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Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
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Gray Avenger Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 07:03 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  [quote='UCGrad1992' pid='13245968' dateline='1462492591']
[quote='quo vadis' pid='13245913' dateline='1462490865']

....Cincy contributes to a bridge to WVU, Memphis contributes nothing to that bridge.

Quo, if I didn't know better, I would think you are upset at the idea of Memphis leaving USF behind in "G5 Land". Any idiot can look at the map and see that the "bridge" is comprised of TWO schools. Without Memphis, there is still a huge gap between Cincy/WVU and the rest of the Big 12. I love the AAC, but (with apologies to all the reasonable USF fans) one of the great things about joining the Big 12 would be leaving your snarky ass in the dust. All you have ever done is put the AAC down.
(This post was last modified: 05-06-2016 08:02 AM by Gray Avenger.)
05-06-2016 08:01 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 08:01 AM)Gray Avenger Wrote:  
(05-06-2016 07:03 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  [quote='UCGrad1992' pid='13245968' dateline='1462492591']
[quote='quo vadis' pid='13245913' dateline='1462490865']

....Cincy contributes to a bridge to WVU, Memphis contributes nothing to that bridge.

Quo, if I didn't know better, I would think you are upset at the idea of Memphis leaving USF behind in "G5 Land". Any idiot can look at the map and see that the "bridge" is comprised of TWO schools. Without Memphis, there is still a huge gap between Cincy/WVU and the rest of the Big 12.

Gray, you can pimp Memphis all you want, but any idiot who isn't a blinded Tiger can see that Memphis is a bridge to nowhere: You are almost 500 miles from ANYONE in the Big 12, including Cincy and WVU. You're not going anywhere, LOL.
(This post was last modified: 05-06-2016 08:16 AM by quo vadis.)
05-06-2016 08:13 AM
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FrancisDrake Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
What Memphis and Cincy do is fit inside the current conference footprint. Like in-fill in a center center vs creating sprawl. Memphis and Cincy are closer to WVU and don't create additional travel for any other Big12 member. They both have decent sized markets and brand names in hoops.

As an ECU fan, I'm still asking Jobu to prevent any Big12 expansion...

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05-06-2016 08:17 AM
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Gray Avenger Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 08:17 AM)FrancisDrake Wrote:  What Memphis and Cincy do is fit inside the current conference footprint. Like in-fill in a center center vs creating sprawl. Memphis and Cincy are closer to WVU and don't create additional travel for any other Big12 member. .......

Thankyou. Quo's denial of the truth is sad. Assassins will be hunting for Jobu.
05-06-2016 08:21 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 08:17 AM)FrancisDrake Wrote:  What Memphis and Cincy do is fit inside the current conference footprint.

I've been told many times around here that a major problem for the Big 12 is that it's footprint is too small. 07-coffee3
05-06-2016 08:23 AM
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Gray Avenger Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 08:23 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  I've been told many times around here that a major problem for the Big 12 is that it's footprint is too small. 07-coffee3

Which is true with WVU out on an island by themselves. By filling in that gap, the footprint (as well as TV markets and recruiting territory) is significantly improved.
05-06-2016 08:30 AM
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Rabbit_in_Red Offline
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Post: #47
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
One of these days, I'll understand why Quo's not been banned for being such a blatant troll...
05-06-2016 08:40 AM
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FrancisDrake Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 08:21 AM)Gray Avenger Wrote:  
(05-06-2016 08:17 AM)FrancisDrake Wrote:  What Memphis and Cincy do is fit inside the current conference footprint. Like in-fill in a center center vs creating sprawl. Memphis and Cincy are closer to WVU and don't create additional travel for any other Big12 member. .......

Thankyou. Quo's denial of the truth is sad. Assassins will be hunting for Jobu.

It is very bad to drink Jobu's rum!



05-06-2016 08:43 AM
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billybobby777 Offline
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Post: #49
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-05-2016 03:20 PM)hawghiggs Wrote:  The Big 12 needs to add Colorado state and New Mexico. Then make a push for Houston and either Memphis or Tulane.

If we think like an AD/president then New Mexico and Colorado St would be two of the top choices. Big state flagships/very high research schools. If we think like a fan then those two won't even be candidates because they don't have a good enough football history. They've both been playing forever, but mostly mediocre at best histories. I've been saying for 5 years now those 2 schools are one magic Boise like season away from getting picked up. Probably won't happen though.
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05-06-2016 09:07 AM
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Post: #50
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 09:07 AM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(05-05-2016 03:20 PM)hawghiggs Wrote:  The Big 12 needs to add Colorado state and New Mexico. Then make a push for Houston and either Memphis or Tulane.

If we think like an AD/president then New Mexico and Colorado St would be two of the top choices. Big state flagships/very high research schools. If we think like a fan then those two won't even be candidates because they don't have a good enough football history. They've both been playing forever, but mostly mediocre at best histories. I've been saying for 5 years now those 2 schools are one magic Boise like season away from getting picked up. Probably won't happen though.
Cheers!

AD/president won't touch them because its about $. Historically bad football programs don't get anyone to watch them on TV. That means fewer $.

Tulane gets some thought because of academics, but then they look at the numbers. UNM and CSU don't get eyeballs.
05-06-2016 09:25 AM
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billybobby777 Offline
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Post: #51
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 09:25 AM)bullet Wrote:  
(05-06-2016 09:07 AM)billybobby777 Wrote:  
(05-05-2016 03:20 PM)hawghiggs Wrote:  The Big 12 needs to add Colorado state and New Mexico. Then make a push for Houston and either Memphis or Tulane.

If we think like an AD/president then New Mexico and Colorado St would be two of the top choices. Big state flagships/very high research schools. If we think like a fan then those two won't even be candidates because they don't have a good enough football history. They've both been playing forever, but mostly mediocre at best histories. I've been saying for 5 years now those 2 schools are one magic Boise like season away from getting picked up. Probably won't happen though.
Cheers!

AD/president won't touch them because its about $. Historically bad football programs don't get anyone to watch them on TV. That means fewer $.

Tulane gets some thought because of academics, but then they look at the numbers. UNM and CSU don't get eyeballs.

Yep.
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05-06-2016 10:37 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #52
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 08:30 AM)Gray Avenger Wrote:  
(05-06-2016 08:23 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  I've been told many times around here that a major problem for the Big 12 is that it's footprint is too small. 07-coffee3

Which is true with WVU out on an island by themselves. By filling in that gap, the footprint (as well as TV markets and recruiting territory) is significantly improved.

Dude, Memphis is almost *500 miles* from ANYONE in the Big 12, including Cincy if they get a bid. You are the definition of an "island", and you fill absolutely zero gaps, as anyone who can read a map can see. 07-coffee3
05-06-2016 05:33 PM
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texasorange Offline
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Post: #53
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 08:40 AM)Rabbit_in_Red Wrote:  One of these days, I'll understand why Quo's not been banned for being such a blatant troll...

Maybe because Quo is not a troll. Sometimes the truth sucks for fans desperate to see their school move up to a better conference.
(This post was last modified: 05-06-2016 06:59 PM by texasorange.)
05-06-2016 06:58 PM
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Gray Avenger Offline
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Post: #54
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 05:33 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Dude, Memphis is almost *500 miles* from ANYONE in the Big 12....

The centroid (I assume you know what that is) of the Big 12 is approximately at Branson, MO. Memphis is closer to that location than all other expansion candidates. Another measure is the average distance to all schools, in which Memphis is also the best location other than Houston which is already inside the current footprint and thus is not seriously considered:

Average Distance to current Big 12 schools:
BYU 1,182
USF 1,248
UCF 1,226
Cincinnati 826
Uconn 1,516
Memphis 588
Houston 588
Tulane 766

And if you cannot see that Memphis helps fill the gap between Cincinnati and the western Big 12 schools there is no point in wasting time on you (which I already knew).
(This post was last modified: 05-07-2016 08:24 AM by Gray Avenger.)
05-06-2016 07:39 PM
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Post: #55
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 07:39 PM)Gray Avenger Wrote:  
(05-06-2016 05:33 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Dude, Memphis is almost *500 miles* from ANYONE in the Big 12....

The centroid (I assume you know that that is) of the Big 12 is approximately at Branson, MO. Memphis is closer to that location than all other expansion candidates. Another measure is the average distance to all schools, in which Memphis is also the best location other than Houston which is already inside the current footprint and thus is not seriously considered:

Average Distance to current Big 12 schools:
BYU 1,182
USF 1,248
UCF 1,226
Cincinnati 826
Uconn 1,516
Memphis 588
Houston 588
Tulane 766

And if you cannot see that Memphis helps fill the gap between Cincinnati and the western Big 12 schools there is no point in wasting time on you (which I already knew).

Nooice Gray! I'm not sure why this concept of the bridge had to get to this level of analysis. Maybe we should use the concept of stepping stones from WVU to the rest of the schools west of the Mississippi. Cincinnati and Memphis provide travel partner options to WVU that are superior to any other schools in the current B12. Not to mention the natural rivalries between Cincy and WV and Cincy and Memphis.

[Image: Big-12-map1.jpg]
05-06-2016 08:34 PM
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Post: #56
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-05-2016 03:06 PM)MWC Tex Wrote:  
(05-05-2016 03:03 PM)EvilVodka Wrote:  I just don't know how anyone passes on BYU....

BYU is football power, it's a fact...IMO, BYU should be #11, and then #12 could be Cinci or Memphis

BYU will still have recruiting limitations with the Honor Code and having 24 yr old freshman. The Big 12 needs to consider that.

24 yr old freshman? LOL. Poor MWC Tex. BYU's moved on. You can too. Enjoy life. Stop worrying about what happens to BYU. Enjoy your MWC. You are letting this bother you far too much. 03-lmfao
05-07-2016 01:58 AM
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Post: #57
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-05-2016 03:12 PM)jrj84105 Wrote:  BYU WAS a football giant is probably more correct. BYU maxed out its performance in the Lavell Edwards era when it installed a revolutionary new offense. No BYU coach before Lavell Edwards had success. Under Edwards BYU massively expanded its sports infrastructure, and BYU had every possible advantage over its MWC peers post Edwards. But BYU couldn't get it done post Edwards. The honor code and peculiar culture prevented BYU from parlaying institutional advantages into on field advantages with TCU, Utah, and Boise fielding superior teams without the resources.

With TCU and Utah moving up, the gap in success has grown even larger as BYU's unique limitations prevent it from competing at a higher level against resource equivalent schools. BYU has an intrinsically lower ceiling than other programs, and that ceiling was hit in the mid 1980s. Is the BigXii looking for a maxed brand to tide things over until UT/OU bail or are they looking to build a conference for the long term.

And this folks, is why the FRutes were mentioned as the school most obsessed with their "rival". They follow BYU posters around, threads around, whatever, and feel the need to give their worthless, biased, non-sensical drivel. It's rent free living in their tiny brains! 02-13-banana
05-07-2016 02:00 AM
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Post: #58
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 08:34 PM)UCGrad1992 Wrote:  
(05-06-2016 07:39 PM)Gray Avenger Wrote:  
(05-06-2016 05:33 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Dude, Memphis is almost *500 miles* from ANYONE in the Big 12....

The centroid (I assume you know that that is) of the Big 12 is approximately at Branson, MO. Memphis is closer to that location than all other expansion candidates. Another measure is the average distance to all schools, in which Memphis is also the best location other than Houston which is already inside the current footprint and thus is not seriously considered:

Average Distance to current Big 12 schools:
BYU 1,182
USF 1,248
UCF 1,226
Cincinnati 826
Uconn 1,516
Memphis 588
Houston 588
Tulane 766

And if you cannot see that Memphis helps fill the gap between Cincinnati and the western Big 12 schools there is no point in wasting time on you (which I already knew).

Nooice Gray! I'm not sure why this concept of the bridge had to get to this level of analysis. Maybe we should use the concept of stepping stones from WVU to the rest of the schools west of the Mississippi. Cincinnati and Memphis provide travel partner options to WVU that are superior to any other schools in the current B12. Not to mention the natural rivalries between Cincy and WV and Cincy and Memphis.

[Image: Big-12-map1.jpg]

From the article linked in the OP:

[Image: Big12Map.jpg]

From Big12fanatics:

Quote:11. Moneyline: The clubhouse leaders for pro-expansion crowd at the moment are Cincinnati and Memphis. Not only do they both draw a line from the Big 12 to West Virginia, but they also provide two new states with decent population with Ohio and Tennessee. Additionally, with both being river towns, each DMA stretches over multiple states. Memphis includes significant chunks of both Mississippi and Arkansas, while Cincinnati includes parts of Kentucky and Indiana. Corporate leaders for both cities have been courting the Big 12 and the Liberty Bowl is seizing on the opportunity to solidify its relationship with the Big 12. Houston is only in the conversation due to being in Texas and that is actually hurting the school. The Texas block has little interest in sharing the Power Five’s enhanced exposure with any other schools in the state. BYU is also a discussion point, but many are leery of what it would take to work with the university, let alone add all that travel to the mix.

http://big12fanatics.com/big-12-expansion-edition/
05-07-2016 07:45 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #59
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 06:58 PM)texasorange Wrote:  
(05-06-2016 08:40 AM)Rabbit_in_Red Wrote:  One of these days, I'll understand why Quo's not been banned for being such a blatant troll...

Maybe because Quo is not a troll. Sometimes the truth sucks for fans desperate to see their school move up to a better conference.

Yes, it's pretty amazing that I am being called a "troll" merely for pointing out obvious geographical problems with the notion that Memphis would be a "bridge" to WVU.

I guess if you argue against Memphis as a good choice for the Big 12, you are a "troll", LOL. 07-coffee3
05-07-2016 08:05 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #60
RE: Why Cincinnati & Memphis Make Sense for the Big 12
(05-06-2016 07:39 PM)Gray Avenger Wrote:  
(05-06-2016 05:33 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Dude, Memphis is almost *500 miles* from ANYONE in the Big 12....

The centroid (I assume you know that that is) of the Big 12 is approximately at Branson, MO. Memphis is closer to that location than all other expansion candidates. Another measure is the average distance to all schools, in which Memphis is also the best location other than Houston which is already inside the current footprint and thus is not seriously considered:

Average Distance to current Big 12 schools:
BYU 1,182
USF 1,248
UCF 1,226
Cincinnati 826
Uconn 1,516
Memphis 588
Houston 588
Tulane 766

And if you cannot see that Memphis helps fill the gap between Cincinnati and the western Big 12 schools there is no point in wasting time on you (which I already knew).

Your logic is very fallible.

First, you claim Houston is not seriously considered. You don't know that. Houston may be at the top of the Big 12 expansion list. The Big 12 might very well think that, given that Memphis is completely surrounded on all sides by SEC powers, that it is pointless to expand there because Memphis would bring little or nothing market-wise to the conference.

Second, being closer to the center of the Big 12 means ... what? Nobody travels to and from the "centroid" of a conference. And you are still 600 long miles from there, which takes us to ...

Third, even if Memphis *is* the best "bridge" option to WVU, that doesn't mean it is a *good* bridge option to WVU. In fact, because it is 750 miles from WVU, it is a lousy such bridge. And it is the "good" part that would matter, not the "better than" part. The Big 12 only benefits from a "good" bridge, not the best bridge of a bad lot.

Memphis may end up being the Big 12's choice. But the geographical argument is a weak one.
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