https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2016/...icies.html

Probably will happen, the current CAFE regulations are too stringent. Market for electric and hybrid cars have barely grown, but automakers are forced to provide more and more in order to meet CAFE standards.

Good. Hopefully I can pay cash for a cheap new car again someday.

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(12-04-2016 07:14 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  Good. Hopefully I can pay cash for a cheap new car again someday.

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Not going to happen. They just want to roll back regulations to increase profits, not lower costs to the consumer.

(12-04-2016 09:27 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 07:14 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  Good. Hopefully I can pay cash for a cheap new car again someday.

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Not going to happen. They just want to roll back regulations to increase profits, not lower costs to the consumer.

That isn't the auto industry. Ford and Chevy would much rather people buy new cars. Their problem is they can't produce them where people can afford them. If someone only has $5,000, they are getting a used car and Ford and Chevy get schit other maybe 0.5% if one of their dealerships happened to sell it.

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(12-04-2016 09:36 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:27 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 07:14 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  Good. Hopefully I can pay cash for a cheap new car again someday.

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Not going to happen. They just want to roll back regulations to increase profits, not lower costs to the consumer.

That isn't the auto industry. Ford and Chevy would much rather people buy new cars. Their problem is they can't produce them where people can afford them. If someone only has $5,000, they are getting a used car and Ford and Chevy get schit other maybe 0.5% if one of their dealerships happened to sell it.

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I'm sorry but I don't buy that for a second. No pun. People ARE buying new cars. New car sales have increased by nearly 40% since 2010. There's no justification for automakers to lower costs to the consumer. I just don't see it. It's fools gold to think costs will drop. Rolling this back will just line their pockets. Not yours.

(12-04-2016 09:46 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:36 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:27 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 07:14 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  Good. Hopefully I can pay cash for a cheap new car again someday.

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Not going to happen. They just want to roll back regulations to increase profits, not lower costs to the consumer.

That isn't the auto industry. Ford and Chevy would much rather people buy new cars. Their problem is they can't produce them where people can afford them. If someone only has $5,000, they are getting a used car and Ford and Chevy get schit other maybe 0.5% if one of their dealerships happened to sell it.

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I'm sorry but I don't buy that for a second. No pun. People ARE buying new cars. New car sales have increased by nearly 40% since 2010. There's no justification for automakers to lower costs to the consumer. I just don't see it. It's fools gold to think costs will drop. Rolling this back will just line their pockets. Not yours.

People are buying new cars, but a lot more would. They sell debt and a lot of people aren't buying it. Cash for Clunkers helped them by driving up the cost of used cars, but I'd still rather buy a $5,000 used car with 50k miles than go into debt for 5 years to by a $28k Civic or Cavalier. Those cars were under $9k off the lot not too long ago. There is a large market for someone to make a lot of money of regulations are rolled back. It might or might not be Ford or Chevy, but I wonder what it would cost to make a '97 Civic. With today's technology, you could probably make and sell one for $5k max and make good margins. All the patents have expired. CAFE and, the global warming bullschot other bs regulations are what prevent it.

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(12-04-2016 09:54 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:46 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:36 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:27 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 07:14 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  Good. Hopefully I can pay cash for a cheap new car again someday.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

Not going to happen. They just want to roll back regulations to increase profits, not lower costs to the consumer.

That isn't the auto industry. Ford and Chevy would much rather people buy new cars. Their problem is they can't produce them where people can afford them. If someone only has $5,000, they are getting a used car and Ford and Chevy get schit other maybe 0.5% if one of their dealerships happened to sell it.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

I'm sorry but I don't buy that for a second. No pun. People ARE buying new cars. New car sales have increased by nearly 40% since 2010. There's no justification for automakers to lower costs to the consumer. I just don't see it. It's fools gold to think costs will drop. Rolling this back will just line their pockets. Not yours.

People are buying new cars, but a lot more would. They sell debt and a lot of people aren't buying it. Cash for Clunkers helped them by driving up the cost of used cars, but I'd still rather buy a $5,000 used car with 50k miles than go into debt for 5 years to by a $28k Civic or Cavalier. Those cars were under $9k off the lot not too long ago.

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Just heard where the average new car price was around $35k. Entirely absurd. I don't want to hear anyone complain about health care costs again.

(12-04-2016 09:59 PM)dfarr Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:54 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:46 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:36 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:27 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  Not going to happen. They just want to roll back regulations to increase profits, not lower costs to the consumer.

That isn't the auto industry. Ford and Chevy would much rather people buy new cars. Their problem is they can't produce them where people can afford them. If someone only has $5,000, they are getting a used car and Ford and Chevy get schit other maybe 0.5% if one of their dealerships happened to sell it.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

I'm sorry but I don't buy that for a second. No pun. People ARE buying new cars. New car sales have increased by nearly 40% since 2010. There's no justification for automakers to lower costs to the consumer. I just don't see it. It's fools gold to think costs will drop. Rolling this back will just line their pockets. Not yours.

People are buying new cars, but a lot more would. They sell debt and a lot of people aren't buying it. Cash for Clunkers helped them by driving up the cost of used cars, but I'd still rather buy a $5,000 used car with 50k miles than go into debt for 5 years to by a $28k Civic or Cavalier. Those cars were under $9k off the lot not too long ago.

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Just heard where the average new car price was around $35k. Entirely absurd. I don't want to hear anyone complain about health care costs again.

I own both my cars free and clear. They are '04s and neither has ever given us a problem that I couldn't solve for $30 at Auto Zone and less than an hour and a half of work.

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(12-04-2016 09:54 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:46 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:36 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:27 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 07:14 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  Good. Hopefully I can pay cash for a cheap new car again someday.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

Not going to happen. They just want to roll back regulations to increase profits, not lower costs to the consumer.

That isn't the auto industry. Ford and Chevy would much rather people buy new cars. Their problem is they can't produce them where people can afford them. If someone only has $5,000, they are getting a used car and Ford and Chevy get schit other maybe 0.5% if one of their dealerships happened to sell it.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

I'm sorry but I don't buy that for a second. No pun. People ARE buying new cars. New car sales have increased by nearly 40% since 2010. There's no justification for automakers to lower costs to the consumer. I just don't see it. It's fools gold to think costs will drop. Rolling this back will just line their pockets. Not yours.

People are buying new cars, but a lot more would. They sell debt and a lot of people aren't buying it. Cash for Clunkers helped them by driving up the cost of used cars, but I'd still rather buy a $5,000 used car with 50k miles than go into debt for 5 years to by a $28k Civic or Cavalier. Those cars were under $9k off the lot not too long ago. There is a large market for someone to make a lot of money of regulations are rolled back. It might or might not be Ford or Chevy, but I wonder what it would cost to make a '97 Civic. With today's technology, you could probably make and sell one for $5k max and make good margins. All the patents have expired. CAFE and, the global warming bullschot other bs regulations are what prevent it.

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Hey I want you to understand that I totally agree cars are too expensive. But the point is that auto manufacturers are NOT seeking to roll back cafe regulations to decrease said consumer costs. They only want it to increase profits. Making a '97 civic will hurt their profit margins. Don't be duped into supporting the roll back thinking it'll save you or any other consumer money. It most certainly will not.

(12-04-2016 11:12 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:54 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:46 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:36 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:27 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  Not going to happen. They just want to roll back regulations to increase profits, not lower costs to the consumer.

That isn't the auto industry. Ford and Chevy would much rather people buy new cars. Their problem is they can't produce them where people can afford them. If someone only has $5,000, they are getting a used car and Ford and Chevy get schit other maybe 0.5% if one of their dealerships happened to sell it.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

I'm sorry but I don't buy that for a second. No pun. People ARE buying new cars. New car sales have increased by nearly 40% since 2010. There's no justification for automakers to lower costs to the consumer. I just don't see it. It's fools gold to think costs will drop. Rolling this back will just line their pockets. Not yours.

People are buying new cars, but a lot more would. They sell debt and a lot of people aren't buying it. Cash for Clunkers helped them by driving up the cost of used cars, but I'd still rather buy a $5,000 used car with 50k miles than go into debt for 5 years to by a $28k Civic or Cavalier. Those cars were under $9k off the lot not too long ago. There is a large market for someone to make a lot of money of regulations are rolled back. It might or might not be Ford or Chevy, but I wonder what it would cost to make a '97 Civic. With today's technology, you could probably make and sell one for $5k max and make good margins. All the patents have expired. CAFE and, the global warming bullschot other bs regulations are what prevent it.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

Hey I want you to understand that I totally agree cars are too expensive. But the point is that auto manufacturers are NOT seeking to roll back cafe regulations to decrease said consumer costs. They only want it to increase profits. Making a '97 civic will hurt their profit margins. Don't be duped into supporting the roll back thinking it'll save you or any other consumer money. It most certainly will not.

I agree... The major manufacturers only want the roll back on the CAFE regulations so they can pad their profit margins. Which I understand. They are making thousands of these hybrid cars to sell at a loss in order to meet government regulations. They probably wont drop their price of vehicles, unless the vehicles don't sell.

However, what would be interesting is if they role this back and new company starts up and manufacturers old cars based off old designs such as a '97 accord. Their is a market there for a company to make new (or refurbished) cars that would be a bare-bones option for people looking to just go from point A to B. Especially if they could get the price under $10K.

(12-04-2016 11:12 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:54 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:46 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:36 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:27 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  Not going to happen. They just want to roll back regulations to increase profits, not lower costs to the consumer.

That isn't the auto industry. Ford and Chevy would much rather people buy new cars. Their problem is they can't produce them where people can afford them. If someone only has $5,000, they are getting a used car and Ford and Chevy get schit other maybe 0.5% if one of their dealerships happened to sell it.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

I'm sorry but I don't buy that for a second. No pun. People ARE buying new cars. New car sales have increased by nearly 40% since 2010. There's no justification for automakers to lower costs to the consumer. I just don't see it. It's fools gold to think costs will drop. Rolling this back will just line their pockets. Not yours.

People are buying new cars, but a lot more would. They sell debt and a lot of people aren't buying it. Cash for Clunkers helped them by driving up the cost of used cars, but I'd still rather buy a $5,000 used car with 50k miles than go into debt for 5 years to by a $28k Civic or Cavalier. Those cars were under $9k off the lot not too long ago. There is a large market for someone to make a lot of money of regulations are rolled back. It might or might not be Ford or Chevy, but I wonder what it would cost to make a '97 Civic. With today's technology, you could probably make and sell one for $5k max and make good margins. All the patents have expired. CAFE and, the global warming bullschot other bs regulations are what prevent it.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

Hey I want you to understand that I totally agree cars are too expensive. But the point is that auto manufacturers are NOT seeking to roll back cafe regulations to decrease said consumer costs. They only want it to increase profits. Making a '97 civic will hurt their profit margins. Don't be duped into supporting the roll back thinking it'll save you or any other consumer money. It most certainly will not.

They don't need to make '97 Civics. The competition will. They don't want to roll back regulations because they effectively chokes out the competition by having barriers to entry unreasonably high.

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(12-04-2016 11:27 PM)muffinman Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 11:12 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:54 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:46 PM)Pyrizzo Wrote:  

(12-04-2016 09:36 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  That isn't the auto industry. Ford and Chevy would much rather people buy new cars. Their problem is they can't produce them where people can afford them. If someone only has $5,000, they are getting a used car and Ford and Chevy get schit other maybe 0.5% if one of their dealerships happened to sell it.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

I'm sorry but I don't buy that for a second. No pun. People ARE buying new cars. New car sales have increased by nearly 40% since 2010. There's no justification for automakers to lower costs to the consumer. I just don't see it. It's fools gold to think costs will drop. Rolling this back will just line their pockets. Not yours.

People are buying new cars, but a lot more would. They sell debt and a lot of people aren't buying it. Cash for Clunkers helped them by driving up the cost of used cars, but I'd still rather buy a $5,000 used car with 50k miles than go into debt for 5 years to by a $28k Civic or Cavalier. Those cars were under $9k off the lot not too long ago. There is a large market for someone to make a lot of money of regulations are rolled back. It might or might not be Ford or Chevy, but I wonder what it would cost to make a '97 Civic. With today's technology, you could probably make and sell one for $5k max and make good margins. All the patents have expired. CAFE and, the global warming bullschot other bs regulations are what prevent it.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

Hey I want you to understand that I totally agree cars are too expensive. But the point is that auto manufacturers are NOT seeking to roll back cafe regulations to decrease said consumer costs. They only want it to increase profits. Making a '97 civic will hurt their profit margins. Don't be duped into supporting the roll back thinking it'll save you or any other consumer money. It most certainly will not.

I agree... The major manufacturers only want the roll back on the CAFE regulations so they can pad their profit margins. Which I understand. They are making thousands of these hybrid cars to sell at a loss in order to meet government regulations. They probably wont drop their price of vehicles, unless the vehicles don't sell.

However, what would be interesting is if they role this back and new company starts up and manufacturers old cars based off old designs such as a '97 accord. Their is a market there for a company to make new (or refurbished) cars that would be a bare-bones option for people looking to just go from point A to B. Especially if they could get the price under $10K.

Correct. Major Shark Tank opportunities on the horizon.

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All auto makers, but particularly the American ones make their profits on Trucks and bigger vehicles. They would rather make more of those and less of the small cars with little profit margins, particularly if those same small cars don't sell well.

(12-05-2016 08:58 AM)Crebman Wrote:  All auto makers, but particularly the American ones make their profits on Trucks and bigger vehicles. They would rather make more of those and less of the small cars with little profit margins, particularly if those same small cars don't sell well.

Of course they don't sell well. They have schitty performance, have gotten extremely difficult to work on, and go for $30k. Might as well buy a truck if you are going to spend that kind of money. Cars like Civics, Focuses, and Cavaliers sold very well in the '90s when middle-classers could buy them for $8k-$9k for their teenagers when they got their licenses.