http://www.foxsports.com/college-footbal...rio-080416

Excerpt: Presumably you could get eight of 10 presidents to agree on two schools, perhaps Cincinnati and Houston. Plus, it does the least to alienate the league’s TV partners short of scrapping expansion altogether (which could still happen mind you), and it gives the best hope for a smooth integration of the newbies. The larger you go from there, the more scattershot the final product will become.

(08-04-2016 07:30 PM)BamaScorpio69 Wrote:  http://www.foxsports.com/college-footbal...rio-080416

Excerpt: Presumably you could get eight of 10 presidents to agree on two schools, perhaps Cincinnati and Houston. Plus, it does the least to alienate the league’s TV partners short of scrapping expansion altogether (which could still happen mind you), and it gives the best hope for a smooth integration of the newbies. The larger you go from there, the more scattershot the final product will become.

People keep saying it will water down the product but fail to realize a few things.

1. Cincy was a BCS school for almost a decade going to two BCS bowl games.

2. BYU is a legit P5 level FB program with a big and dedicated fanbase.

3. Houston just beat FSU in the Peach Bowl.

How is that making the conference loo closer to a G5 than a P5?

Mandel is an idiot.

I agree with that. People are GROSSLY understating the quality of the leading expansion candidates.

Let's be real for a second: what's the difference in the profiles of Kansas and UConn? And yet is anyone demanding that KU be expelled from the Big 12? Of course not, that would be absurd.

You can play the same game with TCU and Cincinnati, Texas Tech and Houston and Oklahoma State and BYU. The expansion candidates are at least as strong as their would be league-mates/comps.

(08-04-2016 08:46 PM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  I agree with that. People are GROSSLY understating the quality of the leading expansion candidates.

Let's be real for a second: what's the difference in the profiles of Kansas and UConn? And yet is anyone demanding that KU be expelled from the Big 12? Of course not, that would be absurd.

You can play the same game with TCU and Cincinnati, Texas Tech and Houston and Oklahoma State and BYU. The expansion candidates are at least as strong as their would be league-mates/comps.

It's invented bs to try and talk them out of it. Even UCF had a great team w/ Bortles, they're also the largest school in the US. Any of Cincy, Houston, BYU, UConn, UCF, USF, Memphis are deserving. They'll have a chance to better all their facilities and get better/keep coaches once they're in the B12.

Would people like to see a Boise State Vs Oklahoma every year? That is one hell of a game when Boise State beat Oklahoma in the Fiesta Bowl. UCF beat Baylor in the Fiesta Bowl.

(08-04-2016 08:46 PM)Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Wrote:  I agree with that. People are GROSSLY understating the quality of the leading expansion candidates.

Let's be real for a second: what's the difference in the profiles of Kansas and UConn? And yet is anyone demanding that KU be expelled from the Big 12? Of course not, that would be absurd.

You can play the same game with TCU and Cincinnati, Texas Tech and Houston and Oklahoma State and BYU. The expansion candidates are at least as strong as their would be league-mates/comps.

TCU and Cincinnati? Are you sure you aren't a Colorado fan who has been partaking of that now legal stuff?

Houston and Cincinnati don't have the fan support that the P5 schools have (with only 3 or 4 exceptions of the 65). That is one area where they are lacking.

(08-04-2016 09:32 PM)bullet Wrote:  Houston and Cincinnati don't have the fan support that the P5 schools have (with only 3 or 4 exceptions of the 65). That is one area where they are lacking.

Not sure about Houston, but Cincinnati has at least mid pack P5 support. They certainly have more football support than Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern, Vanderbilt, Wake Forest, Kansas, Rutgers, Pitt, Syracuse, Boston College, Wash St, Ore St, etc etc etc.

(08-04-2016 09:32 PM)bullet Wrote:  Houston and Cincinnati don't have the fan support that the P5 schools have (with only 3 or 4 exceptions of the 65). That is one area where they are lacking.

Our support was just fine when we were playing Pitt, WVU, UL and others. Much less so now that we're playing the Tulanes and Tulsas of the world.

(08-04-2016 09:32 PM)bullet Wrote:  Houston and Cincinnati don't have the fan support that the P5 schools have (with only 3 or 4 exceptions of the 65). That is one area where they are lacking.

OK, but you have no agenda right?

(08-04-2016 10:13 PM)rtaylor Wrote:  

(08-04-2016 09:32 PM)bullet Wrote:  Houston and Cincinnati don't have the fan support that the P5 schools have (with only 3 or 4 exceptions of the 65). That is one area where they are lacking.

OK, but you have no agenda right?

I think it's a fair criticism. But at the same time Texas has never had to see things from our side of the fence.

If UConn were in the middle part of the country, you'd already be in! But that map says the ACC is a much better fit. Too bad they didn't take you in the last round.

(08-04-2016 10:20 PM)PlayBall! Wrote:  If UConn were in the middle part of the country, you'd already be in! But that map says the ACC is a much better fit. Too bad they didn't take you in the last round.

UConn to the ACC and UL and UC to the B12 would have made all the sense in the world.

I think they do water-down the money long term, but not for the reasons people usually get at. It's not that several of these teams couldn't be mid-level Big 12 teams with some really good years. It's that right now, you have Texas and Oklahoma football representing 20% of the league. The top teams in this sport generate a very disproportionate amount of the revenue. You add two more teams (even comparable to most the rest of the conference) and the average value per teams is likely to drop long term (even if short term, unequal revenue sharing helps).

(08-04-2016 09:42 PM)Section 200 Wrote:  

(08-04-2016 09:32 PM)bullet Wrote:  Houston and Cincinnati don't have the fan support that the P5 schools have (with only 3 or 4 exceptions of the 65). That is one area where they are lacking.

Not sure about Houston, but Cincinnati has at least mid pack P5 support. They certainly have more football support than Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern, Vanderbilt, Wake Forest, Kansas, Rutgers, Pitt, Syracuse, Boston College, Wash St, Ore St, etc etc etc.

I'd agree that Cincy and Houston's fan support would be accurately portrayed as middle of the pack P5, but both of their upsides is considerably higher. UH/OU is sold out at 72k+, and the word from NRG officials is that it will be 2/3rd's UH fans. If you are to believe them, that's in the ball park of 45-50k Coogs. If it were a team of OU's caliber that wasn't so close, we could have sold more. OU obviously ate up their fair share. I also wouldn't be surprised if UH sold out every game at TDECU this year.

There's no doubt that Cincy could also sell out big, showcase-type games at Paul Brown.

Just wondering, what is Cincy's current season ticket base? Granted we're coming off a strong season, but we're at 23-24k right now, which will be close to a 30k final number after adding in the students (which I think most schools include when touting season ticket numbers).

It's not out of the realm of possibility that we could hit 35-40k season tickets with a Big 12 schedule and continued success, as TCU saw a 40% rise two years after joining the Big 12.

Based on UConn head coach Bob Diaco's bombshell words, UConn has no shot of ever playing in the Big 12. Geography is huge.

(08-04-2016 09:42 PM)Section 200 Wrote:  Not sure about Houston, but Cincinnati has at least mid pack P5 support. They certainly have more football support than Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern, Vanderbilt, Wake Forest, Kansas, Rutgers, Pitt, Syracuse, Boston College, Wash St, Ore St, etc etc etc.

That's exaggerating things by quite a lot.

59 of 65 P5 schools had higher average attendance than Cincinnati in 2015. (2015 attendance numbers here.) In 2014, every P5 team except Wake had higher average attendance. (2014 attendance numbers here.)

(08-04-2016 10:41 PM)Kronke Wrote:  

(08-04-2016 09:42 PM)Section 200 Wrote:  

(08-04-2016 09:32 PM)bullet Wrote:  Houston and Cincinnati don't have the fan support that the P5 schools have (with only 3 or 4 exceptions of the 65). That is one area where they are lacking.

Not sure about Houston, but Cincinnati has at least mid pack P5 support. They certainly have more football support than Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern, Vanderbilt, Wake Forest, Kansas, Rutgers, Pitt, Syracuse, Boston College, Wash St, Ore St, etc etc etc.

I'd agree that Cincy and Houston's fan support would be accurately portrayed as middle of the pack P5, but both of their upsides is considerably higher. UH/OU is sold out at 72k+, and the word from NRG officials is that it will be 2/3rd's UH fans. If you are to believe them, that's in the ball park of 45-50k Coogs. If it were a team of OU's caliber that wasn't so close, we could have sold more. OU obviously ate up their fair share. I also wouldn't be surprised if UH sold out every game at TDECU this year.

There's no doubt that Cincy could also sell out big, showcase-type games at Paul Brown.

Just wondering, what is Cincy's current season ticket base? Granted we're coming off a strong season, but we're at 23-24k right now, which will be close to a 30k final number after adding in the students (which I think most schools include when touting season ticket numbers).

It's not out of the realm of possibility that we could hit 35-40k season tickets with a Big 12 schedule and continued success, as TCU saw a 40% rise two years after joining the Big 12.

If I had to guess I'd think around 17k (without student tickets). Probably makes sense given the population differences between the two cities. There's room for improvement there but I think the potential's there.

(08-04-2016 10:59 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(08-04-2016 09:42 PM)Section 200 Wrote:  Not sure about Houston, but Cincinnati has at least mid pack P5 support. They certainly have more football support than Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern, Vanderbilt, Wake Forest, Kansas, Rutgers, Pitt, Syracuse, Boston College, Wash St, Ore St, etc etc etc.

That's exaggerating things by quite a lot.

59 of 65 P5 schools had higher average attendance than Cincinnati in 2015. (2015 attendance numbers here.) In 2014, every P5 team except Wake had higher average attendance. (2014 attendance numbers here.)

Comparing apples to oranges. Put Cal in the MWC and see how they draw.

We're going to play OU in front of 72k+. Memphis played Ole' Miss in front of 60k+. Cincy would sell out Nippert most if not every week with a Big 12 schedule.

(08-04-2016 10:59 PM)Wedge Wrote:  

(08-04-2016 09:42 PM)Section 200 Wrote:  Not sure about Houston, but Cincinnati has at least mid pack P5 support. They certainly have more football support than Indiana, Purdue, Illinois, Northwestern, Vanderbilt, Wake Forest, Kansas, Rutgers, Pitt, Syracuse, Boston College, Wash St, Ore St, etc etc etc.

That's exaggerating things by quite a lot.

59 of 65 P5 schools had higher average attendance than Cincinnati in 2015. (2015 attendance numbers here.) In 2014, every P5 team except Wake had higher average attendance. (2014 attendance numbers here.)

It was a capacity number Einstein. Nippert is one of the most historic stadiums in college football. It underwent an upgrade to roughly 40k in 2015. Yes, in 2014 we were low because of CAPACITY. But in 2015 we were ahead (according to your own link: http://www.cbssports.com/college-footbal...ower-rate/) of Oregon State, Houston, Boise State, Northwestern, Vandy, 'Cuse, Navy, Army, BC, UCF, Washington State, SDSU, UConn, Kansas, Wake, USF, Duke, and CSU. Read what you post, boss.