Highest ranking in 16 years. We were in a tie at #41 too. Happy to be on the end moving up not down!

Looks like most of the public universities in the Big 12 and on the Big 12 expansion list lost a few spots. Only exceptions: Cincy and Kansas St.

And most of the private universities in the Big 12 and on the Big 12 expansion list improved a few spots.

Everyone should check both the score and the ranking. Some schools have scores that are the same or better than last year, but still dropped in ranking. And the further down the list your school appears, the more this discrepancy may be amplified.

As previously noted, the US News systems is quite manipulable. Many small liberal arts schools began awarding doctorates so they could be listed as "National Universities". Our friends at Vanillanova joined the list this year in that very way. So there are more schools being evaluated in the National University category - some with very small enrollments and some of which you may not even recognize.

So, under the new math, it appears that if your school is ranked in the top 220 is is still "top tier".

If you moved up in this environment, much congratulations.

(09-13-2016 09:34 AM)Hank Schrader Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 09:26 AM)mtmedlin Wrote:  Even though I know that Tulane is a great institution, I think us news rankings at massively faulty and total crap.

When USF is ranked alongside schools that do 1/3rd the research, no where near the patents, have a fourth of our endowment and their entrance scores are all lower (like gmat, gre, mcat) and yet they rank us with them.... It shows a serious flaw in methodology.

They don't factor in anything that you just highlighted. It is based on Graduation/Retention rates, Undergrad academic reputation based on a peer assessment survey, faculty resources, student selectivity (focusing on SAT/ACT scores), financial resources, graduation rate preformation, and alumni giving rate.

So what you're saying is that it caters to small private liberal arts colleges, and large state schools. Urban, City schools get the shaft? I give props to urban schools that can make this list, they are doing something right.

Uconn came in at 60

(09-13-2016 10:48 AM)muffinman Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 09:34 AM)Hank Schrader Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 09:26 AM)mtmedlin Wrote:  Even though I know that Tulane is a great institution, I think us news rankings at massively faulty and total crap.

When USF is ranked alongside schools that do 1/3rd the research, no where near the patents, have a fourth of our endowment and their entrance scores are all lower (like gmat, gre, mcat) and yet they rank us with them.... It shows a serious flaw in methodology.

They don't factor in anything that you just highlighted. It is based on Graduation/Retention rates, Undergrad academic reputation based on a peer assessment survey, faculty resources, student selectivity (focusing on SAT/ACT scores), financial resources, graduation rate preformation, and alumni giving rate.

So what you're saying is that it caters to small private liberal arts colleges, and large state schools. Urban, City schools get the shaft? I give props to urban schools that can make this list, they are doing something right.

It's a ranking for "National Universities". Urban city schools are often just that... schools meant for their urban city population and nothing more.

Which isn't true of Temple in 2016.

(09-13-2016 11:08 AM)JDTulane Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 10:48 AM)muffinman Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 09:34 AM)Hank Schrader Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 09:26 AM)mtmedlin Wrote:  Even though I know that Tulane is a great institution, I think us news rankings at massively faulty and total crap.

When USF is ranked alongside schools that do 1/3rd the research, no where near the patents, have a fourth of our endowment and their entrance scores are all lower (like gmat, gre, mcat) and yet they rank us with them.... It shows a serious flaw in methodology.

They don't factor in anything that you just highlighted. It is based on Graduation/Retention rates, Undergrad academic reputation based on a peer assessment survey, faculty resources, student selectivity (focusing on SAT/ACT scores), financial resources, graduation rate preformation, and alumni giving rate.

So what you're saying is that it caters to small private liberal arts colleges, and large state schools. Urban, City schools get the shaft? I give props to urban schools that can make this list, they are doing something right.

It's a ranking for "National Universities". Urban city schools are often just that... schools meant for their urban city population and nothing more.

Yea, I find that several of the "National Universities" in that list laughable.

(09-13-2016 09:26 AM)mtmedlin Wrote:  Even though I know that Tulane is a great institution, I think us news rankings at massively faulty and total crap.

When USF is ranked alongside schools that do 1/3rd the research, no where near the patents, have a fourth of our endowment and their entrance scores are all lower (like gmat, gre, mcat) and yet they rank us with them.... It shows a serious flaw in methodology.

Rankings in general are bogus, for one reason or another. The ones that favor research penalize liberal arts. And vice versa. And there really is no objective way to rank something subjective like prestige. Association and recognition by other peer groups (like AAU status) is one of the better ways.

(09-13-2016 11:08 AM)JDTulane Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 10:48 AM)muffinman Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 09:34 AM)Hank Schrader Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 09:26 AM)mtmedlin Wrote:  Even though I know that Tulane is a great institution, I think us news rankings at massively faulty and total crap.

When USF is ranked alongside schools that do 1/3rd the research, no where near the patents, have a fourth of our endowment and their entrance scores are all lower (like gmat, gre, mcat) and yet they rank us with them.... It shows a serious flaw in methodology.

They don't factor in anything that you just highlighted. It is based on Graduation/Retention rates, Undergrad academic reputation based on a peer assessment survey, faculty resources, student selectivity (focusing on SAT/ACT scores), financial resources, graduation rate preformation, and alumni giving rate.

So what you're saying is that it caters to small private liberal arts colleges, and large state schools. Urban, City schools get the shaft? I give props to urban schools that can make this list, they are doing something right.

It's a ranking for "National Universities". Urban city schools are often just that... schools meant for their urban city population and nothing more.

UH and a few others do just fine.

National University generally means an institution whos reputation and quality is such that people come from more than jut the surrounding geographical area to attend.

For instance, I'm from NY. I considered UH for undergrad/law school, despite never living in Houston or Texas. I considered Cal and Amherest, despite never living in CA/MA. I ended up at Tulane, despite never living in New Orleans or Louisiana.

I never considered going to UC Santa Cruz despite considering Cal, never considered Loyola/ULL despite considering Tulane, never considered Texas State or UTSA despite considering UH.

(09-13-2016 11:08 AM)JDTulane Wrote:  It's a ranking for "National Universities". Urban city schools are often just that... schools meant for their urban city population and nothing more.

I'm not sure if your post is meant to be insulting or not. But, if so, then Tulane will need to do much work to catch up to UCLA - a public, urban, city school that is ranked much higher than Tulane.

The point is that the list of "National Universities" now includes:

Lesley University
Yeshiva Univeristy
St. John Fisher College
Immaculata College
University of LaVerne
Seattle Pacific
Biola University
Marysville Univeristy
Edgewood College

At least some of these small colleges very intentionally handed out a few doctorates just so they could be called "National Universities".

While it is not "apples and oranges" to compare Tulane University to the University of South Florida, it is to compare the University of South Florida to Lesley University.

That said, I don't expect US News to make any adjustments. Change means admitting that something wasn't perfect from the outset.

Again, kudos to all those in the conference that moved up either in ranking or in score.

(09-13-2016 11:45 AM)Enriquillo Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 11:08 AM)JDTulane Wrote:  It's a ranking for "National Universities". Urban city schools are often just that... schools meant for their urban city population and nothing more.

I'm not sure if your post is meant to be insulting or not. But, if so, then Tulane will need to do much work to catch up to UCLA - a public, urban, city school that is ranked much higher than Tulane.

The point is that the list of "National Universities" now includes:

Lesley University
Yeshiva Univeristy
St. John Fisher College
Immaculata College
University of LaVerne
Seattle Pacific
Biola University
Marysville Univeristy
Edgewood College

At least some of these small colleges very intentionally handed out a few doctorates just so they could be called "National Universities".

While it is not "apples and oranges" to compare Tulane University to the University of South Florida, it is to compare the University of South Florida to Lesley University.

That said, I don't expect US News to make any adjustments. Change means admitting that something wasn't perfect from the outset.

Again, kudos to all those in the conference that moved up either in ranking or in score.

Tulane 39 http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreview...rsity-2029
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USF 159 http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreview...s/usf-1537
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Lesley 197 http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreview...rsity-2160

First point, there are 4,000 or so colleges and universities in the United States. If you are top 200, you're in the top 5%. Congrats!
Second point, the alumni giving rate is a direct result of the economic standing of alumni. The trust fund schools, such as the Ivy's, have a much higher percentage of wealthy students, who become wealthy contributors.
Third point, the margins, as previously noted, are extremely small. The actual difference between school 50 and school 100 is negligible.
In summary, the USNWR rankings are one of many tools that prospective students can use to evaluate schools, but should not be taken as the end-all be-all.

(09-13-2016 11:45 AM)Enriquillo Wrote:  I'm not sure if your post is meant to be insulting or not. But, if so, then Tulane will need to do much work to catch up to UCLA - a public, urban, city school that is ranked much higher than Tulane.

To be fair, I don't think anyone reasonably expects you to think "directional state school meant for the surrounding populace" when you think UCLA. That's one of the State of California's flagship schools, and California has the best state university system in the nation.

EDIT: Incidentally, and based on nothing but my own suspicions, I've sort of suspected that USF and UCF would be a little more well-received nationally (athletically speaking) if they went by Tampa and Orlando, in the mold of Houston, Memphis, and Louisville. Turn those three into the Universities of East Texas, Western Tennessee, and Northern Kentucky and even given the same athletic success I don't think they'd be received as well.

Only quibble is the trust fund issue.

Tulane has 34% (1/3rd) of its student body qualifying for and receiving need based aid. Of those, the average award is 95% of need. (All no-loan grants/scholarships/waivers).

Tulane's endowment is 1.3 billion dollars.

Rich kids do make rich alumni, and that helps pay the bills. But many don't feel the sort of "attachment" to their university-- it was just where they went to school after all. In contrast, the smart but poor kids who were given a chance and made the most of that opportunity? They love their school and will never forget what it did for them. (I know, because I'm one of them). New money that your University helped to create is one of the most reliable source of donations out there.

(09-13-2016 11:57 AM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  Only quibble is the trust fund issue.

Tulane has 34% (1/3rd) of its student body qualifying for and receiving need based aid. Of those, the average award is 95% of need. (All no-loan grants/scholarships/waivers).

Tulane's endowment is 1.3 billion dollars.

Rich kids do make rich alumni, and that helps pay the bills. But many don't feel the sort of "attachment" to their university-- it was just where they went to school after all. In contrast, the smart but poor kids who were given a chance and made the most of that opportunity? They love their school and will never forget what it did for them. (I know, because I'm one of them). New money that your University helped to create is one of the most reliable source of donations out there.

Fair enough. The trust fund note was mainly pointed out for the Ivy League schools, who typically have the ability to raise lots of alumni money, which is a big factor in their typically high ranking in this report.

(09-13-2016 11:51 AM)vick mike Wrote:  First point, there are 4,000 or so colleges and universities in the United States. If you are top 200, you're in the top 5%. Congrats!
Second point, the alumni giving rate is a direct result of the economic standing of alumni. The trust fund schools, such as the Ivy's, have a much higher percentage of wealthy students, who become wealthy contributors.
Third point, the margins, as previously noted, are extremely small. The actual difference between school 50 and school 100 is negligible.
In summary, the USNWR rankings are one of many tools that prospective students can use to evaluate schools, but should not be taken as the end-all be-all.

(09-13-2016 12:02 PM)vick mike Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 11:57 AM)Enviro5609 Wrote:  Only quibble is the trust fund issue.

Tulane has 34% (1/3rd) of its student body qualifying for and receiving need based aid. Of those, the average award is 95% of need. (All no-loan grants/scholarships/waivers).

Tulane's endowment is 1.3 billion dollars.

Rich kids do make rich alumni, and that helps pay the bills. But many don't feel the sort of "attachment" to their university-- it was just where they went to school after all. In contrast, the smart but poor kids who were given a chance and made the most of that opportunity? They love their school and will never forget what it did for them. (I know, because I'm one of them). New money that your University helped to create is one of the most reliable source of donations out there.

Fair enough. The trust fund note was mainly pointed out for the Ivy League schools, who typically have the ability to raise lots of alumni money, which is a big factor in their typically high ranking in this report.

It is a factor for sure, but actually participation rate-- that is, what percentage of your alumni donate something, even just $5 dollars-- is a bigger factor when compared to size of donations. And this makes sense, because its a great way to determine of much alumni feel their time at their university was well spent. Even if you aren't "rich" you can afford to donate a few bucks to your school once a year, if you were so motivated.

(09-13-2016 11:08 AM)JDTulane Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 10:48 AM)muffinman Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 09:34 AM)Hank Schrader Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 09:26 AM)mtmedlin Wrote:  Even though I know that Tulane is a great institution, I think us news rankings at massively faulty and total crap.

When USF is ranked alongside schools that do 1/3rd the research, no where near the patents, have a fourth of our endowment and their entrance scores are all lower (like gmat, gre, mcat) and yet they rank us with them.... It shows a serious flaw in methodology.

They don't factor in anything that you just highlighted. It is based on Graduation/Retention rates, Undergrad academic reputation based on a peer assessment survey, faculty resources, student selectivity (focusing on SAT/ACT scores), financial resources, graduation rate preformation, and alumni giving rate.

So what you're saying is that it caters to small private liberal arts colleges, and large state schools. Urban, City schools get the shaft? I give props to urban schools that can make this list, they are doing something right.

It's a ranking for "National Universities". Urban city schools are often just that... schools meant for their urban city population and nothing more.

shhh,,

Ignorance starting to show...

(09-13-2016 11:45 AM)Enriquillo Wrote:  

(09-13-2016 11:08 AM)JDTulane Wrote:  It's a ranking for "National Universities". Urban city schools are often just that... schools meant for their urban city population and nothing more.

I'm not sure if your post is meant to be insulting or not. But, if so, then Tulane will need to do much work to catch up to UCLA - a public, urban, city school that is ranked much higher than Tulane.

The point is that the list of "National Universities" now includes:

Lesley University
Yeshiva Univeristy
St. John Fisher College
Immaculata College
University of LaVerne
Seattle Pacific
Biola University
Marysville Univeristy
Edgewood College

At least some of these small colleges very intentionally handed out a few doctorates just so they could be called "National Universities".

While it is not "apples and oranges" to compare Tulane University to the University of South Florida, it is to compare the University of South Florida to Lesley University.

That said, I don't expect US News to make any adjustments. Change means admitting that something wasn't perfect from the outset.

Again, kudos to all those in the conference that moved up either in ranking or in score.

I used the word often, not always.

(09-13-2016 09:26 AM)mtmedlin Wrote:  Even though I know that Tulane is a great institution, I think us news rankings at massively faulty and total crap.

When USF is ranked alongside schools that do 1/3rd the research, no where near the patents, have a fourth of our endowment and their entrance scores are all lower (like gmat, gre, mcat) and yet they rank us with them.... It shows a serious flaw in methodology.

so what you're saying is that someone looking for graduate school should pick USF over those other schools than USF is ranked alongside? hmmm that would be something interesting to think about if that had anything to do with this ranking.