at making a couple of their 2 year schools into a four year. Mohave CC in Kingman with campuses in Bullhead City and Lake Havasu City. They have a large student body.
Arizona Western in Yuma is another one. That area from Lake Mohave all the way down to Yuma is growing very fast.

Washburn could be a travel partner for UMKC.

Fort Hays State could be for Northern Colorado. Even Chadron State or Nebraska-Kearney could be something to look at. Sioux Falls seems to be on the rise as well. And don't get me started on Minnesota.

Please stop. None of those schools are going D1.

(01-30-2017 12:38 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(01-30-2017 12:28 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I disagree about the saturation of schools at D1. It is more saturated mainly on the east coast. Mainly mid-Atlantic and southeast. Look at Pennsylvania? A large populated state, and not many schools at D1. They are mainly in the Pittsburgh and Philly area. New York could also need some more schools for that large of a state. Maine only have one. Vermont 1 with no football.

Kansas on north could do need some schools at the D1. It could help keep cost down.

Central Oklahoma -Edmond
Rogers State-Claremore
SW Oklahoma State-Weatherford
Cameron- Lawton
Oklahoma Baptist -Shawnee

Those are some large populated areas. Weatherford is the largest in west central Oklahoma.

Colorado Mesa and Colorado State-Pueblo are some nice choices to add where there is no D1 schools at.

Western Washington, Central Washington (Yakima area), Evergreen State (Olympia) are some good ones to add that are not have a school in D1. Pacific Lutheran and Puget Sound in Tacoma could be good choices.

Western Oregon, Willamette, Linfield, Oregon Tech and Eastern Oregon might work.

Montana State-Billings is more eastern part of Montana that could find a spot.

Black Hills State or South Dakota Mines in western South Dakota could have been a key to go with North Dakota in the Big Sky.

Dixie State, Azusa Pacific, Sonoma State, Humboldt State, Chico State and San Bernardino State could be place where other D1 schools are not at.

Arizona might look at making a couple of their 2 year schools into a four year. Mohave CC in Kingman with campuses in Bullhead City and Lake Havasu City. They have a large student body.
Arizona Western in Yuma is another one. That area from Lake Mohave all the way down to Yuma is growing very fast.

Washburn could be a travel partner for UMKC.

Fort Hays State could be for Northern Colorado. Even Chadron State or Nebraska-Kearney could be something to look at. Sioux Falls seems to be on the rise as well. And don't get me started on Minnesota.

Please stop. None of those schools are going D1.

Then, all the schools at D1 will go bankrupt when the FCOAs and all that kicks in. Plus all the lawsuits that the NCAA and the schools are facing with all the rape scandals and head injuries and so forth. That is why I am seeing that the D1 will get larger as a safe guard in case they lose in court on many of these issues.

(01-30-2017 01:55 AM)DawgNBama Wrote:  5. Maybe Arkansas Tech could move up, but that's a big maybe. Who's a bigger name in Arkansas D2 football, Arkansas Tech or Harding? I really don't know, but I did take some juco classes with a former Harding football player once.

Over time, Tech is the bigger name. Harding has had a great run as their head coach is retiring, this was his last year. A friend who used to be in the newspaper business relates receiving a press release announcing that their former football coach was closing in on 100 wins, was getting fired up for a story until he realized it was the guy's 20th year as head coach there. :)

If Tech has investigated Division I, they've kept it super quiet.

Harding has been hoops crazy most of the time, have drawn very well. They made overtures to a number of Division I leagues several years back with the idea of joining Division I but playing football in the Pioneer as a non-scholarship.

When the Great America Conference formed in 2010 all the Division I talk ended.

(01-30-2017 12:52 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(01-30-2017 12:38 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(01-30-2017 12:28 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I disagree about the saturation of schools at D1. It is more saturated mainly on the east coast. Mainly mid-Atlantic and southeast. Look at Pennsylvania? A large populated state, and not many schools at D1. They are mainly in the Pittsburgh and Philly area. New York could also need some more schools for that large of a state. Maine only have one. Vermont 1 with no football.

Kansas on north could do need some schools at the D1. It could help keep cost down.

Central Oklahoma -Edmond
Rogers State-Claremore
SW Oklahoma State-Weatherford
Cameron- Lawton
Oklahoma Baptist -Shawnee

Those are some large populated areas. Weatherford is the largest in west central Oklahoma.

Colorado Mesa and Colorado State-Pueblo are some nice choices to add where there is no D1 schools at.

Western Washington, Central Washington (Yakima area), Evergreen State (Olympia) are some good ones to add that are not have a school in D1. Pacific Lutheran and Puget Sound in Tacoma could be good choices.

Western Oregon, Willamette, Linfield, Oregon Tech and Eastern Oregon might work.

Montana State-Billings is more eastern part of Montana that could find a spot.

Black Hills State or South Dakota Mines in western South Dakota could have been a key to go with North Dakota in the Big Sky.

Dixie State, Azusa Pacific, Sonoma State, Humboldt State, Chico State and San Bernardino State could be place where other D1 schools are not at.

Arizona might look at making a couple of their 2 year schools into a four year. Mohave CC in Kingman with campuses in Bullhead City and Lake Havasu City. They have a large student body.
Arizona Western in Yuma is another one. That area from Lake Mohave all the way down to Yuma is growing very fast.

Washburn could be a travel partner for UMKC.

Fort Hays State could be for Northern Colorado. Even Chadron State or Nebraska-Kearney could be something to look at. Sioux Falls seems to be on the rise as well. And don't get me started on Minnesota.

Please stop. None of those schools are going D1.

Then, all the schools at D1 will go bankrupt when the FCOAs and all that kicks in. Plus all the lawsuits that the NCAA and the schools are facing with all the rape scandals and head injuries and so forth. That is why I am seeing that the D1 will get larger as a safe guard in case they lose in court on many of these issues.

Just stop please............

I have to admit, part of me wishes Washburn would move up. They're the only one in KS that I believe has actually talked about it in the past.

(01-30-2017 01:32 PM)utpotts Wrote:  

(01-30-2017 12:52 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(01-30-2017 12:38 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(01-30-2017 12:28 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I disagree about the saturation of schools at D1. It is more saturated mainly on the east coast. Mainly mid-Atlantic and southeast. Look at Pennsylvania? A large populated state, and not many schools at D1. They are mainly in the Pittsburgh and Philly area. New York could also need some more schools for that large of a state. Maine only have one. Vermont 1 with no football.

Kansas on north could do need some schools at the D1. It could help keep cost down.

Central Oklahoma -Edmond
Rogers State-Claremore
SW Oklahoma State-Weatherford
Cameron- Lawton
Oklahoma Baptist -Shawnee

Those are some large populated areas. Weatherford is the largest in west central Oklahoma.

Colorado Mesa and Colorado State-Pueblo are some nice choices to add where there is no D1 schools at.

Western Washington, Central Washington (Yakima area), Evergreen State (Olympia) are some good ones to add that are not have a school in D1. Pacific Lutheran and Puget Sound in Tacoma could be good choices.

Western Oregon, Willamette, Linfield, Oregon Tech and Eastern Oregon might work.

Montana State-Billings is more eastern part of Montana that could find a spot.

Black Hills State or South Dakota Mines in western South Dakota could have been a key to go with North Dakota in the Big Sky.

Dixie State, Azusa Pacific, Sonoma State, Humboldt State, Chico State and San Bernardino State could be place where other D1 schools are not at.

Arizona might look at making a couple of their 2 year schools into a four year. Mohave CC in Kingman with campuses in Bullhead City and Lake Havasu City. They have a large student body.
Arizona Western in Yuma is another one. That area from Lake Mohave all the way down to Yuma is growing very fast.

Washburn could be a travel partner for UMKC.

Fort Hays State could be for Northern Colorado. Even Chadron State or Nebraska-Kearney could be something to look at. Sioux Falls seems to be on the rise as well. And don't get me started on Minnesota.

Please stop. None of those schools are going D1.

Then, all the schools at D1 will go bankrupt when the FCOAs and all that kicks in. Plus all the lawsuits that the NCAA and the schools are facing with all the rape scandals and head injuries and so forth. That is why I am seeing that the D1 will get larger as a safe guard in case they lose in court on many of these issues.

Just stop please............

Ditto!

thank you.

(01-30-2017 12:38 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(01-30-2017 12:28 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I disagree about the saturation of schools at D1. It is more saturated mainly on the east coast. Mainly mid-Atlantic and southeast. Look at Pennsylvania? A large populated state, and not many schools at D1. They are mainly in the Pittsburgh and Philly area. New York could also need some more schools for that large of a state. Maine only have one. Vermont 1 with no football.

Kansas on north could do need some schools at the D1. It could help keep cost down.

Central Oklahoma -Edmond
Rogers State-Claremore
SW Oklahoma State-Weatherford
Cameron- Lawton
Oklahoma Baptist -Shawnee

Those are some large populated areas. Weatherford is the largest in west central Oklahoma.

Colorado Mesa and Colorado State-Pueblo are some nice choices to add where there is no D1 schools at.

Western Washington, Central Washington (Yakima area), Evergreen State (Olympia) are some good ones to add that are not have a school in D1. Pacific Lutheran and Puget Sound in Tacoma could be good choices.

Western Oregon, Willamette, Linfield, Oregon Tech and Eastern Oregon might work.

Montana State-Billings is more eastern part of Montana that could find a spot.

Black Hills State or South Dakota Mines in western South Dakota could have been a key to go with North Dakota in the Big Sky.

Dixie State, Azusa Pacific, Sonoma State, Humboldt State, Chico State and San Bernardino State could be place where other D1 schools are not at.

Arizona might look at making a couple of their 2 year schools into a four year. Mohave CC in Kingman with campuses in Bullhead City and Lake Havasu City. They have a large student body.
Arizona Western in Yuma is another one. That area from Lake Mohave all the way down to Yuma is growing very fast.

Washburn could be a travel partner for UMKC.

Fort Hays State could be for Northern Colorado. Even Chadron State or Nebraska-Kearney could be something to look at. Sioux Falls seems to be on the rise as well. And don't get me started on Minnesota.

Please stop. None of those schools are going D1.

(01-30-2017 05:43 AM)The Cutter of Bish Wrote:  Merging the NIT to feed into the national bracket makes too much sense. You could, in theory, cut the field down in half and get your four over four days with the NIT, then come the "first four." The field kind of expands, still gives one-bid conference regular season champions some life, and you cut down the controversy of those last in/out shenanigans, because everyone is really still in.

The problem with that is...Those past few seasons where nearly or over half of the NIT field are their auto bids, and the at-large pool is sliced. But, I don't see how a full NIT could integrate into a combined field.

Know why the NCAA bought the NIT? The NIT was suing to block the rule that requires any school invited to the NCAA Tournament to either play in the NCAA Tournament or stay home.

Why does that matter?

Quite likely because I did a war game scenario for a former employer where the NIT was owned and operated by a specific group of conferences who would place their regular season and tournament champions in the NIT. There would be four regional qualifying tournaments that send either the two finalists or the four semi-finalists into the field providing access for non-members of the group. There would also be a number of at-large spots to fill as well.

Straight-up a replacement for the NCAA Tournament. The little recognized part of the NCAA Tournament is that not a huge portion of the revenue is paid out of the performance pool (basketball units), most of it goes to fund NCAA operations keeping the dues ridiculously low for the services provided.

The NCAA needed to head that lawsuit off to keep the rule on the books and make it harder to create a basketball version of the BCS that was owned and operated by the schools on a low overhead budget.

They could walk out today create an exact carbon copy of the NCAA Tournament and simply not sending over half of the revenue to operate the NCAA would result in a windfall even with the smallest conferences still taking a 1/124th share of the revenue for a one and done.

(01-30-2017 12:52 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(01-30-2017 12:38 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote:  

(01-30-2017 12:28 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  I disagree about the saturation of schools at D1. It is more saturated mainly on the east coast. Mainly mid-Atlantic and southeast. Look at Pennsylvania? A large populated state, and not many schools at D1. They are mainly in the Pittsburgh and Philly area. New York could also need some more schools for that large of a state. Maine only have one. Vermont 1 with no football.

Kansas on north could do need some schools at the D1. It could help keep cost down.

Central Oklahoma -Edmond
Rogers State-Claremore
SW Oklahoma State-Weatherford
Cameron- Lawton
Oklahoma Baptist -Shawnee

Those are some large populated areas. Weatherford is the largest in west central Oklahoma.

Colorado Mesa and Colorado State-Pueblo are some nice choices to add where there is no D1 schools at.

Western Washington, Central Washington (Yakima area), Evergreen State (Olympia) are some good ones to add that are not have a school in D1. Pacific Lutheran and Puget Sound in Tacoma could be good choices.

Western Oregon, Willamette, Linfield, Oregon Tech and Eastern Oregon might work.

Montana State-Billings is more eastern part of Montana that could find a spot.

Black Hills State or South Dakota Mines in western South Dakota could have been a key to go with North Dakota in the Big Sky.

Dixie State, Azusa Pacific, Sonoma State, Humboldt State, Chico State and San Bernardino State could be place where other D1 schools are not at.

Arizona might look at making a couple of their 2 year schools into a four year. Mohave CC in Kingman with campuses in Bullhead City and Lake Havasu City. They have a large student body.
Arizona Western in Yuma is another one. That area from Lake Mohave all the way down to Yuma is growing very fast.

Washburn could be a travel partner for UMKC.

Fort Hays State could be for Northern Colorado. Even Chadron State or Nebraska-Kearney could be something to look at. Sioux Falls seems to be on the rise as well. And don't get me started on Minnesota.

Please stop. None of those schools are going D1.

Then, all the schools at D1 will go bankrupt when the FCOAs and all that kicks in. Plus all the lawsuits that the NCAA and the schools are facing with all the rape scandals and head injuries and so forth. That is why I am seeing that the D1 will get larger as a safe guard in case they lose in court on many of these issues.

so you think schools will be sued for head injuries and go bankrupt trying to support FCOA and you answer is have D2 schools add football? Wouldnt did just add to their problems? If anything under your scenario schools would be more likely to drop FB and thus save costs and reduce injuries

C-USA will add 12 more and increase the TV contract by 4 dollars and 28 cents.

(01-31-2017 12:24 AM)Noodles Wrote:  C-USA will add 12 more and increase the TV contract by 4 dollars and 28 cents.

Don't give them any ideas.