The unofficial online home for fans of the Western Michigan University Broncos. Part of Collegiate Sports Nation (CSN).

Let that sink in for a minute as we stew over the way Fleck and recruits left. Maybe that was it, we blew our proverbial load on a 13-1 season. Maybe we come back better than ever under new leadership. The point is Western Michigan football achieved far more than anyone could imagine.

I meant to revisit this last point when NIU brought up the G5 playoff idea, which I was a proponent of weeks ago (G5 & p5 8 teams each). As great as our team was this season we are light years away from the talent, coaching and resources that make Clemson and Alabama what they are. I realistically don't think we have a chance vs the teams ranked ahead of Wisconsin. It is what it is. Despite our best effort this lifetime it's not good enough.
Time to separate the 128 teams. There are teams that don't have a shot, never have, never will. In College football there are about 30 programs that have a realistic shot at a championship in about a 50 year period. Even P5 teams like the Vandys, Rutgers, Kansas are just there to fill out their conferences.
"But if you have a G5 playoff it will be a JV championship" Does N Dakota St apologize for winning 5 without beating Alabama? It is what it is, the sooner we recognize that the sooner we could move toward more fulfilling ends to our season. Does anybody care that western was in the Bahamas Bowl? Or next year will anyone outside of Michigan and Wisconsin remember who played in this Cotton Bowl? People complain about the multitude of crappy bowl games. Wouldn't a playoff with WMU, Navy, Boise St, SDSU, Ohio, Temple, WKU & Houston be more compelling? I'm ok with the other fan bases not giving a rats ass. IF YOU HAVENT NOTICED, THEY ALREADY DON'T.

P.S. 'But BYU won it all once'. Yes 1984, way before mid level P5 head coaches made $21million over 6 years. And the divide between power 5 and group of 5 is much wider since the college football playoff started. With 4 teams playing for it all good luck to Boise St or NIU or Houston anyone else in these "lesser" conferences On cracking the top 4 ranking. Not happening. Not sure how long fans can hope for a mythical shot to win it all? I would take the JV championship in a real competitive playoff format.

Delete thread.

From the title it appears you're going to go in the exact opposite direction of where you ended up up going.

G5 playoff is the worst idea ever to be brought up. The parity and rise and fall of programs has never been better.

Could we have beaten bama or clemson? Not this year - but maybe next or the next or the next. You never know, programs rise and fall. But get out of here with G5 playoff. The

We lost by one score to a top ten team and you want to relegate us to a weaker subdivision just for the sake of trying to go undefeated? Get out.

G5 isn't going to their own playoff, P5 is expanding playoff. With hundreds of millions jumping up for grabs four team limit is changing. Michigan has $100m invested in pigskin dept, if they don't make final 4 next year Jimmy gonna run again for the Sunday game when he figures out the odds are stacked in D1 football

(01-10-2017 09:32 AM)fastbuicks Wrote:  G5 isn't going to their own playoff, P5 is expanding playoff. With hundreds of millions jumping up for grabs four team limit is changing. Michigan has $100m invested in pigskin dept, if they don't make final 4 next year Jimmy gonna run again for the Sunday game when he figures out the odds are stacked in D1 football

Michigan loses almost its entire defense.

It was only the 3rd best team in its Big Ten Division this year. It likely will NOT make the Final 4 playoff next year, unless it is just for ratings purposes (see OSU's invite this year).

(01-10-2017 07:51 AM)lancergolf1 Wrote:  Delete thread.

From the title it appears you're going to go in the exact opposite direction of where you ended up up going.

G5 playoff is the worst idea ever to be brought up. The parity and rise and fall of programs has never been better.

Could we have beaten bama or clemson? Not this year - but maybe next or the next or the next. You never know, programs rise and fall. But get out of here with G5 playoff. The

You want me to delete a thread because of the truth? Because I didn't want to spout some crap on how close we really can be at making the CFP? I reflected on what is now the past. Get over it. I can be positive yet skeptical at the same time. Realistic is the word.
What would it take for Western Michigan to beat any of the top 6 or 8 teams this year? Parity? Back to back championships with the same 2 teams. OSU another top recruiting class, they aren't going down. The parity is between teams 15-25. Look at the way too early rankings for next season. FSU, Bama, OSU, Penn St, Florida, USC, Clemson, Michigan again. There are numerous opinions from people who know a hell of a lot more than I that believe the opposite of parity is happening.
I'm now 41. WMU has never had a season like this and may never again. For a team to essentially not be able to make a playoff from the get go is a real problem. If Western wins at USC and MSU next year and goes undefeated in MAC that's still not a top 4 pedigree. Better than NU & Illinois but not enough. Need about 3 wins against top 10-15 teams + undefeated in MAC. Does anyone see that on the upcoming schedules?

(01-10-2017 08:11 AM)SonOfGoldBlooded Wrote:  We lost by one score to a top ten team and you want to relegate us to a weaker subdivision just for the sake of trying to go undefeated? Get out.

I mentioned nothing of being undefeated as a goal. The ultimate goal is a championship. Something that we by default are not qualified for in 2017, 2018, 2019 & 2020. We are relegated to MAC bowl tie ins and a token NY6 bowl. Call that what you want.
It's like talking to my ex wife in this forum. I know what I say and what she processes are 2 completely different things.

I think if we beat USC and an improved MSU and ran the table we would be getting at a minimum heavy discussion for the playoffs. Now that isn't going to happen, but that's a different discussion.

One Score *

* - Wisconsin had a another one if they wanted it but took a knee.

(01-10-2017 11:39 AM)Carolina Rocket Wrote:  One Score *

* - Wisconsin had a another one if they wanted it but took a knee.

We also gave them the ball at the 50 yard line by trying an onside kick with 3 minutes left.

In any other circumstance in the game, they'd have to go the length of the field for a TD, something they failed to do after the first quarter.

We gave up 4 points when the ball hit one of our WRers in the hands in the end zone and he didn't catch it-we settled for a FG. If, if, if.....

The final score was 24-16, I can live with that.

(01-10-2017 11:33 AM)wmubroncopilot Wrote:  I think if we beat USC and an improved MSU and ran the table we would be getting at a minimum heavy discussion for the playoffs. Now that isn't going to happen, but that's a different discussion.

That is worthy of discussion. Looking forward USC looks to be a top 10 team. Say MSU gets up to a possible 6-6 or 8-4 that's maybe a top 15 team at best. Idaho and Wagner do nothing for us. Maybe a team like Toledo gets top 25 consideration, another MAC school on our schedule receives some votes.
If we could miraculously run the table after losing multiple key components it's still not good enough to be considered when SEC, ACC & B1G teams routinely play 4-5 ranked teams.
Maybe 2018 is the year, huge matchup with GA St. 2019 Ga St, MSU & Monmouth. So next year is the best shot at a top 10 ranking in the foreseeable future, still far short of a top 4 schedule.
The politics of the P5 CFP system cannot be underestimated. They don't want us on their turf. People have a tough time with that. I hate it. Enjoy a real competitive playoff with teams of like abilities. I don't see the problem with that. We will never get the level of talent on the field or coaching to get there.

I'll take the occasional toe-to-toe with the big boys. If you're only concerned with being named a national champion why not just drop to FCS?

Our D played pretty well, but our O (yes, I realize it was Wisconsin) wasn't quite up to it's full potential. However, in many games, regardless of the opponent, our O could light on fire or sputter for a couple drives, which did give me frustration and worry going into big bowl season (whether we'd play in Cotton or a fellow power G5).

Either way, I expected our O to be a bit better, and our D to be not quite as good as they were.

(01-10-2017 01:37 AM)WMUlaxer97 Wrote:  Time to separate the 128 teams. There are teams that don't have a shot, never have, never will. In College football there are about 30 programs that have a realistic shot at a championship in about a 50 year period. Even P5 teams like the Vandys, Rutgers, Kansas are just there to fill out their conferences.

"But if you have a G5 playoff it will be a JV championship" Does N Dakota St apologize for winning 5 without beating Alabama? It is what it is, the sooner we recognize that the sooner we could move toward more fulfilling ends to our season. Does anybody care that western was in the Bahamas Bowl? Or next year will anyone outside of Michigan and Wisconsin remember who played in this Cotton Bowl? People complain about the multitude of crappy bowl games. Wouldn't a playoff with WMU, Navy, Boise St, SDSU, Ohio, Temple, WKU & Houston be more compelling? I'm ok with the other fan bases not giving a rats ass. IF YOU HAVENT NOTICED, THEY ALREADY DON'T.

No. Just NO!!! H@ll no.

This would be like willingly separating ourselves into a separate division. Might as well just drop to FCS, then.

Read this and then think. It is written by a former MAC sportswriter (EMU grad) who now lives in OK. What you are advocating is creating a G5 ghetto.

http://www.enidnews.com/sports/football/...c829c.html

Liking the idea of a G5 playoff seems cool at first. But it would definitely without question put us in another separate sub-division. And when The playoff expands in the near future, a G5 won't have a chance at a national championship. Even not having a full-blown auto-bid in an 8-team playoff, every once good in a while a G5 will be able to make it, being in the Top 8-10. So you'd have to nix that, too.

IMO, in 8-12 years there'll be a 12-team playoff -- basically taking the whole NY6 and making a 12-team playoff -- giving an auto-bid to the G5. So no, you don't want to separate the G5 & P5 in different subdivisions purely for a cool playoff.

The *BEST* strategy I think is to ditch the current bowl structure, and to go the way of NCAA Basketball post-season... and have separate Playoffs. They could each be bowl championship series.

Basically the National Championship Series of an 8 (later 12-team) playoff for the National Championship...

... and 4 or 5 different 8-team bowl championship series of different sponsors, some with different themes LIKE a Pure G5 battle. Another one maybe pitting two conferences against each other (like the B1G vs ACC challenge in basketball).

... and the remaining teams being in POS bowls as usual. :)

[/quote]

No. Just NO!!! H@ll no.

This would be like willingly separating ourselves into a separate division. Might as well just drop to FCS, then.

Read this and then think. It is written by a former MAC sportswriter (EMU grad) who now lives in OK. What you are advocating is creating a G5 ghetto.

http://www.enidnews.com/sports/football/...c829c.html
[/quote]

"The answer is an emphatic no," said AAC commissioner Mike Aresco, whose conference includes the University of Tulsa. "We compete for national championships like anyone else in FBS, including the Power 5, and have no interest in any kind of separate championship," he told McMurphy.
Delusional comment of that piece. Nobody from G5 is really competing for the national championship in the CFP because they've already been excluded through this system.
The editor even included this definition at the onset
ghetto (definition): restricted, isolated or segregated area or group conferring inferior status or limiting opportunity
I thought he was going to expound on how and why this is the current situation we find the G5 in and what can be done for equality. Ruthenberg uses his forum as editor to not so objectively shred the idea. Instead of examining the pros and cons of a G5 playoff. Typical modern day media. It sadly smacks of a jealous hit piece on McMurphy and ESPN.com.

Read the recent thread on how much WMU really profited on the cotton bowl. Do you believe a "pay day" minus expenses for bringing along the band, administration and ancillary costs is better than potentially 3 more weeks of national exposure and valuable post season practices in a 8 team competition. I thought it was great that we made it to the Cotton Bowl. But something about it seemed not good enough. Like we were relegated to inferior status matched up against the B1G runner up. Token NY6, GHETTO or a moral victory for being there. Call it what you want that's what we were RESTRICTED to.

Milehighbronco I found this piece of real journalism that explores the situation in depth. Not just a couple quotes from G5 ADs, admin and an editor who hate the idea of a separate playoff. It's a couple years old but he examines all aspects as well as potential solutions. 5 parts but a quick read.
http://www.sportingnews.com/ncaa-footbal...h46mditvr8

Here's a small nugget from that article that drives home the problem. With regards to 9 G5 undefeated teams. Notice the only team that might have been considered for CFP, that team moved up to P5.

Those schools went 7-2 in the postseason with five BCS bowl wins, but none of those teams were given a shot at the BCS championship. The Horned Frogs are the only team that would've made the current four-team playoff.

(01-10-2017 07:51 AM)lancergolf1 Wrote:  Delete thread.

From the title it appears you're going to go in the exact opposite direction of where you ended up up going.

G5 playoff is the worst idea ever to be brought up. The parity and rise and fall of programs has never been better.

Could we have beaten bama or clemson? Not this year - but maybe next or the next or the next. You never know, programs rise and fall. But get out of here with G5 playoff. The

http://usat.ly/1LlEiPu
Of the programs that defined this era(BCS), only Boise State remains in the Group of Five; TCU has gone to the Big 12 Conference, Utah to the Pac-12 Conference and Brigham Young to independent status, robbing the Group of Five of three standard-bearers.
The gap between the Power Five and the Group of Five has widened considerably in the year since, even as a few teams from the latter have stepped off impressively during the first month-plus of the 2015 season.

Parity, right