With the two drafts taking place just a day apart, I noticed that while they are two completely different animals, they have grown a little more similar in recent years just with the number of international players taken.

I can't help but feel bad for the NBA hopefuls that don't get picked and have no way back to school, and wonder if the NBA could learn a thing or two from the NHL.

Why is it that a hockey player can be drafted, deemed not ready for the NHL, go to college for a few years, and then sign with the team when he is physically ready, while a basketball player forfeits his college eligibility by entering the draft?

I think it would make sense for the NBA to allow players to be drafted at 18, and then let the team that drafts the player hold their rights for several years. As long as the player doesn't sign a contract, he should be allowed to attend college; or if he does sign, he could play in the D-League until physically and emotionally ready for the rigors of the NBA.

Actually, NBA prospects only forfeit their eligibility if they sign with an agent. If they do not sign with an agent they are free to return to school if they still have eligibility.


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"This year, men's basketball student-athletes wishing to retain their eligibility must withdraw from the NBA draft by 11:59 p.m. Tuesday, April 10. This applies only to underclassmen who already have declared for the draft."

You lose your eligibility if you don't withdraw from the draft a couple of months before the draft takes place, even if you don't hire an agent.

In hockey, you don't 'declare' for the draft, you're just automatically eligible in the year you turn 18. Therefore you don't have to withdraw from the draft, and can be drafted and still have college eligibility. They also get around the agent rule by having, as Erik Cole calls them, 'advisors'.

(06-26-2016 10:42 AM)chargeradio Wrote:  Actually, NBA prospects only forfeit their eligibility if they sign with an agent. If they do not sign with an agent they are free to return to school if they still have eligibility.


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No true. If they go they with the draft, where her drafted or not, they cannot go back to college.

(06-26-2016 11:12 AM)Chappy Wrote:  In hockey, you don't 'declare' for the draft, you're just automatically eligible in the year you turn 18. Therefore you don't have to withdraw from the draft, and can be drafted and still have college eligibility. They also get around the agent rule by having, as Erik Cole calls them, 'advisors'.

Yup, Same as baseball. You don't actually have to "enter" the draft, which makes it a bit different.

There were 30 undrafted underclassmen Thursday. It would be good for both college basketball and these young men if the ones that don't sign deals as free agents could return to school and play.

(I know that is different than what I was suggesting in the OP, but I think it also would be good if the NBA refuses to change their one year removed from high school rule.)

I wonder if the basketball rules are set that way so that the college programs have the additional time to fill that roster spot. With the current rule they have a little over three additional months to look for a replacement for players that leave. Not sure that the college coaches want that much more uncertainty.

And it's not like these undrafted underclassmen were caught unaware. The pre-draft process for the NBA is very up front with their player evaluations and slotting of players. These players know about where they are projected to go in the draft and there's enough evidence that unless you are a first round pick it's probably a good idea to go back to school another year because with the limited roster size there is no guarantee you'll even make a roster, and unlike the NHL with it's sizeable minor league system the chances beyond that are limited.

(06-26-2016 06:35 PM)adcorbett Wrote:  

(06-26-2016 10:42 AM)chargeradio Wrote:  Actually, NBA prospects only forfeit their eligibility if they sign with an agent. If they do not sign with an agent they are free to return to school if they still have eligibility.


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No true. If they go they with the draft, where her drafted or not, they cannot go back to college.

You're right, apparently that has been the case since 2011.

(06-26-2016 07:22 AM)Chappy Wrote:  Why is it that a hockey player can be drafted, deemed not ready for the NHL, go to college for a few years, and then sign with the team when he is physically ready, while a basketball player forfeits his college eligibility by entering the draft?

I was looking at the NHL Draft, and a lot of the players drafted in the first round actually are professionals who played in Europe or Canada. The USHL, a Major Junior league, allows players to retain amateur status, but the Canadian Major Junior leagues do not. A rookie in the NHL could have been playing professional hockey since the age of 16, or in some rare cases, age 15.

(06-26-2016 10:10 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  I wonder if the basketball rules are set that way so that the college programs have the additional time to fill that roster spot. With the current rule they have a little over three additional months to look for a replacement for players that leave. Not sure that the college coaches want that much more uncertainty.

Somewhat. One reason the NCAA had changed the rule a few years ago to force players to withdraw from the draft about a week after the championship, was coaches demanded it for just that reason. The NCAA finally came to their senses, and rescinded that rule this year, to give them more time. But I think they don't allow them to come back, much like football, because you have to apply to enter the draft, as opposed to the MLB or NHL draft where teams can draft you whether you plan to leave or not. The NBA draft used to allow teams to draft players once they were four years removed from HS, which is why you'd see guys like Tony Gwynn drafted or Andre Dawson, or other baseball and football players, and guys like Larry Bird who was drafted while still playing at Indiana St.

(06-26-2016 10:10 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  

(06-26-2016 06:35 PM)adcorbett Wrote:  

(06-26-2016 10:42 AM)chargeradio Wrote:  Actually, NBA prospects only forfeit their eligibility if they sign with an agent. If they do not sign with an agent they are free to return to school if they still have eligibility.


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No true. If they go they with the draft, where her drafted or not, they cannot go back to college.

You're right, apparently that has been the case since 2011.

Actually that rule was only in affect for a couple of seasons. I forget which year they started allowing it, but it wasn't for long, and was only used by a couple of players. It also sort of messed with the NBA's system, because then guys who were undrafted were technically free agents, and would go back to school, play, and would sign with teams right after the college season ended, and start playing right away, which I know happened on one or two occasions, which gave them better negotiating power than drafted players. It could actually be to your advantage to go undrafted in that situation.

(06-26-2016 10:17 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  

(06-26-2016 07:22 AM)Chappy Wrote:  Why is it that a hockey player can be drafted, deemed not ready for the NHL, go to college for a few years, and then sign with the team when he is physically ready, while a basketball player forfeits his college eligibility by entering the draft?

I was looking at the NHL Draft, and a lot of the players drafted in the first round actually are professionals who played in Europe or Canada. The USHL, a Major Junior league, allows players to retain amateur status, but the Canadian Major Junior leagues do not. A rookie in the NHL could have been playing professional hockey since the age of 16, or in some rare cases, age 15.

Yes, the NBA and NHL drafts are becoming similar in that aspect.

The cynic in me always wondered if the 'one and done' rule was done in part to boost NBA draft ratings... The NFL draft is good TV because we know who the players are - college stars. The NBA draft had a lot of HS kids anyone who wasn't a die-hard had never heard of... make them go to school for a year and then we know who the players are. But with the number of international players being picked, we still don't know who half the players being picked are.

The NBA forces the players to declare. Add the NCAA denying eligibility if they don't withdraw and the NBA has a bird's nest on the ground.

There is no risk of drafting a player and the player opting to return to college if they don't get the deal they want.

On the flip side, the NBA draft is only two rounds. The NHL draft goes 7 rounds. MLB goes 40. So they can price the risk of player remaining in the amateur ranks into their selections.

(06-27-2016 08:42 AM)Chappy Wrote:  The cynic in me always wondered if the 'one and done' rule was done in part to boost NBA draft ratings...

No, it was to protect NBA teams from themselves, to prevent them from having to make decisions on high school players. As the players who tended to jump from HS to the NBA were mostly the most "talented" players, teams were forced to draft them, or forever be behind the eight ball, but no one really knew what they were getting. Those players were flaming out at an alarming rate, for guys who were supposed to be the cream of the crop (most were big men), and left a a crater in the league for years to come. Hence why so many bigs were able to play into their late 30's and early 40's during and after the prep-to-pro era. The players who were supposed to take their place, washed out.

College teams with the most draft choices by the NHL:

BU 6
UND 5
Wisconsin 5
Providence 4

Four of BU draft choices were first round
All but one of UND's newly drafted picks are signees, not current players. Three of them won't suit up for UND for at least a season.

(06-27-2016 09:30 AM)adcorbett Wrote:  

(06-27-2016 08:42 AM)Chappy Wrote:  The cynic in me always wondered if the 'one and done' rule was done in part to boost NBA draft ratings...

No, it was to protect NBA teams from themselves, to prevent them from having to make decisions on high school players. As the players who tended to jump from HS to the NBA were mostly the most "talented" players, teams were forced to draft them, or forever be behind the eight ball, but no one really knew what they were getting. Those players were flaming out at an alarming rate, for guys who were supposed to be the cream of the crop (most were big men), and left a a crater in the league for years to come. Hence why so many bigs were able to play into their late 30's and early 40's during and after the prep-to-pro era. The players who were supposed to take their place, washed out.

It was a save us from ourself rule.

There is no question about and no real argument against the proposition that there are high school players capable of making an effective transition to the NBA without college competition.

But franchises that make bad decisions in scouting and evaluation had those poor decisions amplified when high school players were available.

The year of college allows the badly run teams a better opportunity to see player X is a beast only against inferior competition and makes them less likely to blow it. It also protects good teams because what is between the ears and what the person has in making good judgments is better exposed going through recruiting and a year of tougher competition.

The year of college though is bad for the player who could have gone out of high school and reduces their lifetime earnings as well as their lifetime stats.

Really comes down to who you want to protect and if you are an NBA owner the answer is yourself and your business partners.

In reality though, there were really only 3-4 prep-to-pros who had such good rookie seasons you can honestly say they didn't need the extra year (Stoudemire, James, and Howard). And even those have an asterisk by them as they came many years after the prep-to-pro issue was a thing, and the NBA was full of high schoolers and one and dones who really weren't ready, thus lowering the competition level.

Plus the NBA and NFL, unlike the other two, don't have true developmental leagues. The NBA does have the D league, but its' not a progressive training ground like MLB and NHL minor leagues. It's essentially a league to keep rookie and second year players in game shape when they would otherwise be sitting on the bench.

(06-26-2016 11:12 AM)Chappy Wrote:  "This year, men's basketball student-athletes wishing to retain their eligibility must withdraw from the NBA draft by 11:59 p.m. Tuesday, April 10. This applies only to underclassmen who already have declared for the draft."

You lose your eligibility if you don't withdraw from the draft a couple of months before the draft takes place, even if you don't hire an agent.

In hockey, you don't 'declare' for the draft, you're just automatically eligible in the year you turn 18. Therefore you don't have to withdraw from the draft, and can be drafted and still have college eligibility. They also get around the agent rule by having, as Erik Cole calls them, 'advisors'.

Correct, MLB works much the same way. However, there's a pattern there. Hockey relies on juniors and minor leagues to develop players. Baseball relies on its minor league system to develop players. Football and basketball rely on college to develop players.

The NHL is actually talking about raising the draft eligible age to 19 – which would be a lot like the NBA rule. Personally, I don't think they are going to be able to pull that off with the consent of the NHLPA but that is something they are discussing.

I have always thought that the best draft rules for college basketball would be for the players to be permitted to declare for the NBA draft coming out of high school and if they were not taken then - and very few would be - they could declare again following their sophomore or junior seasons.

I don't think the one-and-done rule helps anyone.