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Government Waste
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VA49er Offline
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Post: #1
Government Waste
The waste is enormous. Remember this each time some Congress person mentions the need to raise a current or create a new tax.

This is just one Department.

Pentagon buries evidence of $125 billion in bureaucratic waste

Snippet:

Quote:The Pentagon has buried an internal study that exposed $125 billion in administrative waste in its business operations amid fears Congress would use the findings as an excuse to slash the defense budget, according to interviews and confidential memos obtained by The Washington Post.

Pentagon leaders had requested the study to help make their enormous back-office bureaucracy more efficient and reinvest any savings in combat power. But after the project documented far more wasteful spending than expected, senior defense officials moved swiftly to kill it by discrediting and suppressing the results.
12-06-2016 09:21 AM
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Niner National Offline
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RE: Government Waste
On top of the trillion + the Pentagon lost in the not so distant past.

The Pentagon is a cesspool of waste and political favors.
12-06-2016 10:04 AM
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VA49er Offline
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RE: Government Waste
(12-06-2016 10:04 AM)Niner National Wrote:  On top of the trillion + the Pentagon lost in the not so distant past.

The Pentagon is a cesspool of waste and political favors.

Yep, and I am pretty sure that level of waste isn't just confined to one government agency/department, etc.
12-06-2016 10:05 AM
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UTSAMarineVet09 Offline
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RE: Government Waste
most transparent administration evah!!!
12-06-2016 10:26 AM
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Bull_Is_Back Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Government Waste
(12-06-2016 09:21 AM)VA49er Wrote:  The waste is enormous. Remember this each time some Congress person mentions the need to raise a current or create a new tax.

This is just one Department.

Pentagon buries evidence of $125 billion in bureaucratic waste

Snippet:

Quote:The Pentagon has buried an internal study that exposed $125 billion in administrative waste in its business operations amid fears Congress would use the findings as an excuse to slash the defense budget, according to interviews and confidential memos obtained by The Washington Post.

Pentagon leaders had requested the study to help make their enormous back-office bureaucracy more efficient and reinvest any savings in combat power. But after the project documented far more wasteful spending than expected, senior defense officials moved swiftly to kill it by discrediting and suppressing the results.

And the dreaded sequester was.... ** 85 Billion **
12-06-2016 10:53 AM
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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Post: #6
RE: Government Waste
Trump need to be a commander in chief...not a puzzy in chief. Make the Pentagon toe the line and be efficient.
12-06-2016 12:20 PM
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olliebaba Offline
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RE: Government Waste
(12-06-2016 12:20 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  Trump need to be a commander in chief...not a puzzy in chief. Make the Pentagon toe the line and be efficient.

…and any government entity that is spending money on parties, vacations with our money. That just irks me to no end. Anyone doing that in the future should be fired immediately and made to repay the money. I'll bet it wouldn't happen again.
12-06-2016 04:46 PM
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UTSAMarineVet09 Offline
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Post: #8
RE: Government Waste
(12-06-2016 04:46 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 12:20 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  Trump need to be a commander in chief...not a puzzy in chief. Make the Pentagon toe the line and be efficient.

…and any government entity that is spending money on parties, vacations with our money. That just irks me to no end. Anyone doing that in the future should be fired immediately and made to repay the money. I'll bet it wouldn't happen again.

does this include all parties?

I was thinking holiday parties are ok, as long as they dont go over a certain budget.
12-06-2016 04:48 PM
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olliebaba Offline
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RE: Government Waste
(12-06-2016 04:48 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 04:46 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 12:20 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  Trump need to be a commander in chief...not a puzzy in chief. Make the Pentagon toe the line and be efficient.

…and any government entity that is spending money on parties, vacations with our money. That just irks me to no end. Anyone doing that in the future should be fired immediately and made to repay the money. I'll bet it wouldn't happen again.

does this include all parties?

I was thinking holiday parties are ok, as long as they dont go over a certain budget.


No, everyone has parties just not the ones that costs thousands if not millions of dollars from our pockets.
12-06-2016 04:51 PM
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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Post: #10
RE: Government Waste
(12-06-2016 04:48 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 04:46 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 12:20 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  Trump need to be a commander in chief...not a puzzy in chief. Make the Pentagon toe the line and be efficient.

…and any government entity that is spending money on parties, vacations with our money. That just irks me to no end. Anyone doing that in the future should be fired immediately and made to repay the money. I'll bet it wouldn't happen again.

does this include all parties?

I was thinking holiday parties are ok, as long as they dont go over a certain budget.

Other than official government diplomatic functions at high levels and White House functions? If you want a holiday party at your bureaucratic office?...Pay for it yourself. I have no real inclination to pay for your fun. There is really no reason for you to expect the taxpayers to foot the bill for this IMO.
12-07-2016 06:47 AM
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VA49er Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Government Waste
(12-07-2016 06:47 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 04:48 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 04:46 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 12:20 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  Trump need to be a commander in chief...not a puzzy in chief. Make the Pentagon toe the line and be efficient.

…and any government entity that is spending money on parties, vacations with our money. That just irks me to no end. Anyone doing that in the future should be fired immediately and made to repay the money. I'll bet it wouldn't happen again.

does this include all parties?

I was thinking holiday parties are ok, as long as they dont go over a certain budget.

Other than official government diplomatic functions at high levels and White House functions? If you want a holiday party at your bureaucratic office?...Pay for it yourself. I have no real inclination to pay for your fun. There is really no reason for you to expect the taxpayers to foot the bill for this IMO.

Eh, I don't really have an issue with a simple holiday party. Now flying everyone to Barbados for a party is a different issue altogether.
12-07-2016 10:08 AM
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QuestionSocratic Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Government Waste
(12-06-2016 10:04 AM)Niner National Wrote:  The Pentagon is a cesspool of waste and political favors.

Yes.

How many bases are open simply because they are in a powerful Congressman's district? How many weapons programs exist not because the military wants then but because they are manufactured in some powerful Congressman's district?

Too much oink in the defense budget.
12-07-2016 10:24 AM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Government Waste
(12-07-2016 10:24 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 10:04 AM)Niner National Wrote:  The Pentagon is a cesspool of waste and political favors.
Yes.
How many bases are open simply because they are in a powerful Congressman's district? How many weapons programs exist not because the military wants then but because they are manufactured in some powerful Congressman's district?
Too much oink in the defense budget.

I think the F-35 has subcontractors in something like 47 states and 400 congressional districts. That is enough to ensure a steady stream of overpriced and underperforming combat aircraft. The pilot cannot see behind him because his view is blocked by the housing for the vertical lift fan (which is only installed on the STOVL version, but the same structure is there for all versions). No problem, he has this handy-dandy helmet with displays that show what is going on behind him. Except that so far the helmet doesn't work. The Eurofighter Typhoon and Saab Gripen have helmets that do almost as much as the F-35 pilot helmet. Except they work. And, oh yeah, almost forgot, the pilot can actually see behind him if they don't.

We have the LCS, which supposedly replaces the Knox/Perry ASW frigates. It does 45 knots, which is cute. But it's engines are too noisy for it to do ASW. And it's "big" gun is a 57-mm (2-1/4 inches) that can't be fired accurately when the ship is at speed because the platform is not stable enough. It's also supposed to do mine countermeasures, but so far the MCM module does not work, plus how much sense does it make to put an expensive asset into that role, when sweeps are historically viewed as throwaway vessels? It's supposed to cost $450 million a pop, but so far it's coming in closer to $750 million a pop. For that money, we could have a far more capable Horizon or FREMM or Nansen or Huitfieldt or Type 124, or a little bit more for an F-105 or a Daring. So far none have passed a proper shock test, because the fear is that a standard shock test would essentially destroy all the mission-capable equipment (assuming there is anything that is mission-capable). And so far, every one that has deployed has ended up being towed home. Plus we have gotten rid of all the Knoxes and Perrys, and we are laying up the Ticonderogas, in order to make room in the fleet for the LCSs.

Or the Ford aircraft carriers that cost twice as much as their predecessors ($13 billion versus $6 billion), carry 1/3 fewer aircraft, and so far everything works except the catapults and the arresting gear.

This stuff is hard to make up. Europe--yes, Europe--is getting more bang for the buck out of its military procurement because they are designing and building to budget and we are not.
(This post was last modified: 12-07-2016 12:16 PM by Owl 69/70/75.)
12-07-2016 12:13 PM
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Fo Shizzle Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Government Waste
(12-07-2016 10:08 AM)VA49er Wrote:  
(12-07-2016 06:47 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 04:48 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 04:46 PM)olliebaba Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 12:20 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  Trump need to be a commander in chief...not a puzzy in chief. Make the Pentagon toe the line and be efficient.

…and any government entity that is spending money on parties, vacations with our money. That just irks me to no end. Anyone doing that in the future should be fired immediately and made to repay the money. I'll bet it wouldn't happen again.

does this include all parties?

I was thinking holiday parties are ok, as long as they dont go over a certain budget.

Other than official government diplomatic functions at high levels and White House functions? If you want a holiday party at your bureaucratic office?...Pay for it yourself. I have no real inclination to pay for your fun. There is really no reason for you to expect the taxpayers to foot the bill for this IMO.

Eh, I don't really have an issue with a simple holiday party. Now flying everyone to Barbados for a party is a different issue altogether.

Im against any and all misappropriation of the stolen fruits of our labors..from office parties to driving government vehicles on non government business. It is theft just like stealing office supplies.
12-07-2016 12:23 PM
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hoopfan Offline
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Post: #15
RE: Government Waste
(12-07-2016 12:13 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(12-07-2016 10:24 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 10:04 AM)Niner National Wrote:  The Pentagon is a cesspool of waste and political favors.
Yes.
How many bases are open simply because they are in a powerful Congressman's district? How many weapons programs exist not because the military wants then but because they are manufactured in some powerful Congressman's district?
Too much oink in the defense budget.

I think the F-35 has subcontractors in something like 47 states and 400 congressional districts. That is enough to ensure a steady stream of overpriced and underperforming combat aircraft. The pilot cannot see behind him because his view is blocked by the housing for the vertical lift fan (which is only installed on the STOVL version, but the same structure is there for all versions). No problem, he has this handy-dandy helmet with displays that show what is going on behind him. Except that so far the helmet doesn't work. The Eurofighter Typhoon and Saab Gripen have helmets that do almost as much as the F-35 pilot helmet. Except they work. And, oh yeah, almost forgot, the pilot can actually see behind him if they don't.

We have the LCS, which supposedly replaces the Knox/Perry ASW frigates. It does 45 knots, which is cute. But it's engines are too noisy for it to do ASW. And it's "big" gun is a 57-mm (2-1/4 inches) that can't be fired accurately when the ship is at speed because the platform is not stable enough. It's also supposed to do mine countermeasures, but so far the MCM module does not work, plus how much sense does it make to put an expensive asset into that role, when sweeps are historically viewed as throwaway vessels? It's supposed to cost $450 million a pop, but so far it's coming in closer to $750 million a pop. For that money, we could have a far more capable Horizon or FREMM or Nansen or Huitfieldt or Type 124, or a little bit more for an F-105 or a Daring. So far none have passed a proper shock test, because the fear is that a standard shock test would essentially destroy all the mission-capable equipment (assuming there is anything that is mission-capable). And so far, every one that has deployed has ended up being towed home. Plus we have gotten rid of all the Knoxes and Perrys, and we are laying up the Ticonderogas, in order to make room in the fleet for the LCSs.

Or the Ford aircraft carriers that cost twice as much as their predecessors ($13 billion versus $6 billion), carry 1/3 fewer aircraft, and so far everything works except the catapults and the arresting gear.

This stuff is hard to make up. Europe--yes, Europe--is getting more bang for the buck out of its military procurement because they are designing and building to budget and we are not.

Trump said last night that he was going to end the sequester. Maybe we will now build budgets again.
12-07-2016 03:00 PM
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Niner National Offline
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Post: #16
RE: Government Waste
(12-07-2016 12:13 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(12-07-2016 10:24 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 10:04 AM)Niner National Wrote:  The Pentagon is a cesspool of waste and political favors.
Yes.
How many bases are open simply because they are in a powerful Congressman's district? How many weapons programs exist not because the military wants then but because they are manufactured in some powerful Congressman's district?
Too much oink in the defense budget.

I think the F-35 has subcontractors in something like 47 states and 400 congressional districts. That is enough to ensure a steady stream of overpriced and underperforming combat aircraft. The pilot cannot see behind him because his view is blocked by the housing for the vertical lift fan (which is only installed on the STOVL version, but the same structure is there for all versions). No problem, he has this handy-dandy helmet with displays that show what is going on behind him. Except that so far the helmet doesn't work. The Eurofighter Typhoon and Saab Gripen have helmets that do almost as much as the F-35 pilot helmet. Except they work. And, oh yeah, almost forgot, the pilot can actually see behind him if they don't.

We have the LCS, which supposedly replaces the Knox/Perry ASW frigates. It does 45 knots, which is cute. But it's engines are too noisy for it to do ASW. And it's "big" gun is a 57-mm (2-1/4 inches) that can't be fired accurately when the ship is at speed because the platform is not stable enough. It's also supposed to do mine countermeasures, but so far the MCM module does not work, plus how much sense does it make to put an expensive asset into that role, when sweeps are historically viewed as throwaway vessels? It's supposed to cost $450 million a pop, but so far it's coming in closer to $750 million a pop. For that money, we could have a far more capable Horizon or FREMM or Nansen or Huitfieldt or Type 124, or a little bit more for an F-105 or a Daring. So far none have passed a proper shock test, because the fear is that a standard shock test would essentially destroy all the mission-capable equipment (assuming there is anything that is mission-capable). And so far, every one that has deployed has ended up being towed home. Plus we have gotten rid of all the Knoxes and Perrys, and we are laying up the Ticonderogas, in order to make room in the fleet for the LCSs.

Or the Ford aircraft carriers that cost twice as much as their predecessors ($13 billion versus $6 billion), carry 1/3 fewer aircraft, and so far everything works except the catapults and the arresting gear.

This stuff is hard to make up. Europe--yes, Europe--is getting more bang for the buck out of its military procurement because they are designing and building to budget and we are not.
Let's not forget the tanks the military said it didn't need, but congress approved anyway because some congressman needed to keep jobs in his district in Ohio.

I wonder how many millions of jobs rely on military spending?
12-07-2016 03:50 PM
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olliebaba Offline
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Post: #17
RE: Government Waste
(12-07-2016 03:50 PM)Niner National Wrote:  
(12-07-2016 12:13 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(12-07-2016 10:24 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  
(12-06-2016 10:04 AM)Niner National Wrote:  The Pentagon is a cesspool of waste and political favors.
Yes.
How many bases are open simply because they are in a powerful Congressman's district? How many weapons programs exist not because the military wants then but because they are manufactured in some powerful Congressman's district?
Too much oink in the defense budget.

I think the F-35 has subcontractors in something like 47 states and 400 congressional districts. That is enough to ensure a steady stream of overpriced and underperforming combat aircraft. The pilot cannot see behind him because his view is blocked by the housing for the vertical lift fan (which is only installed on the STOVL version, but the same structure is there for all versions). No problem, he has this handy-dandy helmet with displays that show what is going on behind him. Except that so far the helmet doesn't work. The Eurofighter Typhoon and Saab Gripen have helmets that do almost as much as the F-35 pilot helmet. Except they work. And, oh yeah, almost forgot, the pilot can actually see behind him if they don't.

We have the LCS, which supposedly replaces the Knox/Perry ASW frigates. It does 45 knots, which is cute. But it's engines are too noisy for it to do ASW. And it's "big" gun is a 57-mm (2-1/4 inches) that can't be fired accurately when the ship is at speed because the platform is not stable enough. It's also supposed to do mine countermeasures, but so far the MCM module does not work, plus how much sense does it make to put an expensive asset into that role, when sweeps are historically viewed as throwaway vessels? It's supposed to cost $450 million a pop, but so far it's coming in closer to $750 million a pop. For that money, we could have a far more capable Horizon or FREMM or Nansen or Huitfieldt or Type 124, or a little bit more for an F-105 or a Daring. So far none have passed a proper shock test, because the fear is that a standard shock test would essentially destroy all the mission-capable equipment (assuming there is anything that is mission-capable). And so far, every one that has deployed has ended up being towed home. Plus we have gotten rid of all the Knoxes and Perrys, and we are laying up the Ticonderogas, in order to make room in the fleet for the LCSs.

Or the Ford aircraft carriers that cost twice as much as their predecessors ($13 billion versus $6 billion), carry 1/3 fewer aircraft, and so far everything works except the catapults and the arresting gear.

This stuff is hard to make up. Europe--yes, Europe--is getting more bang for the buck out of its military procurement because they are designing and building to budget and we are not.
Let's not forget the tanks the military said it didn't need, but congress approved anyway because some congressman needed to keep jobs in his district in Ohio.

I wonder how many millions of jobs rely on military spending?


In El Paso, a LOT!
12-07-2016 05:36 PM
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HarmonOliphantOberlanderDevine Offline
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Post: #18
RE: Government Waste
Easy way to cut government waste. Only spend money on things in the Constitution.

Bye bye welfare, benefits. Etc
12-07-2016 08:13 PM
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