(08-30-2016 03:40 PM)72Tiger Wrote:  I am considering buying a short term plan (about 75$ a month) instead of buying a plan for 360$ a month that meets the requirements of obamacare. Renew it each time it expires. The catch is that I would be subject to the penalty or fee for not having coverage (that I don't need, and wouldn't use) that meets the oc requirements. It would protect me against catastrophic health events. Other stuff I would be better off money wise just paying out of pocket as I am fairly healthy.

Handily enough they can only collect the fee if you decide not to pay it in one way: by withholding it from future tax returns you might be owed. Easy enough to make sure I am not due a return by managing my w2, etc. That's it. They can't put a lien on you, withhold from your paycheck, or give you jail time if you don't pay the fee.

Anyone else considering or thought through this strategy? Pitfalls?

That is interesting info...What plan/company? Id be up for something like this. I thought the IRS could just assess you this in the form of a tax. I always owe more. I never get a refund. Could they somehow just add the "fine/tax" to the additional that they make my pay?

Catastrophic care if that is what you want to call it is available through short term plans through just about every insurance carrier out there. Google short term insurance. You just have to renew at the end of the term ( anywhere from a month to a year).

It is available to anyone. You will owe the penalty without being granted a hardship waiver, but frankly, there doesn't seem to be any way other than tax returns to enforce the penalty. Anyway, I'm still working through the thought process, but that's my take on it right now. Would love to get input from others on the idea. Without a subsidy, premiums are getting ridiculous. This on top of a 7k deductible.

Couple of links:

https://www.healthinsurance.org/faqs/ive...this-true/

https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/ehi/st/...s.zipCode=

(08-30-2016 09:04 PM)72Tiger Wrote:  Couple of links:

https://www.healthinsurance.org/faqs/ive...this-true/

https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/ehi/st/...s.zipCode=

This looks very interesting. I have my wife looking into this. She has access to people in the know on this stuff at her job. This could be a great answer to my problem. It shows I could get one of 80/20 with 5k deductible for $261 per month. Im paying $740 now for a very schitty policy. I could set up my own de facto HSA with the difference and and fund my limited HC needs with no problem. Thanks for the info. Ill let you know what I find out.

$480/mo pays for an awful lot of coverage (if you have the major stuff covered)

(08-31-2016 11:24 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(08-30-2016 09:04 PM)72Tiger Wrote:  Couple of links:

https://www.healthinsurance.org/faqs/ive...this-true/

https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/ehi/st/...s.zipCode=

This looks very interesting. I have my wife looking into this. She has access to people in the know on this stuff at her job. This could be a great answer to my problem. It shows I could get one of 80/20 with 5k deductible for $261 per month. Im paying $740 now for a very schitty policy. I could set up my own de facto HSA with the difference and and fund my limited HC needs with no problem. Thanks for the info. Ill let you know what I find out.

The short term plans aren't HSA eligible unfortunately.

Another drawback I see, is if you do have a major problem, they can't drop you, but they don't have to renew your policy when it expires. At that point, you are on your own until open enrollment comes around through Obamacare which has to accept anyone. That whole bit is probably the biggest potential benefit to the consumer of Obamacare. Not sure if it is worth the added cost, but I'd probably change my tune if I had to go that route.

A possible way out is to time the short term policy ending date with the end of open enrollment for obamacare. Switch then if you have to. Still need some thought before I act on it. Interested in hearing your wife''s thoughts.

(08-31-2016 03:34 PM)72Tiger Wrote:  

(08-31-2016 11:24 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(08-30-2016 09:04 PM)72Tiger Wrote:  Couple of links:

https://www.healthinsurance.org/faqs/ive...this-true/

https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/ehi/st/...s.zipCode=

This looks very interesting. I have my wife looking into this. She has access to people in the know on this stuff at her job. This could be a great answer to my problem. It shows I could get one of 80/20 with 5k deductible for $261 per month. Im paying $740 now for a very schitty policy. I could set up my own de facto HSA with the difference and and fund my limited HC needs with no problem. Thanks for the info. Ill let you know what I find out.

The short term plans aren't HSA eligible unfortunately.

Another drawback I see, is if you do have a major problem, they can't drop you, but they don't have to renew your policy when it expires. At that point, you are on your own until open enrollment comes around through Obamacare which has to accept anyone. That whole bit is probably the biggest potential benefit to the consumer of Obamacare. Not sure if it is worth the added cost, but I'd probably change my tune if I had to go that route.

A possible way out is to time the short term policy ending date with the end of open enrollment for obamacare. Switch then if you have to. Still need some thought before I act on it. Interested in hearing your wife''s thoughts.

Can't you enroll in the zerOcare at any time if there has been a "Lifestyle change" such as losing a policy, changs of job etc.?

And he's saying with the $'s saved each month he can invest/save that and have his own de facto HSA. I've already passed this on to a couple of my people here that this may benefit. If they can save 3, 4, 500 bucks a month, that changes a lot of things in their lives!

Thanks.

Good point on the lifestyle change or whatever it is called. I hadn't thought of that. Will look into it.

(08-31-2016 04:06 PM)JMUDunk Wrote:  

(08-31-2016 03:34 PM)72Tiger Wrote:  

(08-31-2016 11:24 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(08-30-2016 09:04 PM)72Tiger Wrote:  Couple of links:

https://www.healthinsurance.org/faqs/ive...this-true/

https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/ehi/st/...s.zipCode=

This looks very interesting. I have my wife looking into this. She has access to people in the know on this stuff at her job. This could be a great answer to my problem. It shows I could get one of 80/20 with 5k deductible for $261 per month. Im paying $740 now for a very schitty policy. I could set up my own de facto HSA with the difference and and fund my limited HC needs with no problem. Thanks for the info. Ill let you know what I find out.

The short term plans aren't HSA eligible unfortunately.

Another drawback I see, is if you do have a major problem, they can't drop you, but they don't have to renew your policy when it expires. At that point, you are on your own until open enrollment comes around through Obamacare which has to accept anyone. That whole bit is probably the biggest potential benefit to the consumer of Obamacare. Not sure if it is worth the added cost, but I'd probably change my tune if I had to go that route.

A possible way out is to time the short term policy ending date with the end of open enrollment for obamacare. Switch then if you have to. Still need some thought before I act on it. Interested in hearing your wife''s thoughts.

Can't you enroll in the zerOcare at any time if there has been a "Lifestyle change" such as losing a policy, changs of job etc.?

And he's saying with the $'s saved each month he can invest/save that and have his own de facto HSA. I've already passed this on to a couple of my people here that this may benefit. If they can save 3, 4, 500 bucks a month, that changes a lot of things in their lives!

Thanks.

I think the catch to this is that you have to have a "lifestyle change" to obtain one of these policies. There is still some stuff to explore and Im not positive about it.

One thing....These policies combined with single payer basic would solve a lot of problems for people. It would along the lines of the Bismarck system that Owl has touted..in other word... Basic government HC insurance for everyone and then a market paradigm for catastrophic insurance.

One aside... HSAs are pre-tax dollars and this would be post-tax... but the effective tax rate for most people struggling with such an issue probably isn't very high... $486 post tax is perhaps worth $500 or $525 pre-tax... which isn't nothing, but pales in comparison to getting nothing for that money (premiums in excess of the healthcare consumed).

Qualifying life events:

https://www.healthcare.gov/glossary/qual...ife-event/

(08-31-2016 04:41 PM)72Tiger Wrote:  Qualifying life events:

https://www.healthcare.gov/glossary/qual...ife-event/

Yea, so pretty much anything.

"Death in the family"... does that include the family goldfish? And who's gonna follow up to be sure one of these things took place.

"Change of employment", start your own lawn care Co. and run it through there, whether you're mowing many lawns or not.

But seriously, no longer being able to afford existing coverage is solely in the eye of the beholder, is it not? Be a pretty easy argument to make that 700+ bucks a month for one person is no longer "affordable".

(08-29-2016 04:03 PM)shere khan Wrote:  The __________ opposed both international socialism and free market capitalism, arguing that their views represented a third way. They claimed to provide a realistic economic alternative that was neither laissez-faire capitalism nor communism

Bonus points. Name another example of a US president that was proud of this achievement.

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Bill Clinton and FDR, "3rd way" proponents

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Make sure you check your Rx list on these short term plans. Most of them are flat out no coverage on Rx. You don't want to get the nasty surprise of a $30 Rx becoming a $300 Rx.

I don't have any prescriptions, but that is definitely a concern if you do. There are short term plans that cover that. As you said, check first.

(08-31-2016 04:41 PM)72Tiger Wrote:  Qualifying life events:

https://www.healthcare.gov/glossary/qual...ife-event/

This is the key according to my source..and..it has to verified. These companies are under scrutiny for fraudulent applicants and can get severely fined for accepting those trying to defraud the system. However...there are lots of legit reasons this could work for many people. The list is pretty extensive. Im still exploring this.

(08-31-2016 05:50 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  Make sure you check your Rx list on these short term plans. Most of them are flat out no coverage on Rx. You don't want to get the nasty surprise of a $30 Rx becoming a $300 Rx.

Yep...I take a maintenance med every day. Fortunately..I just checked and I can get it from Canada for almost the same price as my copay now.

(08-31-2016 07:53 PM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(08-31-2016 05:50 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  Make sure you check your Rx list on these short term plans. Most of them are flat out no coverage on Rx. You don't want to get the nasty surprise of a $30 Rx becoming a $300 Rx.

Yep...I take a maintenance med every day. Fortunately..I just checked and I can get it from Canada for almost the same price as my copay now.

Agreed... some years ago, the government decided not to enforce import rules on identical FDA approved drugs taken for personal use (not resale). The packages often even have an RX in the tracking number. I think this has essentially been the case since the late 90's.