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The Case for Houston
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Kronke Offline
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Post: #21
RE: The Case for Houston
(09-01-2016 10:44 PM)miko33 Wrote:  Surprised about there not being more discussion about Houston. I wouldn't sleep on this school.

There's not much else to be said, and I think we're all burned out on the subject. We've already heard it all over the past month.
09-01-2016 10:56 PM
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BigHouston Offline
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Post: #22
RE: The Case for Houston
(09-01-2016 10:56 PM)Kronke Wrote:  
(09-01-2016 10:44 PM)miko33 Wrote:  Surprised about there not being more discussion about Houston. I wouldn't sleep on this school.

There's not much else to be said, and I think we're all burned out on the subject. We've already heard it all over the past month.

Spot on, Kronke

Here glad football has finally arrived 04-cheers
09-02-2016 01:08 PM
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chess Offline
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Post: #23
RE: The Case for Houston
(08-31-2016 10:21 PM)miko33 Wrote:  Houston could be a great addition to the Big12. They used to play with a number of teams back in the day, so there's familiarity there. Also, the Big12 has lost a few teams that wore red jerseys in Nebraska, TAMU and Arkansas, so the Big12 could use this opportunity to fill the fashion void left by the departures of those 3 schools. Houston has a strong case.

Arkansas was never a member of the Big XII or the Big 8. Arkansas was a member of the Southwest Conference.
09-02-2016 01:26 PM
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YNot Offline
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Post: #24
RE: The Case for Houston
Houston deserves to be at or near the top of the list. "Markets" are a red herring. Which matchups would the casual fan in Dallas, Atlanta, and Chicago watch on any given Saturday?

Houston-Texas Tech
Houston-Kansas St.
Houston-TCU

OR

Cincinnati-Texas Tech
UConn-TCU
UCF-Kansas St.

??

Which games would have more visiting fans?


From where I sit, Houston is the better option.
09-02-2016 02:52 PM
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Kronke Offline
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Post: #25
RE: The Case for Houston
(09-02-2016 02:52 PM)YNot Wrote:  Houston deserves to be at or near the top of the list. "Markets" are a red herring. Which matchups would the casual fan in Dallas, Atlanta, and Chicago watch on any given Saturday?

Houston-Texas Tech
Houston-Kansas St.
Houston-TCU

OR

Cincinnati-Texas Tech
UConn-TCU
UCF-Kansas St.

??

Which games would have more visiting fans?


From where I sit, Houston is the better option.

UH, Cincy, BYU, and UCF or UConn.
09-02-2016 03:08 PM
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Kronke Offline
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Post: #26
RE: The Case for Houston
The Oklahoman's Berry Tramel visited the UH campus, and left impressed.

Quote:It was a great experience and I learned a lot, mostly that Houston is ready for Big 12 inclusion. That’s my take, not UofH’s spin. The Cougars have invested in their athletic program and done the things necessary to warrant Big 12 inclusion.

http://newsok.com/houston-travelblog-uof...le/5516491
09-02-2016 04:49 PM
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Middle Ages Offline
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Post: #27
RE: The Case for Houston
Number of Big 12 players from Houston area:

Tex-23
TT-19
TCU-18
Bay- 17
KU- 14
Oklahoma-11
OSU- 8
ISU- 6
KSU- 3
WVU-2

[Texas A&M- 30]

Look at the top of that list (and OSU has historically had 10+ from Houston). All are recruiting from the same pool as UH. Adding UH would make it much harder for other big 12 schools to recruit Houston. It would be great for Houston- the only P5 in one of the top 2-3 recruiting MSA's in the country- but not for the other B12 schools that rely on Houston for 10-20% of their team.
Adding Rice would give the league a presence in Houston (no Rice doesn't 'deliver' Houston, but neither does UH) but Rice is not recruiting/ can't recruit the same players as the other B12 teams. As a P5 Rice would be trying to recruit more like Stanford or Northwestern- in Houston but also around Texas and nationally for great players with great academics. I could see more recruiting battles with Vandy, Notre Dame, and Stanford than OU or Texas. UH would be head to head for all of the top players with every other Big 12 team.

Plus the presidents of the existing B12 schools would much, much rather associate with Rice than Houston.

There is no doubt that UH has the better program and team currently, and has done more to prepare themselves to move up than Rice. But as I said a few days ago- what they bring to the table may not be aligned with what the B12 schools and presidents want from new additions.
(This post was last modified: 09-02-2016 08:37 PM by Middle Ages.)
09-02-2016 08:07 PM
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10thMountain Offline
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Post: #28
RE: The Case for Houston
SWC 2.0! A proven model for success in the modern college athletics world!
09-02-2016 08:31 PM
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DogPoundNorth Offline
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Post: #29
RE: The Case for Houston
They just made their case and it's convincing. Houston SHOULD be in the Big 12.
09-03-2016 02:40 PM
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Kronke Offline
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Post: #30
RE: The Case for Houston
SBNation: UH just beat the Big 12 favorite; Add them, or look like cowards.

http://www.sbnation.com/college-football...-expansion
09-03-2016 07:01 PM
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Middle Ages Offline
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Post: #31
RE: The Case for Houston
(09-03-2016 07:01 PM)Kronke Wrote:  SBNation: UH just beat the Big 12 favorite; Add them, or look like cowards.

http://www.sbnation.com/college-football...-expansion

Fascinating marketing strategy. "What are you, chicken?"
09-03-2016 07:43 PM
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Kronke Offline
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Post: #32
The Case for Houston
(09-03-2016 07:43 PM)Middle Ages Wrote:  
(09-03-2016 07:01 PM)Kronke Wrote:  SBNation: UH just beat the Big 12 favorite; Add them, or look like cowards.

http://www.sbnation.com/college-football...-expansion

Fascinating marketing strategy. "What are you, chicken?"

Marketing strategy? We have nothing to do with that article.

It's true. If they want to improve their on the field product, they know who to call. If not, go ahead and add NIU and Rice.
(This post was last modified: 09-03-2016 07:48 PM by Kronke.)
09-03-2016 07:46 PM
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Middle Ages Offline
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Post: #33
RE: The Case for Houston
(09-03-2016 07:46 PM)Kronke Wrote:  
(09-03-2016 07:43 PM)Middle Ages Wrote:  
(09-03-2016 07:01 PM)Kronke Wrote:  SBNation: UH just beat the Big 12 favorite; Add them, or look like cowards.

http://www.sbnation.com/college-football...-expansion

Fascinating marketing strategy. "What are you, chicken?"

Marketing strategy? We have nothing to do with that article.

It's true. If they want to improve their on the field product, they know who to call. If not, go ahead and add NIU and Rice.

you're right, but I have heard similar sentiment from UH people I know too. Also- is that what this expansion is about- improving the product on the field? They've been pretty good with OU, TCU, and Baylor, and UT won't be down long. If it was just about product on the field why did the cut Boise St., San Diego St, East Carolina. I honestly don't know how they are making their decisions, but if I'm a member of the Big 12 today it makes no sense to me to add a rising power in a market that I rely on for recruiting. Now if it adds a market or opens up recruiting in a new area- great, but adding Houston just adds another team to the same pool. It would be fantastic for UH. I still haven't heard how it's good for any existing member of the Big 12
09-03-2016 08:09 PM
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Kronke Offline
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Post: #34
RE: The Case for Houston
ESPN PR (@ESPNPR)
Okla-Hou: 4.0 overnight & 12.8 in Houston, market’s highest rating for an opening weekend cfb game across ESPN nets

Bill Jones (@CBS11BillJones)
DFW Saturday Ratings:
Oklahoma/Houston 7.3
Alabama/USC 5.2
UCLA/Texas A&M 5.0
LSU/Wisconsin 5.0
Astros/Rangers 3.4
SDakSt/TCU 2.0
09-04-2016 11:21 AM
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CheeseSndwch Offline
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Post: #35
RE: The Case for Houston
(09-03-2016 07:43 PM)Middle Ages Wrote:  
(09-03-2016 07:01 PM)Kronke Wrote:  SBNation: UH just beat the Big 12 favorite; Add them, or look like cowards.

http://www.sbnation.com/college-football...-expansion

Fascinating marketing strategy. "What are you, chicken?"

[Image: latest?cb=20110818090648]
09-04-2016 11:46 AM
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sierrajip Offline
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Post: #36
RE: The Case for Houston
(08-31-2016 10:23 PM)Sellular1 Wrote:  
(08-31-2016 10:21 PM)miko33 Wrote:  Houston could be a great addition to the Big12. They used to play with a number of teams back in the day, so there's familiarity there. Also, the Big12 has lost a few teams that wore red jerseys in Nebraska, TAMU and Arkansas, so the Big12 could use this opportunity to fill the fashion void left by the departures of those 3 schools. Houston has a strong case.

You should start calling people

You forgot having lunch too.
09-04-2016 04:45 PM
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Akkula Offline
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Post: #37
RE: The Case for Houston
I think it is very unlikely for Houston to get in. They need 8 votes and almost every school has an intense reason to withhold their vote. Texas will have to agree to extend the GOR or maybe Houston could get in if they expand by four as part of a compromise to grow larger than Texas would prefer. That seems like the only hope. It isn't because you guys don't deserve it but the conference already has too many Texas schools and too much political and recruiting power concentrated in Texas for other members liking.
09-04-2016 05:05 PM
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Kronke Offline
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Post: #38
RE: The Case for Houston
(09-04-2016 05:05 PM)Akkula Wrote:  I think it is very unlikely for Houston to get in. They need 8 votes

Such a tired argument. No one is going to get 8 votes on their own, it's going to take a compromise and a packaged deal (whether it be 2 or 4) to get each voting block on the same page.

If the Texas schools want UH, and the Northern schools want Cincy, and neither side is budging, no expansion will happen. Each side can block the other. But, what about a package of UH and Cincy? Or UH, Cincy, BYU, and [insert 4th school]? Each side would be getting something they want, and would have a much higher probability of passing 8/10.
(This post was last modified: 09-04-2016 06:25 PM by Kronke.)
09-04-2016 06:15 PM
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Akkula Offline
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Post: #39
RE: The Case for Houston
(09-04-2016 06:15 PM)Kronke Wrote:  
(09-04-2016 05:05 PM)Akkula Wrote:  I think it is very unlikely for Houston to get in. They need 8 votes

Such a tired argument. No one is going to get 8 votes on their own, it's going to take a compromise and a packaged deal (whether it be 2 or 4) to get each voting block on the same page.

If the Texas schools want UH, and the Northern schools want Cincy, and neither side is budging, no expansion will happen. Each side can block the other. But, what about a package of UH and Cincy? Or UH, Cincy, BYU, and [insert 4th school]? Each side would be getting something they want, and would have a much higher probability of passing 8/10.

Why the heck would any Texas schools want Houston to compete with them? The only one that seems to have something to gain in all of this is Texas. How would adding Houston help TCU or Baylor?

Also, because of the GOR, Texas can't say "my way or the highway" in this round of negotiations. They don't have much leverage unless they give up something significant to the conference. They are essentially just a normal member whose vote should count just as much as anyone else's vote. They can really only say, "you will be sorry in 2025!" I don't think the conference wants to piss off Texas but I also don't think they feel the need to bend to Texas will if it isn't in their best interests.

Great performance by Houston, though, yesterday.
09-04-2016 06:24 PM
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Kronke Offline
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Post: #40
RE: The Case for Houston
(09-04-2016 06:24 PM)Akkula Wrote:  
(09-04-2016 06:15 PM)Kronke Wrote:  
(09-04-2016 05:05 PM)Akkula Wrote:  I think it is very unlikely for Houston to get in. They need 8 votes

Such a tired argument. No one is going to get 8 votes on their own, it's going to take a compromise and a packaged deal (whether it be 2 or 4) to get each voting block on the same page.

If the Texas schools want UH, and the Northern schools want Cincy, and neither side is budging, no expansion will happen. Each side can block the other. But, what about a package of UH and Cincy? Or UH, Cincy, BYU, and [insert 4th school]? Each side would be getting something they want, and would have a much higher probability of passing 8/10.

Why the heck would any Texas schools want Houston to compete with them?

Because I'd like to think they aren't cowards and want to do what's best for the conference. Just like when they added TCU, despite already "owning" the D/FW market between UT, OU, Tech, and Baylor.
09-04-2016 06:34 PM
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