Professors live in their ivory tower. Fact is, you aren't getting 50,000 people to show up for a thesis.

From the often referred to USAToday College Athletic Budget DataBase:
University/Subsidy/% Budget Subsidy
UConn - $28.1MM 39%
Houston - $26.0 MM 58%
UCF - $24.7 MM 48%
UC - $23.2 MM 44%
USF - $21.8 MM 48%
Memphis $18.2 MM 42%
ECU $18.1 MM 37%

UC is about in the middle of conference members for subsidy amount and %.

(08-15-2016 06:51 AM)oldtiger Wrote:  From the often referred to USAToday College Athletic Budget DataBase:
University/Subsidy/% Budget Subsidy
UConn - $28.1MM 39%
Houston - $26.0 MM 58%
UCF - $24.7 MM 48%
UC - $23.2 MM 44%
USF - $21.8 MM 48%
Memphis $18.2 MM 42%
ECU $18.1 MM

UC is about in the middle of conference members for subsidy amount and %.

if these schools were in a P5 getting 20-30mil/year instead of peanuts the AAC pays out, subsides wouldn't be necessary.

People knock subsidies, but really they show that a school views athletics as important and to keep up with the jones' and without real tvp5 money the school is willing to subsidy. I see subsidy as the school showing athletics is important.

I know this wasn't the point of your post, I just wanted to get on my subsidy in the G5 world soapbox...

(08-15-2016 06:51 AM)oldtiger Wrote:  From the often referred to USAToday College Athletic Budget DataBase:
University/Subsidy/% Budget Subsidy
UConn - $28.1MM 39%
Houston - $26.0 MM 58%
UCF - $24.7 MM 48%
UC - $23.2 MM 44%
USF - $21.8 MM 48%
Memphis $18.2 MM 42%
ECU $18.1 MM

UC is about in the middle of conference members for subsidy amount and %.

About $4M of Houston's "subsidy" is the stadium fee the students voted for. It goes to capex spending (football stadium, basketball practice facility, basketball arena), not to cover annual budget shortfalls.

The subsidy to cover our shortfall is $22M.

I'm sure we're not the only school where USAToday conflates operating expenses with capital expenditures.

(08-15-2016 06:51 AM)oldtiger Wrote:  From the often referred to USAToday College Athletic Budget DataBase:
University/Subsidy/% Budget Subsidy
UConn - $28.1MM 39%
Houston - $26.0 MM 58%
UCF - $24.7 MM 48%
UC - $23.2 MM 44%
USF - $21.8 MM 48%
Memphis $18.2 MM 42%
ECU $18.1 MM 37%

UC is about in the middle of conference members for subsidy amount and %.

These are the numbers that should raise eyebrows.

I don't mind the capital expenditures but if a program is subsidizing at these rates just to keep up with the poorer relations of the Joneses, there needs to be some soul searching when the the expansion bus pulls out of the depot this time if you are not on it.

(08-15-2016 07:04 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(08-15-2016 06:51 AM)oldtiger Wrote:  From the often referred to USAToday College Athletic Budget DataBase:
University/Subsidy/% Budget Subsidy
UConn - $28.1MM 39%
Houston - $26.0 MM 58%
UCF - $24.7 MM 48%
UC - $23.2 MM 44%
USF - $21.8 MM 48%
Memphis $18.2 MM 42%
ECU $18.1 MM 37%

UC is about in the middle of conference members for subsidy amount and %.

These are the numbers that should raise eyebrows.

I don't mind the capital expenditures but if a program is subsidizing at these rates just to keep up with the poorer relations of the Joneses, there needs to be some soul searching when the the expansion bus pulls out of the depot this time if you are not on it.

i'm OK with schools on this list spending this kind of money in the short term. I think a lot of them we're hoping for P5 invites so they were spending the money to gear up for that but you're right once the P5 expansion bus leaves the station, if you're not on it, at that point you need to figure out if this is sustainable or not...and the answer is probably not.

(08-15-2016 06:57 AM)CougarRed Wrote:  

(08-15-2016 06:51 AM)oldtiger Wrote:  From the often referred to USAToday College Athletic Budget DataBase:
University/Subsidy/% Budget Subsidy
UConn - $28.1MM 39%
Houston - $26.0 MM 58%
UCF - $24.7 MM 48%
UC - $23.2 MM 44%
USF - $21.8 MM 48%
Memphis $18.2 MM 42%
ECU $18.1 MM 37%

UC is about in the middle of conference members for subsidy amount and %.

About $4M of Houston's "subsidy" is the stadium fee the students voted for. It goes to capex spending (football stadium, basketball practice facility, basketball arena), not to cover annual budget shortfalls.

The subsidy to cover our shortfall is $22M.

I'm sure we're not the only school where USAToday conflates operating expenses with capital expenditures.

Good, the students and Texas citizens are only paying about 48% of the Cougars' cost to put athletic teams on the field, diamond, and court instead of 58%. Appreciate the information.

(08-15-2016 07:51 AM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  

(08-15-2016 07:04 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(08-15-2016 06:51 AM)oldtiger Wrote:  From the often referred to USAToday College Athletic Budget DataBase:
University/Subsidy/% Budget Subsidy
UConn - $28.1MM 39%
Houston - $26.0 MM 58%
UCF - $24.7 MM 48%
UC - $23.2 MM 44%
USF - $21.8 MM 48%
Memphis $18.2 MM 42%
ECU $18.1 MM 37%

UC is about in the middle of conference members for subsidy amount and %.

These are the numbers that should raise eyebrows.

I don't mind the capital expenditures but if a program is subsidizing at these rates just to keep up with the poorer relations of the Joneses, there needs to be some soul searching when the the expansion bus pulls out of the depot this time if you are not on it.

i'm OK with schools on this list spending this kind of money in the short term. I think a lot of them we're hoping for P5 invites so they were spending the money to gear up for that but you're right once the P5 expansion bus leaves the station, if you're not on it, at that point you need to figure out if this is sustainable or not...and the answer is probably not.

I am also for the short term. The difference between expense/revenue would be well covered by P5 type TV revenue. At some point, however, tax payers will demand better management of expenditures as state, local, and our own budgets get pinched.

(08-15-2016 07:04 AM)rath v2.0 Wrote:  

(08-15-2016 06:51 AM)oldtiger Wrote:  From the often referred to USAToday College Athletic Budget DataBase:
University/Subsidy/% Budget Subsidy
UConn - $28.1MM 39%
Houston - $26.0 MM 58%
UCF - $24.7 MM 48%
UC - $23.2 MM 44%
USF - $21.8 MM 48%
Memphis $18.2 MM 42%
ECU $18.1 MM 37%

UC is about in the middle of conference members for subsidy amount and %.

These are the numbers that should raise eyebrows.

I don't mind the capital expenditures but if a program is subsidizing at these rates just to keep up with the poorer relations of the Joneses, there needs to be some soul searching when the the expansion bus pulls out of the depot this time if you are not on it.

I agree with you 100%.

I actually tend to agree to a point. This is where i applaud USFs leadership. We have a plan in place and the dollars set aside to build a $100 million plu stadium (I heard it will be $120-140 million) but they arent going to spend it unless the Big 12 comes through.
The simple fact is that many of us could play in already built stadiums and not increase the debt our universities have. In an ever changing landscape that could quickly land all of us in a conference where we make so little that the losses would be enormous, unless you have a guaranteed ticket, I do tend to think its a bit irresponsible.

(08-15-2016 08:40 AM)mtmedlin Wrote:  I actually tend to agree to a point. This is where i applaud USFs leadership. We have a plan in place and the dollars set aside to build a $100 million plu stadium (I heard it will be $120-140 million) but they arent going to spend it unless the Big 12 comes through.
The simple fact is that many of us could play in already built stadiums and not increase the debt our universities have. In an ever changing landscape that could quickly land all of us in a conference where we make so little that the losses would be enormous, unless you have a guaranteed ticket, I do tend to think its a bit irresponsible.

This is a little off topic, but the part in bold reminded me of it. This whole arms race is stupid, although a fact of life now. But to me, it's even crazier b/c it forces schools to try for conferences that make no sense from a geographic or cultural standpoint.

Does it really make sense for USF to strive for the Big 12? Nor really. I realize they have no choice, but they would be a much better fit in the SEC or ACC. Same with UConn, who would fit better in the ACC or B1G. And so on.

One thing the P5 might eventually do, if they break away, is negotiate as one entity and re-from into more geographical scheduling groups, or whatever you want to call them, to restore some old rivalries and make non-revenue travel expenses more reasonable.

That would help with the original complaints about costs.

(08-14-2016 08:28 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  Editorial by 2 UC Profs in today's Sunday local paper.

UC spending on 'athletic arms race' irresponsible

Athletics can be a fun part of the college experience for students. The faculty enjoy watching sporting events and supporting student athletes as much as anyone, but at some point you have to ask at what cost?

After factoring in ticket sales, sponsorships, advertising and all other sources of revenue, UC’s athletic program loses more than $20 million per year. This $20 million deficit is covered by taking $20 million from the academic side of UC. This money – generated from tuition, student fees and other sources – is diverted from every college and program that make up the University of Cincinnati.

See free link for complete article.
http://www.cincinnati.com/story/opinion/.../88584650/

Diaco thinks the college arms race is ridiculous

(08-14-2016 08:28 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  Editorial by 2 UC Profs in today's Sunday local paper.

UC spending on 'athletic arms race' irresponsible

Athletics can be a fun part of the college experience for students. The faculty enjoy watching sporting events and supporting student athletes as much as anyone, but at some point you have to ask at what cost?

After factoring in ticket sales, sponsorships, advertising and all other sources of revenue, UC’s athletic program loses more than $20 million per year. This $20 million deficit is covered by taking $20 million from the academic side of UC. This money – generated from tuition, student fees and other sources – is diverted from every college and program that make up the University of Cincinnati.

See free link for complete article.
http://www.cincinnati.com/story/opinion/.../88584650/

UC's operating budget is $1.3B for fiscal 2017. So are we talking about less than 2% of their operating budget?

(08-14-2016 02:20 PM)Thegoldstandard Wrote:  

(08-14-2016 12:35 PM)UCBEast Wrote:  

(08-14-2016 08:28 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  Editorial by 2 UC Profs in today's Sunday local paper.

UC spending on 'athletic arms race' irresponsible

Athletics can be a fun part of the college experience for students. The faculty enjoy watching sporting events and supporting student athletes as much as anyone, but at some point you have to ask at what cost?

After factoring in ticket sales, sponsorships, advertising and all other sources of revenue, UC’s athletic program loses more than $20 million per year. This $20 million deficit is covered by taking $20 million from the academic side of UC. This money – generated from tuition, student fees and other sources – is diverted from every college and program that make up the University of Cincinnati.

See free link for complete article.
http://www.cincinnati.com/story/opinion/.../88584650/

Like it or not, these professors across the country would not have the enrollments they do if their schools did not have successful sports programs. In people's minds, winning college sports = successful school, whether that's factual or not. Penn State, for instance, did not become a big school solely due to its outstanding offerings. It's been called 'The House that Joe Built" because he did build PSU's perception with the successful football program.

They're just feeling extra salty now because Dr. Ono has moved to UBC, and they think this is the time to strike. Their vision is of the tunnel variety. There are so-called academicians who will [i]never[/] hold anything but academics in esteem. They have their own sporting event: stabbing up and coming professors in the back to get ahead. But that's a whole other story.

A rising tide lifts all boats.

When was the last time the math dept drew 30k to campus for a weekend

*drops mic*

A law librarian and a history teacher. Maybe we should ask how many students have loaded up on debt for their law degrees and/or history degrees (no offense but both are struggling degree paths).

I can assure these profs that the student experiences (for many at least) watching winning FBall and Bball at Cinci were far more memorable than any classroom experience. Graduates of UC are not following what research is coming out of the history department but do make sure to see how the sport teams are doing. A B12 invite for UC just may do more for academics than athletics.