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Official Game Thread: VMI
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CaptainJackAubrey Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI
Holy smokes that was FUN.

OK crowd for a holiday. The boys looked GOOD. Surgical precision. I like when they have fun on the court. That chemistry and days like today are invaluable.

11-3.
12-31-2016 06:17 PM
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JWBUC Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI
Fun game

Saw some fans walking in thinking it was a 4 pm game.

They missed a good show

Go Bucs
12-31-2016 07:08 PM
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swvabucsfan Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI
Peter got cheered when he went in. Fans like him.

But in the first half we got a perfect little demonstration of the problems in using him.

Hanner failed to stop 6-10 VMI frosh Tyler Creammer on one inside move and Forbes put Jurkin in at 5:25 to nice applause. The Bucs were leading 37-25.

Peter promptly stopped Creammer's next move.

But after a couple times down the Court, VMI went all small with 6-6 Jr Armani Branch their big guy, Jurkin's man to defend. Branch promptly goes to the perimeter 2 successive times down the court, Jurkin fails to get out to defend effectively and Branch promptly sinks 2 3's to cut the lead in half, 41-35.

Jurkin does do what he does well and makes a little shot over the VMI defense and Jason Williams makes 2 free throws, so the lead goes back out to 10 points, 45-35, before Forbes can get Banks back in for Peter.

VMI promptly tries the same trick against Banks - but of course he gets out quickly and stops Branch from getting off the 3.

And all the Jurkin sceptics say "we told you so"!

In fairness, Peter had a more effective turn the second half, winding up with 6 points (2-4 from the floor, 0-1 from 3, 2-2 from the line), a rebound and a nice steal diving to the floor in 11 minutes, all told. I still think we should use him, but the risks are there.
(This post was last modified: 12-31-2016 11:12 PM by swvabucsfan.)
12-31-2016 07:17 PM
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swvabucsfan Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI
By far the best game for Jason Williams and Jermaine Long. Defense, assists, rebounding, and... for the first time since their arrival... good offense!!! IF they can continue in this vein against the better teams in the SoCon, Forbes choice of these guys over JUCO All-American Julian Walters will have been justified.

Williams: 21 minutes, 6 points (1-4 from the field, 4-4 from the line), 6 rebounds, 5 assists, 3 t.o.'s, 2 steals, and a smiling, confident job of driving the ball hard up the court and going to the rim at every opportunity. For all his offensive skills, Walters sometimes seemed more of a half court type guy.
Long: even more surprising, 10 minutes, 9 points (2-2 from the field 5-6 from the line), 3 rebounds, 2 assists, 0 t.o.'s. The first time all season that Long has seemed comfortable on offense. A high scorer, but low percentage shooter, in the JUCO ranks, this is VERY good to see. Maybe, like Desonta last year, Long has to find out what his quick, athletic body is capable of.

The only caveat - this WAS VMI, folks. Dylan Reppart looks studly against them (7 points in 4 minutes, 2-2 from the field 1-1 from 3 and 2-3 from the line). Every other team in the SoCon presents more challenges than we saw this afternoon.
(This post was last modified: 12-31-2016 07:42 PM by swvabucsfan.)
12-31-2016 07:41 PM
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Buc'ed_Up Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI
(12-31-2016 01:51 PM)Bucs06 Wrote:  Attendance today is not good.

Ironically, more people at this game (3051) than the Savannah St. game (2768)
12-31-2016 07:53 PM
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Bucfaithful Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI


12-31-2016 10:10 PM
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posterformerlyknownasthedoctor Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI
(12-31-2016 12:48 PM)Just Buc Wrote:  There is nothing to "nail down." PJ is the 5th big in a 4 man rotation pure and simple. Nothing more than skills. Doesn't matter if he's 7' or 5'. The growing obsession with this is becoming comical especially with the conspiratorial secrets aspect now injected. And Forbes doesn't owe anybody an explanation just because they buy a ticket.

First of all, yes, you're *technically* correct to say that Forbes doesn't owe us an explanation. But we all know that. And yes, we're hyper-sensitive to these kinds of issues because of the nonsense bartow put us thru for A LONG FREAKING TIME. bartow didn't "owe" us explanations, either, but yet we suffered thru his years of obfuscatory coachspeak and maddeningly awful coaching "decisions". And then he had the gall to criticize the fact that some fans were leaving early in an already-lost fiasco of an embarrassing loss. You can't have it both ways. And no, to be clear, Forbes is not this way, is unlikely to become like that, and I think we're all quite happy with him in charge here - despite what you attempt to portray our attitudes as.

All *THAT* said......there is this unwritten, non-formal "contract" between a university, it's athletics team, and it's fans. The fans give money, voluntarily, to support athletic programs, and they buy tickets to support athletic programs. The fans, for the most part, enjoy this, and continue to do it. The university benefits, obviously, financially. The players, at least ostensibly, get an education. Yet the players are still individuals, with rights to privacy, both personally and academically. So, no, Forbes technically owes us nothing, on such specific issues. But without "us", there is no Forbes, and there is not much of an intercollegiate athletics program. So it behooves the athletics administration to at least keep the fans modestly informed, so that they know what they're "getting into" (and "getting in to" (haha)) when they buy tickets, or help provide scholarships, etc.

With all that as background, what was the big difference today between this game and Savannah St.'s, in terms of Jurkin's PT? He played 11 minutes today (vs. HMP's 15), vs. 0 in the previous game, which although not quite as much a blowout, was as easily in hand by the middle of the second half. I don't know the answer, but I bet there is one that's more than you proffer. And listen, I'm not one of the huge PJ apologists on here. I'm pretty positive that I'm the first one who months ago pointed out his slow foot speed makes him less of an asset than otherwise. In fact, I may have mentioned that last season, but I'm not gonna go back and search for it. And in general, I'm actually a big fan of allowing the coach his 'freedom' to manage minutes as he sees fit. That's what he's there for. I don't *quite* agree he's the 5th man on a 4-man rotation, however, because: a) he and Banks do different things; and b) he and Burrell do different things; and c) he and Glass do different things, although their (his and Glass's) roles are pretty close. But anyway, I'm not going to argue he's "more valuable" than any of those. (Although I personally think he's a bigger help than Banks **in some situations**, but I know most here wouldn't agree with that.)

Now, further, with *that* said, your viewpoint doesn't jive with what Trey quoted Forbes as saying about Jurkin in practice. And since now Forbes has VERY forcefully said a player has to earn his PT in practice, something isn't adding up. Has Forbes been reading this board and decided to let us have our man? Could be. I don't know. But you don't just let a guy sit when you're up 20+ against Savannah St., and then put him in for good stretches 2 days later against VMI in a similar situation without some underlying cause. There's almost certainly more to it than we can see. And that's ok, too, but I really think Forbes *should* have brought it up, if a "reporter" wasn't going to.
01-01-2017 02:24 AM
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posterformerlyknownasthedoctor Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI
(12-31-2016 07:41 PM)swvabucsfan Wrote:  By far the best game for Jason Williams and Jermaine Long. Defense, assists, rebounding, and... for the first time since their arrival... good offense!!! IF they can continue in this vein against the better teams in the SoCon, Forbes choice of these guys over JUCO All-American Julian Walters will have been justified.

Williams: 21 minutes, 6 points (1-4 from the field, 4-4 from the line), 6 rebounds, 5 assists, 3 t.o.'s, 2 steals, and a smiling, confident job of driving the ball hard up the court and going to the rim at every opportunity. For all his offensive skills, Walters sometimes seemed more of a half court type guy.
Long: even more surprising, 10 minutes, 9 points (2-2 from the field 5-6 from the line), 3 rebounds, 2 assists, 0 t.o.'s. The first time all season that Long has seemed comfortable on offense. A high scorer, but low percentage shooter, in the JUCO ranks, this is VERY good to see. Maybe, like Desonta last year, Long has to find out what his quick, athletic body is capable of.

The only caveat - this WAS VMI, folks. Dylan Reppart looks studly against them (7 points in 4 minutes, 2-2 from the field 1-1 from 3 and 2-3 from the line). Every other team in the SoCon presents more challenges than we saw this afternoon.

Good comments, swvabucsfan, both in this post and the previous one about Jurkin. I have a feeling Forbes reined in Long's more aggressive passing ideas for the time being, as he hasn't tried any of the elaborate stuff in the last few games. And as you say, and as I pointed out earlier, Williams got a lot of his points in h.s. from driving and creating stuff. I think now he's getting comfortable enough (and Forbes agrees) to let that part of his game come out. And as I also pointed out, Williams may not be as useful against some of the bigger guards we'll encounter. Remains to be seen how he'll defend them. But he has a broader palette of skills than Petey, one of which is scoring ability. We're no longer going 4-on-5 at times like last year. But Petey was one tough cookie. So also remains to be seen how Williams hangs in there when it gets a bit rough.

But no doubt that this game was perfectly timed for both Long and Williams to gain confidence and maturity which hopefully will pay off down the line.
01-01-2017 02:42 AM
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posterformerlyknownasthedoctor Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI
posterformerlyknownasthedoctor ("Bluenanza tonight" thread):

Quote:...Even before that, I was carefully taking the measure of the team's attitude and closeness, and I must say both those completely pass the eyeball test. Although it pretty much goes without saying, I think Forbes is largely responsible for that. The players, to a man, seemed to have a joy, and even a love for each other that seemed almost impossible to believe, due to all the newcomers. And yet it was there. I couldn't help wondering how much less of that there would have been had bartow still been in command. If the elusive "team chemistry" that I worry about from year to year can be predicted by what we witnessed tonight, that will *not* be a problem. (Of course it's a bit more than that, but what a huge head start!)

.....And finally, I just *have* to say it one more time - I was rather strongly impressed by the enthusiasm, camaraderie, and sense of joy that seemed to fully infect each and every player. Really fun to see.

Jason Williams (JC Press):
Quote:“I’m having fun,” Williams said. “This is the best team I’ve been on. The chemistry’s crazy. Everybody’s really together. It feels good.
01-01-2017 02:53 AM
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seagrove10 Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI
I don't *quite* agree he's the 5th man on a 4-man rotation, however, because: a) he and Banks do different things; and b) he and Burrell do different things; and c) he and Glass do different things, although their (his and Glass's) roles are pretty close. But anyway, I'm not going to argue he's "more valuable" than any of those. (Although I personally think he's a bigger help than Banks **in some situations**, but I know most here wouldn't agree with that.)

Our fan group (3 of us that have never coached but think we've seen enough BB to comment) feels that if Coach wanted to run some zone then Peter could be used more effectively. He wouldn't necessarily have to have as much "foot speed" and his size would take up a lot of space.

Notice I said "if Coach wanted to".
01-01-2017 08:16 AM
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RodShaw2 Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI
(01-01-2017 02:24 AM)posterformerlyknownasthedoctor Wrote:  With all that as background, what was the big difference today between this game and Savannah St.'s, in terms of Jurkin's PT? He played 11 minutes today (vs. HMP's 15), vs. 0 in the previous game, which although not quite as much a blowout, was as easily in hand by the middle of the second half. I don't know the answer, but I bet there is one that's more than you proffer.
.

Well VMI had a 6'10 240 pound not very athletic center that PJ could keep up with. Savannah St didn't. You notice as soon as VMI put the other guy in he stepped out on Jurkin and started popping threes.
He is limited in who can play against.
01-01-2017 01:20 PM
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posterformerlyknownasthedoctor Offline
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Post: #32
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI
(01-01-2017 01:20 PM)RodShaw2 Wrote:  
(01-01-2017 02:24 AM)posterformerlyknownasthedoctor Wrote:  With all that as background, what was the big difference today between this game and Savannah St.'s, in terms of Jurkin's PT? He played 11 minutes today (vs. HMP's 15), vs. 0 in the previous game, which although not quite as much a blowout, was as easily in hand by the middle of the second half. I don't know the answer, but I bet there is one that's more than you proffer.
.

Well VMI had a 6'10 240 pound not very athletic center that PJ could keep up with. Savannah St didn't. You notice as soon as VMI put the other guy in he stepped out on Jurkin and started popping threes.
He is limited in who can play against.

Well yes, and I've been making that point all along, even last year - and I think moreso than most here. I'm talking about later on in the second half, when he could have gotten some PT without risk.
01-01-2017 01:48 PM
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posterformerlyknownasthedoctor Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Official Game Thread: VMI
I know I should wait and post this when the Keydets visit Freedom Hall, but since I'll likely forget at that time:

Feb. 25, 1991, VMI @ ETSU, in the Dome........

Attendance: 12,208.

Simply amazing.
01-03-2017 01:54 AM
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