(12-18-2016 05:33 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(12-18-2016 04:32 PM)Bearcatbdub Wrote:  

(12-18-2016 04:27 PM)bulldog23 Wrote:  

(12-18-2016 03:55 PM)Bearcatbdub Wrote:  The only time Cumberland has looked good this year has been against crap competition. When he starts doing it against good competition, thats when it's time for him to start. I will be the first person to endorse him. But he's not there yet.

cumberland didn't make the schedule. he looked better last year in high school than kj would ever look. if we had play KY in tournament, i would take my chances with cumberland on monk over kj.

Yeah. If I had to choose between Cumberland and the Wolverine to fight the evil Magneto, I'd probably pick Cumberland, too.

it wouldn't matter....Monk would drop 30 on us regardless of who Mick threw at him

I don't know, it's usually the crappy shooters who go unconscious with the threes against us
Having said that, Monk is a lot of fun to watch, if we see them in the tournament, maybe someone should pull a Tonya Harding on him.


As for the Cumberland bit, he's not that good yet. The last several games bear that out. We'd all love it if the kid could be good enough to start, but the most he can do this season is be a microwave offensively. Kind of like what SK did here at first. He'll get better, he'll be a lot like Kilpatrick and by the time he leaves, who knows? Could well be another All American. The reality is though, we live in the present. In the present, Johnson is pretty decent and Caupain with Jenifer in as point periodically, does good enough at the 2.

(12-18-2016 04:27 PM)bulldog23 Wrote:  

(12-18-2016 03:55 PM)Bearcatbdub Wrote:  The only time Cumberland has looked good this year has been against crap competition. When he starts doing it against good competition, thats when it's time for him to start. I will be the first person to endorse him. But he's not there yet.

cumberland didn't make the schedule. he looked better last year in high school than kj would ever look. if we had play KY in tournament, i would take my chances with cumberland on monk over kj.

Mr. Cumberland, your kid will be a starter, just probably not this season.

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(12-18-2016 04:27 PM)bulldog23 Wrote:  

(12-18-2016 03:55 PM)Bearcatbdub Wrote:  The only time Cumberland has looked good this year has been against crap competition. When he starts doing it against good competition, thats when it's time for him to start. I will be the first person to endorse him. But he's not there yet.

cumberland didn't make the schedule. he looked better last year in high school than kj would ever look. if we had play KY in tournament, i would take my chances with cumberland on monk over kj.

He looked better in High school against High school kids than KJ ever would? What does that even mean? If you have not noticed this is High level D1 basketball, and he is not nearly ready to start and play major minutes.

Come on guys he is a Freshman. The best things about Freshman is they become Sophomores.

Not many players are polished as Freshman SK spent a year at prep school then red shirted a year.

The only first year player I have seen at UC in 60 years of watching that was almost as good first year as his last year was "O".

(12-17-2016 03:49 PM)nati streets Wrote:  

(12-17-2016 03:40 PM)Recluse1 Wrote:  Again, not taking into context who did what vs what opponent, Kevin Johnson is 4-7, 2-4 from 3, with 3 assists, no turnovers and having gone 5-8 from the line for a total of 15 points at half today.
Cumberland meanwhile, is scoreless.

I mean look, he's not detracting from offense these past 5-6 games, so I really don't get what we're complaining about here.
Cumberland isn't consistent on either side of the ball right now and putting him in doesn't fix our problems.

The complaint is Cumberland will not get better without more PT. He will not get that PT unless you bench KJ. But when we play horrible teams KJ looks brilliant because the competition is so poor, and he pours in a bunch of points we dont need. It distracts the coaching staff and fans from the real potential this team could have.

I really like KJ, and wish he could put up these types of performances against more competent teams- but unfortunately he will not be as productive as Cumberland. So give Cumberland the start.

JJ improved immensely watching from the bench. He barely got any minutes last year once we got into conference. So you can't say that about Cumberlin. Obviously, Scott improved watching last year.

(12-19-2016 02:25 AM)Edgebrookjeff Wrote:  

(12-17-2016 03:49 PM)nati streets Wrote:  

(12-17-2016 03:40 PM)Recluse1 Wrote:  Again, not taking into context who did what vs what opponent, Kevin Johnson is 4-7, 2-4 from 3, with 3 assists, no turnovers and having gone 5-8 from the line for a total of 15 points at half today.
Cumberland meanwhile, is scoreless.

I mean look, he's not detracting from offense these past 5-6 games, so I really don't get what we're complaining about here.
Cumberland isn't consistent on either side of the ball right now and putting him in doesn't fix our problems.

The complaint is Cumberland will not get better without more PT. He will not get that PT unless you bench KJ. But when we play horrible teams KJ looks brilliant because the competition is so poor, and he pours in a bunch of points we dont need. It distracts the coaching staff and fans from the real potential this team could have.

I really like KJ, and wish he could put up these types of performances against more competent teams- but unfortunately he will not be as productive as Cumberland. So give Cumberland the start.

JJ improved immensely watching from the bench. He barely got any minutes last year once we got into conference. So you can't say that about Cumberlin. Obviously, Scott improved watching last year.

I'd say Washington is another example. He's a much more polished player than he was at NC State. The idea that players don't improve from the bench is silly. Practice is probably the place where players improve the most.

So let's put kj on the bench until tournament time and see if he improves. Kj is the worst starter on any top #25 team.

(12-19-2016 08:55 AM)bulldog23 Wrote:  So let's put kj on the bench until tournament time and see if he improves. Kj is the worst starter on any top #25 team.

Hey Bulldog, how many times have you been banned over on BearcatTalk for dissing KJ like this and other things.......

(12-19-2016 08:55 AM)bulldog23 Wrote:  So let's put kj on the bench until tournament time and see if he improves. Kj is the worst starter on any top #25 team.

Or we could just accept that he's the best option at the 2 for the moment and get over it.
I choose b, because I'm an adult and recognize he's the hot hand right now. If at some point Cumberland surpasses him or Jenifer can play point all game allowing Caupain to play off the ball, great. Until then though, it is what it is.

I like KJ as a 20-25 minutes a game starter on this team. His game is harder to appreciate because he is a below average offensive 2 guard, but he's been great defensively. What he does in the matchup zone is fun to watch if you like watching the little things on defense. Hopefully he starts making open 3s more often. If he could shoot 35% or so from outside that's all we'd really need from him with his defense and fairly solid 2 point shooting.

(12-19-2016 10:11 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  I like KJ as a 20-25 minutes a game starter on this team. His game is harder to appreciate because he is a below average offensive 2 guard, but he's been great defensively. What he does in the matchup zone is fun to watch if you like watching the little things on defense. Hopefully he starts making open 3s more often. If he could shoot 35% or so from outside that's all we'd really need from him with his defense and fairly solid 2 point shooting.

KJ is the ONLY guard on this team who understands how to effectively double DOWN on a big and help on the boxout when the other team's bigs are bigger than ours.

Mark, I agree with you. There is one heck of a lot more to a 2 guard than shooting 3's.

(12-18-2016 05:54 PM)subflea Wrote:  

(12-18-2016 04:27 PM)bulldog23 Wrote:  

(12-18-2016 03:55 PM)Bearcatbdub Wrote:  The only time Cumberland has looked good this year has been against crap competition. When he starts doing it against good competition, thats when it's time for him to start. I will be the first person to endorse him. But he's not there yet.

cumberland didn't make the schedule. he looked better last year in high school than kj would ever look. if we had play KY in tournament, i would take my chances with cumberland on monk over kj.

Mr. Cumberland, your kid will be a starter, just probably not this season.

Sent from my SM-N920P using CSNbbs mobile app

Bulldog isn't Mr. Cumberland, however he is a legend over at bearcattalk!

(12-19-2016 10:40 AM)QSECOFR Wrote:  

(12-19-2016 10:11 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  I like KJ as a 20-25 minutes a game starter on this team. His game is harder to appreciate because he is a below average offensive 2 guard, but he's been great defensively. What he does in the matchup zone is fun to watch if you like watching the little things on defense. Hopefully he starts making open 3s more often. If he could shoot 35% or so from outside that's all we'd really need from him with his defense and fairly solid 2 point shooting.

KJ is the ONLY guard on this team who understands how to effectively double DOWN on a big and help on the boxout when the other team's bigs are bigger than ours.

Mark, I agree with you. There is one heck of a lot more to a 2 guard than shooting 3's.

I dont agree with this. I think KJ does it way too often when it isnt necessary. 1 example would be when he decided to double the post on an inbound pass leaving his man leading to a game winning Rhode Island 3. That would be an example of not understanding

(12-19-2016 10:11 AM)bearcatmark Wrote:  I like KJ as a 20-25 minutes a game starter on this team. His game is harder to appreciate because he is a below average offensive 2 guard, but he's been great defensively. What he does in the matchup zone is fun to watch if you like watching the little things on defense. Hopefully he starts making open 3s more often. If he could shoot 35% or so from outside that's all we'd really need from him with his defense and fairly solid 2 point shooting.

I just disagree on this - if he was great defensively, he'd get a rebound every now and then.

Bad shooter, bad rebounder, bad passer, turns it over too much, on d - pretty good on the ball (still needs to create more turnovers/blocks ).

Our games against Rhode Island and Butler emphasize, we will lose before the sweet 16 if KJ still is our 2 unless he gets much much better.

Our two losses he took 13 shots, scored 7 points had 3 rebounds, 2 assists, and 3 turnovers in 59 minutes of play. We don't pass the ball in these games and KJ's the prime reason why IMO.

Our other 4 starters 30/18/0, 18/18/2, 34/9/7, 39/11/1 - if you're on the floor for you D , be more like Immanuel McElroy and pass the ball, he needs to double his assist and rebound counts to be the type of player he is and not kill us.

(12-19-2016 09:36 AM)CincyBro Wrote:  

(12-19-2016 08:55 AM)bulldog23 Wrote:  So let's put kj on the bench until tournament time and see if he improves. Kj is the worst starter on any top #25 team.

Hey Bulldog, how many times have you been banned over on BearcatTalk for dissing KJ like this and other things.......

Bulldog, I really hope that you aren't related to Jarron. By all accounts, he seems like a great kid, and he's going to develop into a fan favorite at UC - I can sense that already. If you read through the thread, the intensity of your opinion is an outlier, and your KJ bashing is on the verge of getting a little too extreme. I hope you'll cool your jets a bit.

(12-19-2016 12:05 PM)geef Wrote:  

(12-19-2016 09:36 AM)CincyBro Wrote:  

(12-19-2016 08:55 AM)bulldog23 Wrote:  So let's put kj on the bench until tournament time and see if he improves. Kj is the worst starter on any top #25 team.

Hey Bulldog, how many times have you been banned over on BearcatTalk for dissing KJ like this and other things.......

Bulldog, I really hope that you aren't related to Jarron. By all accounts, he seems like a great kid, and he's going to develop into a fan favorite at UC - I can sense that already. If you read through the thread, the intensity of your opinion is an outlier, and your KJ bashing is on the verge of getting a little too extreme. I hope you'll cool your jets a bit.

Good post. I really like Cumberland. He is going to have a great career for UC and hopefully will be a key bench guy capable of scoring against good competition as the year goes on. Even if he is a defensive liability now, UC has the players to overcome that. He's going to get plenty of chances throughout the year and just because KJ fits better as a starter now doesn't mean people are down on Cumberland. He's shown flashes of being the explosive player many thought he could be and his career is just getting going.

American MBB
‏@American_MBB
Cumberland averaged a team-high 14.5 points and shot 64.7 percent in a pair of @GoBearcatsMBB wins

and since we are on KJ here.....

And which guard from UC who totally befuddled Taco Fall last year when UC played UCF? None other than Kevin Johnson. Watch the first half of that game. Gary doubled across the lane on Fall and it was ineffective. In the 2nd half, Kevin doubled down on Fall and helped UC win the game without scoring a point.

(12-19-2016 03:34 PM)QSECOFR Wrote:  And which guard from UC who totally befuddled Taco Fall last year when UC played UCF? None other than Kevin Johnson. Watch the first half of that game. Gary doubled across the lane on Fall and it was ineffective. In the 2nd half, Kevin doubled down on Fall and helped UC win the game without scoring a point.

Good point, maybe we can slide Tre over to the 2 to guard Burrito Johnson this year.

(12-18-2016 04:32 PM)Bearcatbdub Wrote:  

(12-18-2016 04:27 PM)bulldog23 Wrote:  

(12-18-2016 03:55 PM)Bearcatbdub Wrote:  The only time Cumberland has looked good this year has been against crap competition. When he starts doing it against good competition, thats when it's time for him to start. I will be the first person to endorse him. But he's not there yet.

cumberland didn't make the schedule. he looked better last year in high school than kj would ever look. if we had play KY in tournament, i would take my chances with cumberland on monk over kj.

Yeah. If I had to choose between Cumberland and the Wolverine to fight the evil Magneto, I'd probably pick Cumberland, too.

LOL

Your response is a great example of dealing with ridiculous subject in an appropriately ridiculous way.